TNB Conlang (katlani)

Ginger Industries

20:00

so now all we need is for @pxeger to sync the hackmd with the github

grandBagel

WR: hoptol (n): pig

mathcat

where is it commiting to?

grandBagel

github

Wezl - a cautionary tale

github.com/tnb-conlang/tnb-conlang/commit/…

grandBagel

WR: hoptol (n): pig

@PUSH

Ginger Industries

20:02

only I can do that lol

GitHub is rate-limited so it pushes every 30 min.

WR: hoptol (n): pig

pxeger

Are you gonna publish the bot's source code?

Ginger Industries

perhaps

Redwolf Programs

Complete guide to numbers in katlani:

Digits:

    1   ano
    2   ino
    3   ako
    4   iko
    5   ato
    6   ito
    7   afo
    8   ifo
    9   aro
    0   iri

Powers of ten:

    10    kib
    100   kid
    1k    kik
    10k   kin
    1m    kot
    1b    kol
    1t    kos
    1q    kon

Numbers are formed with a number of pairs of a digit and power of ten. For example, 2496 is:

    ino kik iko kid aro kib ito

On its own, ino is 2, but ino kik is 2000.

Ginger Industries

nice

pxeger

@GingerIndustries I would like to contribute so that it can push using normal git, rather than the GitHub API

Ginger Industries

20:04

@mathcat send that again

pxeger

Then it can also use a Deploy Key, and I don't have to give full repository access to a bot

mathcat

WR: rar (intj): er/um indecisive sound

Ginger Industries

@pxeger GingerBot is sad

Redwolf Programs

WR: ry (part): Ordinal particle; ry kib aro is "19th"

Ginger Industries

wait, one sec

I may have to restart again lol

pxeger

20:06

@RedwolfPrograms I'm not sure we really need one-syllable words for trillion and quadrillion

These words are also way too similar

Redwolf Programs

"so many"?

So, TNB is byt ry kib ano

pxeger

Well, any

Redwolf Programs

Why not?

It's two single syllable words, out of more than 1600

Ginger Industries

restarted

pxeger

@pxeger If you don't hear exactly, it's gonna be hard to tell if I said "aro" or "ato", or "kid" or "kik"

Redwolf Programs

20:08

@pxeger I agree with you, but there was a lot of support for using this system

pxeger

@RedwolfPrograms By whom? I might overrule because it's pretty objectively stupid for practicality

Redwolf Programs

So as I compromise I've made sure to make the words as distinct as possible

pxeger

Can you make the bot reply to the messages it's describing?

Ginger Industries

@pxeger yes, one sec

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger I agree, but Ginger and especially ASCII-Only were very vocal about defending it

So this was a compromise

Ginger Industries

20:10

okay, I think that works now

dammit

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms Originally, every digit was a.o aside from zero

Ginger Industries

captcha caught, one sec

mathcat

biya

Redwolf Programs

Bai!

Ginger Industries

biya! o/

aE

Redwolf Programs

20:12

@RedwolfPrograms But it doesn't matter that much, since it's not like we're likely to speak this in person very often

ASCII-only

o crap

Ginger Industries

hey ascii

GingerBot

@GingerIndustries Word ry added to queue.

Ginger Industries

nice

Redwolf Programs

@ASCII-only fosaksi atirlo!

ASCII-only

20:13

:o

Ginger Industries

eh?

@ASCII-only also, can you link the GitHub repo to the HackMD?

the bot edits the repo

ASCII-only

hm

i might need edit access to the repo

Ginger Industries

ask @pxeger

pxeger

The repo is the canonical source, ideally we'll get rid of the hackmd eventually

ASCII-only

h m

Ginger Industries

20:14

hopefully we will need it less because the bot works now

Redwolf Programs

The repo is currently a huge mess

Can we all take a break from suggesting words for a half hour or so?

I want to merge the hackmd into the repo and clean things up

Ginger Industries

the bot just looks for a top-level file called vocab.md to commit to

pxeger

→ 25 messages moved to Sandbox

ASCII-only

btw

1 min ago, by ASCII-only

i might need edit access to the repo

pxeger

yesterday, by pxeger

@pxeger please let me know your github usernames to get an invite

ASCII-only

20:16

o

somebody1234

Redwolf Programs

I'm going to merge the repo and the hackmd, give me half an hour or so

Ginger Industries

I'll help if you'd like

pxeger

→ 4 messages moved to Sandbox

ASCII-only

are we still going to sync the hackmd

pxeger

→ 1 message moved to Sandbox

Ginger Industries

20:18

@ASCII-only probably not, as it's redundant now

pxeger

I'm in favour of eliminating it

Ginger Industries

the bot means we don't need it

grandBagel

@pxeger +1

Redwolf Programs

We currently have both kat and kata. It kata the verb form of kat?

Ginger Industries

@pxeger sy gusti

pxeger

20:18

gusti?

Ginger Industries

@pxeger I wholeheartedly agree

ASCII-only

~~noita (n): witch~~

Redwolf Programs

Once I finish merging the two, we can just paste that into GH and drop the hackmd

Ginger Industries

@ASCII-only hmm

pxeger

@GingerIndustries oh right

Ginger Industries

20:20

@RedwolfPrograms keep in mind the bot may do a commit while you're merging

should I just push it now?

Redwolf Programs

Dw, I'm doing it in a separate text editor

Ginger Industries

okay

Dw = dumb witches

Redwolf Programs

Is alo meaning "jump" still a thing?

Ginger Industries

yes

baka noita

baka should be an adjective

onioni?

ASCII-only

sy

btw

Ginger Industries

20:23

actually should we just remove the noun form?

Redwolf Programs

I like the noun form

baka susi is cool

pxeger

no I think the noun form is useful

Ginger Industries

okay, have both

Redwolf Programs

bakil for adjective maybe?

Ginger Industries

@RedwolfPrograms sy gust

ASCII-only

20:24

i mean

Ginger Industries

WR: bakil (adj): fool, idiot

GingerBot

@GingerIndustries Word bakil added to queue.

ASCII-only

you could just have a short word for "thing"

Ginger Industries

@ASCII-only you mean y?

ASCII-only

right

pxeger

20:24

@RedwolfPrograms or add another particle for making words into adjectives?

ASCII-only

baka susi y?

i think that looks fine?

thats how adjectives work right

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger Ooh good idea

pxeger

isn't it y baka susi?

Ginger Industries

"stupid sussy thing?"

ASCII-only

/person

no?

Ginger Industries

20:25

@pxeger wait I thought of that this morning but didn't mention it :/

ASCII-only

y - thing (any thing or person)

pxeger

adjectives follow the noun

Ginger Industries

@pxeger either should work but I prefer after

ASCII-only

bruh

did this language change from prefix to postfix overnight

pxeger

I don't remember adjectives ever preceeding nouns

Ginger Industries

20:26

@ASCII-only [verb] [noun] [adjectives] is how it's always been

wait didn't we have a pronoun for "someone"?

where'd it go

i'm going to look for it

pxeger

mako

it's still there on github

Ginger Industries

ah

presenting the most vague sentence ever: mako nai y

"someone did something to something"

Wezl - a cautionary tale

nai mako su y

Ginger Industries

stupid noun cases

mi aaaaa

Redwolf Programs

@GingerIndustries That's not gramatically correct, and I ninja'd you by 24h :p

pxeger

20:30

You need nai mako su y

Ginger Industries

@RedwolfPrograms .̀_.́

pxeger

@GingerIndustries if you want "to something" as well, you need nai mako su y lia y

Ginger Industries

@pxeger .̀___.́

grammar is hard

do we have a verb for "to speak"?

grandBagel

kata

Ginger Industries

@grandBagel is that on github?

grandBagel

20:34

yes

o/

Ginger Industries

biya! o/

WR: gasi (adj): easy

GingerBot

@GingerIndustries Word gasi added to queue.

Redwolf Programs

Wait, an adjective ending in i?

Ginger Industries

@RedwolfPrograms :/

darn it

ah well, once it gets pushed we can change it to gisa or smth

or we cah just add a hyphen, like I said earlier

Redwolf Programs

How about gasil

Ginger Industries

20:38

22 hours ago, by Ginger Industries

if a word ends in -i or -u, add a hyphen

@RedwolfPrograms that's good

Redwolf Programs

@GingerIndustries Yeah, but it's still ambiguous if you don't know the word

Ginger Industries

:\

CMQ: What is the difference between :/ and :\?

Redwolf Programs

E.g., is virmi the word "virm" with an -i, or just a word?

Ginger Industries

i see

i have to turn the bot off for a sec, sorry

@PUSH

it broke anyway

brb

Redwolf Programs

Okay, I have them merged

ASCII-only

20:41

@GingerIndustries :\ is for left handed people i guess...

Redwolf Programs

Let me know once it's pushed, then I'll update it

ASCII-only

idk i havent seen anyone use :\

wait virm hasnt been defined yet?

Redwolf Programs

It's not a word

I made it up as an example

Y'know...it might actually be more useful if the bot doesn't push directly to vocab.md

ASCII-only

oh?

Redwolf Programs

If it pushed to like...vocab-staging.md, we could revise things before we add them to the main dictionary

That way if we miscategorize something, we don't have to go back in and fix it manually, and we don't need to worry about making joke ones since we can just not manually add them to vocab.md

ASCII-only

20:45

alternatively dont use bot? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Redwolf Programs

The bot's cool though :p

ASCII-only

then theres another trivial solution

add more commands to the bot

RW: word

short for "remove word"

Redwolf Programs

Merged with hackmd

ASCII-only

ok what the bot should do though

is update a changelog file, with all commands recieved between previous and current commit

pxeger

@RedwolfPrograms It could just push to a new branch, which we can fix up and then merge properly using git

Redwolf Programs

20:47

Eh, I think a separate file where it just lists the new words would be better

ASCII-only

but effort >:(

Redwolf Programs

Because with the bot merging automatically, it can't handle subdivisons of the parts of speech as well

pxeger

@RedwolfPrograms That seems like an inelegant solution

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms Which I brought over from the hackmd

ASCII-only

cough

hackmd sync

pxeger

20:48

When it merges, does it put them in the right sorting order automatically?

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger So does a bot that auto-adds new words without any revising

@pxeger Yes

ASCII-only

probably even easier than typing out WR: tbh

pxeger

@RedwolfPrograms the elegant solution is to use git properly

Redwolf Programs

I'd argue anything involving git is already inelegant lol

pxeger

@ASCII-only we'll get to a point where adding new words needs to be difficult, won't we?

ASCII-only

20:49

the elegant solution is to not use a bot

pxeger

HackMD is among the least elegant solutions I can think of

ASCII-only

@pxeger can be trivially solved by not syncing

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger No, the vocab.md is only a reflection of our usage

Adding a word to the list doesn't mean it gets used

HackMD sounds like a good idea to me

pxeger

it's no better than a google doc

Redwolf Programs

And a google doc is what we would've used if it didn't leak email addresses

pxeger

20:50

and literally anyone can edit it

Redwolf Programs

Yep

I disagree with syncing it, but it shouldn't matter either way

ASCII-only

@pxeger isn't that the point

Redwolf Programs

^

pxeger

but what if someone comes along and deletes everything

Redwolf Programs

It's github

We undo the last few changes

And the HackMD would work better as just new words not already in GH IMO

ASCII-only

20:52

hackmd has version control yes

pxeger

You can't tell me its version control approaches git

Redwolf Programs

Why would it need to?

Undoing is not space age technology

ASCII-only

ok it kinda sucks pasting images into SE chat, is there a userscript that helps?

i thought hackmd literally used git

for version control

idk tbh

pxeger

> Only showing recent 10 versions for free plan. Upgrade to Prime plan to show all versions.

There's reason #1 not to use it

ASCII-only

can again

be trivially solved

by moving to the oss clone of hackmd

not to mention, if someone does a massive oopsie generally it's a very recent change

and again you could just not push to github

pxeger

20:54

but if someone just does 10 massive oopsies

Redwolf Programs

Then we still have github from like two hours ago?

The hackmd is just the bleeding edge changes

ASCII-only

exactly

51 secs ago, by ASCII-only

and again you could just not push to github

Redwolf Programs

It seems like we're all either talking past each other or just have different goals in mind

pxeger

So I don't see why we don't just use github for everything

ASCII-only

thank u for reading

pxeger

20:55

It's not hard to use

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger it's harder to collaboratively edit, and it takes longer

ASCII-only

hackmd is decent for live collaborative editing

i.e. it's a lot easier to talk about changes you have

it's a lot easier to see changes other people make

pxeger

we have chat to talk about them

you can see changes by looking at the transcript and looking at the commits

Redwolf Programs

wait, just to clear something up, if I start editing the vocab.md and someone else edits it while I'm doing so, will my edit overwrite theirs?

ASCII-only

on hackmd?

Redwolf Programs

20:56

No, GH

ASCII-only

gh using web editor?

Redwolf Programs

No, just the edit button

The web editor doesn't work for me

ASCII-only

aka web editor

Redwolf Programs

Oh

pxeger

github will either automatically merge it or reject your change and make you put it on a new branch

@ASCII-only I think Redwolf thought you were talking about codespaces (press . in GitHub)

ASCII-only

20:57

anyway re: github

pxeger

@pxeger I've disabled force pushes on the main branch, so it can't overwrite it

Redwolf Programs

Also, @pxeger, why are you so insistent on taking unilateral actions against the hackmd? You've unpinned it, removed it from the room description, and griefed it with a link to the GH

ASCII-only

the discussion was bot vs hackmd, yes?

so i'm not even sure where github fits in all this anyway

like, the alternative is let ginger manually commit again

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms Like, I get you dislike it, but discuss it, don't just get rid of it without anyone's support

ASCII-only

tbh

pxeger

20:59

Because I thought it was only supposed to be a temporary solution because I didn't set up the github right

Redwolf Programs

@ASCII-only I was bringing up a third option, manually using GH

ASCII-only

i guess vscode live share is a viable option

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