@BESW As if they need it :( Also there was an AvP comic about a guy who ate a predator's heart as a kid and gained long life, and still does it every several decades when a new predator will land
So maybe a vampire who drinks a predator's blood will TURN ALIVE. (or just die)
@BESW I want to but I'm still not sure what terms to ask it in to not have it become a duplicate of that other question.
I want a weather generation system for 4e that has some mechanical impact. The other one wants weather generation for D&D in general terms, with no specified mechanical impact.
I somehow doubt it's kosher to ask a question you know your friend is going to answer.
But even if I answer, if you don't accept any answer for--maybe a week? We might get alternate solutions and rebuttals. That would be cool.
(I keep thinking about SuperPac collusion.)
@C.Ross Player confession: I'm the guy who strikes up a chat with the villain and helps talk him through his problems, defusing the situation and maybe concluding the encounter with some tea and scones.
@BESW It is entirely kosher. The site exists as a repository of knowledge for the 'net. It's Wikipedia in Q&A form. You can answer your own question, you can create a question just to answer it, and you can create bounties just because you want to award more rep to a particular already-existing answer because an upvote isn't good enough.
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If I were asking it just so I could +1 you and you could +1 me, or something, that would be rotten, but that wouldn't be why I'd ask it.
Yeah, it would require customisation because of how differently combat and other systems work in 4e. There's new stuff weather could do, and old stuff it probably shouldn't.
"Temperate rain forests? Never heard of 'em. What? You say there's one in our state?"
@JonathanHobbs Sure, it just requires hand-building more tables.
The basic weather types should be pretty easy to translate into 4e, and the more complex weather like storms is just combining the basic types, and then you make a d% table for the climates you're interested.
You have to decide how granular to make your weather and your table, though.
The DMG has three or four different kind of wet storms, but only one sandstorm.
Lawful good characters follow the law where it benefits the people, and will oppose laws that do not help the people. If they are wronged, they would like vengeance just as much as anyone else, but they'll try to find their solution within the system (e.g. through the justice system) rather than subverting it (e.g. going to the person's house and killing them, or hiring an assassin).
A Lawful Good character could easily turn chaotic if, after years of trying to work within the system and use the law to benefit poeple, he realises that the system simply does not work. The establishments are corrupt, the founding principles were bad, the lawmakers do not work for the betterment of the people and the laws are abusable by evil.
Such a character would, naturally, oppose every law and find no comfort in working within the system, because the laws and system would be against himself and the common man.
Such a character would either turn chaotic good, or just be a lawful character not following the land's laws, but instead following his own principles. That may still be chaotic, I'm not sure.
I'm working on the assumption that D&D alignment is an objective mechanic: in a world where alignments can grant magical power and create planes of existence, and a spell can tell the difference between a man who saves babies for Pelor and a man who eats babies for Pelor, alignment must be ob...
I agree with that maxim to a certain extent. Not that I'm anti-fun, but if the AL cards get thrown out the window then things like Hierophants, Detect, Forbiddance... All of those mean nothing
@LitheOhm I spent years trying to rip the alignment axis out of D&D 3.5 and failing to detach it without getting half the system along with it, so I learned to deal with it constructively.
@LitheOhm I firmly believe the point of a game is to have fun. The rules should enable that, and when they're actively obstructing fun I have to look at them long and hard.
@LitheOhm I am with you there; it can be quite bad for play. The fun factor is self-balancing. It's not fun to just begin ignoring the rules whenever you feel like it - they do need to be followed so people get what they came for and know what's going on.
it's a top priority, but it's not so much that it is capable of sacrificing all the other mechanics
@BESW only half-noted that. I have a friend who writes up a code that is three or more pages of "I can do what I please when it pleases me." Rules-lawyers ruin the fun for me, but that's personal
I do think the RAW AL needs some work. It's definitely a game-by-game basis where I've run across. Some games, AL has about as much effect as dwarves in medium armor. Other games it's integral
@LitheOhm Very much so. I've actually got a lot of training and experience in collaborative techniques for teaching, working with kids, and facilitating social development training programs.
@LitheOhm It should be. It is the best approach for social problem solving. Either you, as a DM, just give up and let it sit there and annoy you, you override your player and make them unhappy, or you collaborate and create a win-win.
Most problems between players should be solved collaboratively!
If a DM is just trying to completely overrule his player, or vice-versa, they are doing something horribly wrong
collaboration requires learning and growth, both sides furthered. Compromise means between the two making the equal solution
@JonathanHobbs to a point. If I am a manager and one of my subordinates picks a fight with me but is due to be fired by one of my bosses, avoidance might be fair for me
basically, when exercising effort to handle the problem is barely considered an even-pay-out. It's definitely not for everything either, and does breed problems like you mention
@JonathanHobbs yep. Lack of your growth and a lack of theirs. Acknowledging a problem is half the battle, nothing in there about the 'success' of noticing a problem lol
@JonathanHobbs and the more avoidance is exercised, the further the persona goes from the psyche and the more can slip out. While I smile, my eye twitches irritatedly lol
@JonathanHobbs Jung psychology, we are all broken up into part-selves. I'm a student, a boyfriend, a son, a brother... Much of these personalities are mutually inclusive but some are not. Nice guy persona (there is no fight, avoidance) goes far from the psyche (all my experience tells me there's a fight, can't lie to myself) and so there's a split where the persona/ego disagrees with the psyche/shadow.
@BESW yes. And by poorly I add in, also, "not under our control."
repressing anger doesn't quell it, just means when it vents it's even less under your control
that's why after months of conflict and playing Nice DM, problem players get criticized for even small things
@JonathanHobbs nice :) I'm a hardcore Jung psychology lover - working on three books right now. IMO it should be standard reading in school lol. Useful stuff
and I apologize for having my big rant over this, I got well off topic lol
@LitheOhm Yes, a lot of stuff like that should definitely be standard knowledge. Fuck, there is just so much people could do if they understood a bit of this, like being able to recognise when they were stopping themselves short of obtaining success just because they were afraid of failure. :(
@JonathanHobbs I don't put much stock in any particular psychological construct, but I have learned the hard way that if I don't vent in small bursts I explode every six months or so.
a curse because we resist ourselves a lot (like Plato's chariot) but also a blessing because the further we go from our real, true selves - the harder our unconscious will push to bring us back
@BESW yep :)
I'm actually trying to throw in a lot of Jungian architecture (metaphysical) into my current campaign project. I really, really like it.. Like words cannot express lol
have always been interested in behavior (we're such interesting creatures, humans) and how/what people think, as well as what motivators exist within each. Jung shed a lot of light in the field
Teleport is already very powerful: it doesn't provoke opportunity attacks, it ignores line of effect, it can provide the effect of movement that would normally require skill checks.
@JonathanHobbs My response was "Do it that way if it's what's needed, but engage in these specific social events first to determine if and why you should do it, and then use this strategy to do it."
me too :P as was shown a few minutes ago, I suppose
@BESW sometimes more than is needed though. But here again, matter of preference. I've nothing against that user, we just seem to have different play styles
While on this note, I'm quite glad they are active on the site - I've even complimented them on their encyclopedic knowledge
not as powerful as magic recharge, but definitely a problem when mystic theurges (or anything else capitalizing on two pools of spell points) come into play
@BESW I found that when trying to design a homebrew system. Spell damage tends to cap out at so much higher than fighting damage
ultimately - spellcasters kick ass. It's everything the designers wish they could do (which tends to be a lot), and without many real precedents it doesn't have many constraints. Whereas with weapon masters at least we have a standard to compare it to, magic makes mortals godlike
best balance I can see is that low level mages tend to suck when compared to their fighting counterparts, and the tables turn at some point (depending on the system)
all that is barred in dead/antimagic, but those are usually the exception rather than the rule
Might want to read up on the discussion we had last night; I'm in no position to recap it now unfortunately, but it hits on a lot of what you're talking about now.
Correct me if I'm wrong but it seems like it's like this: 3.5e: Define everything strictly in the rules. Because you can't really do that without ending up with a mess, reduce everything to very few things where possible. 4e: Define all the important and basic bits in the rules. Leave everything else up to the players to house rule how they like.
Munchkin is a card game that mercilessly mocks the ruthless RAW min/maxing and player rivalries that often defined old-school D&D games, and simultaneously revels in it.
...and is really really funny while doing it.
Our new PC is a wizard who uses an unstrung shortbow as his implement.
@BrianBallsun-Stanton It's the only way to get Magic Missile to qualify as a valid RBA for Rapid Shot.
(Rapid Shot requires "a ranged basic attack with a weapon" rather than a ranged basic attack with the weapon keyword. It's a nitpick, but one I'm more than pleased to exploit for a really underpowered build that makes a player really happy.)
@BrianBallsun-Stanton Because the goal and motive purpose of this build is to create a PC that never rolls attacks.
Wizard/ranger hybrid with Archery Mastery and Reaper's Touch... between wizard and ranger every power slot can be filled with RBAs, MBAs, or non-attack powers.
The 'problem' is that Magic Missile neither hits nor rolls damage and thus nearly every feat to enhance attacks and damage or apply riders is useless to him.
The only way to get MM to roll damage I could find was against insubstantial creatures.
But otherwise, he's doing minion damage. Reliably, and often multiple times per turn, but... minion damage.
I can take a stab at it (while I wait for people to turn up to take some of my stuff away. Seriously, how hard is it to give stuff away???"). DOn't have any E6 experience though - and it really doesn't sound like my type of game.
I was reading an essay that suggested that solo/elite/standard/minion are the real power tiers used to gauge NPC power vs PC power, and that level is more of a conceit to separate different kinds of play.
Which makes a certain amount of sense: aside from adding level-based modifiers, the only real difference between NPCs of different level tiers is the kind of debuffs they wield.
This led me to speculating (as I often do, but with more focus this time) about removing the level-based modifiers in 4e PCs and NPCs.
I would also find some level where HP and damage are balanced fairly well and leave it there. Feat and power progression would continue, so a 'level 10' PC would have less power than a 'level 20' PC but it would be about ability and choice rather than numbers.
So more powerful NPCs would be solos, and more 'advanced' NPCs would be distinguished by their debuffs (and ability to handle new kinds of debuffs from the players) rather than their numbers.
@SimonGill Tragic. I would've come!
Just Friday I got Call of Cthulhu 6e because my friend was leaving island and he couldn't get rid of it.
@BESW You could have something like combat advantage too. Weakness or Strength would be rated from -3 to +3 and give bonuses or penalties to every number/roll. Applied to the players rolls of course.
I was thinking of inventing at least one more NPC type after solo: Boss. It'd be kind of like the homebrew (boss) subtype or the worldbreaker powers combined.
@BESW Heh, yeah, that is a weirdness of the wide power curve. 3.5E did work on that by encouraging the use of PC levels for monster races... but then that caused all kinds of extra work!
4e did a little better with the damage curve and such, but by making hit and defense level-based it destroyed any chance that a hundred level 5 goblins could give a level 15 fighter a bloody nose.
@BESW But that's accurate for the genre conventions. Would you have expected Leonidas to fall to a small unit of hunchbacks with sharp sticks? Even if they did know some kung fu.
If D&D adventurers are supposed to be heroes, it feels wrong to give them a horde of goblins to defend a village from and make it just feel like a tall guy putting his hand on a short kid's forehead.
A number-independent variant would make the goblins less of a threat because the PCs had more options rather than that they were nigh-invulnerable.
I think it would ultimately make the players feel more awesome because it was their actions rather than their passive buffs that defeated the foe.
Of course - you don't have to stick to a D&D clone. There may be other fantasy RPGs that give you everything you want, including that narrower power curve.
@SimonGill Sure. I'm just speculating on how easy it might be to adjust a system my group already likes and knows.
It would have been harder in 3.5 because, for example, attack bonuses not only scaled with level; they were a defining part of each class and removing that would've changed balance (such as it is in 3.5) in ways I'm not going to pretend I understand.
I suspect DFRPG is closer to what I'm interested in.
@BESW At least for a fighter, that should be easy: No attack bonus at all, but at levels 6, 11 and 16 you gain an additional attack in that round, at -5, -10 and -15 respectively. Clerics table goes: Levels 1-4: -1, levels 5-8: -2, levels 9-12: -3, levels 13-16: -4, levels 17-20: -5; bonus attacks (at additional -5 and -10) at levels 8 and 15.
The more interesting problem is: How do I explain to my players that their character has a harder time to hit stuff as he levels up? :D
But being able to hit more accurately is important to a fighter too; it's one of the only things he gets, after all.
And I never really liked the penalty to multiple attacks, so as a personal preference if I'm making this variant I'm disinclined to include it. [so there]