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20:01
@tylerl Please, back that claim of yours. You "see a number of edits like this", and "adding a space". I'd like to see links so I can provide proper explanation, since "you'd love to hear why".
@Adnan duuude, touchy much?
looks like the @kalina story really got to you ;-)
@AviD Please notice that I extensively edited the title as well. I turned it into an actual question.
@AviD kalina story?
44 mins ago, by AviD
Title is better though.
@kalina little red riding hood?
I don't get it
20:03
@AviD Not at all, I know for a fact that I have two space-only edits (I think "the number" @tylerl is talking about), and the reason is because I changed my mind and I wanted to reverse/remove my vote after the grace period.
IIRC, many of us engage in this activity.
@Adnan in general this activity is normally frowned upon
@Adnan ?
orly?
changing your vote for no reason other than "you feel like it"
@Adnan well, two is, in fact, a number.
I've never been willing to do that. The editing system is clearly designed to not allow it.
20:05
not that I care, I don't use this site
@kalina yes, but not actually forbidden. Unlike dating your students.
@Simon youtube.com/watch?v=U5kuU9zhy6g listen from 50 secs
DAT MELODy
@kalina THIS IS NOT OKAY
@AviD some people date their students
@AviD why isn't it ok?
@kalina nevermind... was a friends quote.
20:06
that has to be the most ambiguous quote ever
AND
^ Lord of the rings quote
appears several thousand times
@kalina No, I change my mind about votes because, well, people change their minds depending on new inputs. There might be something in the post that I didn't see before, and now I see it.
@Adnan solution: read the post before you vote
It's perfectly normally. It's the scientific and rational approach.
no, the scientific and rational approach is to comprehend before taking action
20:07
@kalina PEOPLE LEARN FUCKING NEW THINGS!!
not sure if thats the whole clip....
@Adnan your face
@Adnan also:
2 mins ago, by kalina
not that I care, I don't use this site
@kalina It's just a necessary workaround for the broken-by-design vote locking
@kalina good, now you can geeeeet out
It's not broken, it's designed to stop you fucking around with votes
editing a post isn't a solution, too many edits forces a question into community wiki
so if each of you edit a post twice to add a space, you're just abusing the system
20:09
@Adnan you familiar with Carlin's "The F-Word"?
Actually Jeff claims it's designed to counter tactical down voting
@Adnan also, fucking fuck.
Or just, GTFO
1 min ago, by kalina
It's not broken, it's designed to stop you fucking around with votes
@Adnan you don't like any possibility of you being wrong do you?
even the thought of it drives you crazy
The problem is that it doesn't just block tactical downvotes, it blocks cases where you learn something new
20:10
@kalina Not at all, I just happen to be right most of the fucking time.
@Adnan well you're not
I am technically correct in this instance, and as you know, technically correct is the best kind of correct.
It's like using a nuke because a single cockroach annoys you
6 mins ago, by kalina
not that I care, I don't use this site
@CodesInChaos do you always exaggerate like this?
@Adnan oh this is no longer about the site, this is about seeing how irate I can make you
beep boop I am pushing @Adnan's buttons
@kalina Only when I'm not flying doomstars through security holes
20:12
@kalina Previous engagements have proven that you can, to a high degree.
@Adnan If it's any consolation, I'm laughing my ass off
@LucasKauffman :*
@tylerl So?
@Adnan yes?
@Adnan @kalina - I'm going to have to ask both of you to go ahead and take it easy, mmkay?
20:14
Found "the number" you were talking about?
@AviD Why don't you take it easy?
@AviD aww c'mon, I just said that I'm laughing, it's not my fault
too much antagonism going around, and I already have a couple of teenage daughters here.
@kalina yeah, one of them is laughing while tormenting the other.
just like my girls...
@Adnan I've seen about 4 edits that seemed unusual, and I couldn't see why you would take the effort. Not trying to start a fight; just wanted to understand the reasoning.
people in this room need to stop comparing me to other girls they know
@AviD But I'm not feeling tormented.
20:15
so far I'm Simon's ex and your daughter
this is some serious shit
@kalina I always compare you to my 10 year old niece.
@kalina I'm not, I was comparing @Adnan to girls I know ;-)
hah
@Adnan you pervert.
@tylerl I know you weren't starting a fight. It's alright, I'm happy I explained.
20:16
isn't there an ignore user function on this thing?
I don't have a 10 year old niece.
but yeah, even if neither of you are offended, it is creating a toxic environment.
@LucasKauffman Click on @Kalina's avatar.
Then people like @ScottPack will feel too comfortable.
"Ignore this user"
20:18
breaks the css for the userlist
think there's a post on meta on how to fix it if it bothers you
@Adnan and @kalina can both of you please shake the sand out of your vaginas. Either ignore each other or be nice. Stop arguing. Now!
6
I don't like that phrase
@LucasKauffman this.
@LucasKauffman 3rded
@kalina Will you let me be nice to you?
20:20
@Adnan no, I don't like you
OK, both of you. You can fight if you like, just not in public.
it's probably your odour
@tylerl don't say that! He'll come stalk me on IRC
@kalina right can you get a private chat room please?
@LucasKauffman good point, the old saying "get a room" does seem appropriate in this instance..
fast forward 3 years
20:22
@RoryMcCune hehehe
@CodesInChaos That's inefficient. Cockroaches are 200 times more resilient to radiation than humans.
me still half drunk in church at he marriage of @kalina and @Adnan
just FYI, that wasn't me who flagged that
stop freaking out.
oh crap, cmon, guys, back to flagwars?
20:25
now look what you did, loads of people are joining
well, that's one way to bring people to a room i guess
@whoever did all that flagging
ohh noooesss
and I disagree with @Adnan getting suspended for an hour for that -.-
Alright I guess both of you should be put in the time out corner <.<
20:25
kal you aren't flinging people into the sun again are you? :P
@RhysW @Krazer now you will recieve all our event pings for evar.
@RhysW I am completely innocent
@kalina he got suspended?
Everyone knows the way to start a party is to insult someone.
@AviD for an hour, if you'd undo it
20:25
@AviD aye
@AviD eh, been here before i think
aww cripes, someone validated those flags?
because i get them all anyway
@AviD Which flags?
somebody flagged a bunch of @adnan exploding
somebody else validated them
20:27
@AviD can you unban adnan?
okay, all new mods dropping in - unbunch your panties, the situation is being handled.
@LucasKauffman done
Bravi, white knights. Bravi!
SNAFU
I was suspended for 2 and a half hours.
20:27
@ManishEarth Knew you were everywhere :P
@ManishEarth cool, teach me how for next time?
I have a feeling I will need it...
@Adnan you -> irc
NOOO I ONLY MEANT TO LURK IN THE TRANSCRIPT IGNORE ME
@AviD I keep mistaking your gravatar for an ant eater
@OrigamiRobot you'll get event notifications for a month now
20:28
@AviD Step (1): Ping Manish. Step (2): Give cookies. Step (3) Receive unban
10
@OrigamiRobot NOOO COME BACK
@OrigamiRobot ping
@RhysW huh?? It's a tigger!
OK, that got 3 simultaneous stars
@ManishEarth you forgot 4) ??? 5) Profit
@AviD yeah im not sure how im making that mistake tbh, im even wearing my glasses
@AviD go to the profile, there are goodies under "moderation tools"
@LucasKauffman 500mb of a video? eh?
20:29
@ThomasPornin I deliberately chose cockroaches for their radiation resistance. The voting lock doesn't really prevent tactical downvoting, but causes lots of collateral damage.
@ManishEarth I had to dance the robot as well for bonus points
hahaha
hey, I didnt realize @Adnan was on Friends!
I'm sure I've expressed this before, but is anyone else ever frustrated when they have a question reach "Popular Question" (1,000+ views) status while having a vote rank of <10?
@Iszi sure. just means the title is more awesome than the question.
20:31
@AviD noooooooooo! now im going to have to o and rewatch every series of friends! why would you do this to meeee!
@Iszi no, not in the slightest.
Right. I forgot this room is full of assholes. ;-)
@Iszi I am.
@RhysW just that one clip, thats about all of it.
@Seth Except you, you're exempt from my previous statement.
20:32
@AviD nope, the damage is done, you reminded me of it now
But then, voting is a problem where I come from.
@Iszi immensely so, lots of people with no opinions popping through apparently
@Iszi I only came because of teh flagz.
@Seth the kitchen?
So... turns out that denial of service attack from a single IP address is a less-effective takedown strategy.
20:32
@AviD No, Ask Ubuntu.
who knew!
@tylerl learnt through experience?
Uhh.. Isn't that obvious?
@AviD What's this now?
@Seth Ah, thanks for that. Generally, I try not to take offense with certain language - especially in here - but there were just a few too many f-bombs being dropped in the transcript, with apparently hostile intent, for my liking.
20:33
@Iszi says the person with a starred comment calling everyone in the room an a$$hole :P
@Iszi Agreed.
I usually let one or two swears by, but that was a lot. Esp. for this room IMO.
@RhysW The winky implies non-hostile intent, dick. ;-P
@Iszi totally agree. it is a word most effective when used sparingly.
@RhysW Well, I was the one teaching the lesson, but yeah. Got a call "my server is down" .. check the netstat ... that's strange, why all this traffic from 84.240.30.56? "OK, server's up again"
@Seth you mean "even" for this room.
20:34
@Iszi Oh those are the rules are they ;) prepare for my inevitable revenge!
@AviD No, I meant especially. I wouldn't have even blinked if it came from the Comms.
@RhysW yes, we will be sure to be winking while we break his kneecaps.
@AviD Nonsense, I don't have a long hair.
@Seth ah, I guess everything is relative.
@RhysW Careful now. An unspoken implication can be subverted by a more obvious expression of intent.
20:35
usually our profanity is in good taste.
@AviD That sounds removes sunglasses Smashing YEAHHHH!!
@RhysW you and your British phrases
@RhysW Removes sunglasses? I thought he usually put them on before the punchline?
@ManishEarth ... orright Govenor?
@AviD Yes pretty much.
I'm out.
20:37
@Iszi I put them on for the first joke, then i had to remove them, or im the ass wearing two pairs of sunglasses
@Adnan wow time flies
@RhysW Well if you're going to be an ass at all, you may as well be the ass with eyes that are well-protected from ultraviolet rays.
@Iszi i had a slight problem, they were polarised in opposite directions, thus making me blind
@RhysW D'oh!
It's all in the details
20:39
@AviD I may have just seen them and thought it would be fun to throw fuel on the fire, but then again I might not have
@AJHenderson It means you missed me too much..?
@AviD Re "Still secure, though, since you obviously know the password..." umm, no? Having knowledge of the username and password in this particular case does not necessarily imply that an individual knows this is the correct username and password for a Domain Admin account.
@Seth clearly we aren't trying hard enough
@Seth That's true. We're usually more subtle in our mind boggingly inappropriate commentary in here.
@Iszi Do you mean the fact that this user account is a domain admin, is what is potentially unknown, and thus assuming that fact is a security hole?
FAIL - dat is teh obscurity the cool kidz talk about.
11 mins ago, by AviD
usually our profanity is in good taste.
@Iszi I remember reading an in-depth risk analysis of this, how the domain identifier not being part of the security identifier is not a security hole, but I really dont remember where.
20:49
@AviD Not necessarily. Consider the rare edge case that a Domain Admin account having the same username & password as a Local Admin account on a non-joined system is a complete coincidence to which neither the Domain Admin nor the owner of the non-joined system are aware. How is this not a hole?
(Putting aside the fact that password selection should be random and/or complex enough as to nearly guarantee collision avoidance.)
Hold on. I need time to concoct a situation to fit my argument.
because boobies.
2
@Iszi because what would stop that local admin from creating an identically named domain of his own, with the same username/password?
@AviD marked one of your comments obsolete because I deleted mine you were replying to ... leave just the first one, that one is fine IMO
the issue here is that it is not about spoofing authentication, but accessing assets inappropriately on the remote server.
20:50
@LucasKauffman How many beers you had man?
@TildalWave 6 pack
nice ... what are we celebrating?
@AviD That's not a problem at all, but allowing that local admin access to the existing domain just because his UN & PW happen to match (without actually prompting him to log in to the domain) is.
@LucasKauffman What kind?
the remote server in fact has one source of authentication information. if your username and password match - thats it.
20:51
@TildalWave hack.lu beer filtration CTF challenge, ended up having to retake it three fucking times
@ScottPack Jupiler
@Iszi I meant there, and then access the remote server with his ostensibly same-domain account.
@AviD But it shouldn't be the same domain. SIDs between the two should not match.
think of it this way - password gets hashed. if your password hash matches the one I have on record for this account - you are authenticated.
hehehe ... I'm still with geolocation one, taking it easy too I should be doing other stuff ... but heck doing the CTF is more fun
@Iszi why not?
20:52
@AviD Because you created a new domain.
if I am malicious - I can make it match.
@AviD twss
@AviD Certainly, but that's not part of this equation.
@Iszi it is. because of that, the other situation does not play in this risk model.
now, the remaining issue is if an innocent user, accidentally has the same password - and username - as the domain admin.
If you're authenticated to a system as YourLocalSystem\YourUsername, you should not be able to automatically use that token to log into my domain as MyDomain\YourUsername.
20:54
@Iszi again, why not?
@AviD I thought that was the situation I was posing.
@Iszi okay, so see @ScottPack's comment.
@AviD Because, for all intents and purposes security-related, they're not the same account.
@AviD Which, where? Am I jumping into the transcript without reading again?
@Iszi no, but they are authentication-equivalent.
domain is a management concept, not an authentciation one.
@AviD And why ought it not be?
20:56
7 mins ago, by Iszi
(Putting aside the fact that password selection should be random and/or complex enough as to nearly guarantee collision avoidance.)
@Iszi oh sorry, it was yoiur comment.
@Iszi because it does not help, at least not in any malicious scenario.
@AviD I said that because we all know full well that users (and many Admins) don't choose good passwords.
@AviD I would say it's almost equivalent to doing away with usernames completely.
not at all.
(From a purely logical standpoint, not practical implementation.)
Well colour me confused.. Firstly the SIDs are different, secondly the usernames are also different. A fully qualified username "LocalPC\User" is not the same as "Domain\User" because they have different scopes.
hang on, I'm looking for the page with the analysis...
@David yes - but when authenticating to a remote server, e.g over SMB - it simply does not matter.
21:00
@David You're thinking like I'm thinking. But in practice that's not the case. If you're logged into LocalPC as LocalPC\User, and you have the same password as Domain\User, you can automatically authenticate to any domain system as Domain\User (without being prompted) even if LocalPC is not joined to the domain.
@AviD At the very least, the fact that the system requesting authentication is not joined to the domain should be a red flag.
@Iszi that is configurable.
but irrelevant.
I'd love to see a full analysis of that.
@AviD Ok, so it can be set such that StandalonePC\User cannot auto-login as Domain\User but DomainPC\User can?
If LocalPC is not joined to the domain that's a big hole in your group policy. I didn't think that should work anyhow.
ah found it! linked by wikipedia...
21:03
Excellent @AviD, let's see
Ah, good ol' Mark. Why don't we have him here?
hmm, on reading through, I think that is only about the SID, not the domain name. hang on...
Indeed. e.g. "As further evidence that a SID isn’t sufficient, remember that built-in accounts like the Local System account have the same SID on every computer, something that would be a major security hole if it was."
21:10
hmm. So perhaps it would behoove us to have that question asked on the site.
What is the question?
"If I have a local user account with the same username and password hash as a domain user, can I do nasty stuff on the domain"
@David Is domain-less pass-through authentication a risk. (or something like that).
FWIW, my answer would still be the same - If I know the password to a known account, I can authenticate regardless.
@David yea
:)
I am almost 100% certain that the answer will be "no", because your local user is not the same as the domain user. The names are different (when fully qualified) and so are the SIDs.
knowing the fact that that user is a domain admin (or really, whatever its privileges are) - is not real security.
21:12
I'd be interested to watch it though :)
@David you would be wrong :-)
it is actually a well known technique, to set up a local user with the same password as an account in the domain. Useful for e.g. authenticating from a non-domain webserver in the DMZ, to a backend domain database.
Not doubting I'm wrong, just want to see a decent writeup!
not today... at least not from me.
I will google when I've finished messing around with the PCB in front of me
but if ya do - link it here :-)
21:14
@AviD deadline friday GO
@LucasKauffman no, my deadline is tomorrow. I will probably be at least a few days late.
21:27
Waiting for remote hands at a datacenter to connect a cable... crazy frustrating.
@tylerl Slow clap when they connect it.
@David no joke.
also lsblk is a very cool tool
@tylerl that was a life saver when I was trying to reconstruct a 4 disk RAID array
@tylerl Provided in the form of "oh, here's 4 disks we pulled from a working server and made no notes on"
21:44
Here we go... (ping @AviD & @David)
0
Q: What are the risks posed by "pass-through authentication" and how are they mitigated?

Iszi"Pass-through authentication" on Windows systems allows for the possibility for user accounts with the same name and password to impersonate one another, even though they may not be intended to have the same privileges. Example: Say we have a standalone PC, not joined to any domain. The PC i...

@LucasKauffman This song yells: "JUMP JUMP JUMP JUMP" repeatedly.
22:11
@Iszi two nitpicking points: your question applies even for a non-admin (your question is phrased that way, but the example might cloud the issue), though of course the admin situation is much worse; and you might want to note that this is also true if the unattached "rogue" PC is in fact another domain by the same name.
23:03
Aw man that @David feller is getting me unnecessary pings. :\
@Simon i have no words for how good Wasted Penguinz is.
@LucasKauffman If i had a favorite anime, it would probably be Trigun.
@DavidFreitag interesting, so we can now ambiguously @rory on @david too?
@AviD yes, and with @david, you get three pings for the price of one!
@dav gets me 3. who 3 for @David?
Well actually one of them left.
oic. Oh well.
@DavidFreitag Good, good. Soon, you'll hunt down raves in your area.
23:15
@Simon Somehow i doubt that. Even if i wanted to i highly doubt there are any nearby. Maybe boston, definitely New York, but i don't want to drive that far.
@DavidFreitag Usually, you just have to know the right people/join the right groups on FB or such.
And then you realize there are way more parties around you than you thought.
@Simon Well, considering i don't have a facebook this might be difficult.
Oops.
Man, Adnan is on a roll today.
@Simon No worries. I'm not exactly the social type.
I used to be like that and then all of a sudden it changed for no apparent reason.
23:19
@Simon I mean sure, i go to a local diner with some friends to study, but i think my brain might explode if i was in a big enough group of people. I would end up finding a corner to isolate myself in an enjoy the music.
@DavidFreitag Haha. It does get quite insane sometimes like you gotta hold onto something otherwise you're gonna get pushed all over the place.
In general, it's just crazy.
@DavidFreitag oh? what now?
@tylerl No, i was just reading the transcript.
@DavidFreitag yeah. those two were at it like... erm...
@OrigamiRobot I laughed so damn much when I read this, still unsure why.
23:21
(what's a noisy mamal that fights a lot?)
@Simon It's all the brain stimulation. I can't take it sometimes. I'd be better off with a few friends and a set of really nice headphones :]
@DavidFreitag Headphones 4eva.
@tylerl Like a howler monkey crossed with a ram?
@DavidFreitag I can't imagine a farmer attempting that
but it would make for an interesting afternoon
Hawooooooo crash Hawooooooo
And then it would be born. Hopefully with the body of a ram and the vocal cords of a howler monkey. It could get kinda weird, like a monkey with a ram's horns, or a ram with opposable thumbs.
23:34
wut
ooh hey, i got 3 visits from morocco today.
cc @Simon @LucasKauffman
I listen to it quite often, very good track.
If you know of more that sounds like this. Please share.
Wasted Penguinz is quite particular but there's another DJ who's known as the "Melodyman".
Hang on.
You might wanna skip to 0:50
He's my 2nd favorite Hardstyle DJ.
I noticed something in the past few days. I get better gas mileage while listening to techno then i do listening to hardcore metal.
23:46
Haha, is the music influencing your driving habits?
The numbers show a correlation at least
2:54 is where it's at.
Was voted as the best track of 2012.
This comment is what i am thinking exactly.
> I'm not a hard style fan but FUUUUUUUUUUUUUAAAAAAAAAARRRRRR­RRKKKKKK
Lmao.
It means it is growing on you.
Like mold.
23:49
LIKE AN OLD GRUMPY MAN.
@Simon It's not growing on me, it just sounds good. If more Hardstyle was this good then i would be a fan, it's just that simple.
and awe yea, google play has Frontliner too.
a lot more than wasted penguinz too.
"Keep it up" is the next track you need to listen then.
@AviD Link your favorite song then.
@DavidFreitag my favorite song is still only on vinyl.
LOL
23:51
@AviD I'm willing to bet it's been transcribed.
@DavidFreitag with hammer and chisel.
@AviD ».»
I think Keep it up is my favorite track of Frontliner.
So much energy.
@Simon It didn't make it into the "Top Songs" list that Google has for Frontliner. I trust Google too because they are usually right...
@DavidFreitag I think it hasn't been released yet.
23:54
@Simon Google play has it, it must be.
Oh.
Google is always right. Google knows everything.
It's damn good though!
Back in the day, we used to say "Alta Vista is always right."
@AviD C'mon seriously though, i want to know what you like to listen to. You don't even need to link it, i has teh googlefu.
23:56
@AviD no we most certainly did not. We said Lycos was always right.
@tylerl yeah, we couldnt make up our mind.
@AviD Believe it or not, I actually remember AltaVista.
or was it excite?
actually, there was a time that I knew which site was better for which topic. There was a difference.
@tylerl I think excite was later.
The most significant thing I remember about the search engines before Google was that they all sucked pretty bad
23:57
@Simon visited the internet museum lately, have you?
You'd have better luck finding what you were looking for under the couch
@tylerl so did google for a long while...
@AviD Dude! I got my first PC in 99! It was still around.
@Simon awww dats sweet, he got one of those toddler laptops, thought it was a real pc.
@DavidFreitag most often, we go for the classics. Like Ring around the rosie, Daddy's gonna buy you a mockingbird, etc.

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