EL&U 2014 Election

medica

01:13

@YoichiOishi - no one enjoys having a question closed. It does feel like an insult, as attested to by the posts in meta. If people were more aware of the SE model - that a down vote and a close vote reflects on the question, not the user, and if all this was done respectfully without denigrating comments, perhaps it would be less painful.

I agree with MrHen that down votes should remain anonymous, and posted reasons for this in meta. Comments with down votes are too often unproductive fuel for a comments war. Emphasizing respectfulness all round might help.

Looking solely at your last 150 questions, I saw only one closed. This is proof that your questions are a great fit for this site.

Yoichi Oishi

01:29

MrHen. I' not opposing anonymity of Down / Close vote. I'm saying when you cast down / close vote, it's better to manifest the concrete reason(s) for your down / close voting. As I mentioned I've seen and hard of many cases of morbid down voting simply because of their disliking questioner and answerer, and for the vague reason of '0ff-topic."

Actually I kept receiving down-votes from single, two at most from unknown users to almost every questions of mine as soon as I posted in a row for a quite long period.

Though, fortunately, that practice has ceased, I wondered why most of my question had to be down-voted at an instance I post, when the share of the total budge I received including 13 Gold budge account for 50% plus. We should take measures of locating the pathological or stalker-like down-voters as long as we acknowlede current down-vote and close-vote sytem.

medica

01:45

@YoichiOishi - this is a good reason to keep down votes anonymous: to not depict a down voter as pathological. Are the people who up vote your questions also pathological? People up and down vote. One is not pathological if one down votes. Abnormal down votes (revenge down votes, etc.) are detected by the system and reversed. Do people abuse the system? Certainly, at times. Are all down votes wrong? Not at all. No more that all up votes are perfectly reasoned out.

@YoichiOishi As I said in my post, if people accept up votes as proof of their intelligence, but down votes as proof of something undesirable in the down voter, then they are not understanding the system.

Speaking of up votes feeling good and down votes feeling bad, I realized that @tchrist has a right to support whomever he pleases in whatever manner he pleases. What felt unfair at the time is, in retrospect, fair, and for that reason (and I'm sorry I didn't realize it at the time) I apologize for casting him in a negative light above. He was within his rights.

user116848

02:08

@medica So Miss Medica what are your chances of winning? :D

medica

Well, I heard that there is a high voter turnout for this election, much higher than for the last. That reassures me that whoever wins are the moderators the community wants. And that is a win for everyone.

user116848

Yay

user116848

So I want to ask something. Join me here chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/95/english-language-usage

Yoichi Oishi

03:10

Media. Do you think my particular experience of receiveing fown-vote for most of my questions at least every other single one within one minits I posted during almoast one year until just a few month ago is the deed of sound-minded individual.

Yoichi Oishi

03:21

I reported this case in meta in the past, and I repeated several times to stop such dirty action in my comments below my question. And I've read users' comment of similar experience many time in Meta. Do you think such deed is sound and normal deed. I doon't think so. Unless you have experieced mal-deed, you can't tell everybody is sound-minded.

If you actually have the system to check and identify such malicious doer, I want to know it what it is like. I trust 99.9% users are fair and human, but I think there are a few exception based on my experience of 40 months as a non-native English speaking user.

medica

@YoichiOishi - We can't determine if someone is of sound mind. If someone is leaving inappropriate comments, they should be flagged. I think people don't flag enough, out of fear of making work for the moderators. The moderators can investigate irregular voting patterns.

medica

03:48

Most if not all of us have experienced inexplicable down votes, myself included. It's a risk. Over the long run, things even themselves out. People should feel free to flag, though, not just post in meta, if they believe they are being targeted.

Mari-Lou A

08:28

Hello @medica you're still up at this hour? Pre-election nerves? :)

I am catching up on latest developments... as I suspect chat is also catty... sigh

Mari-Lou A

08:41

@MrHen @AndrewLeach @YoichiOishi and @medica What about this case? Stephen King has deleted his answer (which was upvoted 44 times) and I think, purely speculative mind you, that his reaction might have been motivated by this answer which attracted four downvotes (?) english.stackexchange.com/a/177977/44619 and here english.stackexchange.com/questions/180173/…

Andrew Leach

@Mari-LouA Deletion like this is called vandalism, and is not allowed. Flag it. There's no point in rolling back since it will only result in an edit war. Authors cannot prevent SE from displaying their answer: see the first sentence of Section 3 of the Terms.

Mari-Lou A

Oh, I have :) But I was curious as to the motivation behind the deletion. I tried contacting him, but he had probably already logged out. What do you think? What could a mod do in this case?

@AndrewLeach I don't think I have never seen that TOS, but I guessed as much. I have seen enough greyed-user avatars (deleted accounts) to know that answers and questions are pretty permanent.

Alraxite

Should it be flagged as "other"?

The one that requires moderator intervention?

Andrew Leach

08:56

@Mari-LouA What appears to happen -- given that I've not been involved in actually dealing with these -- is that the edit is rolled back by a mod; a comment is added warning the user not to do that; and the post might be locked. In particularly egregious cases I'm sure a user has been handed a long suspension (although if they want their account deleted, that can be arranged).

@Alraxite Yes. That's the only option which fits.

Alraxite

@AndrewLeach OK.

Andrew Leach

If a user has done this to a number of posts, contact may be made privately to try and ascertain the reasoning. They may have been the subject of untoward actions by other users, and those need to be investigated.

But vandalising your own content isn't really the answer to anything. I can only see that it damages; I can't see any benefit.

Mari-Lou A

@AndrewLeach but what do you think about his latest post receiving four downvotes? I didn't find it particularly poor, and at least his written English is impeccable (I know mine isn't!) The user, Stephen King has only deleted his top answer.

Andrew Leach

Right, that one. But it doesn't actually answer the question. Does one surmise from the answer that the presence or absence of a preposition doesn't matter; or that in should not be present at all? How is that answer "useful"? Anyway, receiving downvotes is not a reason for vandalism.

If a user chalks it up to experience and deletes an answer the community doesn't like, he gets the rep back and (at -3 or below) a badge!

Mari-Lou A

@AndrewLeach OK, but obviously he tried to rectify, he edited his piece ten hours ago. A comment, reminding him that he didn't specifically answer the question, would have HELPED him, and would have been CONSTRUCTIVE. english.stackexchange.com/a/180176/44619

And he is, was, a newcomer, probably still needed to learn the ropes. A potentially useful and articulate contributor, lost forever. EL&U needs more native speakers, not fewer...

Andrew Leach

09:13

I'm not convinced that the edit made the answer any more useful. A comment by one of the downvoters might have helped, yes. Or he could have written a "Why the downvote?" comment, which might have elicited some advice. I agree that the loss of a potentially valuable contributor is regrettable.

Mari-Lou A

"climb the rankings" , "ascend the rankings", and "surmount the rankings" That's SK's answer, isn't it? I mean, four downvotes, for that?! Maybe the conclusion sounded pompous to the downvotes, overly literary, who knows? Four people saw fit to downvote without leaving any explanation. (Anonymous voting always gets me, sometimes it's hard to interpret the downvotes)

BTW is there a way to make the chat box larger? Once I reach the bottom it's impossible to read what I've written.

Anyway, I have to go. Thank you @AndrewLeach for your time. Good bye.

Alraxite

@Mari-LouA You mean the box where you type?

Andrew Leach

In many browsers the chat box can be extended horizontally -- drag the triangle in the bottom right corner. But three or four lines appears to be the maximum, and that depends on the size your browser renders text at.

Alraxite

I can also extend it vertically.

Except that it then moves out of view.

I can also extend it out of view horizontally it seems.

Andrew Leach

09:29

Yes. I can extend it vertically. That seems less useful :-)

Mari-Lou A

10:48

@AndrewLeach I see, only horizontally. Thanks for the tip in any case.

Robusto

13:32

@medica: It's a little late for apologies. I forgave the first time, and the second, but you have a history of flying off the handle in the face of the slightest frustration. If it's all about people picking on you, why did you admit you were wrong the first time, and even changed your SE username because your "image" was compromised? Why are you apologizing now in one breath yet implying that it's still my fault in the next?

That strikes me as disingenuous at least. More to the point, it's the sort of behavior that should disqualify someone from a position of authority. Pique is not a substitute for patience.

I mentioned in our second go-round that I was testing your equanimity, which I think is a valid thing to do to one who wishes to moderate this site. If we look to the dictionary definition of moderation, we find: "the quality of being moderate; restraint; avoidance of extremes or excesses; temperance." Do you really think that describes you?

KitFox

14:02

Did you test the other candidates similarly?

MrHen

14:31

You seem to think that the number of downvotes is relative to the quality of the post. It isn't. The number of downvotes is more correlated with how many people saw the post and *agreed* it should be downvoted. There is nothing about a -4 post that suggests it is worse than a -1 post.

People *think* such a correlation exists but they are simply incorrect. That isn't how things like this work. Yes, the worse a post is the more likely it is to be downvoted but once it has passed the "obviously downvotable" the only thing that matters is visibility.

@Mari-LouA I basically agree with Andrew Leach on this.

@Mari-LouA If that is their answer then it should have been downvoted because it wasn't answering the actual question being asked. The content was valuable but not an answer to this particular question which was only asking about the difference between "in" and "the". The post in question was treating this like a literary exercise when the question was actually just asking about prepositions.

Regarding anonymous downvotes, we've talked about this in the past.

I'm going to assume people already know my opinions on them.

Robusto

14:53

@KitFox The other candidates didn't come into ELU chat and start teeing off on me.

KitFox

I'd like to speak with you privately, if you have a moment.

Robusto

@KitFox Sure. Where?

KitFox

I'll send you a message.

KitFox

16:21

So I'm reading the transcript, catching up, and there are a few things I want to say.

The first is that I appreciate that some folks are stepping forward to say they are uncomfortable with chat and they want things changed. That's great.

The second is that it has nothing to do with the elections or current moderation. If you don't bring it to our attention, we don't know about it.

The same thing goes for rude or offensive or bullying comments made on the main site. I handle plenty of flags for these behaviors. For every clear-cut case, there are probably two or three where the flagged comment is "You should post some links to support your answer" or "You need to provide more information about [thing you are asking] so we can give you a better answer."

I don't see, and I mean it literally, I don't see huge numbers of comments that are actually rude or offensive in my flag queue. If it's there and people are being unfriendly, flag it so we can do something about it.

Mitch

16:40

@KitFox people are flagging for informational lapses like not providing a link? That just seems like unintentional misuse.

KitFox

I just want to make it clear that there are a lot of flags.

MrHen

@Mitch Actually, it sounds like the comment being flagged is, "You should provide a link."

Mitch

@MrHen Oh. Still not flag worthy though?

KitFox

We get a lot of "not constructive" or "too chatty" flags on comments that appear to be useful to me.

Mitch

I feel like flags are supposed to be only for rude, mean, or objectionable content.

MrHen

16:44

@KitFox I think every "too chatty" flag I've raised has been rejected. People don't like to remove useless but cute comments.

KitFox

So I'm concerned about the implication that EL&U is incredibly rude to its new users. If people have noticed this, why are they allowing it to continue?

MrHen

@KitFox I think it is partly confirmation bias.

Partly squeaky wheel syndrome.

Mitch

And that flagging for 'too chatty' is just way way overboard. But flagging for chattiness in comments is a reasonable use?

Matt Эллен

@MrHen wait for the hat festival. if there is a hat for flagging of becoming a deputy or something, go mad on comment flags ;)

MrHen

Partly accurate.

Matt Эллен

16:45

just don't tell Kit I told you

KitFox

@MrHen But if you see something that you think is offensive, then you should flag it.

Then we would see it and take action.

MrHen

@KitFox I do flag offensive things. I'm not sure why others don't flag things they think are offensive.

Mitch

@MattЭллен if you italicize that, she can't read it. It's totally private

Matt Эллен

I don't see things I find offensive.

Mitch

You'll see when she doesn't respond to it

Matt Эллен

16:46

@Mitch oh! cool. thanks for the info

KitFox

SO that's the thing, you see? "EL&U is incredibly rude, look at all this evidence." If the evidence is there, it must be that you did not flag it, not that the mods don't care.

phenry

@KitFox - I think people are doing what they can about it, which isn't much.

Mitch

people or mods?

is 'doing what they can' flagging or is it commenting or what?

KitFox

My job as moderator is not to police the site, but to handle flags.

medica

@Mari-LouA- I don't know what mods do and don't do in cases like this. but I'll give you my take. I've been watching Stephen King as a new user with good comments, answers and the potential to become... well, real an asset to the community. Myself, seeing this attempted deletion of his top answer, I might have dropped him a line explaining why down votes occur, their capriciousness nature,

that down votes are for an answer and *not a person - but only if I had known about it, which means someone would need to flag about it. I would have attempted to keep him; I hope he stays.

KitFox

16:48

If there is no flag, then it is implicitly acceptable behavior.

phenry

@Mitch - I think the people who say that we are unfriendly to new users are doing what they can, which is to raise the issue in meta as well as flagging where appropriate.

MrHen

@KitFox More explicitly, it heavily suggests that the moderators shouldn't remove it. Otherwise you'd get slammed for censoring people. :P

Mitch

@phenry OK. And you expect the mod to handle that by fixing the text or by commenting to the flagged user?

KitFox

@MrHen Exactly. Same thing with chat.

MrHen

@phenry I think Kit's point is that there isn't a large number of flags which implies there isn't some massive issue. @KitFox, correct me if I misunderstood your point?

Mitch

16:50

The user is going to take as rude -anything-: a flag, an edit, a comment about why downvoted, a comment correcting behavior.

KitFox

I am extremely hesitant to fight people's battles unless I know someone wants me to fight them.

@MrHen That's accurate.

medica

@KitFox - may I speak with you privately at some point here?

KitFox

And in fact, most of the flags are for things that are at best borderline, and many are not at all rude.

@medica Sure.

medica

Tell me where.

KitFox

The usual spot?

medica

16:52

It's not visible to me.

MrHen

@KitFox Kit's Corner. Tea not included.

phenry

I would say that the appearance of unfriendliness is the result of a number of factors, which can't all be gauged by looking at comments that are clearly rude or offensive when viewed in isolation.

Mitch

@KitFox and would you (as our representative mod) like more flags? and (separately) do you see more flags as helping the site?

KitFox

@MrHen No, that was the other mod.

MrHen

@phenry I'd agree with this. The problem isn't just "offensiveness" or with comments that are flaggable.

KitFox

16:53

@Mitch If people are genuinely rude, yes. If that isn't really a problem, no. That plus more mods to handle flags would improve the site.

MrHen

@KitFox Hence the election.

KitFox

@medica You're in it.

MrHen

Although, at this point -- given the questions asked of the candidates -- I'm wondering what the community thinks the moderators actually do around here.

medica

I was. I'll go back.

phenry

Here's the text of a comment I once flagged as being rude, but the flag was declined: "Neither one is correct. There are too many other, simpler, mistakes here, none of which has to do with perfect usage. Learn more grammar before trying the perfect constructions."

KitFox

16:55

@MrHen Yes. But I dislike that the implication is that our current moderation team contributes to the negativity of the site. There are none of us who would encourage rude behavior.

Matt Эллен

@MrHen yeah. It's a community site. Mods sweep up after people leave

tchrist

@MrHen No kidding.

KitFox

@phenry Can you link to the actual question? I'd like to see the context.

phenry

0

Q: What is the difference between Past perfect cont and present perfect cont?

Could you explain the differences between the two tenses? When should I use present perfect continuous and when should I use past perfect continuous? "I had been doing before I was young" "I have been doing"

present-perfect-tense

Mitch

@KitFox Right. It seems that @phenry is blaming the mods for not controlling rudeness. Is that right, phenry?

phenry

16:57

I want to emphasize that the person who left that comment is someone I have great respect for, and he's absolutely correct about the question having other problems.

But there's a right way and a wrong way to talk to people, and that's the wrong way.

Mitch

@phenry and you want the mods to enforce that?

tchrist

It is not a flaggable offence.

phenry

@Mitch - I'm hesitant to use the word "blame".

tchrist

It is not even an offence, let alone flaggable.

KitFox

@Mitch No! No, I am not saying that phenry is blaming anyone for anything. I like and encourage his stance on improving the user experience here.

Mitch

16:59

Sorry, blame is too strong. 'hold accountable'?

ok encourage?

phenry

I think that there is a culture at ELU that has good aspects and bad aspects. Ideally, we should all be encouraging the good aspects and discouraging the bad aspects.

Mitch

But anyway, I'm with @tchrist. I don't consider that comment an offense at all.

phenry

As an individual, I'm limited in what I can do to shape the culture, obviously. As a community, it's very difficult to get everyone lurching in the same direction.

The moderators, by virtue of having more power than other users as well as being a small group that can act in concert more easily, have a certain ability to influence the culture that is not available to me as an individual, or to us as a large amorphous community.

Matt Эллен

It's not offensive. It is direct. On the internet people tend to take directness as a personal attack (because text isn't like speaking), and thus find it offensive. I know I feel that way

KitFox

I declined it. I didn't feel it reached the level of rude or offensive. He suggested a problem and gave clear advice on how he thought the OP could resolve that problem.

tchrist

17:02

@MattЭллен Use imperatives if you want to bother the thinskinned.

KitFox

There was no value judgment and no snotty attitude.

Matt Эллен

I agree

tchrist

I don’t think the use of an imperative is ipso facto evidence of rudeness.

phenry

@KitFox - Wouldn't it be better to retain the constructive aspects of the comment, but make it less confrontational?

Matt Эллен

@tchrist I agree with that too

tchrist

17:04

Or even per se evidence, which is probably the better legalese.

Matt Эллен

but that doesn't stop people feeling upset

you won't find it offensive if you remember people aren't out to get you, but asking a question puts you in a vulnerable position, so you're already on the defensive

MrHen

@KitFox Well, that's part of why I don't think the community really understands what the moderators do. There is an interesting collision between "community run site" and "moderators run the site". :/

phenry

@MattЭллен - And if people feel upset, our analysis of their "right" to feel upset is, in a way, secondary.

Matt Эллен

yeah

KitFox

@phenry Maybe, but that is time-consuming, re-pings the user, and could make it worse rather than better.

phenry

17:06

That's why retailers say "the customer is always right." Obviously the customer is not always right, strictly speaking. But if my customer is pissed, that's a problem for me, regardless of why he's pissed and of whether his complaint has merit.

MrHen

(Somewhat off-topic) People have the right to be offended by anything they want to feel offended by. But that doesn't automatically imply that a community has to respect that offense.

KitFox

@phenry Yes, exactly this, and also why I was irritated about Jez's complaints about being flagged in chat. Someone was offended. Did they have a right to be? Of course they did.

People have a right to feel offended about whatever they feel offended about.

It's not up to me to tell them not to feel that way.

Me too.

phenry

@KitFox - Does it have to be? I recently left a comment that, while it made a good point (IMO, obviously), had a very sarcastic tone. Someone edited it to remove the sarcasm. I never found out until I happened to run across it again, hours later.

MrHen

@KitFox Sorry, removed as it was a little inflammatory.

KitFox

Meh, it was truth, right?

MrHen

17:09

@phenry People actually tend to get very offended by edits to their posts. Especially if all you edit is tone.

KitFox

@phenry Which one, out of curiosity?

MrHen

Editing for formatting or clarity is less dramatic. But editing out something like sarcasm is a drama magnet.

phenry

@MrHen - And I was mad! Here I am, the greatest person here, and someone has the temerity to come along and edit my shining diamonds of wit!?

But you know what, it was probably the right thing to do.

KitFox

@MrHen And this too. Which is funny for me to say, but there's the line there. I'm not going to tell you to not be offended, but I'm also not going to tell someone not to say offensive things if that's how they feel.

MrHen

@phenry If it makes you feel better, you have the right to be mad. :)

@KitFox I think there is a line somewhere that makes it okay to clean up potentially offensive things.

In my opinion, some "offense" is more legitimate.

KitFox

17:12

Yes. If someone is cussing someone else out, that's not OK.

MrHen

But I think when judging these things we should be considering our target audience and how our site appears to the internet.

ELU wants to appear professional and keep users engaged for as long as possible.

KitFox

If someone is offended about my pastafarianism, that's OK too, unless they are going to use it as an excuse to argue with me about it so they can get offended.

MrHen

Comments are actually not a terribly visible portion of the site. Post titles are, so I would be much more strict about making post titles less offensive.

phenry

@KitFox - I don't think I should say, as it was a dispute that (directly or indirectly, I don't remember) involved someone who may be present in this room.

MrHen

@KitFox They can be offended but that doesn't justify treating you disrespectfully.

KitFox

17:14

Right.

MrHen

@phenry I don't think it could have been me, but if it was I don't mind linking to it.

phenry

@MrHen - It wasn't you.

KitFox

It's not going to change my gender or my beliefs or my enjoyment of My Little Pony.

@phenry So I'll do it the hard way then...

phenry

I had written something like "@OtherUser - It's a good thing we have you here to tell us that X is true" and it got edited to something like "It is hard to know for sure whether X is true" without the @reference to the other person.

Matt Эллен

Run! She's getting the thumb screws!

KitFox

17:16

Um, actually I was just going to go through the comment history.

Matt Эллен

oh. right. of course

KitFox

That sounds like one I might have done.

And I was curious to know if it was.

phenry

If it helps, it was on June 6.

MrHen

The irony here, obviously, is that even the people who are most "pro-friendly" make comments that are actually not very friendly. It isn't easy to be nice to new users.

Stupid markdown. What is strike?

KitFox

Oh yeah, that thread.

Matt Эллен

17:18

@MrHen guilty!

KitFox

I remember doing that now. At least, if it's the one I was thinking it was. I pruned a lot of comments and tried to quell the flames.

@MrHen ---

phenry

@MrHen - We make pretty heavy use of comments here, more so than a lot of SE sites; they become this omnipresent Greek chorus constantly kibitzing whenever someone says something. If attitudes taken in comments contribute to an atmosphere of unfriendliness, maybe that's something we should look at.

MrHen

@KitFox Testing... -test one- and --test two-- and ~~test three~~

Thanks.

@phenry Sure. My point wasn't that we shouldn't take a look. My point was that different areas of the site should have different thresholds for culling potentially offensive things.

@phenry Whoa, if its the thread I just found by that hint, that's one crazy thread.

KitFox

@phenry I don't disagree with you. It's good to push for these kind of changes. Also, you don't need mod powers to do it.

phenry

@MrHen - yeah, no good was ever going to come out of that question.

MrHen

17:23

@KitFox Also, the odds of you getting an entire community to play nice is ridiculously small. The Summer of Love was an attempt to get the entire SE network to play nice. It had mixed success.

That isn't to say you shouldn't try. Just be prepared for a very long and difficult struggle.

KitFox

Yes. That.

tchrist

@MrHen Those are two different goals, of course, and they don’t necessarily lead to the same place if one is not careful.

MrHen

People suck and they don't like to change. So... yeah.

KitFox

I have tried, and occasionally have spurts of unexpected patience, but mostly I rely on the community to handle up through the edge of the grey area, and then I try to take up the slack on handling the serpents.

MrHen

@tchrist Correct.

KitFox

17:25

I'm not always so good at that, but luckily none of you know that.

crickets

My talents are soooo wasted on this audience.

2

tchrist

@KitFox Many ELU users are unaware of how important (non-moderator) community policing is to the site’s scalability, professionalism, and culture.

KitFox

We should probably change that view.

tchrist

@KitFox Not all frogs are meant for pithing contests.

KitFox

giggles

phenry

Certainly if we can get everyone mostly lurching in the same direction, that's going to make the moderators' jobs a lot easier.

KitFox

17:28

If I had a nickel for every frog I pithed, I'd have ... more than I got in swag from EL&U.

@phenry Yes, indeed. So even if you don't get elected, I fully expect that you will continue to lead the effort.

glowers

phenry

@KitFox - Assuming I'm not too exhausted from this election.

KitFox

hahaha

phenry

All this meeting people and being nice to them. For the birds.

KitFox

And being in chat and stuff. WTH?

tchrist

Baby-smooching.

Matt Эллен

17:29

chat is for weirdos

tchrist

Babies mooching.

Matt Эллен

I'm never in chat

phenry

I'm weird enough already. Don't need more.

MrHen

@KitFox Speaking of swag, I never did get my t-shirt.

KitFox

Didn't forward?

I got two. Still need to send one to that person I was going to send it to. Crud. Like three months ago.

MrHen

17:31

@KitFox No clue. I never got it and keep forgetting to ping the admins about it.

Also, that reminds me, a Kickstarter I funded never sent me the goods. I keep forgetting to pester them, too. :/

KitFox

@MrHen @Shog This man needs a t-shirt! He's owed!

MrHen

Not having a t-shirt during the moderator election is like not wearing a flag pin during the presidential election. I'm doomed!

KitFox

DOOMED!

Wait. I don't think any of the other candidates has one.

MrHen

@KitFox WE ARE ALL DOOMED!

And, seriously? There are a few other old timers in the race.

KitFox

Everybody Wants to Rule the World just popped up on Pandora. rofl

@MrHen Maybe Matt or Andrew.

MrHen

17:35

28

Q: English Stack Exchange swag for top users

As a thank you for being awesome, if you are on page 1 or page 2 of … http://english.stackexchange.com/users?tab=reputation&filter=all … we'll be sending you a little care package shortly: English Stack Exchange t-shirt in your size English Stack Exchange die-cut, vinyl stickers Stack Exchang...

discussion swag

> asked Jun 14 '11 at 7:33

So, top two pages of rep in 2011.

> Andrew Leach 48, United Kingdom, acleach.me.uk 42.7k ●5 ●69 ●128 member for: 2 years 3 months

KitFox

They typo'd the t-shirt, which made it that much specialer.

phenry

@MrHen - I still have mine. Still working on getting thin enough to fit into it.

Matt Эллен

I don't have an EL&U t-shirt. I'm sorry, I wasn't rep hungry enough

MrHen

> Matt Эллен 33, Black Crag, matthewellen.co.uk 19.4k ●7 ●50 ●107 member for: 3 years 5 months

> Yoichi Oishi 81, Japan 21.5k ●13 ●102 ●293 member for: 3 years 5 months

And phenry but he just confirmed his t-shirt.

Andrew Leach

2 years 3 months doesn't take me back to 2011.

Matt Эллен

17:38

I do have an SE t-shirt

MrHen

@AndrewLeach Correct. Kit had just guessed that you were around then. I was posting dates to help determine if it was true.

Matt Эллен

but that's not quite the same

phenry

@KitFox - ha ha, yeah--they must have lost a lot of money on that.

MrHen

@MattЭллен No ELU shirt?

Andrew Leach

@MattЭллен No. The Google stuff I've got isn't quite the same either.

MrHen

17:39

I have some crappy Microsoft swag. But it is crappy.

Matt Эллен

@MrHen no, I wasn't on the top two pages when the gift was given

MrHen

@MattЭллен I think I was barely on the second page.

I am kind of tempted to run a strawpoll to get some early numbers. I'm getting curious.

KitFox

No sense. It's done tomorrow.

MrHen

Plus it would be interesting to see how the views differ from (a) meta (b) ELU chat (c) election chat

> I'm getting curious.

Matt Эллен

views of what?

KitFox

17:42

The candidates. I wonder that too.

Matt Эллен

you mean opinions about them?

KitFox

Considering there are a handful of users that use chat. Certainly not enough to sway the election.

MrHen

I'm also curious about how many people vote without participating in the meta threads. I'd imagine a whole ton.

@KitFox Right. They are the most vocal but probably not terribly relevant in the end.

Matt Эллен

give that there were over 580 voters by yesterday, definitely more than participate on meta

MrHen

If I really wanted to win I'd snap up some of that ad space and run smear campaigns! Booyah!

Matt Эллен

17:44

good idea!

phenry

580 new voters.

MrHen

@MattЭллен Where is that number posted?

Matt Эллен

it's calculated by adding up howmany people got the constituent badge this election period

60 per page

MrHen

@MattЭллен Ah, okay

phenry

@MrHen - It's the number of people who've earned the "Constituent" badge this month

Matt Эллен

17:45

sorry, yeah, that one

phenry

currently 817 people hold the badge; there were about 230 previously

MrHen

That's... actually kind of impressive.

Matt Эллен

yeah, last time there were < 200 voters

MrHen

It's also interesting to note that those users have already voted.

phenry

so at least 580 people have voted, plus an unknown number of people who already held the badge.

Matt Эллен

17:46

you get it each time

phenry

oh, I didn't know that. So yeah, 587 or so.

medica

How can anyone tell how mwny votes have been cast, do you know?

Oh, I see - the badges

phenry

@medica - You got it.

KitFox

It says on the election page as well, doesn't it?

medica

well, this is a good sign

Matt Эллен

17:56

@KitFox not until after the election

medica

I didn't see it there, but it might.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox I don't see that

KitFox

raises eyebrow

medica

nor do I

phenry

The closest thing we have to a pre-election poll is the votes on the candidate questionnaire page, and those numbers are a couple of orders of magnitude lower than the total votes cast. So I have no idea what's going to happen.

medica

17:56

yep.

KitFox

Right under the post, in the blue bar where it says "Election closes in 2 days"?

medica

I'm really glad there's a high voter turnout, though.

nope. nothing there for me.

Matt Эллен

@KitFox yup. it doesn't say it there. it just says "election closes in two days"

medica

It means they want something.

Matt Эллен

or whatever

phenry

17:57

not for me either. moderators is special peoples.

KitFox

Awkward.

Matt Эллен

:D

medica

either a vote to keep things as they are, or a vote for change.

phenry

Or maybe just a function of the site getting bigger and more heavily visited.

medica

either way, everyone wins by getting mods that were elected by a large number of members.

maybe.

Matt Эллен

17:58

it shows more people are invested in the site, which is good.

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