Initially, Purāṇas were meant to be the substitute of the Veda as religious literature for the uninitiated people.
स्त्रीशूद्रद्विजबन्धुनां न वेदश्रवण मतम् । तेषामेव हितार्थाय पुराणानि कृतानि च ।।
Women, Śūdras & benefactors of the dvijas (i.e uninitiated boys born in dvija families & touchable ...
As you said the stances hardened later. But, all the puranas were written by written by Ved vyas himself. Thus, how can a single person make different rules. Although the puranas appear from different manvantar, yet every time same events takes places in eber manvantar just with a few changes. Thus, I'm confused how can devi bhagwatam allow, while rest others disallow. Since, basic rules don't change, even if manvantar do. Kindly, enlighten me upon this topic.
The core of all Puranas are written by Vedavyasa but additions and deletions continued to occur on the text throughout the time as it passed down through the hands of the scribes, who were exclusively Brahmins & took advantage of the reader's ignorance. Thus one finds Garuda Purana praising Madhvacharya & Saura Purana stating that Madhva was an incarnation of Vasanta who avenged Kama's death by denigrating Mahadeva. Texts which have no commentary on them are prone to such interpolations.
For example, Nirnayasindhu (the most popular nibandha among North Indian Hindus) cites certain passages from Narada Purana which prohibited Brahmins from bowing down before idols that had been shown respect by women, Shudras & Buddhists. I browsed the Narada Purana & found that the anti-Buddhist passage was indeed present in that text but the anti-woman & anti-Shudra passages were not. In that age where only the rich could afford to possess books, nobody would be going verify each & every word stated by learned pundits.
@AnubrataBit Thanks alot, indebited to u, for clearing the doubt in such lucid words. Honestly this debatable topic was put under such perfect words. Bows to ur shastra gyana.
@AnubrataBit Shudras cannot read puranas but they can listen to them. This is also mentioned by Adi Shankaracharya in his Vishnu sahasranama commentary where he says shudras cannot recite the sahasranama, but they can (and should) only listen to it.
शूद्रो विद्यां ग्रहीतारं ब्राह्मणं पातयेदधः ब्राह्मणोऽपि पठन् शूद्रादात्मानमेव घातयेत्॥ The Shudra causes the Brahmin to fall down (in hell) on receiving knowledge (from him) & the Brahmin kills himself (i.e afflicted with the sin of committing suicide) on receiving knowledge from the Shudra. [Brihaddharma Purana: Uttarakhanda:4:17.02]. Combined with the scriptures sanctioning extreme distaste towards the Brahmin who receives money from a Shudra in exchange of service, I doubt that the majority of Brahmins ever imparted Pauranik knowledge among Shudras with the aim of the Shudras' paramartha.
Even in the Buddhist chronicles, Hinduism is referred as the religion of Brahmins. Sanskrit terms that describe Hinduism like Vaidika dharma or Varnashrama dharma seldom appear in Buddhist texts. These facts clearly show that the Brahmins had completely monopolised religious knowledge & its interpretation. From the viewpoint of an illiterate Shudra, Hinduism appeared to be only about mimicking & pleasing the Brahmins before the advent of printing & widespread dissemination. Otherwise how could non-scriptural vidhanas like having separate smashana for antyajas come into widespread practice ?
@AnubrataBit "I doubt that the majority of Brahmins ever imparted Pauranik knowledge among Shudras..." - Completely false. Even today, acharyas constantly give public lectures to everyone on puranas.
For which they are paid, I might also add. I was talking about imparting religious knowledge solely for the aim of aiding in the achievement of moksha (the way the guru imparts gyana to the deserving shishya) & not being motivated solely by the monetary aspect (the way teachers are paid to teach students in schools).
@AnubrataBit "For which they are paid", they don't do it for money. Look at matha-adhipatis like the shankaracharyas and sri vaishnava jeeyars, they are holy and sincere men who don't care about making profit.
"For which they are paid, I might also add" - as donation, not as fees. @AnubrataBit. Everyone seems to be ignoring to address the root cause of the issue - WHY should Shudras not read Vedas/Puranas. Answer is simple - for same reason a non-army layman is not given a ak-47. for same reason a non-scientist layman is not given a bio chemical agent. they would at best misuse it, and at worst, abuse it. the necessary discipline required to wield knowledge is missing in shudras. of course i'm talking about shudras and brahmanas who have both birth and character matching their varna.
@mar. I do understand the logic behind restricting Shudras from accessing Veda but a majority of Brahmins have unethically blocked women & Shudras access to other scriptures like Puranas & Tantras when the aforementioned Puranas & Tantras themselves state that they are meant for women & Shudras. How do you defend their exclusion from Puranas & Tantras ?
"but a majority of Brahmins have unethically blocked women & shudras" - citation required. in all upanyasams i have seen, majority listeners / front benchers are women. and most shudras are simply not interested in puranas. there is no gatekeeper blocking shudras from entering pravachan hall. anycase blocking puranas from being read is different from blocking puranas from being listened to. former is dangerous if they start misinterpreting using limited intellect. @AnubrataBit
in all homes, girl children are told stories of ramayan and mahabharat, they're taught stotras of acharyas, they're taught household decorum and duties listed in Smritis. not just puranas, brahmins taught vedangas to shudras - including stapathyam (sculpture), ayurveda etc. did you know that ahobila mutt pitadhipathi appointed a shudra sthapathi to build the famed srirangam raja gopuram in 1980s, because modern 'engineers' gave up, but that stapathi knew sanskrit shlokas which determined ratios for structure ? i think you're buying into false librandu trope that brahmins oppressed everyone.
The Shakta Tantra texts clearly state that they have been composed with the aim of the spiritual progress of women & Shudras in Kaliyuga on par with that of Vaidika Brahmins of Satyayuga but in here in Bengal & also in Assam (where the Hindu religious viewpoint is heavily influenced by Tantra), Tantrasadhana is exclusively limited to certain Brahmin families. All manuscripts of Tantras were exclusively obtained from such Brahmin households when they were searched for publications. These Brahmin families also solidified their influence over the Shudras through the system of Kulaguru.
The Kulaguru system runs like this-Suppose you take Tantrika diksha from a certain Brahmin, then your son & daughter-in-law is also bound to take Tantrika diksha only from the sons of that Brahmin. Even your grandsons & granddaughters-in-law are also bound to take diksha only from the grandsons of your Guru, even if the Guru's grandsons were incompetent. Taking diksha from from any other competent sadhaka outside the Kulaguru's family was considered to be a sort of apostasy. In this way incompetent descendents of a siddha sadhaka enjoyed hereditary Guruhood of bhogarthi grihasthas.
Tantrasadhana is exclusively limited to certain Brahmin families. @AnubrataBit, ur exactly correct. To say, Tantras themselves bare Brahmins or dwij to take diksha into tantra, or an explicit warning is given by Mahade that such dwijas will fall into hell.
Well, speaking about being rigid with puranas, I think that must be changed.
To continue in on my stand, thou I follow scripture, but it can't just be blindly followed. For example, many dikshit say anyone who chants Durga Saptashati without diksha will face severe consequences. To my knowledge, 2 frnds of mine have chanted Saptashati by themselves and honestly they got guru as they desired for it. Although, here I'm not asking anyone to read Saptashati. Yet the point is, today the efficiency to follow such astringent rules is impossible.
Take eg, today already everyone is busy with work & studies. The time they get, they devout to Scriptures. If such a block is put over, u think wht the outcome would be?
@AnubrataBit - "But these wandering siddha-sadhakas failed to attract much following" - would YOU trust a wandering sadhak compared to a guru putra ? given that you and i don't have capability or right to test a guru thoroughly before accepting diksha ? i think kulaguru system is meant for choosing safe path. and if this system gets rotten/corrupted, it will have to change. but such massive changes are the responsibility of avatara purushas like jagadacharyas, not you and i.
Discussion on answer by Anubrata Bit:…
Discussion on answer by Anubrata Bit:…