TNB Conlang (katlani)

Redwolf Programs

17:00

Oh, I added gangip so I could say "I guess", but we already have nai mogusi niny (maybe it does)

pxeger

It's useful to have words like that anyway

Ginger Industries

brb

Redwolf Programs

WR: tiksias (adj): Cold

(The similarity to "Texas" is funny but not intentional)

pxeger

WR: seksy (adj): Hot

DLosc

Lol ^^ and ^

mathcat

17:02

lol

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger *siksy

mathcat

wait we need lol

DLosc

@pxeger No e though!

Redwolf Programs

@mathcat We have lol, it's lol

pxeger

12 mins ago, by Wezl - a cautionary tale

WR: hyhy (intj.): laughing

mathcat

17:02

oh ok

pxeger

hyhyhy

Redwolf Programs

WR: kivsk (n): Parent

Ginger Industries

back

pxeger

WR: mykivsk, n.: child

because children belong to parents

Redwolf Programs

How about ksik

A simplified backwards spelling

With less social implications, because those suck

Or maybe ksyk to make them sound less similar

pxeger

17:08

I like ksik

Or skik?

Redwolf Programs

ksik sounds nicer to me

DLosc

WR: sitsili (v): to laugh

Redwolf Programs

I feel like it should have an y in there

Since we spell laughing as hyhy

DLosc

sitsyli?

Redwolf Programs

sy gust

WR: shushu (conj): Because

grandBagel

17:11

back

what did i miss?

DLosc

@pxeger I'm noticing several words in the GitHub vocab doc that are different from what I expected. Should I just change those, or should we discuss them here first?

pxeger

unless they're obviously just mistakes, discuss them

DLosc

Well, first of all, there's several words that use c or e

Redwolf Programs

lol

grandBagel

lol

pxeger

17:13

ah ok, seksy needs changing

Redwolf Programs

siksy probably

pxeger

siksy?

Redwolf Programs

sy gust

DLosc

sy gust

grandBagel

soskiy

Redwolf Programs

17:14

I am a diga today lol

DLosc

Also kloc

grandBagel

kloa

pxeger

fixed all of them

Redwolf Programs

WR: rus (n): Day

WR: nirus (n): Today

grandBagel

WR: poboa: nice (as in: "Nice work!")

Redwolf Programs

17:15

Seems too close to fos

DLosc

@pxeger And pxgr? It could be a foreign borrowing which would excuse the x, but then we might as well just spell it pxeger I would think

@RedwolfPrograms Near-synonyms are fine IMO

Redwolf Programs

Okay, these two I'm not as sure about:

DLosc

Real languages have tons of them

Redwolf Programs

WR: pasrus (n): Yesterday

WR: fyrus (n): Tomorrow

pxeger

@DLosc I wouldn't complain if that word were removed altogether, in all honesty

Redwolf Programs

17:16

Same

DLosc

@pxeger Agreed

Redwolf Programs

maka no longer means "hey everyone"

pxeger

maybe we should also remove some other stupid words like vaiksal, sus?

DLosc

It'd be nice if each list was alphabetised so it's easier to find the word you're looking for

Redwolf Programs

@pxeger sus is fine, vaiksal should probably be removed

DLosc

17:18

^

lyxal already said he didn't like the "vyxal bad" joke, so we shouldn't put it in our language

Ginger Industries

Part of speech abbreviation list:

PARTS = {
  "pre": "Prefixes and Suffixes",
  "suf": "Prefixes and Suffixes",
  "n": "Nouns",
  "v": "Verbs",
  "adj": "Adjectives",
  "pro": "Pronouns",
  "adv": "Adverbs",
  "part": "Case Particles",
  "intj": "Interjections",
  "conj": "Conjunctions",
  "othr": "Other"
}

onioni?

Redwolf Programs

Add more

Ginger Industries

Those are all the ones in the HackMD

DLosc

@pxeger sus is an adjective, not a verb. The verb susin means "to suspect (someone)"

Redwolf Programs

int for intj, pron for pro, prep, noun for n

Ginger Industries

17:21

@RedwolfPrograms ok

Redwolf Programs

other for othr

par for part

pxeger

@DLosc I thought that was a bit weird; I'll fix it

DLosc

@GingerIndustries Maybe ptc for particle

pxeger

@RedwolfPrograms part is fine IMO

Redwolf Programs

It is, but I use par too

DLosc

17:22

Redwolf wanted to change opb to just op; onioni?

Ginger Industries

PARTS = {
  "pre": "Prefixes and Suffixes",
  "suf": "Prefixes and Suffixes",
  "n": "Nouns",
  "noun": "Nouns",
  "v": "Verbs",
  "adj": "Adjectives",
  "pron": "Pronouns",
  "pro": "Pronouns",
  "adv": "Adverbs",
  "part": "Case Particles",
  "par": "Case Particles",
  "int": "Interjections",
  "intj": "Interjections",
  "conj": "Conjunctions",
  "othr": "Other",
  "other": "Other"
}

Redwolf Programs

Looks better

Maybe a for adj?

Ginger Industries

noice

pxeger

misc for "other"?

@DLosc gust opb

Redwolf Programs

WR: id (adv): More so (e.g., id fos is "better")

DLosc

17:24

@pxeger Oh, that's another thing: the verb we've been using for "to like (something)" is gus without the t

@RedwolfPrograms Isn't that what -i does?

fosi

pxeger

WR: sik (part.): per se; "the word". E.g. sik opb means "The word opb"

DLosc

Or is there a slight difference?

Redwolf Programs

Oh true

I was thinking more like id fos pat xyz

But idk if we want to reuse pat there, or add another word like do

DLosc

I guess "very good" !== "better" unless you're thinking in Latin/Greek (as I clearly am)

pxeger

-i is for intensification, not comparison

Redwolf Programs

17:26

I kind of like adding a word for comparisons only, do

id fos do [thing]

And also ud for less, maybe

DLosc

Suggestion: do is a preposition meaning "from"

pxeger

Overloading that onto pat seems a bit eurocentric imo; they're quite distinct meanings

Redwolf Programs

@DLosc bomy, sy gust!

@pxeger onin ma su niny ama

Oh, we need to add bomy to the GH

There's a whole bunch of words in the hackmd and not the GH

pxeger

Yeah most of those words aren't on the GH, it confused me lol

DLosc

^^

pxeger

17:28

> golfy - fast

really?

DLosc

I'm okay with changing that :P

Redwolf Programs

Same

Suggestion: tiz

DLosc

Wasn't there already a word for "fast" on GH?

Redwolf Programs

Or if that's too short, tizani

DLosc

Yeah, holt

Wezl - a cautionary tale

17:30

@RedwolfPrograms pasrusi (or pasrusii) can be the past and fyrusi(i) can be the future

Redwolf Programs

Oh yeah, we have holt

gus ma su "holt"

Wezl - a cautionary tale

nirusi can be like these days

Redwolf Programs

Ooh good idea

sy gusti

WR: sibin (n): Thought, idea

WR: sabist (v): To discuss

Wezl - a cautionary tale

sabist imi su "sabist" :P

Redwolf Programs

fobl imi kai lia ma su onioni

DLosc

17:34

@Wezl-acautionarytale sabist imi vmak? ;P

Redwolf Programs

sibin fos: Good idea

DLosc

Though I suppose if you leave out the subject, we just guess an appropriate one from context

Wezl - a cautionary tale

implicit y'all

Redwolf Programs

Hmm, if we can have an implied ta I guess an implied subject isn't far off

Wait no

That's passive

Well, maybe with imi it's not?

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms It can function like a passive, but it's not exactly.

Redwolf Programs

17:35

sabist su "sabist" would mean "'sabist' is being discussed", but with imi I guess it's clear

DLosc

It's more like "they" or "you" as a dummy pronoun in English: "They say there is no free lunch" ~= "It is said that there is no free lunch"

(Similarly on in French, man in German, third-person plural verb with no explicit subject in Koine Greek)

Redwolf Programs

Hmm, should "I want to think" be kiro ma pat onin ma or kiro ma pat onin? (do we need the subject twice)

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms Yeah, if you translate a missing-subject verb as a passive, then sabist imi su y would mean "Let the thing be discussed," which is fairly clear from context as a command/invitation to discuss the thing

Redwolf Programs

Ooh, I like that

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms We can probably omit the subject when it's clear from context, yeah

Redwolf Programs

17:38

And should that be kiro ma pat onin, or kiro ma su pat onin?

I guess pat onin isn't a noun, so no su?

Wezl - a cautionary tale

no lani my shor vi kod my ma

Redwolf Programs

I can't parse that lol

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms Either way, but I prefer it without su. You could think of pat as introducing a clause which is a "thing" that is the direct object of the verb, or you could think of certain verbs as just taking a pat clause instead of a direct object.

Wezl - a cautionary tale

my programming language does not have built-in words, so I can make a separate standard library from the normal one that uses katlani words

@Wezl-acautionarytale "my language of programming does not have words"

Redwolf Programs

WR: un (adv): Less so (used with do like id)

DLosc

17:41

@Wezl-acautionarytale I got "not my programming language's words"

Redwolf Programs

si niny su un fos do pasny: This is worse than that

Wezl - a cautionary tale

okay is there a better way to say "x does not have y"?

Redwolf Programs

no oto x su y

DLosc

@Wezl-acautionarytale Use no oto

Wezl - a cautionary tale

oh, I always forget oto

DLosc

17:42

@RedwolfPrograms diga intarnit :P

Redwolf Programs

I thought naita was internet, so it'd be diga my naita

DLosc

@Wezl-acautionarytale It's a pretty Eurocentric construction TBH, but we're all English-speakers here so our conlang is going to be Eurocentric in a lot of ways

@RedwolfPrograms Or diga vi naita?

Redwolf Programs

Yeah, this isn't meant to be an IAL, so a little eurocentrism is fine since we all speak english

Wezl - a cautionary tale

mostly because oto's definition says "to own" and I was looking for "to have"

which is impossible to search for btw

Redwolf Programs

@DLosc I read my as being like "of" in that sentence, like "juice of orange" for orange juice

Rather than vi which I'd read as closer to "juice with orange"

DLosc

17:45

@RedwolfPrograms One of the meanings of X vi Y, I think, is "a Y type of X", thus "an internet kind of ninja"

Redwolf Programs

Ah, ok. sy gust

DLosc

(which, fun fact, is the original meaning of "genitive"--from the Latin genus, "kind")

Redwolf Programs

How do we say "most [adj]" and "least [adj]"?

Ginger Industries

WD: test word (n): test word def

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms Remind me what "more" and "less" are again?

Redwolf Programs

17:48

id and ud

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms Would idi and udi work for "most" and "least," or do you want something fancier?

Redwolf Programs

I think idi would be more like "much more"

How about ida?

Or idid even

Wezl - a cautionary tale

idii/udii?

Redwolf Programs

That's just "much much more"

I kinda like idid and udud :p

Wezl - a cautionary tale

ama ma

a mama

DLosc

17:51

@RedwolfPrograms That's fair--a lot of languages use reduplication more than European languages do, and we haven't used it much so far. sy gust

Redwolf Programs

si ka su idid izl do bakai: You are the most dangerous of the fools

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms sy, fy iz ma su ka >:)

Redwolf Programs

D:

DLosc

ma izlii

Wezl - a cautionary tale

how do you say "I have many jaws" :P

DLosc

17:53

This plural/intensifier suffix is my favorite thing about katlani ^_^

@Wezl-acautionarytale Do we have a word for "jaw"?

Redwolf Programs

WR: tshomp (n): Jaw

DLosc

hyhyhy

Wezl - a cautionary tale

I was going to suggest "dog"

oto ma su tshompii

Redwolf Programs

Might confuse people since dogo exists

Wezl - a cautionary tale

fEAR mE

Redwolf Programs

17:56

WR: asikini (a): Funny

Wezl - a cautionary tale

WR: tshava (v): frighten

Redwolf Programs

tshava su ma

Wezl - a cautionary tale

"I am frightened"

Redwolf Programs

sy

tshava su ma ta tshompii my ka

Wezl - a cautionary tale

tSHAVA iMI tu mA

tshava java

(means the same as tshava java su yi)

Redwolf Programs

18:00

sabist imi makai su lani shin

WR: atir (a): Additional, more

lani atir: More words

DLosc

@pxeger Whoa, TIL

mathcat

Is there a word for if already?

DLosc

Don't think so

Redwolf Programs

I don't think so

I think I suggested one super early on

22 hours ago, by Redwolf Programs

WR: iis: If

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms ta ma ni si su dagi

Redwolf Programs

18:06

@RedwolfPrograms But that was back when is meant sy for like 10m

@DLosc Seems like a su might be needed

Or maybe if there's a ta, the su is implied instead?

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms yps

Redwolf Programs

@RedwolfPrograms syy or ysy would be the updated version of this if we used it

DLosc

Is nistaha transitive or intransitive?

Redwolf Programs

What's the difference?

DLosc

Can it take a direct object or not?

Redwolf Programs

18:08

Yes

nistaha imi ka su o means "Look at the cat"

grandBagel

back

haia!

Redwolf Programs

WR: riomr (n): Machine

DLosc

nistaha imi ka su ma. ta ma si su dagi lia pasla.

Redwolf Programs

WR: simriomr (n): Computer

DLosc

Is sim- a prefix?

Redwolf Programs

18:11

No

But I based the word for "computer" off of "machine" because why not

DLosc

Seems like it should be if the riomr element is shared

Redwolf Programs

Well, I did take sim from think

So we could make it like a...one time use prefix?

DLosc

I'm pushing for more derivational morphology strategies here

Redwolf Programs

Oh, it was sib that's the first syllable of thought

DLosc

It could be cool to have some words that are compounds of verb + noun, like "sawbones" in English or "chupacabras" in Spanish

I either saw a video or read an article about those. It said that they are present in (many? most? all?) languages.

Redwolf Programs

18:14

I don't think we need to have a standardized way of doing it though

We can just make words that sound how we think they should

Which could mean combining existing ones

grandBagel

Is ginger-bot working yet?

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms I'm just looking for patterns here

Ginger Industries

@grandBagel I'm working on it

Redwolf Programs

WR: tshrio (v): To finish

fy tshrio su niny isplo?

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms mogusi. si "isplo" su vy?

(as in, "When exactly is that?", not "What does the word mean?")

Redwolf Programs

18:22

WR: varis (v): To mean

pas varis "vaiksal" su "oro"

DLosc

ni ktom isi ma su ktomish. fy aksi ma lia barda. o/

Redwolf Programs

When I greet a bunch of people, should I say Hai, makai! like we used to, or Hai, kai! since I'm not really greeting myself?

@DLosc bai!

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms I think it's an amusing exception to have the idiom be makai. gus ma su "makai".

Redwolf Programs

barda's not a word anymore, right?

I thought we replaced it with fylo

DLosc

IDK, I searched "later" in the chat transcript and that's what I found

Redwolf Programs

18:25

Oh lol

I guess we could give barda a meaning, but it'd be inconsistent with our -lo suffix

DLosc

Ah, found fylo in the HackMD

Redwolf Programs

Also, did you mean isa?

isi doesn't show up anywhere

WR: atirlo: Again

DLosc

@RedwolfPrograms Bah. I meant imi.

mathcat

WR: wis: if

DLosc

ni ktom imi ma.

Ginger Industries

18:28

Okay, I've got my algorithm appending words to the markup!

mathcat

same syntax like pat?

Redwolf Programs

fy aksi ma lia atirlo: I will come again

Ginger Industries

only problem: It can't alphabetize :/

mathcat

?

Ginger Industries

It appends the new word to the markdown, but not in alphabetical order

I don't know how to easily fix this

Redwolf Programs

18:30

WR: ktomizo (n): A meal

ktomizo pasla: Breakfast

ktomizo nila: Lunch

ktomizo fyla: Dinner

mathcat

@GingerIndustries can you just sort?

Ginger Industries

@mathcat I'm working on that

mathcat

like sort()?

Redwolf Programs

ktaf vi lani: Dictionary

("Book with words")

Also ktof do varis, "book for defining"

fosaksi atirlo: Welcome back!

We can make a lot of stuff by combining existing words

onin ka pat si vy su idid fos do ktomishi?

mathcat

pr?

Redwolf Programs

18:38

kahidai "slaint" pat varis pat rno ov banli?

How do we say "x that is y" in place of a noun?

mathcat

what's the (adverb) abbreviation?

Redwolf Programs

adv

mathcat

WR: rar (adv): sort of er, um (things someone says when they're indecisive)

Redwolf Programs

WR: vop (pn): Where?

WR: vash (pn): When?

mathcat

I thought tshadom is when

Redwolf Programs

18:46

Yeah, but "when" as in like "My cat is angry when I'm gone", not "When will you be gone?"

Wezl - a cautionary tale

tshadom is when but not as a question

mathcat

oh

wait is the bot working because vop got added

grandBagel

WR: mognos: tip-toe

Ginger Industries

bot thinks that T is in the same place as K in the alphabet :/

Redwolf Programs

mognos ta digai

mathcat

18:50

wait rar in an interjection

I can't delete it anymore

Redwolf Programs

gus vmak su borsh?

Ginger Industries

found the problem

Redwolf Programs

gus ka su borsh, o vi matiks?

a ka, ginger?

mathcat

WR: rar (intj): sort of er, um (things someone says when they're indecisive)

Wezl - a cautionary tale

gus ma su borsh asi no gogi

mathcat

18:53

@RedwolfPrograms isn't borsh soup?

Redwolf Programs

varis "gogi" su vy?

@mathcat sy

Wezl - a cautionary tale

4 hours ago, by Redwolf Programs

WR: gogi (n): Meat

Redwolf Programs

Added to hackmd

onin ma pat gogi fos, kashi nai ka su ka

mathcat

@RedwolfPrograms sy gust, nilvan

Redwolf Programs

li fos

Wezl - a cautionary tale

18:56

@RedwolfPrograms is this "you do you"?

Redwolf Programs

Yep

I'm betting in under a week we can talk primarily in katlani, and any inglish will need to be in italics instead of katlani in code

WR: ozon (n): Name

WR: umub (N): Number

Wezl - a cautionary tale

@Wezl-acautionarytale better: gus ma su borsh no vi gogi or gus ma su borsh kashi no gus ma su borsh vi gogi

Ginger Industries

I think that the bot's parsing engine now works

yay

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