behind a tree

The thug aims at Tharvyrion one last time, leg beginning to quiver under his weight...

(WIS save with +0 against DC 13)

d20

disadv?

oh wait nbm

later on

(rolling with +3 with disadvantage for long range)

d20 d20

The thug's arrow goes well wide again as Tharvyrion is able to get away.

back to the top

(attack again +5)

1d20

whelp.

heh

that's my turn

i come running in with my sword raised at the archer and come crashing down with a jump attack "hyaa"

+5

d20

Aelar's arrow goes wide this time...

but the distracted thug doesn't see the charging Shal coming

d8

+3

-_-, 5 dmg

and Shal's blade connects, gashing the thug's left arm and causing him to unleash a string of elvish swears as he pulls his mace out and drops his bow, the latter a near-involuntary action

The thug retaliates by swinging his mace at Shal...

(at a +4, d20)

d20

"hit me I dare you you whippernsapper"

but Shal is able to parry it with his longsword

back to the top

ready your bow to attack if i leave his range

oh wait i provoke oppurtunity

well ill zap him if he attacks me

ready an attack ill go in for a strike, jump back, and if he hits me i zap him and you can finish him off if he survives

Ready - I will shoot an arrow at the bandit should he not be in melee with Shal

end turn

i whack him with my sharp thing

d20

+5

13

Your slash connects with the thug...

d8

7 total

and hews his gut open, sending his entrails spilling out. He drops his mace, swearing as he staggers sideways into a tree.

"Yay"

"sorry you're going to die, you guys were acting like real assholes though"

"Oh, and fuck spiders"

So... anything else @Shalvenay

that's the end of the encounter

that was...rough, for sure.

I may have to go back and tell @daze413 that his spider idea was the straw that broke the camel's back

got any feedback on the encounter (other than me being sloppy -- I know :) or the overall RP for that matter?

and @Reibello -- just ping me some weekday night US time when you want to do the dungeon itself (it's actually probably easier than this from a not-dying standpoint, but definitely could be interesting esp. with a Lawful Evil char)

@Skyler @Reibello?

hmm

2 secs

comments? questions? concerns? suggestions? criticisms?

how much health did the bandits have, 20?

spider ~15

bandits and spider had 11HP each

thug had 32

Tharvyrion also had 11HP

so the big challenge is this encounter turned into 65 hp vs 20 hp

I thought it went well - technically @Skyler shouldn't have had that second reaction - but it was pretty necessary for our success.

Was this downscaled from an expected party size?

it was designed to scale with party size

though to be fair since you attacked the guy who was brought me down it didnt completely skew things a lot

the big problem is the 4 attacks vs 2 attacks

it's 1 bandit/PC party member + 1 thug and 1 spider

I think the spider pushed it over the top

yeah -- the 2nd reaction for @Skyler was a Rule of Cool thing xD

and I have to eat, bbiab

yeah

okay

yea, i mean if i didnt get a DOUBLE CRIT this fight woulve failed

yeah

I think it could have gone better for us

then again, if i went first this fight could have ended almost right away

but definitely a hard encounter - be curious to know what it rated via DMG

if you want me to simulate what my plan originally was

if instead of sanctuarying dude he fought with me and you thunderwaved guys up front

we probably would have done much better

yea, rei should have gone for the thug

and then "thunderwave"

3d8

and unless they made a dex save all 3 guys wouldve died

or is it 2d8

lemee double check

(still fatal if 4 and 7 though)

I mean, I went for the guy in the back

it wouldve been 2d8

I didn't see hidden guy yet

yea, he defined "back" after i said back

no

he said one in front, one in back

spider was with front

and then "thug" hidden

ah

yeah

I hadn't seen that guy at first, so I went for the single target

first impressions make everything i guess

yeah

@Reibello very definitely in the Deadly category

yeah

Might have helped to keep sanctuary in our back pocket instead of leading it

but

yeah, I think using Thunderwave early would have helped quite a bit

AoEs are powerful tools when you're outnumbered

@Shalvenay wut, my spider ate a camel?

@daze413 ate a few things, actually

but yeah, I think the spider is just too much in terms of encounter difficulty, even after an initial nerfbat attempt

the action economy is way skewed at 2 people vs 4

Yeah - there are a few things that help with that

but rogues aren't one of them

wait! i wanna see how it went! Where's the spider in action :D

yeah, I agree there. it's basically an either-or proposition for the thug and the spider...

@daze413 for one example, scroll up. I'll have to pastebin you the logs of the other one.

@Shalvenay oh god, what have you done

@Shalvenay you could make one of the bandits a falconer and give them a blood hawk - still interesting tactically, but far less deadly I thin

@Reibello yeah, the giant spider is definitely brutal even after I nerfed the poison damage

bpaste.net/show/2637dbfee481 for the logs of the other (the player is a regular on the GitP IRC channel, btw)

@Reibello yeah -- the spider was a thematic choice

ah okay

@Shalvenay haha that is awesome

@daze413 basically i was going to be dead as hell if I didnt double crit (in a row)

so basically a message from god

so that was 3 bandits and 1 spider?

@daze413 2 bandits, 1 spider, 1 thug

against a tempest cleric, a rogue, and the tax collector

1 wild card spider :D

how do you adjudicate the spider's actions btw? whats the d6 mean?

that's who the spider attacks that round

oooh. no animal handling checks from the bandit trying to control it?

that might take some actions out of the enemies

@daze413 nope. didn't think of that offhand...will have to look into that for one more try with the spider in play

what DCs are used for Animal Handling checks in 5e? PHB doesn't give any guidance

and really sell that the spider is not tamed at all. perhaps an insight or animal handling check will tell the players that? or narrate it however you want. Seeing it in play, I do think it's too much, if it keeps attacking anyone after getting its first kill... Maybe, after the spider's first kill, it drags the victim off into the woods: be it PC or NPC?

@daze413 that might work better?

Hmm... I'd set it at 10, following theangrygm's advice: 10 - requires either training or talent to succeed. At 15, requires both training and talent. 20, tough even for the trained and talented.

@daze413 good thinking

If it comes to a point that the bandit and the PC is both trying to handle the animal to make it do something on its turn, then an animal handling showdown is at-hand! :D

idk, I've always been a nature kinda guy (always playing rangers/druids/cleric, and always getting proficiency in animal handling) so I might have biases there

Anyway, I should go. Have fun tweaking the spider :D

@daze413 ah.

I'll give the spider another whirl if I can get players in for it :)

@Shalvenay the handler died remember

@Skyler that is true -- the spider handler died xD I may ahve it revert to random behavior in the future if that happens

functionally this game played out the handled case then since the handler died in the first turn

@Skyler true

@Skyler well, mostly

@nitsua60 Yep!

@Miniman So, one martial and one caster each? You have any preferences?

Or some hybridization?

@nitsua60 I don't have any strong preferences - if you decide what you want to do I'll work with that.

2d12

Hmm...I guess that would be 2 warlocks....

d12

monk?

@Miniman So a monk and a warlock?

Hmmm, interesting.

In that case, I guess I'll go for a cleric and something else.

I haven't actually played a warlock yet. Any tips?

@nitsua60 Depends how you want to build them.

But in general, eldritch blast is >>>> than melee.

yeah, eldritch blast is mean

@Miniman So, ranged attacker... buffs? Or debuffs/control?

Whoopsie: 10=sorceror, not warlock.

@nitsua60 Well, at 5th level you've got 2 spells per short rest.

(Dunno what I was thinking.)

If you're monk + sorc, I'm thinking I'll go cleric + paladin.

So probably a WM sorcerer, maybe supporting by haste or blur on melee, spamming cantrips and the occasional AoE for damage?

@nitsua60 Sounds good to me! (With reservations about WM, of course :p)

=D

That's the paladin done - I'd forgotten how long this takes.

Ok, that's the cleric done.

@Miniman ok im ready. Ping me when you guys are @nitsua60 does double pinging work?

@daze413 Ready!

And yep, double pinging works in chat.

Just not in comments on the main site.

So what classes and archetypes did you pick?

you're supposed to also have magic items... but I haven't worked it out yet so lets play without some

Variant Human Oath of the Crown Paladin, and Hill Dwarf Life Cleric.

A pair of City Watch members.

@daze413 I was going to ask, can I assume by level 5 I'd have managed to pick up plate mail?

yeah, go do it. Players can't get this far without getting a few thousand gold

Thanks!

docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/…

meanwhile...

im having trouble giving ranged attackers a challenge in this fight

Not to worry - we're looking at 3 melee, one spellcaster, so it shouldn't be an issue.

yeah, but I wan't this to be replayable hehe

Ah, yeah.

Honestly, it's tough to really threaten ranged characters in D&D without giving your encounters great ranged attacks themselves or restrictive conditions.

Fortunately, players don't tend to abuse their advantages.

I was going for the restrictive conditions option. Without lair actions though its tough

Maybe I should give this guy the Aggressive ability

take out magic resistance

it kinda works... recalculating CR >_<

@daze413 Having played around with it, I've sort of come to the conclusion that lair actions/legendary actions/legendary resistance are basically necessary to pull off a boss monster.

we'll see. it's relatively low level so I;m guessing it's ok?

plus, this guy isn't alone, he has aplaymate, Wilbur

@daze413 Probably, yeah.

we'll place him in the map

Incidentally, bones are half cover, 3/4, or full?

depends on size

for small, that's 3/4

medium 1/2

Cool.

Also, how does the party get in?

have you played Darkest Dungeon?

No, sorry.

No no it's fine, I guess it's better that way.

You should try it. The game is pretty good and the narration is so sexy

@daze413 here

maybe I put in some other Bones in there for player cover... Then when TSP treads them, he just levels them and clears the difficult terrain

yeah, that sounds good

docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/…

@nitsua60 here, have some editing priveleges

@daze413 I could easily swap in a ranged martial for the monk

@Miniman I'd agree. Otherwise, they just don't get enough "screen time."

@nitsua60 Hmm... Then I'll replace his extra attack with a Legendary Action. Just have to come up with another LA that isn't to attack hehe

@nitsua60 up to you. I'd be ok with any combination actually.

Just... have... to... replace Magic Resistance with Aggressive

oh... no change in CR even if I don't take out MR.

ok, ready?

@daze413 I'll just stick with these, then. If we want a round 2, I'll pull out a Sharpshooter =)

Ready!

ok

place your characters beyond the line

ready

In place