« first day (1921 days earlier)      last day (3257 days later) » 

11:01
@AviD, does that count as instant coffee?;)
@SmokeDispenser filthy casual
@AviD, hu?
any of you mods happy to moderate my recent flag away?;)
11:22
@SmokeDispenser hm.
ah, french press.
Nothing french about it
That is an indian coffee filter.
@JourneymanGeek ah, that's why I didnt recognize it.
kinda looks the same:)
how is it different from e.g. french?
@SmokeDispenser not really
11:23
IIRC in a french press you dump the coffee and the water together yes?
then the thing pushes the grounds down?
@JourneymanGeek, right
yes exactly
Indian filter coffee, you put the coffee in, water on top
it drips SLOWLY through the grounds
and you end up with the goodness below.
so basically drip coffee?
but in a nice compact device?
so like a manually filtered? afe those holes all filtering that happens?
so that there are no parts that need constant replacements (like with drip coffee)?
what is the part in the right in the right picture for?
11:31
to press the coffee grinds I think
morning
@TildalWave, morning:)
heehee how did I manage to wind up with 55 cents in my paypal
thats almost like exact
@AviD, haha, didn't get a topping you ordered on a pizza lately and subsequentially a refund?
ah no, I know where the money came from (OWASP). just amused that the few payments I use it for went almost exact.
11:34
:)
11:45
paychecks ... most significant digits always end prematurely by at least two orders of magnitude, but they do get the least significant digit right about 10% of the time :)
paychecks, are those things still around?
it's a figure of speech
@TildalWave you're a figure of speech
;-)
well yes in a manner of speaking :P
so to say
bah it's a spring cleaning Sunday ... what's wrong with a bit dirty windows? It adds them character I think
all my pet free range spiders are gonna have to emigrate :(
12:03
@SmokeDispenser nothing needs replacement and
0
Q: NTAG216 lock bytes security

ttouchI will put an inplant in my hand by dangerousthings (xNTi) 1. It has NTAG216 by NXP which supprts security bytes to lock write or read and write by password. How safe is that? Is it safe enough to have my PUBLIC key (readable to everyone but not writable. Not too bad if someone overwrites it but ...

...
@Simon you should consider getting one of those. For obvious reasons.
12:21
I will put an inplant in my hand ... doesn't even know what it's good for
be very scared of hand eating llamas :))
gawd the pain. how can I feel hungover? I do not drink and wasn't even out last night
@TildalWave is that a euphemism?
Nov 14 '14 at 20:19, by Iszi
@raz This is the DMZ. Everything's a euphemism.
what is an inplant anyways? a plant, like a power plant, that is really in, e.g. en vouge?
or more like a plant that is mostly green?:)
@SmokeDispenser what does “en vouge” mean? Is that some kind of medieval martial term?
12:30
Is that even on-topic? The guy needs a medical professional more than an information security professional
also, seriously, it doesn't protect you from Carl
@Gilles, isn't 'en vouge' a english term as well as it is french and german?
@TildalWave, does medical cover mind sciences?;)
@SmokeDispenser “en vogue” is a French expression which is occasionally used in English, I don't know about German
it doesn't fit the context however
it means “fashionable”
@Gilles, right.
@Gilles, there was some word play involved based on the typo from op.
@SmokeDispenser it covers 5 ml of a strong sedative intravenously, a straitjacket and a quiet room
@TildalWave, that might partially solve ops problems.
12:35
oof. My kids are really enjoying our new piano. Me, not so much.
> WARNING This kit definitely contains dangerous things. The xNT transponder device has not been tested or certified by any regulatory agency for implantation or use inside the human body. Use of this device is strictly at your own risk.
@AviD, :/
@TildalWave, maybe refer op to some of the people still alive that have e-ink implants?;)
I bet the store is going to be sued to hell soon.
hopefully for op, before he places his order.
> This app will ensure your xNT cannot be accidentally or maliciously be forever locked into a read-only state.
neah as long as they don't claim it does something it doesn't and include all the warnings where required by law, they should be fine... it's just a fancy tag, we've been using them for a long time now, mostly on livestock and pets, but sometimes also on alien abductees just for the kicks of it
this might suggest something about the 'security' of the lunatics device.
lunatics device? :O
12:47
well.
the device the lunatic will insert in his hand.
e.g. self-insert.
that alone has 'lunatic' written all over it.
12:59
it's not even a good something you are factor, it's just a ridiculous something you have (or don't have, if Carl is hungry)
that "$5 wrench XKCD" comes to mind
anyway, yeah, back to washing the damn windows LOL
13:38
I'm having a brainblink moment, I am rewriting someone's coding guidelines, and I cannot come up with a better example than the wrong one they have.
In a properly-architected and -designed system, what would be a good scenario that would require a blacklist for input validation, instead of a whitelist?
I honestly cannot think of any valid use case right now.
and please do not say "oh you need to block quotes in strings, to prevent SQL injection!"
because I did say "properly designed"
Last time I had a discussion about input validation, we concluded that there is never a valid scenario for blacklisting, except if dictated by business rules (in which case it is a higher level validation)
@Jacco hmm. that explains why I can't think of any.
for example: allow all IP-addresses to use our API, except those who have a proven history of abuse.
I mean, sure, in general it might make sense, but you dont really need to block any request with a quote in the last name.
(in which case a blacklist is a cheap solution for what should actually be handled by heauristics)
13:49
@Jacco yeah, meh... thats not really input validation though.
that's why a named it 'higher level validation'.
@Jacco actually I would say that example is closer to permissions, than validation.
but thats just me being pedantic.
so, given such a document, and assuming I dont think the concept of blacklist should be taken out altogether - what kind of example could I leave them with?
See this is why I hate correcting other people's documents. It's shoddy and no overriding rationale.
I'm thinking about that one. The only thing I can come up with is when you have to filter a specific case which you know triggers a vulnerability (due to a bug or design flaw which you cannot address at this point in time).
@Jacco ... which rules out "properly designed". Yeah.
I mean, sure, it is more than likely that these coders ARE concatenating SQL queries directly, in which case it makes sense to talk about quotes and such. But blech.
For a properly designed system, you should not need a blacklist. because a properly designed system uses whitelisting instead of blacklisting.
13:54
@Jacco right, that was my point. But IS there any case where whitelisting isnt enough, and you need to layer on blacklisting too?
(sort of circlar reasoning)
bad sql is one. cant think of another that doesnt require bad design to make sense.
I would say in a properly designed system, there is no reason for black listing
In real-world system, known issues may warrant the use of a blacklist.
@Jacco hmm. thanks for corroborating my thoughts.
@Jacco ymean, like bad SQL?
(as an drop-in solution, that should be removed once the underlying issue has been solved)
bad sql, null-byte in non-binary safe string handler, that sort of stuff
in all of the cases I can think of, blacklisting is a quick-n-dirty fix, which does not solve the issue causing the need for a black list.
13:59
yeah exactly.
thanks.
np
hmm maybe I will explicitly call that out, like that.
Depending on the type of text, it could be a nice addition. It teaches people to notice things like a black lists as a flag for a problem elsewhere.
@AviD that's racist!
wot?
you should include all the lists of the rainbow for composure
@Jacco yeah I might just do that.
was trying to avoid having to write lots of texts...
@TildalWave sure, I already mentioned greenlists, redlists, and bluelists.
14:13
so basically what you're saying is you wanna blacklist blacklists and whitelist whitelists
hmm. I think more like graylist blacklists.
@AviD leaves room for shades of gray ... why am I not surprised?
you calling me a fogey?
hmm damn. @Jacco while writing that out - I actually like the way it works! - I realized that even quotes for SQL strings is not blacklist, it should be encoded...
14:26
ugh why is edit an acceptable way to clear a close vote
i want an "i'm done" button
@AviD proper encoding comes after validation though
yeah exactly
but properly shouldnt be rejecting quotes, should be encoding them
well, in an improper system that requires blocking quotes....
nevermind, I proved myself wrong.
which would lead to problems down the line (such as dont instead of don't)
@Jacco well thats why you encode them
(if its relevant, in an improper sql strings system...)
indeed
14:28
or rather, "don't" would be rejected and considered an attack.
yes, thats the way it was originally written.
people learn quickly how to avoid having their content rejected, they will work their way past the blacklist.
gawddam dem clueless scriptkiddies that consider themselves security experts enough to write a secure coding policy.
@Jacco true.
my typical frustration :-)
I was in a client meeting on Thursday, it was all I could do to not stand up and scream "YOU CALL YOURSELF A DEVELOPER, YOU GODDAMN SONUVABEECH??"
"Coffee is for coders only!"
Luckily I was not there about their software.
If I was, the recommendation I would give them would be to trash every stupid line of Classic ASP code they have on the spot, and rewrite the whole goddamn system properly.
That's my nice recommendation.
My real recommendation would be to fire every single goddamn coder they have there, and hire real developers that have a clue.
Just take a look a the level for the questions tagged [php] on stackoverflow. many of those asking these questions are earning a living and calling themselves professional coders.
14:38
I knoooow :-(
"Trust me, nothing has changed, even ASP.NET MVC is exactly the same thing as ASP Classic! It all works the same, there is no reason to switch!"
^ direct quote (loosely translated).
this was after a series of "oh we cant do that! because reasons!"
I was rejected at a job interview for 'not understanding design patterns' because I mentioned that most MVC are, off course, not really implementing the MVC design pattern and that ORM is horrible because of the object-relational mismatch.
@Jacco I agree with those statements, but they would need to be backed up by a proper explanation.
unfortunately, most people I've heard despise things like MVC and ORM dont actually understand any of those terms they mention.
Didn't get a chance, they stared at me completely blank, agreed with me, rejected me after the interview :-)
With regard to your asp-classic example: I used to be surprised at the resistance people have towards learning something new.
@Jacco exactly that.
though this was another step further - claiming to have learned it, and that it was not new.
denial is a good method of preserving one's ego (or: one's ego comes up with a solution to avoid the need to move from your current position). I always hope that I don't exhibit the same behaviour.
14:49
@Jacco honestly I wasnt sure if it was a question of ego, or simple incapability of understanding concepts.
could be.
It's hard to have a discussion/meeting in such circumstances.
yeah. I had to hold myself back from trying to educate them. I just said "hooookaay then".
Thats when they started getting really defensive ;-)
Big part of any job is social skills, and the patience to use them.
heh.
I'm still struggling to understand why so many programmers are set on implementing their own security measures (as opposed to using some library) while at the same time they happily pull in whole frameworks to simply write 'hello,world' to screen.
14:59
hahaha yeah
although we are not at fault too - security libraries are typically notoriously rather crappy to use.
and it is very hard for to judge the quality of a library.
@Jacco that too. There are probably more horridly broken libraries for any security function (e.g. encryption, passwords, authz, etc) than good ones. Odds are you would wind up with one that makes things worse, if you didnt already know better.
After the first unsuccessful use it gets easier: simply slap another tag to the prosthetic limb. — Deer Hunter 2 mins ago
On second thought, you may qualify for a Darwin award. An inflammation, sepsis, and amputation are acute risks to your security. — Deer Hunter 9 mins ago
that Darwin award comment is a tad unsubtle to my taste
Does any know of a good non-payed paper on ABAC? One that explains why it is so fashionable nowadays?
hey, wasn't that one locked behind a pay wall?
thanks!
some papers would have so-called embargo period yup
dunno if that was the case with this one, but hey it's not paywalled now
15:37
@Jacco NIST publications are always free
I'm pretty sure I tried to download the pdf linked by TildalWave earier (two months ago?) and it required payment.
anyhow, it is free now :-)
15:58
@SmokeDispenser yes I'm basically immune to caffeine and marijuana
@AviD I thought it was quite obvious
@AviD my experience is any guy who is less intelligent than yourself will get turned off when you display your intelligence
@JourneymanGeek I don't understand networks but I understand that WiFi != internet access
so nobody is here
passes out again
I resent the fact you guys have something to do other than readjust to normality on a Sundays
@kalina well - sometimes we don't even make it back to normal...
oh I always try to be normal by monday
normal is overrated anyhow.
@kalina your experience sucks then
@Jacco :-)
16:11
@TildalWave #mylife
@TildalWave I thought you had already concluded that I hang around scumbags and form my opinions off their actions
hey @kalina
I can't even jokingly add "people like @Simon..." to that, even for fun
hello dispenser of smoke
@SmokeDispenser we have a smoke dispenser for gigs. Is that the same
most men I know and including myself are exactly the opposite and turned off by stupidity, and I personally require that a person I'm spending time and such with also has a healthy sense of humor (because otherwise I stand no chance LOL)
what's up, na of kali?
16:13
did you know that I'm not the only person in the room and that by saying hi to me only you've dismissed their existences?
in fact what it is about SO users
weren't there those two indian guys who came here exclusively to say hi to me and ignored everybody else unless they were spoken to
@RoryAlsop, not quite;)
maybe that was on the bridge
and people ask me when I'm so blunt with new people
/rolleyes
@kalina, you hilighted me in here. that's why I said hi to you, not the others.
16:15
I responded to you in here, that's slightly different
also: Go on with your prejudices and have fun with them, I'm just going to ignore them from now on.
that would be awesome
I've been trying to train these guys to ignore anything that obviously doesn't apply to them for literally years
afternoon all
salut
I've been out walking all day and now I'm knackered
16:18
@RoryAlsop, the smoke I'm dispensing is harmful and would not be used at gigs:)
@SmokeDispenser that depends on the effect you want
@TildalWave that. But I came to realize we have selection bias there.
that and when presented with the individual statements describing behavior, most people will claim that they're closer towards acceptable behavior than they perhaps are
I, for example, would definitely circle the "not crazy" option
@kalina, there is something telling me there might be a small part of you wishing death to the crowd.
@SmokeDispenser actually I try to avoid the crowd
16:21
@RоryMcCune ey up
@kalina I'm not crazy, but my behavioural norms are not general society's norms
because society is obviously slightly wrong
obviously
try telling society that
16:22
@RоryMcCune that's a nice plane flying overhead
@kalina society doesn't listen
oh there are wind turbines in the distance
@kalina we had a combination of transatlantic jets, a helicopter and a micro-light today
you should go and plug those directly into your house
@RоryMcCune oh look suede hills
16:23
@kalina I do like a nice wind turbine
@RoryAlsop they make such a relaxing noise
just lay on the ground near one watching the blades while looking at the sky smoking a huge cone
@TildalWave there you go that shot's less suede
@kalina the big ones do. Across from where I grew up in Orkney was the testing ground for the really big ones - we went and lay under where the blade came down (this one was bigger than a 747 wingspan) and it was really 'whoosh'-y
16:25
also no wind turbines :)
(if that's an acceptable adjective
@RоryMcCune I don't know what that means
@RоryMcCune erm, that was me :P
whoops yeah wrong reply
you mistook @TildalWave for me?
16:26
better now
@kalina no, my tired arm mis-clicked
@kalina that sounds like a dangerous thing :-)
why are you tired this early in the day
@RоryMcCune I thought it was your legs that were tired from the walk
16:26
@kalina I've been walking for the last 8 hours and 20 minutes?
@RоryMcCune it's nice but I have to wonder how come they're so barren rock, that's probably not too high for pines at least?
@RoryAlsop climbing pole transfers some of the effort to the arms :)
wind erosion?
@RоryMcCune so...? I spent the first four hours of the day dancing, the second four hours of the day travelling, 2 hours of the day dying on the roadside and then an hour chatting and then sleep
@RоryMcCune perfect day for it. We walked for about an hour this morning in Edinburgh, then spent some time in Falkirk and Slmannan before arriving home and now chilling in the back graden listening to loud Suede :-)
16:27
@TildalWave yeah quite windy, there's a tonne of trees lower down, that hill is about 725m high
I suppose you are a fogey and that it must be hard work merely standing up right
@kalina why were you dying by the roadside?
@RоryMcCune which ones did you get - the slightly sprung ones?
@RоryMcCune I decided to go for a full 15km run with no preparation while tired and coming down off the weekend's supply
I made it about 2km in before realizing that it wasn't going to happen
@kalina woah - good on you for trying
16:28
@RoryAlsop yeah they are a little bit, but a bit lightweight, I managed to bend mine today so may need a new one
@RoryAlsop this morning was proper midsummer weather around here
it seemed logical
That's how I used to do all my marathon training - go out on the lash until very late with a friend, wake up on her couch then run until throwing up became awfully likely
obviously the logic skipped several important steps
@kalina heh, I think we did about 23km today but walking, with about 1.1km of ascent/descent
@RоryMcCune did you see there's a wee adventure race we might try this year - the Bing Blazer. Only 11km, but 6 separate ascents (and descents) of West Lothian bings :-)
16:30
@RоryMcCune yeah that should still be well within the tree line... it's almost as if something happened to the place suddenly more than slow erosion or none at all if there's trees growing there and stop it... is a lot of that glacial?
@RoryAlsop cool...
because I'd understand that, if glaciers simply stripped the tops of all the soil
@RоryMcCune well, good for the fitness
@TildalWave hmm must be a scottish thing, I dont think apart from commercial forestry we see many trees near the tops of our hills, that said they are pretty rocky...
most of the tree loss in Scotland was caused by man - we now have almost no 'native' forest at all
16:32
damn those men
@kalina this is true and I'm sure I'll appreciate that when my feet recover.. :) it was very pretty scenery as welll...
always ruining everything
@kalina possibly women helped - history doesn't say...
@RoryAlsop history does say, women weren't allowed rights until the 20th century, if women were involved their contribution would be classed as slavery
which makes it all about the men
@RоryMcCune yeah but they're not pointy peaks like in the Alps, they're with pretty flat tops like older mountain massives so I'd think that soil would persist for longer and that would mean trees... unless something stripped most of the soil off, or the soil is too salty or something like that
16:36
@RoryAlsop watched the bing blazer promo vid, looks like a lot of muddy fun :)
^ duck and cover;)
@kalina in that time period, (about 3900 years ago) in the highlands, there is nothing to suggest slavery, or an over-dominating male 'power' - between then and the Roman's arrival, most of the tree loss was from farmers (male and female - very little distinguishing them)
@RoryAlsop from mountain tops?
@RoryAlsop are you saying that scottish women look like scottish men?
@TildalWave all over - removal from large areas just speeds up erosion of all types
@kalina skirts...
kilts...
lol
16:39
@RoryAlsop sure, that's still obvious e.g. at half the Northern Adriatic islands where they took trees for Venice from
@RoryAlsop Is that a euphemism?
@MarkBuffalo emmm - I tried, but I can't make it be one
@MarkBuffalo no that's how erosion works
@MarkBuffalo, everything here is;)
I have managed to avoid trousers (american: pants) all weekend! Take that adulthood you wont take me without a fight
2
16:40
@silverpenguin, grats!
@silverpenguin me too
@kalina it always feels like a great acheivement doesnt it
@silverpenguin move to Scotland - you can go out clubbing without trousers and no-one bats an eyelid. Kilts FTW
@RoryAlsop man skirts?
@silverpenguin freedomwear.
16:43
@silverpenguin not really no
there are so many alternatives
Anyone seen the carry on film where the scotish start losing a war because they wear underpants under the kilts? :p
@silverpenguin yep - Carry on up the Khyber
wait, Scots don't wear underpants under their kilts?
@kalina nope :-)
you must have known that
surely
16:45
the brief moments I've been in scotland had me thinking of other things
@RoryAlsop brilliant film
it's not really something I considered
@kalina lol
the nation is famous/infamous for nae pants
@kalina, didn't you stumble upon that fact by 'coincedence'?;)
@SmokeDispenser I've never been with a scottish guy
certainly not one wearing a kilt
I had all on keeping in a straight face when presented with a man wearing a kilt in all honesty
16:47
@kalina heh - without thinking "Ohmygod- he's going commando!"
I just stepped in a wet 0atch on my floor. Now my sock is wet. Weekend ruined
not to mention the accent
the scottish have the perfect freedom wear;) thought that was something everyone knew.
@kalina What are you saying about @RоryMcCune's accent?
@RoryAlsop he obviously spends a lot of time outside of Scotland since he speaks in an understandable accent most of the time
16:48
@RoryAlsop hey I'm sure I can find a video of you on Youtube too ya know :op
@kalina there is much of central Scotland that speaks in pretty understandable accents - even I am understandable.
Sec.SE T-Shirt and all
@RоryMcCune I recognize that room layout, I must have seen this
16:50
@RоryMcCune gotta have a Sec.SE shirt
@kalina Or one of mine from the same place I'd guess
it's essential talk-wear
@RoryAlsop exactly
@RоryMcCune no your room was narrower
16:51
like you were presenting in a closed corridor
oh right, well maybe
this isn't the pen testing must die video though is it
@kalina no that was at B-Sides London
PEN TESTING MUST DIE
@RоryMcCune bah I saw both of these, haven't you got something new like from the irn bru festival securitay?
@TildalWave don't think this year's are out yet
@TildalWave this year's ones aren't up yet :(
16:52
So many scotch eggs in here
@kalina Anything's a euphemism if you're brave enough.
@MarkBuffalo are you questioning my... brave... ness?
@silverpenguin now made from real scots
@kalina i thought scotch eggs were just scotish testicles in breadcrumbs
16:54
Hello. I wanted to ask about Protonmail and whether or not it is considered a secure/safe/trusted email service. Would such a question be on-topic?
I am not a ginger
@Thomas email services by definition are not secure/safe or trusted
@kalina lol
since they communicate in plain text
49
Q: "Is (x) Secure" Question Anti-Pattern

Rоry McCuneA common problem that I see with questions is that they ask something like "Is (x) secure", which to me is an unanswerable question, the same way as asking "is the city north", it has no meaning in an absolute sense and requires context In order for a question to make sense the asker needs to pr...

@kalina, except that proton mail kinda rethinks the whole concept.
16:55
@k
@kalina: From what I understand they actually encrypt all email.
how do you think that works when every other email supplier on the planet doesn't?
Ok, so between two Protonmail accounts at least.
oh this brings back some memories :)
Here is a Tom Leek post regarding Proton Mail
@TildalWave: Thanks.
16:58
I doubt you will need any additional resources

« first day (1921 days earlier)      last day (3257 days later) »