last day (17 days later) » 

18:16
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Q: When should I give up searching for a tenure track faculty job?

phd_cyber_coderI defended my PhD thesis last year December. Before that, I started working as a postdoc last September. I am searching for a tenure track job but so far it is going extremely bad. I sent 30 applications, 12 direct rejections, 3 rejections after interview. I still have 2 more years in postdoc. I ...

"You only sent 30 applications?" Wow. The number of people you're competing with is huge... so you really should apply to maaaaaany more places, since it does turn into a probabilistic thing. Doesn't your advisor ... "have advice"... ???
‘How can I transition into an entry level industry job?’ It might be too soon for that, but that’s your call. Depending on your field, you might explore industry postdocs.
It's pretty common to apply to 75+ openings.. I applied to over 150 across a couple of cycles.
If your postdoc goes to plan, your application gets better and better. So keep at it.
This is in the US? Do you nave certain parts of the US where you refuse to go for a job? (One new PhD I knew applied only for jobs within commuting distance of where he lived.)
18:16
As I answered to another person: I got a PhD in cybersecurity. I have 2 IEEE Transactions papers and 8 other papers (4 journals in which I am the first author in 3, 6 conferences in which I am the first author in 5). I got PhD from Canada. I am looking for a position in Europe since I have to be close to my hometown due to family reasons. I am 38, so I am not in a situation in which I can spend years in postdoc. I am too old.
I think between the top line question and the clarifications, this question becomes too individual to generalize. "People frequently spend more than 7 months in a postdoc" is true, but otherwise it's down to personal circumstances and choice how long you're willing to spend in postdocs.
"I guess this situation means I am not qualified for a faculty job." False. It means you're in an oversaturated job market. One year into your first posdoc you're just warming up.
Oversaturated job market, I guess that means chance is very low. I am 38 already so I cannot gamble with my life. I guess better to give up and find an industry job.
J W
J W
I've noticed that you repeat over and again that you're too old. That's a limiting belief that you might want to re-examine. Not saying it isn't a factor to consider but you could be closing certain doors yourself without having given the full range of options a decent chance.
Add more information on what you did between your primary degree and PhD. Also what was your motivation in doing a PhD in the first place ?
18:16
I worked in some companies and did two Masters. One with a thesis, another one with a project. My motivation was to become a faculty member but looks like that’s impossible. So, I just need to get my life in order and get a stable job
J W
J W
I'm a little puzzled about why you are asking here, as it seems you've already made up your mind (or made it up very quickly on the basis of the responses so far). Just curious - it's up to you what you decide to do, of course.
@paulgarrett Does your advisor have an advice? The OP is a postdoc, not a PhD student. Postdocs are fully qualified academic researchers. Yes, they work on someone else's (PI's) project but it does not imply that they are necessarily looking up to their PI for a career or life advice, or depend on their advice. We should really start showing more respect to postdocs and stop treating them as students.
@DmitrySavostyanov I think this is exactly the kind of advice I would expect to provide to somebody in a postdoc position. Sure, they're fully qualified researchers so if they had questions about basic research procedures, I'd be worried, but since this is the first time they are likely looking for a permanent job in academia, while their advisors have done it before, I don't see an issue with postdocs asking their advisors for advice on this topic.
Nothing really substantial to add to the answers below, but just to mention that I know several UK universities of mid-ish rank which will hire people into (entry level, Lecturer) academic positions (on a research/teaching profile) straight out of their PhD. On the other hand, many UK universities are currently in a bit of a financial pickle. However, it loosely meets your criteria ("Europe" -- kindof) so might be worth keeping an eye.
I applied to many UK universities, just 1 of them interviewed but did not answer after the interview. Most of them rejected.
If you want a big tech job your PhD degree alone will land you one level above entry level. Definitely aim higher than entry-level if you decide industry.
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As @StubbornSnail says, you surely wouldn't be getting an "entry level" position in cybersec. !!! note though that particularly in that field (eg survey.stackoverflow.co/2024 ) for better or worse, basically you make far more blunt money in the Usa. (of course, there are other tradeoffs; and of course, cost of living varies incredibly within the Usa.)
@JW the topic you mention "too old. That's a limiting belief ..." etc. I don't really know the case in academia, but in software engineering for money, unfortunately old == un-hirable, it's sort of a dirty little secret. Just like being, I dunno, a sportsperson or such, you get rapidly worse with age. Yes, for the truly elite and the most elite fields, it's different. (A bit like with musicians. Old studio musicians get left by the wayside, excepting, the ultimate elite dudes, if you're time pierce or joe walsh or whatever who are dinosaurs :) ) Anyway, in Academia, IDK.

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