The DMZ

Stack Exchange

05:01

A new study finds that if you give rats a cell phone and a lever they can push to improve the signal, the rats will chew on the cell phone until it breaks and your research supervisors will start to ask some questions about your grant money.

Iszi

05:22

Ok, does MD5 naturally break down with single-character strings or am I doing something wrong? Trying to golf a PowerShell script to brute-force MD5 hashes, but the bit I'm using to generate hashes doesn't seem to work properly with single-character strings. (Of course, trying to test with single-character strings first so the test will run quickly.) Most characters will make a 31-digit (hex) hash while some (so far, only '0') will put out the expected 32.

Ok. Tested 94 different single-character strings, and only 34 came up with 32-digit hashes.

In related news, counting in (roughly) base 94 seems to take quite awhile starting with just 3-digit numbers.

tylerl

05:48

@Iszi wtf?

MD5 works on any string length.

...so presumably you're doing it wrong. Or Microsoft is.

Could be that an initial zero is getting trimmed off. Test against a different hash implmeentation

 A 7fc56270e7a70fa81a5935b72eacbe29
 B 9d5ed678fe57bcca610140957afab571
 C 0d61f8370cad1d412f80b84d143e1257
 D f623e75af30e62bbd73d6df5b50bb7b5
 E 3a3ea00cfc35332cedf6e5e9a32e94da
 F 800618943025315f869e4e1f09471012

also try md5sum.org

Iszi

07:13

@tylerl Yeah, looks like you might be right about the leading zeroes.

F 80618943025315f869e4e1f9471012

Third character in F is a leading zero, as is another one later on, and those are the only zeroes missing in my output.

So I just need to reconfigure the formatting of the hex output.

Added in enforced double-digits and that's fixed it. Thanks.

Lighty

08:02

'G morning people

AviD

@tylerl @Iszi actually MD5 does not work on ANY strings. It works on bytes.

@Iszi did you base64 it first, or at least .toByteArray() it?

Iszi

@AviD [System.Text.Encoding]::UTF8.GetBytes('string')

AviD

@Iszi ah nevermind me then.

tylerl

@AviD Thank you my pedantic imaginary friend

4

AviD

@Iszi yeah that

tylerl

08:06

"any string of bytes"

better?

Iszi

I knew I had it close, since I had a sample input/hash pair to compare against that was working right.

AviD

@tylerl you are welcome, pigment of my imagination.

Iszi

Just got stuck for a minute on why some of the outputs were screwy.

AviD

@Iszi thats a strange bug to encounter though.

Iszi

@AviD Apparently the operations I'm doing to actually make the hash result in an array of hex codes, instead of one string.

Actually, not even. IIRC, they're just stored as numbers. By default, it would be decimal-formatted.

AviD

08:08

@Iszi "array of hex codes" you mean a byte array, right? ;-)

Iszi

AviD

ahhh

Iszi

To fix it up, I've gotta do this...

AviD

so those numbers are actually the individual bytes, printed out - by default as decimal to string?

Iszi

@AviD Yeah. Default display format for numbers is decimal.

AviD

08:11

hmm

Iszi

The fixup forces the format to double-digit hex, and concatenates.

tylerl

@Iszi jesus that looks painful. Why, god why, are you using powershell?

AviD

I think you should be able to do a UTF8.GetString(..) on the original statement

@tylerl powershell is awesome!

Iszi

@tylerl Because I can.

tylerl

@Iszi [tylerl@home]$ echo -n "string" | md5sum

aaaand DONE.

Iszi

08:14

Yeah, Windows isn't cool like that yet.

Right now, the only built-in hashing is for files.

AviD

@Iszi but so much more awesome!

Iszi

@AviD Yeah, GetString didn't quite work...

tylerl

@AviD one of my favorite things about Google: nobody uses Windows.

Iszi

AviD

@tylerl thanks for the tip, took another clueless hipster religious place off my shortlist!

wait, why UTF8?

Journeyman Geek

08:16

hehe

AviD

UTF 8 is the spawn of the devil

Iszi

@AviD What do you mean why UTF8?

Journeyman Geek

@tylerl: Its mostly linux with some mac systems isn't it?

tylerl

@JourneymanGeek most people have both a Linux desktop and a Macbook. But it's whatever you want. Theoretically you can choose windows (if you have appropriate justification). But you'll look like a tool.

Journeyman Geek

Makes sense

AviD

08:18

@Iszi well, you could also try .ToString()

Journeyman Geek

Yeah, I read about it when a recruiter for SRE contacted me :(

AviD

but I dont think tha twould work...

tylerl

@AviD srsly?

AviD

unless you use the ByteConverter

tylerl

What do you prefer over UTF8?

AviD

08:18

@tylerl have you seen the spec?

@tylerl uhh because all you hipster macbois don't look like tools? ;-)

Iszi

@AviD Nope. Output was:

System.Byte[]

tylerl

YUP. It's a brilliant way of packing a crazy huge codespace into a reasonably efficient serialization scheme.

AviD

@tylerl anything really, even utf8 is fine, as long as I dont have to muck around in the byte structure.

@tylerl "brilliant" "efficient"

actually no, yeah I'll give you that

but once you spend some time with overlong UTF8 representations - you'll understand what I'm talking about

tylerl

Ken Thompson is a pretty smart fellow.

AviD

@tylerl no dispute there.

Iszi

08:22

Killer thing about this script is the goal is to brute-force an MD5 hash of a 9-character input. To generate the inputs for hashing, I've effectively taught the script how to count in base-94. It goes okay up until it hits around 3 digits. Then it just seems to take forever. Don't want to imagine how long it will take to get to 9.

tylerl

Sure, the upper ranges of the code space are stored much less efficiently, but in exchange for that you get basically 1-byte-1-char for 98% of your network traffic.

AviD

@Iszi why dont you just count each character / byte separately?

also, why not just use hashcat?

Iszi

@AviD Perhaps because I'm inexperienced in these things? Do elaborate, but also consider I'm playing code-golf here.

AviD

ahh code golf then... nevermind I guess

also ignore my very practical tool suggestion

Iszi

One of the submissions for this actually put something together that would run any real system out of memory before it got anywhere near the answer.

But it would work otherwise, in theory.

AviD

08:26

you could do a 9-deep nested loop...

tylerl

@Iszi brute force, code golf, Powershell. They go together like peanut butter and vinegar.

Iszi

@AviD Not sure that'd be more efficient in terms of character count. I've only got about a half-dozen if statements involved in my counter. And some of that can probably be optimized.

Haven't actually golfed the base-94 counting part yet.

Gotta get it mashed together and playing nice with the hashing part first.

AviD

not sure how you mean base-94 counting, but you could have a byte array, sequentially increasing each byte through allowed values.

Iszi

@AviD I have it create a reverse-indexed array of characters (last element of the array is the first "digit" of the "number") starting with code 33 (!) and running up to code 126 (~). Each time an element in the array hits 126, the next element is incremented (or created as 33 if non-existing) and the capped one is reset to 33.

(Not sure if that made any sense.)

AviD

ah that could work

why does it slow down then a 3 digits? It should scale linearly.

Iszi

08:35

@AviD Oh, it's still trucking along at the same speed. But it's the difference between counting to about 9,000 and counting to around 821,000.

AviD

ah.

Iszi

That fourth digit's gonna take awhile to show up.

AviD

okay, calculate this quickly: at 94 values per char, how many overall possiblities would you need to test?

Iszi

Google says 5.729948e+17

AviD

calce.exe says 572,994,802,228,616,704

so same, but calc seems more useful, somehow.

now, what is your rate of calculations per second?

Iszi

08:37

Haven't really bothered to benchmark.

AviD

thumb to the wind.

I would guess 70 M at most, probably substantially less.

Iszi

Actually, I could tell you in a sec.

AviD

but even at that speed - how long would it take....? ;-)

Iszi

Took about 2 seconds to hit 3 digits.

AviD

hint: it is well over 200 years.

@Iszi ooo thats order of magnitude slower.

I propose you set up a foundation in your will, so that your great-great-great-great-great-grandchildren can see the results.

2

Iszi

08:40

Yeah, I'm not planning on actually proving that this thing can do the 9-character bit starting from zero.

AviD

@Iszi btw, on average it is only half that ;-)

oclHashcat would kick that script's butte

Iszi

@AviD Maybe if you're checking randomly. If you're starting with a single digit and counting up, it's going to be way more than half.

AviD

@Iszi assuming the password is random, then no - statistically you would need to test half.

Iszi

Password is known to be 9 characters, but our code has to start from 1.

AviD

ah.

wait, what why?

Iszi

08:42

Objective isn't to be fast anyway. It's to be small.

AviD

also does \0x0 count as a char?

Iszi

Printable characters.

AviD

@Iszi @Simon wins on both counts! woot!

4

Lucas Kauffman

@AviD cheecky

David Freitag

I wonder how golfable F# is

AviD

08:46

I wonder how golfable yo momma is

David Freitag

@AviD I would say its possible, but not without making a huge mess.

AviD

0

Q: What are the purposes of device ownership?

There are two scenarios that I have saw device ownership. In TPM, there is an ownership establishment procedure. When we purchase a new cell phone, the SIM card activation also has some ownership establishment procedure. What are the main purposes of these device ownership establishment?

am I missing something, or are these special terms in some niche sub-field that I am not familiar with?

or is the key to the question in the tags, and this is a TPM concept?

Gilles

@AviD it is a TPM concept

AviD

@Gilles damn them all

why cant he put that in the frikkin question??

Gilles

> In TPM, there is an ownership establishment procedure.

AviD

08:51

but I am not familiar enough with those terms to be able to make a sensible edit out of it.

@Gilles errr

umm

it seems like he is saying there that its only one of his scenarios

I've noticed you people are really nasty to @Simon. Any time I say something mean about him (and lets be honest, thats pretty often), it always gets lots of stars.

I mean, I'm just joking with him, yknow like sibling rivalry, but you guys are just nasty.

Rоry McCune

@AviD so the person who says the nasty things is nicer than those who find them amusing ?

:op

AviD

heh, I expected that one to be starred up the wazoo

@RоryMcCune of course! you guys are cyberbullies!

#SimonGate

Iszi

09:23

@AviD I don't think anyone around here wants anything to do with a Tigger's wazoo.

AviD

09:38

@Iszi thats not what your mom said.

kalina

why is the world outside my duvet so cold

AviD

@kalina must be lex luthor.

Rory Alsop

@kalina ...because you are inside your duvet </cringemode>

:-)

I know - I just couldn't resist

kalina

did you just call me hot

aren't you like 60

Rory Alsop

It was minus 3 today - lovely ice everywhere

pffffft

yeah

at least 600

kalina

09:49

that's slightly creepy

Rory Alsop

I know, right

kalina

still not on par with if Simon had said it

Rory Alsop

hahahahahaha - phew

kalina

but still slightly creepy

Rory Alsop

you could try one of the following: central heating; gloves; jumping about; etc

kalina

09:51

central heating is on but still warming up, gloves are a little extreme and only warm a small part of my body, enthusiastic jumping about results in unexpected boob pains

Tinned_Tuna

@RoryAlsop of course the best way to get warm, as all adults know is... build an ice fort!

Rory Alsop

@Tinned_Tuna perfect answer - and much less 'creepy' than any answer I could have possibly given to @kalina

although @kalina - I didn't mean just gloves. I meant in addition to other garments!!

kalina

but surely ice forts have a rather cold building process

Rory Alsop

@kalina simple then - set your central heating to come on earlier

AviD

@RoryAlsop no no, that is the BEST way to build your ice fort!

kalina

09:53

I think I'm just going to hibernate for the winter

AviD

aaaaand creepy again ;-)

Rory Alsop

@AviD well done!

Keeping up the side for us old folks :-)

AviD

@RoryAlsop #SimonGate

Tinned_Tuna

@kalina no, it warms you up moving all the blocks about. Nothing like picking things up and putting them down again!

kalina

@Tinned_Tuna that sounds like a lot of physical exertion. If I were going to exert myself to that extent, surely just having sex would be the quickest and easiest way to generate heat?

Rory Alsop

09:56

@kalina well, obviously - but imagine how creepy @AviD would sound suggesting that

:-)

AviD

@kalina actually, making these comments, in this room, is the quickest and easiest way to generate heat.

Tinned_Tuna

@kalina ew, no. Firstly, that's going to be all sticky. Secondly, you have to take clothes off to do that. At least traditionally. How cold do you think that's going to make you?

AviD

Especially if @Simon or @Adnan were around.

Rory Alsop

@AviD I thought @kalina has the power of fire! That's pretty hot.

AviD

@RoryAlsop what do you think "fire" is referring to?

Tinned_Tuna

09:57

@RoryAlsop ah yes, the power of fire. Huddling round a bin of burning @Simon s

AviD

when @kalina causes @Simon to spontaneously combust, the flames start from his pants.

Rory Alsop

@AviD Erm... I plead Arthur Brown!

AviD

(trousers).

@RoryAlsop uhhh.... the linebacker or the singer?

Rory Alsop

The one who has the crazy world :-)

AviD

nevermind, its clear you meant this one

Arthur Stanley Brown

Arthur Stanley Brown (20 May 1912 – 6 July 2002) was charged in 1998 for the 26 August 1970 rape and murder of Judith and Susan Mackay in Townsville, Queensland. The jury failed to reach a verdict and a new trial was blocked on the grounds that Brown was too senile to be tried again. Brown's arrest attracted wide publicity leading to a witness to the abduction of two children from Adelaide oval in 1973 identifying Brown as the man she had seen. Brown is considered a suspect for the Beaumont children disappearance based on the connections that have been made between him and the Adelaide oval abduction...

Rory Alsop

09:59

How very randomly Wikipedia

AviD

did... did I just make a rape joke that was not too off?

Rory Alsop

I don't think so

AviD

so I made a murder joke then.

Rory Alsop

I think you just linked to a wikipedia page :-)

AviD

well, yeah, but it was funny in context

anyway, moving on then....

I just ruled out the option of building a RDP virtual channel to override faulty mouse behavior in RemoteFX.

after ruling out building a custom mouse driver to override faulty mouse behavior in RemoteFX.

so I'm stuck back at faulty mouse behavior in RemoteFX. :-(

Rory Alsop

10:03

I see the common thread there - do you need RemoteFX?

kalina

@RoryAlsop touché

@AviD :$

AviD

@RoryAlsop yeah

kalina

@Tinned_Tuna you don't have to take your clothes off

AviD

RDPing into a VM works brilliant for gaming. RemoteFX / vGPU is the key to that.

Rory Alsop

@kalina Oh no. To have a good time.

kalina

10:04

@AviD ...

Rory Alsop

@kalina We could dance at parties. All night.

AviD

problem is the mouse driver for RDP relays relative location instead of movement.

Rory Alsop

Just drinking cherry wine

kalina

@RoryAlsop it's still possible to have a good time with your clothes on

AviD

this screws up 3D-heavy apps, like first-person shooters.

Tinned_Tuna

10:05

@kalina oh thank god, I'm in the office right now! I don't think my co-workers would appreciate it if I suddenly stripped!

kalina

provided those clothes include a skirt or dress of some kind

AviD

@RoryAlsop yup. creepy again. #SimonGate.

kalina

@RoryAlsop I doubt your heart could keep up

AviD

@RoryAlsop I found a lot of people complaining about it online, but not found any solution for it yet :-(

Rory Alsop

@kalina not gonna respond... :-) other than to say - I guess you didn't get the music reference then :-(

AviD

10:07

so I thought maybe build one - but that is crazy complicated, and I am NOT in the mood to start building kernel drivers, or digging in the virtual channels again.

kalina

@RoryAlsop no it's far too early for intelligent, meaningful conversation from my end

Rory Alsop

@AviD you'll have any neckbeard privileges rescinded soon!

Tinned_Tuna

@kalina further, while a skirt or a dress would probably be quite fun to wear (although, not entirely my style, to be fair), I think that in this weather, it would be a poor decision.

AviD

@kalina is that an Ace Ventura reference?

kalina

@AviD no

Rory Alsop

10:08

►

kalina

well it could be, but not intentionally

Rory Alsop

@AviD hahahahaha

Arperum

@RoryAlsop http is missing

kalina

I think @Arperum should be kicked for suggesting http over https

Rory Alsop

lol

AviD

10:09

its frikkin youtube

Rory Alsop

@AviD that sounds more fun than normal youtube

AviD

hehe

kalina

you know when you get bed in and bed just swallows you up and you're all comfy and surrounded by duvet?

Rory Alsop

@kalina ... okaaaay

kalina

that's me

I am all comfy and surrounded by duvet

AviD

10:10

@kalina you're @RoryAlsop's bed?

Arperum

@kalina The thing is that http oneboxes, https doesn't afaik.

kalina

no

Rory Alsop

@AviD creeeeeepy

:-)

AviD

@RoryAlsop shame on you

Rory Alsop

heh

kalina

10:11

what is it with the overwhelming creepy going on in here this morning

it's like Simon has infected you all with his aids

AviD

#SimonGate

Rory Alsop

When my alarm goes off at ungodly o'clock, I just like getting out of bed. Admittedly the hot shower before going to work is good, but I see no benefit in staying in bed when there's things I could do out of it

kalina

I'm not like that at all

Rory Alsop

I am very much a morning and night person, though. Mid afternoons suck a little in my world, but aside from that it's all good

David Freitag

Does anyone know if there is a simple way of getting some information about the system ram from a debian terminal?

Arperum

10:13

hmmm, after testing: https youtube does onebox. Good to know.

Rоry McCune

@RoryAlsop I'm glad I saw that before going and looking out that song..

kalina

@DavidFreitag could you not just free

AviD

@RoryAlsop smbc-comics.com/?id=3181

Tinned_Tuna

@DavidFreitag less /proc/meminfo

David Freitag

specifically the clock speed of the ram

Arperum

10:14

@RoryAlsop mornings are the worst. I like to sleep through them.

Tinned_Tuna

@DavidFreitag I'd wager there's something in /proc that'll satisfy you. meminfo is just about sizes though

David Freitag

I found my answer. superuser.com/questions/20182/…

kalina

amazing

Rоry McCune

@AviD may be of use.. gallery.technet.microsoft.com/?CR_CC=200438481

kalina

anybody would have thought you had googled it before asking us

those people would have been wrong

David Freitag

10:17

I was in the process of googling

kalina

yeah, of course you were

just like I'm in the process of getting out of bed

AviD

@RоryMcCune just in general....?

kalina

NOT

David Freitag

I visited the first link

Rоry McCune

@AviD yeah

David Freitag

10:18

Then wondered if anyone knew it offhand

AviD

tq

kalina

I think everything typed into chat should return the first 5 google results before letting you submit your message

it would dramatically reduce the contents of chat

it would also stop silly questions and prevent me from typing "bored"

best idea ever

Rory Alsop

@Arperum mornings are the best. Mostly because most people see them as worst, so I immediately am at an advantage

@kalina what are the top 5 returns if you type 'bored' into google?

kalina

@RoryAlsop I have no idea, I've never done it

AviD

@RoryAlsop probably @kalina, complaining here in the DMZ.

2

Rory Alsop

10:23

@AviD lol

kalina

boredbutton.com

bored.com

i-am-bored.com

urban75.org/useless/bored.html

boredpanda.com

and I thought moving here would get me away from the cold

it's even worse because it's cold and the sun is out

Rоry McCune

@kalina well ya know Iowa can be really cold..

kalina

the weather was lovely when I was last in Australia

they were calling it a heatwave but it felt nice to me

fucking Iowa

asif I'd willingly live in the USA

except California

Rory Alsop

@kalina San Fran is lovely

it's the only city I have enjoyed visiting in the US

kalina

exactly, plus their liberal narcotics laws

Rоry McCune

10:28

@RoryAlsop I was going to say it can be a bit chilly, but then I remembered that's a huge plus for you :)

Rory Alsop

@RоryMcCune ;-P

kalina

I'm about to say "8 degrees is not warm" and then discovered the irony of me complaining about the temperature while half the channel is in Scotland, most likely under several feet of snow...

Rоry McCune

@kalina the snow on the hills does seem to be gradually making its way lower....

Rory Alsop

@kalina nah -the snow isn't lying in the central belt. How's it up your way Rory?

It's already back up at zero C now

Rоry McCune

@RoryAlsop snowy on the rest, not lying here yet

kalina

10:30

"back up to zero C"

hides under duvet

Rory Alsop

@kalina yeah - annoying. Everything is melting. The ice is now slushy. Meh

kalina

NP, I'll just continue complaining it's not 30 C

Rory Alsop

right - time to go for a drive before the slidy is gone for the day. Quick spin to t'other office. Back in a bit.

Enjoy duvet-time

David Freitag

@kalina It's -15° here right now.

kalina

@DavidFreitag that's not even a real temperature

AviD

10:35

@kalina it is here

David Freitag

@kalina That's not even with wind chill

AviD

well actually its only about 25 today.

kalina

@AviD 25 is pretty much the lower limit of what I find acceptable

well, 20 at a push

wandering around outside in this weather is guaranteed to make me miserable

David Freitag

@kalina don't you have like... a job? or something?

kalina

I do

I have an or something

I appreciate my or something, but it's a lot of work in bursts so I've found that over time my sleeping pattern has gone to shit

David Freitag

10:41

Sweet. NAS build is on its way.

kalina

the walk from bed to kettle and back again with coffee has reminded me that today I'm just going to spend the entire day in bed

I need some new toys to play with during down time

it's probably time I got a new phone

David Freitag

I had a oneplus one invite a few days ago

kalina

isn't that the super cheap hipster phone?>

David Freitag

Does @AviD have one?

AviD

@kalina not so cheap

@DavidFreitag ha! noooo.... I like good phones

David Freitag

10:48

@AviD $350 is pretty cheap

kalina

@AviD I think our definitions of cheap don't completely match up

AviD

@DavidFreitag thats midrange

Terry Chia

@DavidFreitag The implication being @AviD is a cheap hipster?

AviD

@TerryChia bastard. Cheap bastard is the term you're looking for.

kalina

basically

David Freitag

10:49

@AviD I should rephrase, it's cheap for what it is

kalina

guys, I have a problem

I currently own a HTC One M7

which in my mind is a "large" phone

David Freitag

M7? I thought you had an M8

AviD

@DavidFreitag its a cheap piece of crap with a knockoff OS. How is that cheap?

oh oh, I forgot to mock android's security model.

David Freitag

@AviD What do you prefer iOS?

kalina

@DavidFreitag I had an M8, I dropped it and went back to my M7

AviD

10:50

@DavidFreitag oh please, dont get me started on that toy.

kalina

the screen wasn't happy about the fall

AviD

WP8 on Lumia

;-)

kalina

I'm not too fussed, since it fell squarely into the "too large to be comfortably usable" category

David Freitag

@AviD Also, FTR it's taking quite a lot of self control not to argue with you right now.

AviD

@DavidFreitag hahaha, Troll Badge Achieved!

kalina

10:51

Ideally, I'd like something the size of the M7 but current, but everything released this year is larger

Terry Chia

@AviD WP's security model being there are no apps for that platform? ;)

AviD

heh, yes I read Taylor too ;-)

kalina

I have looked at Windows phones, I like the UI

David Freitag

@kalina If the M7 is comparable in size to the M8, then the oneplus one is exactly the same size (give or take a few millimeters) and thinner. About half as thick.

kalina

I don't really want to buy back into the Apple ecosystem

@DavidFreitag the M7 it notably smaller than the M8

David Freitag

10:53

@kalina I went from a Nexus 5 to the onplus one. It's quite large in comparison.

kalina

@DavidFreitag Nexus 5 is the right sort of size for me

but it's not a current generation "flagship" model

David Freitag

@kalina I would recommend against the Nexus 5. While it is a really nice phone it suffers from the same problem all of the Nexus devices have. It's battery is much too small.

@kalina Technically it's still Google's current flagship.

kalina

I wouldn't buy a last generation... anything, given the option

@DavidFreitag nexus 6 is out

nexus 6 is too large

AviD

@DavidFreitag and what does that tell you about Google?

David Freitag

@kalina That ain't no phone it's a phablet

kalina

10:55

you call it phablet, I call it big phone

the size introduces usability issues

David Freitag

@AviD Listen you stuffed imaginary psychologist...

2

@kalina Yeah the oneplus one is barely usable with one hand

AviD

haha, first imaginary pedant, now imaginary psychologist.....

@DavidFreitag so is.... #SimonGate

kalina

@AviD is just imaginary, nobody can see or hear him

David Freitag

@AviD Sorry, pedantic imaginary psychologist.

kalina

so basically you're saying that my only real option is whatever cutdown samsung galaxy mini or htc mini gets released next year?

sad panda :(

David Freitag

10:58

@kalina Unfortunately manufacturers have gone the "Bigger is better" route.

There is always the new Moto X

AviD

bigger IS better

BIGGEST ROCK BEST ROCK

David Freitag

My friend just got one. It's quite nice.

AviD

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