@Simon heh cheers for your support! What are you still doing up? :O What's the time in Québec? :P

My pleasure, you answered it perfectly. It's almost midnight, I just finished watching LotR Two Towers extended.

So it's still early because it's Friday!

@Simon Here, it's early however you look at it - 6 a.m. ;) Can't sleep because I had to debug some utter kak of a networking equipment and still feel a bit shaky after it. It was a modem / router / gateway of the biggest ISP here (and the one I love to hate, but that's another story) and I'm not entirely sure yet what all I've discovered, but it looks like I'll again have to "blow the whistle on them" because there's a gaping backdoor hard-wired into it. :?

@TildalWave Wow, sounds like a shit incoming, haha.

@Simon meh this is actually the second time with this same ISP and the same equipment manufacturer (both local)... the first time, in days of first ADSL modems, they even wanted to quiet me by offering me a job, which I thought was an interesting way of dealing with it :))

It is indeed interesting. What did you do?

@Simon I was curious so I went to the interview... it was some daughter (more like bypass if you ask me) company started by both the ISP and the manufacturer... fairly new company back then, but with a whole new building of their own, luxuriously equipped, in every respect a proper holiday resort. I hated it from my guts and made sure I'm as obnoxious as possible. I did go back a few more times to help them iron those problems out, but that was it.

They'll probably offer you another job then.

@Simon I could use a good job, but working for incompetent dirty bastards doesn't really seem worth it. Some saying goes you spend your money as stupidly as you earn it, and if that's half true, I'd be in constant deficit with them no matter how much they'd be willing to splash out on me. ;)

Anyway, I'm really knackered already and can't think straight anymore ... I'll spare you my rantings and turn in for the "night". Laters!

@AJHenderson I'm actually thinking that the bottleneck will be disk I/O instead of CPU.

@Simon That is a paradox of the highest level.

@Ladadadada Lol

Almost 3k :D

I remember we have a question about why sending plaintext passwords over email is a very bad thing? Can someone point me to it?

I want to share it with an online shop that does it.

@ManishEarth Ah yes, that's the one. Thank you. :)

yw :)

Alright, just emailed them. I really hope they will do the right thing.

Ubuntu or Fedora? I'm gonna dump my Windows host in favor of Linux.

@TerryChia Ubuntu

Fedora's shiny, but I like Ubuntu better

@ManishEarth I'm probably gonna start a religious war here, but why? :D

Then again, I've never used Fedora as my primary OS. I just have tried it out

Personal preference

If I start using Fedora, there's a chance i may start liking it :P

brb

@ManishEarth A * cert? Really?

I almost -1 it

@Adnan Browsers still accept them, right?

IIRC that was the case last time I checked

@ManishEarth Hmm, then I could be wrong.

CAs don't issue them, that's all

Hmm, I probably could test it

@ManishEarth Yeah. I think that's the case.

@Adnan Or I can edit that to simply say a "multiple domain wildcard cert". I think those exist.

For example, I can use an unsigned cert on manish.com that works for manish.com,*.google.com

Anyone who uses firefox to connect will be pwned

Any one here care to share their experiences with dual booting Windows and Linux? Any file system oddities I should note?

(Chrome bugs you every time, FF only gives you the option to whitelist)

@TerryChia Me. Just did it yesterday.

Are you on UEFI?

Was the computer Windows 8 built in?

@TerryChia Ask away. Done it for several years.

@ManishEarth Yup, I'm using a UEFI mobo. It's a DIY PC currently installed with W7.

@TerryChia scared

I'm very wary of UEFI

@Adnan Any important quirks I should note? I could probably figure it out on my own given enough time but I would like to finish the process in a day as I actually need to use the system. :P

@TerryChia Not that I've noticed any. Ext3 (later Ext4) partition for Ubuntu, and two NTFS partitions for Windows XP (later Windows 7)

@TerryChia UEFI can be annoying

@TerryChia First, try booting from a 64bit Ubuntu (12.10 0r 13.04) pen drive

and try installing

Everything has been going smoothly for years

@Adnan done it on uefi yet?

If it doesn't give you the option to install alongside Windows, go to "something else", create a 1-4GB swap partition and an >15 GB ext4 partition with mount point /

@Adnan I'm thinking a (relatively) small partition each for Linux and Windows, ext4 and NTFS respectively and have a larger third partition for sharing data between the two. The data partition should most likely be NTFS? Would this setup work or do you have something better?

@ManishEarth I've never done the "Recommended" installation. I always go custom (failed a few times at first, though)

@Adnan I've done it on bios systems a few 50-odd times :P

@TerryChia that's my setup, more or less

it works

@ManishEarth I don't believe so

@TerryChia Note that Windows can't access ext4, and Ubuntu can't access hibernated Windows

@Adnan Well, it ain't gonna be smooth no more

@TerryChia Exactly my setup as well

Google "Windows 8 ubuntu uefi"

@ManishEarth Yeah that probably wouldn't be a problem. I'll only fire up Windows for gaming or if I need to do .NET stuff with VS.

@TerryChia similar things here. Gaming, SolidWorks, and Adobe CS5

@Adnan Basically, Windows preinstalled makes it hard to install Ubuntu. Very hard, and a lot of the issues that crop up are model-specific

Now @TerryChia is not preinstalled Win8, so it ought to go smoothly

but there's a chance it'll go boom

Day before yesterday, I installed Ubuntu on my new Win8. I could only switch OSs by fiddling with settings in BIOS, grub wouldn't work. I finally clean installed and had to delete the leftover GPT data

Is it just me or is there at least one "That's what she said!" starred message at any given time?

@ManishEarth bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=285361

100GB for Ubuntu, 100GB for Windows. Remainding 800~GB for data. I don't think I need to allocate more than 100GB for each partition? Do you guys think I could get by with less?

Doesn't say if "fixed" or not

@Adnan There are valid use cases for * certs though. If I'm the .. say .. CIA and I don't want my employees to be sending sekrit stuff out (forget the CIA, a lot of companies are very strict about pen drives and network usage and such), I can proxy them with a * cert

@TerryChia Holy shit! My setup was 20 Ubuntu, 30 Windows, 30 common partition.

@TerryChia I've never needed more than 30 for Ubuntu, but on this new laptop I did 100 for Ubuntu, 250 for Windows, and the rest 150ish common

@Adnan I'm definitely gonna need a sizable amount for Windows though. A couple of games plus the VS tools eat up a good chunk of space.

@Adnan My old one was 200Windows+30Ubuntu+20 common

The 200 Windows and all are because Windows softwares tend to be huge.

And gaming

Plus I'm on a 1TB drive and it's a desktop so I definitely have room to grow.

Everybody has a bigger HDD than mine :(

@TerryChia A note: If you want to shrink the ntfs drives at some later point in time, do it from Windows. If you do it via gparted Windows doesn't always like it (it brings up chkdsk, which is annoying for drives > 100gb)

Shrinking ext4/swap from gparted is OK, so is creating new partitions of any type

@ManishEarth I see.

Goddammit I took 5mins to find the disk partition tool on W7 cus I couldn't recall the name.....

@TerryChia diskpart

or

compmgmt.msc

diskpart is cui, compmgmt is gui and you can get to it from Manage (right click on My Computer)

In compmgmt there's a Disk management (or something) entry

@ManishEarth See, that's why I'm switching to Linux. :P I could use fdisk in my sleep.

lol

I need to use the help command in fdisk

While fond of cui, I do use gui apps when I can.

@ManishEarth Nothing wrong with that, I do that as well. It's when you need to Google something then it becomes an issue. :D

ah

@Adnan btw I added a footnote to the * post

@ManishEarth Like seriously... find me anyone who can remember all the system ID flags.

Torvalds? :P

That's what I like about the computer world. A lot of the great inventors are still alive :P

@ManishEarth I highly doubt it.... he strikes me as the kind of person who has better things to remember..... :P

@ManishEarth Well.... @RoryAlsop will still be around a thousand years from now so at least the newer generation will have someone to look up to.

lol

So just to be confirm my process - 1) Format the entire disk, 2) Allocate space for Ubuntu and Data partitions using Gparted on a live CD, 3) Install W7 letting it carve out it's own partition, 4) Install Ubuntu

Correct?

@TerryChia Why format the entire disk?

You should be able to work with your present Windows

@ManishEarth Ahh, I'm having some disk I/O issues that might have to do with a screwed up W7 so I'm gonna be wiping and starting from scratch.

@TerryChia Ah ok

that's a good option :)

Clean installing Windows always seems to make it 10 faster :P

@TerryChia No need for step 2

1) Boot from W7 disk into the installation. Use the crappy partition manager that ou get at the beginning of the install to wipe the system and create 2 partitions (Windows and Common), with unallocated space at the end.

2) Install Windows

@ManishEarth Ahh alright.

3) Shove in Ubuntu drive, install normally. Use custom if it doesn't give you the option to install alongside

One final query, I assume I won't have any issues getting office to work with WINE? It's gonna be annoying to have to boot up Windows just to edit a document.

@TerryChia Dunno. Ubuntu comes with LibreOffice though.

As a student, I rarely need Office. LaTeX works. And GDocs.

@ManishEarth I'm trying to avoid that as much as possible. :P I don't have good luck with open sourced Office suites. Plus since I have a valid Office key....

> But it was all apparently a heist to steal a golden vibrator. Because that's all he took -- he went right for the vibrator and went home. Now, to be fair, it's not like he grabbed a cheap-ass $10 bullet any horny moron can buy online. No, this was an 18-carat, gold-plated vibrator worth over $4,000. That's a decent day's work, right?

cracked.com/…

moments away from another ctf solve...

ooh

@TerryChia hahahahaha

cheeky

@TerryChia Dual boot sucks. You just never are on the right system.

On my recent laptop I had a dual boot Win8 / Ubuntu

(with UEFI, which was not that easy to setup right)

I replaced the disk with a SSD, on which I installed Linux only; and I have a Windows (XP) as a virtual machine.

and I set the BIOS to revert to non-UEFI mode

I also configured LVM so that I can add, remove and resize partitions easily. It also works for the Windows since that's a VM (the Windows is not aware that its "disk" is a LVM partition).

@ThomasPornin That works too. But you can't game much

I use both. Not a "real" dual boot tho because they're on separate disks that I switch through a keyboard shortcut supported by BIOS (annoying choice of it cuz it's the same F8 that Win bootloader uses, but it works) and I also use VMs. My host OS is mostly Windows tho, because I'm not bothered to install all the crap I usually rely on in each OS (too much work honestly). I don't know why I don't just move it all to separate machines... I have 3 here gathering dust and I only ever use one :?

@TildalWave interesting. Not a laptop I presume..

I could probably use a good KVM switch tho... constantly switching cables isn't fun

@ManishEarth I rarely use laptop because I don't have enough space on my work desk for all of it :(

ah

I only use a laptop

missus uses it to blow up candy or whatever games she plays :)

(Well, unless I'm at the dept comp room)

I'm my mates' "computer geek" so they expect of me to have a small museum of PC history in my study room ... can't even count all the boxes, some are even in the closet under some bed linen or whatever... not a nice sight I tell you :)

I need to find ways to donate some of them without cashing out much for postage

I wanted to suggest to one mate of mine that is rendering 3D stuff take the lot of them and build himself a rendering cluster, but he was concerned it'll draw too much electricity, which would probably be true :?

@ManishEarth Someone interesting in gaming could reverse the setup: Windows as main OS, Linux in the VM.

@ThomasPornin I'm not that interested

I just play more than one game

@ManishEarth Also, some people have reportedly had some success with VGA pass-through. My laptop has two GPU, so I could conceivably give the accelerated one to Windows and keep the normal (integrated) GPU for Linux.

hmm

In practice, though, I just switch the accelerated GPU off because that saves battery and keeps the machine cooler (thus quieter)

But I don't game, either

Naah, usually I'm great on Linux. I switch to Windows only when I need to use that software (and then I won't be using anything else)

(when I game, it usually is to play NetHack, which does not need much with regards to graphics)

:102240885 Hmm, NetHack. Used to play it a long time ago. I've forgotten all the keys now :S

Good day.

LotR trilogy extended is definitely worth it.

/me fires a wand of striking at a castle gate

@Hennes Are you a magician?

It depends. Do I start with a wand of polumorph, a spell book and a [to be] pet dragon ?

Oh, and a magic marker and a ring of teleport control

You don't get a dragon, sorry.

But but...

Then who will eat the shopkeepers?

@ThomasPornin ha that was a fun game! There was another one, but I don't remember its title... it only had a simple 2D graphic interface too (mostly blue-ish and black, nearly monochromatic LOL), and you had to "climb the social ladder" within the hacking community. I'll try to find what it was called

@Hennes There are no shopkeepers, it is a purist world.

Found it. It was Uplink

damn, Opera 15 sucks so much

@CodesInChaos didn't try it yet, you're saying it's best avoided?

It's chrome with a badly done opera skin

for example its tabs support is utterly broken

and the list of processes it spawned literally doesn't fit a single page in taskmanager

@Simon Any fool can zap a wand of fire. Some can zap fire without a wand, and wizards are good at that.

@CodesInChaos that's not much different in previous versions really ... I'll wait till they polish it out, I only need it to test layouts anyway

Anyone played Cyberpunk? This trailer looks pretty cool for Cyberpunk 2077: cyberpunk.net

@TildalWave Previous versions spawed one process, this one uses >50. Slightly overkill, no?

@CodesInChaos hmmm yes you're right I just checked ... it's still a memory hog tho, a basic setup takes more memory than my Chrome setup that has quite some plugins loaded

Yes it hogs a bit. I'm still surprised it never managed to hit the address space limit yet

Currently at 1.5 GB, and I can still see letters in my tabs, so I don't have many open ATM.

Hey!

@tildal - I was crap at uplink. Much better at Darwinia and Multiwinia

@Simon -that is disturbing

^^ enjoy

@RoryAlsop It definitely has to be the most disturbing meme.

@ManishEarth That's... something.

@RoryAlsop Don't know those. I did finish Uplink a few times tho, I thought it was quite good. ... OT can you please clear this one up? security.stackexchange.com/a/38529/20074 @Xander did all the hard work, it only needs that answer deleted ;)