@BrianBallsun-Stanton Here's my "you told me so" question: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/22215/…

Woot! We have a duel!

er

dool?

@Lord_Gareth nothing to tell, really. I can disable them for lenghty periods of time but then I end up with nothing to throw at them.

In my struggles with epic level 4e encounters, I've found one of the best 'tricks' is to present a Hard Choice: "You have the time/resources to do one of these two cool things, which will you choose?"

Instead of throwing up walls to block them, I throw out options for them to choose from.

It's admittedly a bit easier in 4e, which is more structured, but "if you dispel this fog then you will be blinded" is a harder choice than "if you don't dispel this fog why didn't you?"

I need to find a Q: but can't find it, maybe you english speaking people can be of some help. Anything about ad&d players asking what changes from ad&d to 3.5e is god

You mean what people like about 3.5 compared to AD&D?

no I mean the "I'm new to the system, what are the major changes?

Well, this might be a place to start: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/8535/…

(I just pulled up the list of [adnd] tagged questions; there's only two pages of them.)

funny thing I was on the same list and couldn't find it

thanks @BESW

No problem.

[pokes THAC0 with a stick]

@BrianBallsun-Stanton, I COME TO BESEECH YOU AND BEG OF YOU YOUR DREADFUL WISDOM

@Lord_Gareth You realize he demands that you answer a riddle first, right?

If you can't answer it, he gets to eat your rep.

He cannot, for I ask him Technical Questions, relating to the mighty Website

As a Moderator, he is bound to heed my call.

Ah, you've been flipping through the Necromodicon.

Be sure the Questing Circle is drawn tightly and you don't cross the lines or he'll eat you anyway.

And star'd

Hilarious

(And don't feed the egos after midnight.)

Well @BESW, the summoning has failed, so I turn to you.

Is there a section of Stackexchange at which I might point a knitting enthusiast?

Great, I'm the knock-off store-brand oracle.

Not that I know of, but Area 51 has two or three different proposed sites along those lines.

Hrm, not sure that's helpful

Unfortunately my IM knitter isn't online right now. I think she uses MeFi.

A quick google finds ravelry and knitpicks.

@Lord_Gareth da?

::prods at the diamond circle with a tentacle::

I have been summoned?

Ok, let's throw this out there. Can anyone recommend a rules-light post-apocalyptic RPG? Something fast and fun and easy to learn?

I want to run a post-apocalytic game for my group, currently running Pathfinder. I'm looking for a system that gives focus to cool powers, and coolness-factor in general, but will be easy to switch to for 3 players who've played mostly d20 (and some 4e) in the last few years, and one player that's really crunch-averse.

I still think FATE's the best option, even if you can't get your hands on an actual module for it.

@SimonGill You around?

Fate was what I had in mind, but unfortunately FATE Core is still in production, and I don't want to start adapting rules from other FATE-based games.

It ought to be out by the end of the month.

Unfortunately right now we're in that limbo where the kickstarter's closed so you can't get the beta version for participating.

Meanwhile today's scheduled Pathfinder session, meant to be the grand finale, has been postponed to next week.

Alas!

I know that pain.

If it's a matter of days until FATE Core comes out, I can certainly wait for that. But the site is extremely vague.

That's one reason I pinged @SimonGill. He Knows These Things.

@BESW You have IM knitter?

I have a knitting friend on IM.

mmm. Right now the website's predicting "Spring" for FATE Core.

I thought I saw something a while back that said "Feb."

At any rate, FATE Core and FATE Accelerated will be available for free as pdfs as soon as the books are on shelves.

Anything special with FATE since people mention it so much?

I've heard about it lots of places.

Special as in why we like it, or special things happening right now?

Why you like it.

Lots of reasons, but at the heart because it's an extremely basic-yet-flexible system that places RP at the core of its actual mechanics.

Well, because it's awesome, duh. :P

The mechanical engine for character and story advancement consists of a set of pithy statements about the character, and using game currency to make those statements have mechanical effect.

@BESW Sounds interesting. Might give it a go. Currently me and my group are running our own homebrew system which is also aimed at having RP at the core.

You get more game currency when those phrases ("aspects") complicate your situation, and you spend it for narrative control --bonuses, re-rolls, declaring things about your situation, etc.

The more you can tie your expenditure of game currency into those phrases, the more control you have.

Will it be free when released?

I see the kickstarter stems from a older free version.

Better : it will be Creative Commons.

It is released, as the engine for a number of games. But right now the FATE Core is being developed as a free-to-download streamlined version.

Because the core system is so simple (the rest of it is based on opposed skill checks with a dice pool that has a really strong bell curve), the game also doesn't provide much in the way of pre-made content.

That's exactly the sort of narrative-enhancing mechanics we're aiming for. We've had several homebrewed rules for things like that tacked onto D&D/Pathfinder over the years, but I'd rather play a system designed for that from the ground up.

It gives a set of guidelines for how to make your own content to customize your characters and setting within a loosely balanced system (loosely, because it's all narrative and that's explicitly the balance being sought).

Most of the games based on the system provide their own content, but also make it clear that the provided stuff is just a springboard.

Interesting.

The great example is the Dresden Files RPG: as a spellcaster in that system, you're given some example spells but expected to not only design your own...

you're expected to be making them up on the fly.

The system is flexible enough to have a lot of room to invent on the fly, and simple enough to make it possible mid-combat.

In fact, one of the basic options in combat is to try adding an aspect to someone or something: "Off Balance," "On Fire," "Lined Up The Shot," "Can't Hit A Clown."

Also worth noting: "conflict" can be physical, social, mental, or even others depending on the game and setting, and they all follow the same rules.

When you're "taken out" of a conflict, the person who took you out narrates your defeat. If you concede before that happens, you narrate your defeat.

One of the premades for DFRPG is about a bunch of teens in a haunted house, and being taken out mentally means you flee the house.

But to avoid being Taken Out, you can Concede from a conflict.

Right.

In this case, you get to decide what happens to your character (though it's still supposed to be somewhat bad).

So it requires a lot of agreeing? Or how do you decide that you've been "taken out"?

One moment.

But even if you're taken out, though, Death is something that happens only if it's been agreed upon.

So yes, a lot of agreeing.

But "Taken Out" is still decided by the rules, though.

Conflicts are ruled by "stress tracks" and "consequences."

I just figure, if people disagree about a defeat, something has to govern it.

It's got a strong mechanic.

example: A mime takes a swing at a clown.

The mime rolls his Fists skill vs the clown's Athletics. If the mime meets or beats the clown's roll, the punch connects.

Stress is determined by how much better than the clowns' defense the mime's offensive roll was. Let's say the mime rolled a total of 5 vs the clown's 3. That's 2 "shifts" difference, so the clown takes two "physical stress."

Stress isn't damage: it's one's ability to not be damaged. It 0s out at the end of each conflict, and has some amusing rules of its own I won't go into here.

Damage in FATE takes the form of "consequences." Let's say the clown's already been beat up a bit, and two stress will take him out because he's got so much physical stress already.

He can choose to take a "mild consequence." That's an aspect that will last until the end of the scene after he starts taking care of it, and taking this aspect lets him cancel out two stress on the attack he just took.

Intersting.

The clown chooses the aspect he gets, but it has to be something the group agrees is reasonable for the situation. This is rarely an issue.

So you reduce stress by taking consequences.

Right.

And by doing so, keep yourself from getting "taken out" too soon?

So our clown stays on his feet, but he'll have a Bruised Rib until the end of the scene after he gets it medical attention.

But you might be limbing for the rest of the fight?

Right. The mime is going to be gunning for that rib; as the person who caused it, he gets one free "invocation" on it, for a bonus or a reroll. Anyone else can also take advantage of it by spending game currency.

The clown's stress will drop to 0 at the end of the conflict, but people can tap him in the ribs until he loses that aspect.

So damage is always something you get to choose; it's just that sometimes the alternative is getting taken out.

Let's say the clown comes back with a haymaker and KO's the mime, taking him out; the mime's player may have used up all his consequences, but more likely he's going to feel the clown won't kill the mime, and doesn't want to get a lot of long-duration negative aspects if he can help it.

Now the clown gets to narrate the mime's defeat. Death may be on the table, but the group should have an agreement about that before they start to play.

(Frequently, it includes the GM having to say when death is likely at the start of a conflict, so the players know the stakes.)

The clown's player might drop the mime in the lion cage (for an exciting next encounter!) or just leave him on the side of the road when the circus moves on. If he tries to narrate the mime doing something out of character (like talking), the mime's player gets to adjust the scenario accordingly.

One thing FATE constantly emphasizes is that stuff has to be interesting. If it's not, skip it or change it.

Sounds pretty cool. I see how RP is in focus.

Death is often boring.

An example is a bottomless pit, Indiana-Jones style: if falling in the pit means you die, the GM is encouraged not to make it an option.

Yeah, nothing like being the hero of an adventure and then die because a bad climb check.

Instead give the pit a value of "barrier:2" so everyone has to roll Athletics to get across it, or they simply fail. Or have the failed check mean they're clinging to the edge of the other side.

Failure should generally be at least as cool as winning.

Oh, regardless of whether you're taken out or you concede, you get game currency (FATE points) for the number of consequences you picked up in that fight.

A common narrative conceit enforced by the game is that the more a hero gets beaten up on his way to confront the villain, the harder he kicks the villain's lights out.

@BESW Which can be used at a later point?

Fate points are a currency for narrative control.

Their most commonly use is to get a +2 to a roll, if there's an aspect in the scene (yours, your opponent's, the room's) that justifies it.

So the mime could've spent a Fate point on his punch to give his roll another +2, invoking the clown's aspect Two Big Left Feet to say the clown's off-balance and leans into the punch.

Hmm. I'm starting up a new game soon with my group. If FATE Core is released soon, I think I'll give it a try.

I'm about to start a DFRPG game.

Dresden Files right?

Aye.

FATE was actually designed for the RPG of the Dresden Files books, and it kinda shows.

It's settings-agnostic then? Fantasy, SciFi, Medieval, Modern, everything goes?

But it's great for anything that's driven by narrative.

Yeah. The system actually encourages the group to make the setting as part of character creation.

Games within the FATE system are really just tweaks and occasionally subsystems (like for magic).

Like, DFRPG wants you to make the city the game happens in, and give it aspects.

"Nobody's Safe After Dark" or "What the Elite Want, They Get."

Heck, you could even give the GAME aspects if you wanted to emphasize a certain kind of play.

How familiar with the DF novels or show do I need to be to enjoy thegame properly?

Not at all, really.

"What the Elite Want, They Get." would mean the Elite gets a +2 to certain actions by default?

I like the concept of a modern magic setting, and if it puts the cities in the spotlight, it's even cooler.

You'd still have to spend the Fate points.

Aspects aren't like, say, d20's situational modifiers.

They exist, but to be used mechanically there's usually Fate points passing hands.

However, it's not just for +2s.

There's also "Invoking for Effect," which is where you spend a Fate point and say "because of this aspect, it makes sense for this thing to happen."

Unless you are tagging, then it's free

As the GM, I either accept the Fate point and the thing happens, or I hand you a Fate point to "buy" it not happening.

@MaurycyZarzycki Yes, but I'm keeping it simple for now.

I think that the most important thing to understand FATE is to completely leave the mindset of dnd games

The GM gets to do the same; if you have a "Fiery Bad Temper" aspect, you can spend Fate to get bonuses in the appropriate places... but I can bribe you with Fate to make your temper complicate your life. If you have Fate points you can buy off the "compel," but you don't always want to: compelling your aspects is my primary way of feeding you more Fate points.

A good aspect for a character is one that he can use to his advantage, and that the GM can compel in interesting ways.

And as you said above, to realize that it's driven by the narrative, not by the rules. DnD is like "You can do one of 10 things, what do you do?". Fate is like "You can try to do anything you wish, what do you do?". Anyway sorry for interrupting.

No problem. That actually reminds me of FATE Core's Golden Rule: Decide what you’re trying to accomplish first, then consult the rules to help you do it.

Important: when a GM compels a PC's aspect, it doesn't take control away from the player.

Obviously it helps to know the rules so you know how to leverage aspects for your gain, but if you are a player under a GM the GM can help with that at first.

By accepting a Fate point on a compel, the player is agreeing to constrain their actions so that whatever they do a) complicates things, and b) does so with a particular aspect in mind.

A good GM will let a play fiddle with aspects for the first couple sessions.

And one of the most basic forms of character progression, that you can do at the end of any session, is re-writing one aspect on your sheet in a way that makes sense based on the session.

As you can see, the whole system is very setting-neutral. By changing what the skills and aspects are, you can change the setting.

And because you get to make up your own mechanics within some rough guidelines, there's a lot of room for levels of crunch --heck, one PC could have more crunch than another in the same game and they could still be balanced.

The one's just inventing subsystems to further define what the other is relying on the basic rules to cover.

And now, dinner.

I really love the sound of FATE and I can definitely see why people find it interesting. I'm curios if I can get my players into the mindset for it though. There's a few dice loving combatants in the group as well. I doubt they'll find it interesting every session.

We had an experimental house rule in our previous Pathfinder game, where each player gets a History token, and once per session can use that token to add something appropriate to the setting, whether personal or global.

We met an elven ghost in a dungeon somewhere, and I used my token to have my half-elf bard "suddenly remember" an ancient elven lullaby that his father taught him when he was a child, which made the ghost friendly.

Cool.

One use of skills in FATE is to "assess" or "declare." Assessing is trying to notice elements of the scene (with Perception, maybe).

But declarations are when you roll a check to say something about a scene.

For example, you could "suddenly notice" that the windows are open, if the state of the windows was up 'til then unstated.

Also very cool.

The difficulty to assess or declare something is largely based on how cool it is and whether it'll help everyone or just you.

(GM's call, ultimately.)

DFRPG suggests that the more boring and selfish a declaration is, the harder it is.

Now I officially can't wait for FATE Core to come out. :)

I'm right there with you.

That's pretty much how we play PF, only with a lot of mechanical baggage.

NEXT year, there's going to be a streamlined DFRPG released based on FATE Accelerated.

There's a standing "+1 for coolness factor for any roll" rule.

When I found FATE, I was like "THIS. This is what I've been trying to bend D&D into for nine years."

@BESW When I found Dresden I thought "THIS. Is so much text and I can't grasp it, st00p1d"

@MaurycyZarzycki Okay, yes. DFRPG in particular is a little suffocated in its own style.

But when in another system recommendation someone explained it in more depth I've read it again and was all "Goodness, it's so good I can't believe I've managed to enjoy RPGs and not know it"

I've found the handbook to be a little overflowing with fluff, which sometimes made it difficult to understand the underlying mechanics

Agreed.

I've got a few Qs on the site already and I haven't started running a game yet.

And Simon Gill has been very helpful, as has the FATE Core beta.

I know, because I'm translating it to Polish for my own use, only the mechanics, and I'm sometimes stripping up to 80% of the content

Wow.

But only sometimes, more often the ratio is more... rational

It does a good job of conveying the flavor though, so I can't fault it on that. Just wish sometimes they'd provide a little sidebar or something.

Yea

DF Accelerated will be cool, but.... next year.

So they've reached that milestone in Kickstarter?

Yes.

Neat

But isn't DF Accelerated going to be a compressed ruleset?

Yes, FATE Accelerated is a compressed form of FATE Core.

And FATE Core is streamlined compared to DFRPG.

But really, aside from example monsters and spells and so forth, DFRPG wouldn't suffer from a little bit of streamlining.

@BESW I am now, but you've handled the questions brilliantly :)

Do you know anything more than "Spring" for Fate Core?

Also, [blush].

@BESW I've had my shipping survey (as has everyone else) but no firm idea on when the pay-what-you-want download will be released.

I've been having trouble with the "click to respond" link. M'rr.

Bah.

The amount of money KS makes, you'd think they can feed the testing monkeys.

mmm. I copy-pasted into Safari and it's working.

Yeeeah, this is weird.

How so?

It's just redirecting me to either the Core kickstarter page or the kickstarter homepage.

And I can't find any other way to get to the survey, though one of the posts makes it sound like I should be able to.

Ahah.

I found... something...

Okay, got it. How odd.

sounds like you're having an interesting experience with the KS systems.

Yeah, I think it was a clash of script-blocking, browser, sign-in mechanics, and my sheer stubbornness.

(To be clear, my stubbornness was not an asset in this scenario.)

ah, one of those unhelpful combinations.

Mmm.

The only browser-based weirdness I've ever seen Safari be the solution to is the DDI Silverlight implementation.

ewww, Silverlight.

Eww

It seems to be the best choice for the builders. But still, yes. Ew.

(Not having to front-load the entire content of D&D 4e is a point in its favor.)

Why "eww" Silverlight?

For me, it's because the updates tend to break anything built with it.

It won't let me use older versions, and so I have to sit and twiddle my thumbs until Wizards updates the code on their end.

It was an attempted replacement for Flash in an era of mobile devices that refused to even try to render Flash. It was one of those unfortunate bets on the wrong side of history.

I don't see how that makes it eww though. :P

The ability to upload only what's needed as needed is nice.

Thankfully, they realised where things were going and started supporting HTML5+Javascript.

I'd still love an alternative.

If there's something to eww about, it's JavaScript.

Flash also gets an ewwwww from me - except for games and movies.

Agree

And I say it as a full-time flash developer

@MaurycyZarzycki Who are you agreeing with?

Luckily there are solutions like SharpKit and similar to help us avoid the JavaScript mess.

@SimonGill With your statement about flash

Netflix uses Silverlight as well.

I'd like to know, why clock synchronization is lost, if there is no transition. Could anyone tell me?

To get a bit more on topic. Anyone got some good suggestions on how to handle a group of 4 stable people and 2-3 unstable people?

@William'MindWorX'Mariager Yeah, transpiling is one solution. The important part is having a single domain model to deal with all the elements inside the browser window.

Proxying the characters to other players is fine, but I'd like alternatives.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager Which game?

@William'MindWorX'Mariager I have experience with that!

What system, and what are the difficulties you're encountering?

@William'MindWorX'Mariager I'd keep the stable players as main heroes with their own plots, and the unstable ones as recurring helping PCs

Let's say system-agnostic. Loosely based on Dungeons and Dragons 3.X and Draker och Demoner.

Okay, that makes things a little harder.

4e makes scaling encounters really easy.

But that might not be your problem.

Scaling isn't really an issue. The problem is mostly that the player miss important parts, have to spend time catching up, and their characters aren't properly used, which means they miss out on skill experience in this system.

Okay.

First, standardize experience gain. There's no other way that doesn't punish people for having a life.

If one person gets XP, everyone gets it.

Everyone levels together, whether they were at the table or not.

I've hade my first D&D DM-run with a player that serldom showed up. We decided to let him level up as much as the other players but it was a problem

It felt like he was never risking the life of his character and still getting something out of it

Wealth is also an issue; assign wealth gains equally as well. We'll address the immersion/simulation issues later, this is for the health of the group.

Maybe I was too focused on a "let's try to kill them" mood back in the days,,,

@Zachiel Possibly.

However, do this with the approval of everyone

Personal experience: if you want someone to come when they can, there's no better way to drive them off than to penalize them when they can't.

@BESW Haven't thought about that.

First of all I'd keep the NR (non recurring) characters the same level as the rest of the party. As I said before, I'd make the NRs not very important to the plot altogether, with no major subplots on their own (anything which takes more than one session to resolve is a no). I'd limit their role to the plot to the same of an NPC which from time to time joins with the party for help - he can do stuff when he's around, but the spotlight is never on him, because of his unreliability.

Normally, they miss out if they don't show up.

Of course. Everything I suggest needs to be put before the group and agreed upon.

in-game credibility of "pop-up" characters must be addressed next

How unstable is unstable? Do they show up every other session? After three sessions?

Now, in-game you want a) a method to explain their absence; b) a way to catch them up; and c) a way to keep them engaged in the plot.

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Sometimes stable 3-4 then gone 3-4. Very sporadic with one character.

for C) I suggest keeping an online summary of what happened

The other two are reallife stuff like kids and such.

If they're really unstable, consider having their character not be a part of the party, but still a part of the plot. Have them be a part of a parallel group of adventurers that often crosses paths with the party.

So usually one session.

b) is easy: regardless of who showed up, I always ask my players to summarize what happened last game before we start, just to make sure we're all on the same page. It gives me interesting insights into the player side of things, too.

(Not antagonists, though. That won't work well)

Now, for a) and c) I've experimented a lot. My most recent campaign has a reality-destroying plot, so the PCs no-clip out and then back in; they had no experience of time passing, so they get things explained to them in-game by the other characters because they know no more than their players.

But that's not something which can be done in most campaigns --alas, or I'd do it every time. It works great.

Instead, I've developed a standard gimmick that I use in many campaigns. It addresses my always-fluctuating attendance, and it also helps a few other issues like "you all meet in a bar."

I call it "You All Work For The Same Boss."

Which sends the players to the same areas for the same reason?

So if you run into someone in an ancient abandoned ruins, that's why he's there?

PCs in a campaign like this come from a stable of heroes: they might all be black ops for a government agency, or members of an adventuring club.

They team up for individual missions, and return to the 'stable' (barracks, club) at the end.

People coming and going during missions are recalled and sent out by the club or agency.

I like it. Could add some object that tell the players to return. So when they're missing a session, they're called home.

I often give them a magical com link that lets them talk to "base" and maybe serves as justification for teleporting in and out.

When they return, they've been sent back.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager That's the gist of what I was suggesting. In fact, we tried running an experimental game a while back that was built around the concept of a shadowy organization that sends out the characters to missions across time and space, so "injecting" a character mid-mission isn't unusual.

The nature of their "base" is up to you. Maybe they're mercenaries hired by a group of paladins who don't have enough actual paladins to cover all the evil-smiting.

I used the old Mission: Impossible TV show as my inspiration.

I like it.

Each week the same main cast was there, but sometimes they'd have a guest star and sometimes one or two of the main cast wasn't.

It depended on the nature of the mission and whose skills were needed.

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan Sounds like when Lead showed up on Sapphire and Steel.

Of course, making these changes means talking to your players (all of them) and accepting this sort of change to the campaign, since for people looking for a more realistic/simulationist game, it can be a real challenge to believability and suspension of disbelief.

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan This.

@BESW I'm not familiar with the show. So I'll take your word for it. :)

But in my experience, they're so happy to not have to pretend that somebody's there when they're obviously not, or other such mental gymnastics, that this is very welcome.

Speaking of suspension and believability. Picking up inspiration online can be very hard when you're not English speaking. There are so many awesome names for characters, locations, spells, abilities, etc. in English. But direct translation to Danish makes a lot of them sound kinda silly. :P

@William'MindWorX'Mariager Would you like my treatise on names, as well?

If I were to apply that to my old party, we'd have people disappearing just for a room or two...

Luckily, I believe in not having to be original. So if I use Sherwood for a forest, the players accept it, since I'm not a big writer.

@Zachiel It's been known to happen.

i:8167323 That's one of the reasons my current campaign is set in Biblical Israel. The names are familiar.:)

Of course, it's a bit of a problem since I tend to associate Hebrew names with the day-to-day, and English/European names with a more fantasy feel.

@BESW how did you solve that? "I got to pee" jokes apart

@Zachiel The more capricious and strict your "Base," the better.

If any attempts to question the actions or motives of the O2STK are met with stonewalling, the party quickly develops its own lore.

(Organization Too Secret Too Know.)

Kudos for the Middleman reference!

@AvnerShahar-Kashtan I frequently use my own language for names, but in unusual ways, or just ways common to naming conventions.

One moment, I'll upload a couple of my maps.

Map from a college campaign: docs.google.com/file/d/0BymQQv9ecodqYl9PYjQ2NVN4MDg/edit

Map from a more recent campaign: docs.google.com/file/d/0BymQQv9ecodqZ3Y3Z1NOdi1UX2c/edit

Neither of them use any words outside my native language, although the first one employs a simple trick to make it seem that way, and the second one uses obscure words.

(Okay, the first one uses a single made-up word cribbed from a science fiction setting I liked at the time.)

My players spent six months living in Ossifica, Devo, Tesella, Incep, and Bas, and were never able to figure out why those words seemed so familiar.

But my main point is in the other names: Slurpy Marshes, Eternal Mountains, Southern Wastes, Black River, Snake Bone Hills.

They're totally normal words, sometimes even a bit slangy, but so are a lot of names. Whitehall, Jamestown, Portland.

Look at how ordinary words are turned into names in your language--I'm sure they are.

And maybe do a little digging for obscure words; "Otiose Bog" is just archaic English for "useless swamp."

@BESW Fantastic place for Robin Hood to hide out too.

Think about who named the place and why. We name things after heroes, sponsors and loved ones. We name them for great events, or great hopes.

We name them because of how they look or how we wish they'd look --there are a TON of twin-peaked mountains with names that are just variations on "Those look like boobs."

@BESW What mapping software do you use? Photoshop?

For another wishful thinking name, see: Greenland.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager The older map was made using Caesar III's mapping utility, with a lot of photoshop to mesh snapshots of the same place in different climates.

The newer, cleaner map started out as a scan from the Dictionary of Imaginary Places, and then got Photoshopped.

Both of them, you'll see, got the exact same "rough edged paper" treatment.

@BESW I knew I had seen it somewhere. I just recently got Caesar III from GOG.com. :P

I've tested out Fractal Mapper. Seems to produce some very nice results.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager It served me well as a map tool for a couple years.

These days I'm doing more like the second map, or something similar in pencil.

Used a lot of pencil. Has a nice feel to it as well.

My current campaign is taking place on a map that started out as Dinotopia, before I stretched it out into a continent.

Got a wax thing combat grid too where I can use whiteboard markers on.

(Don't have a digital copy of that at hand.)

Random thought, do you map out all villages/hamlets, or can players easily run into unmapped ones?

Ah, I use the combat grid out of the DMG 3.5, which I had laminated. Crayola window markers come in lots of good colors, and wipe off with water better than actual wet-erase markers.

I sometimes feel like they need to run into a plot-twist-town I haven't mapped yet.

@William'MindWorX'Mariager I have a small stock of maps I reuse as necessary, but often I'll just make it up as I go.

Though for a couple years every campaign I ever ran had the town of Stone's Throw in there somewhere.

@BESW I'm thinking on the general/overland map. Like your scalemap doesn't show any towns or villages.

Oh, no. That'd be way too much.