🐉

@doppelgreener updating our final verdict before the vote is over seems inappropriate, even when it is highly likely that we will end there.

@Akixkisu who said anything about final verdict

the discussion list is just reflecting where the votes are presently at, and i expect it to be updated again whenever things change

@V2Blast "We would appreciate it if you add the outcome of the discussion to the accepted answer in this question. This will allow all of us to see the full picture."

"Outcome" seems unambigious.

@Akixkisu Did you mean to ping doppel in this message?

@V2Blast Yes, mybad.

@doppelgreener ^

my friend, i see a table that was created by a user to track where discussions are presently at

that thing was being updated with 50/50's and "keep pin" and "unpin" within a couple of days of coming out, when the verdict was undoubtedly not yet final

the post is not locked

it can still be edited

it should be edited if things change

i felt it valuable to put on the record that another community was presently 50/50, i have not locked us in to anything or concluded the discussion in any meaningful way

while we have a present outcome and a present verdict, it can change, and it is not final, and nobody there is using the word "final" to describe the post i updated

@doppelgreener Perhaps my feelings of what those things represent are different from yours, as you say - outcomes can still change, and my use of "final" is incorrect in that regard. I see communities signalling what they understand to be a discussion they concluded, for now - one they can resume later but have a good enough understanding to signal something representative.

i'm sure some communities have effectively concluded their discussions, but i didn't see any reference to that post indicating that once i put something there it couldn't change.

a user started that table to record the discussions.

staff are asking us to record our outcomes there, but that doesn't mean we can't record things there before we have a definite outcome either. it was, again, a table created for users by users

@doppelgreener I am pleased to see your latest coda to your answer, and I am glad that we got a lot of different answers from various users

we have a present clear situation to report and i feel like it's valuable to report it to help people piece together a picture of where this is at across the network

i expect in a few days we're likely to update it to say "keep pin"

I do think it's best to avoid listing an "outcome" in the table for discussions that are still open/ongoing, but I think several others had already done that for other sites with ongoing discussions that are listed in that table. I don't think there's a need to rush to a "final" decision in any case.

Going forward, I don't think we (the CMs) are making changes for sites based purely on what's listed in the table - I think that the plan is for mods to approach the CMs to make that change (if needed) following such a discussion on the site's meta.

So I don't think there's too much need to worry about what's listed in the table at any given moment.

@doppelgreener As someone who could have easily updated that post a few weeks ago, when the votes supported in favour of unpinning but decided to refrain from updating it - due to the ongoing vote, I feel in particular unhappy about you changing it now.

As you noted it then, and seem to agree due to your view that we might change it to keep pinned soon, the vote isn't settled.

@Akixkisu i mean, any/all of us could've updated it

i also could've updated it then, and decided not to, and decided to now

@Akixkisu i agree. let's see! nothing i've done implies the vote is settled or attempts to convey a full final community deicsion—i am literally recording where the votes are at, nothing more or less

@doppelgreener I think you are sending a clear signal along with it that implies more confidence than I think we should have (had then and now). I believe that is all that I wanted to express.

i'm recording actual fact, which requires no implications whatsoever

votes are 50/50, i wrote 50/50

ok, that's fine. i'm going to head to bed and would rather leave this be also.

make sure you include V2's messages on the topic also!

← 8 messages moved from TRPG General Chat

I think we both said what we wanted, as always if you rather want it opt-in just move it there :)

← 5 messages moved from TRPG General Chat

← 26 messages moved from TRPG General Chat

→ 2 messages moved to TRPG General Chat