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01:44
@OtavioMacedo going to bed, night! :D Talk to you tomorrow
 
9 hours later…
10:19
Hello guys! @OtavioMacedo and @Cerberus
I don't have time to stay online but I wanted to say hi
@Alenanno Hi!
@OtavioMacedo What's up?
Studying how Latin developed into Portuguese ;-)
10:22
Oh :)
Good!
And how it got all those silly ~'s...
The week is about to end, our first Challenge was a kind of fail :P But well, we must have faith!
making funny face with squiggly nose
@Cerberus Yes, I've learned some interesting facts about that
Oh?
@Alenanno Was it really?
10:24
For example, the plural of ão forms can be ães, ãos or ões
only ões being productive
So, for example, pão/pães (bread)
@Cerberus Let's see... 5 questions were asked on the Topic. (That show the tag, at least.)
phonologically, pão can be analyzed as /pan + e/
that doesn't appear on the surface
@Alenanno Only 5? Did mine show the tag?
but in the plural it does appear: /panes/, but nasalized: [pãjs]
@Alenanno The number of questions increased :-)
@Cerberus Yes yes!
:)
10:27
@OtavioMacedo Hmm yes, it makes sense for the a in the stem to be carried over.
Oh, we also increased the visits, though! We reached 207. :D
Daily?
@Cerberus Yep!
That's quite a lot!
Let's hope they become more and more :P
10:28
I think it was pretty good for the first week, with no tangible prize
Gotta go now, later! :)
@OtavioMacedo Yeah. :)
@Alenanno Ciao
Bai!
Yeah especially with the lack of a prize.
Hey, do you think you could change lɪŋgwɪstɪks into [lɪŋgwɪstɪks](http://linguistics.stackexchange.com/) ?
That way we can easily get to the site from the room description.
hmm, let me see
room topic changed to lɪŋgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
Haha oh dear, didn't work as intended.
10:34
It doesn't work
room topic changed to lɪŋgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
But I meant the description itself, not the name.
> wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks!
This bit.
room topic changed to lɪŋgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
Heheh
Huh that doesn't work either.
What if you do it with only the word lɪŋgwɪstɪks ?
room topic changed to lɪŋgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
Nope
Aww. sad faces
Well, you did what you could!
10:36
But if you click on the Linguistics icon on the bottom right, it leads you to the site
room topic changed to lɪŋgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
Ohh you're right!
Jesus. Why did I never try that?
Stupid.
I guess it doesn't look like a button.
Because it's not obvious
Exactly
In most cases the SE interface is quite consistent.
In a way, it is consistent with the site
if you click on the same image there, it will reload the site
But, in a chat room, it's not obvious at all
Yeah perhaps it is the context.
And that fact that it is in the grey area.
10:41
Yes, grey usually means "dead"
hehe
Heh.
Yeah, inactive in Windows menus.
11:02
Interesting: Latin long vowels kept their qualities in Portuguese
but short ones lowered
i: became i
but i became e
and vowel duration became conditioned to syllable stress
Fascinating!
Conditioned to?
Vaccinating indeed!
all vowels in stressed syllables are long in Portuguese
Ah OK.
and all vowels in unstressed syllables are short
So they became long because the syllables were stressed, or the other way around?
I guess the former, if all vowels like iː lost their quantity.
11:07
I'm not sure, but I think it was the former, too
So, there were short unstressed vowels in Latin?
Ops
Short stressed
and long unstressed
This explains that unusual (to my ears) pronunciation of Classical Latin in that video from Filius Lunae
I mean, unusual to a Romance speaker
Yes, there were unstressed long vowels, I believe.
But I have my doubts about FL's pronunciation.
Different theories exist.
Pronunciation is not my field of expertise.
> in-fīnītus
Two long vowels in succession.
Where is the stress?
It's snowing! But it's 6 degrees.
@OtavioMacedo On the last i, I believe.
The question is: how did the Romans express stress?
Here, it's 22° and warming
There is tone, length, pause, volume...
I don't remember.
@OtavioMacedo Wow, I wish it were 22 here!
11:16
Oh, so stress is not a "primitive" feature
It depends on other features
Hmm what does that mean?
The Romans probably had a consistent way of expressing syllable stress, but I don't know what it was.
Just as we have a consistent way.
The Romans probably had a consistent way of expressing syllable stress, but I don't know what it was.
I mean, the question of whether long vowels were the result of stress or the other way around (in Portuguese) may not make sense
Maybe, long vowels are the way to express stress in Portuguese
I don't know
I'm just brainstorming
Oh, yes, well, I would expect you to use more features to express it.
It's usually a combination.
Of which certain features can be dropped under circumstances.
In English, I'd say it is a combination of tone, volume, and length/pause.
But one feature may be a more pronounced marker of stress than another.
Makes sense
And different dialects may have different combinations
Oh, and someone on ELU explained that Italian (so probably all Romance languages) are timed based on the number of syllables (the length of time between two syllables is the basis), whereas the Germanic languages are timed based on the time between stressed syllables. Something like that.
11:30
Timed?
That's what we colloquially call "rhythm"?
So in a phrase like we need to take **dis**ciplinary **ac**tion, time between need and dis- is about the same as between dis- and ac-, whereas in Italian time would be roughly proportionate to the number of syllables.
Oh, I see!
Ugh, bolding doesn't work.
It needs space to work.
'Ello.
<s>Arg</s>.
I guess it needs spaces in chat, but not in answers/questions.
11:34
Ha.
bold
Um, nope.
How do you strike-through things again?
some &#116;imes
Ops
no HTML tricks allowed here
-- I don't know --
I swear I've seen people do it. I think I got it to work too sometime.
Me too.
It was something like --this--
11:39
Five minutes ago it was snowing: now the sky is all blue and sunny.
@Gigili Yes, I've seen that work too, I think.
[-]
~~This~~
Haha.
Peh, nothing works.
Some text
Haha.
Oh, three dashes
I was waiting for you to ask how did you do that. Moderator powers cause abnormal behaviour/weather/conditions.
11:53
@Gigili exactly. It was me who caused snow on @Cerberus's house
@Gigili Ohhh well done!
@OtavioMacedo It's OK I like the snow.
It has melted anyway.
The World Health Organization (WHO) ranked the healthcare systems of its 191 member states in its World Health Report 2000. It provided a framework and measurement approach to examine and compare aspects of health systems around the world. It developed a series of performance indicators to assess the overall level and distribution of health in the populations, and the responsiveness and financing of health care services. It was the organization's first ever analysis of the world's health systems. Ranking Data from 1997 was used in the report. {|class="wikitable sortable" ! Ranking ! Count...
@OtavioMacedo I suspected so.
Notice how the USA are the no. 1 in healthcare spending per capita, but ranked 37 in quality.
Worse than Colombia, Dominica, Costa Rica, and Morocco.
Germany rocks.
Well, it's not that high.
Only 25th.
11:59
It rocks anyway.
Sure.
@Cerberus I've never seen snow
Aww really?
Now even in the mountains?
In which part of Brazil did you live again?
São Paulo
12:04
I guess your entire country is tropical.
Ah OK.
There is one city where sometimes it snows
Ah, the far south.
@OtavioMacedo Bah, never? I think you missed something which is something.
Never snow in Porto Alegre?
12:07
OK.
Well, it's white and cold.
That's the gist of it.
And it becomes hard and slippery if many people tread on it.
And it becomes a grey, dirty goo after a while due to the salt that is sprinkled on roads.
The salty goo sticks to you shoes and corrodes them. And it is carried inside, where it melts and creates puddles.
In a supermarkets, where lots of people walk in and out, half the floor can become one big puddle.
But white snow is nice.
You can roll balls and throw them at people.
People's face*
It's funny to see a young cat who has never seen snow before.
He will really tip-toe and shake his legs.
@Gigili Now, now, people might not like that!
In which part of Persia do you live? I presume you have snow in winter?
Uhum, lost of snow.
I live in Tehran.
12:13
Ahh cool.
In summer it will probably get hot, right?
Yes, each season is as expected.
My friends were going to visit Persia, but then the protests started—what was it: two years ago?
Half of them still went, and they were very much impressed.
Yeah, I think it was about three years ago.
Has society changed much since then?
Or is that not a good subject.
Um, it has changed of course.
12:20
A lot?
Yes, better to not talk about political issues.
There's always change.
@Gigili Yeah OK.
Have you seen the image I uploaded above?
If someone wants to measure blood pressure, in the evening is not the appropriate time to do it then, right?
Oh, interesting. But doesn't that depend a great deal on what time you normally go to bed? And on the season?
@Gigili I don't know what the normal time of day is that the method is calibrated on.
On the season? How it depends on the season?
12:27
Well, if it's cold and dark, doesn't that have an influence on your body temperature, activity, etc.?
Maybe a few minutes, but we live in a house normally and keep it warm. You know, heater and lamp help in that situation.
Well, even if my thermometer says it's 20 degrees in here, I'm still cold in winter, because temperature at floor level will be colder, and there will be drafts.
But many people will only heat their house to 18 degrees in winter.
My hands are cold now, for example. That never happens in summer.
But your body works as it does in summer, no?
It's probably different.
Then I can say I know absolutely nothing about human biology.
12:38
Of course the temperature at the innermost organs will be at 37 degrees always; but hands, feet, and skin will be warmer or colder. The heart probably has to work harder to keep things at a reasonable temperature in winter; I read that the body uses more energy and needs more food in winter. All that has got to have some influence in certain measurements.
@Gigili I don't know that much about it either. And perhaps the variation will not be that great, I don't know.
@Cerberus That makes perfect sense, I'd try to find the source of the picture to check if there's some useful information.
OK.
I mean, your picture may be accurate for each day separately; but it may not guarantee that values will be the same if you compare different days or different people.
gonna watch some old Italian movies, now
later, guys!
Ciao @OtavioMacedo.
Have fun! Which ones?
Fellini?
 
1 hour later…
13:54
hey @Cerberus
Hi.
Thanks for your congratulations!
@Cerberus :)
room topic changed to lɪŋˈgwɪstɪks: wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! (no tags)
14:11
Hey, do you know the difference between ʊ and u?
I don't.
Uhm
Yes
Book vs Room
Hmm but room can also be pronounced /rʊm/.
It's not very clear to me.
Perhaps I should listen to Wikipedia's samples.
Hmm they sound quite different on Wiki.
0
Q: How should we call our chat room?

AlenannoI recently renamed our chat name and description, and now they are: lɪŋgwɪstɪks wɛlkəm tu lɪŋgwɪstɪks! But a proposal was thrown to ask the community about it and decide together. Do you have a proposal? Structure your answer like: > ### Title > Description Obviously, vote ...

14:18
I suppose American book is also quite different from RP.
14:35
RP?
Received Pronunciation
Received Pronunciation (RP), also called the Queen's (or King's) English, is the accent of Standard English in England, with a relationship to regional accents similar to the relationship in other European languages between their standard varieties and their regional forms. RP is defined in the Concise Oxford Dictionary as "the standard accent of English as spoken in the south of England", but some have argued that it can be heard from native speakers throughout England and Wales. RP is sometimes referred to as Oxford English or BBC English because those organizations are often considere...
Oh, you meant British vs. American accent.
14:56
@Cerberus L'oro di Napoli
Vittorio de Sica
Very funny
Ah cool.
With the beautiful Sofia Loren
@OtavioMacedo de* :D
@Alenanno Oh, that's true
Gotta go now, later! :D
 
8 hours later…
22:47
Hello @Cerberus @OtavioMacedo and @Gigili
0
Q: Is there a proposed parameter of 'copula-drop'?

MitchThere is a property of languages with respect to copula (a verb 'to be' to mark equivalent thing): the copula may be necessary, or prohibited, or optional. For example, English requires a copula: He is good (you can''t take a way the 'is') In Russian: On khorosho. ('he good') In M...

23:05
@Alenanno Hi!
Did you see my answer on Spanish.SE?
Where? Nope. :D
1
A: Why, when, and how did vowels E and I get special treatment from consonants like C,G & Q?

Otavio MacedoYou are right. This phenomenon goes all the way back to Vulgar Latin and applies to other Romance languages, as well. First of all, a little phonetics background: the vowels /e/ and /i/ are what phoneticians call front vowels, because they are articulated in the frontal part of the mouth, unlike...

That question would be on topic here, as well ;-)
Nice answer! +1 for me. :D
23:27
Time for me to go, @OtavioMacedo :D Night. :) I closed the question "sentence with different meaning in two languages?" as NARQ.

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