TRPG General Chat

GcL

00:05

When working with a client devolves to whatever the contract stated, that's the last time I work with that client.

Sorry you're dealing with that. It is no fun.

Ben

Yeah. I'm happy with how it is at the moment though. It means I can not worry about it until next week, and I can just relax this weekend (for the first time in a while)

How goes everyone else?

bobble

already getting antsy for university to start

Ben

My boys are like that with school haha

They're 7 and 9 though, so it'd likely be a bit different :P

bobble

The longest I've lived away from my parents was 3 weeks (incidentally, same university)

Granted, the current plan is to have me commute back on weekends when possible, so it's not like I'm flying across the country forever

Ben

New(ish) adventures!

V2Blast

00:19

@Slate Haha, my plan worked! Welcome back! :)

@Slate Nice. I've been wanting to try out City of Mist...

@Ben Happy Ben is best Ben <3

2

Ben

[Happy Ben noises]

V2Blast

@Ben Also new adventures for me. Moving into a new place with my SO in 2 weeks, and starting a new job a few days after that! Exciting stuff.

Ben

Ohh very nice :D

V2Blast

Indeed :)

BESW

Feature request: AI that can recognize chatty non-helpful comments and not notify me about them.

Ben

00:29

@BESW on Q's and A's, or in chat?

AncientSwordRage

@Ben I'm guessing on questions

BESW

00:45

Mainsite, yeah.

I'm especially "fond" of "I thought of a funny thing to say on this five-year-old answer, I'm sure the exact same joke hasn't been deleted a half-dozen times already."

V2Blast

Yeah...

BESW

At least JKR's self-owns seem to have reduced the number of people who want to fight me about Dumbledore.

Hot RPG Questions

00:59

6

Q: Is there any way to become a swarm of bats as a PC?

Is there any way to transform a PC into a swarm of bats without breaking any of the official rules?

BESW

@HotRPGQuestions 4e vampire, your time has come!

trogdor

01:27

lol

no please, it's not worth it

don't throw your life away like that XD

Ben

@HotRPGQuestions [wooden clunking sounds grow louder to reveal an assortment of sentient baseball and cricket bats] WRONG BATS

bobble

01:54

Some people here might appreciate this:

What do we want? "TIME TRAVEL!" When do we want it? "DOESN'T MATTER!" — Criggie yesterday

Hot RPG Questions

02:15

4

Q: Do creatures that fall from the removal of a stone bridge created by a wall of stone spell get a save?

Wall of stone Says: The wall can have any shape you desire, though it can't occupy the same space as a creature or object. The wall doesn't need to be vertical or rest on any firm foundation. It must, however, merge with and be solidly supported by existing stone. Thus, you can use this spell to...

dnd-5e spells saving-throw

trogdor

@bobble lol

Ben

@bobble true

BESW

02:57

@bobble Zombie rallies: What do we want? BRAINS! When do we want them? BRAINS!

Or, if you prefer, this eye-searing image which says

> Ain't no party
like a Time Lord party
because a Time Lord party is
not bound by typical temporal parameters
and thus
DON'T STOP

Hot RPG Questions

03:31

2

Q: Is it an action to voluntarily end a grapple?

If a monster, such as a Chuul, has grappled a character can they end the grapple for free? EG a Chuul attacks a halfling with a pincer attack and hits, the halfling is now considered grappled, trapped in its pincers. The Chuul then grappled another character with its other pincer and finally para...

dnd-5e actions grapple

BESW

03:56

@Slate [wave] Weird seeing you in this interface again, but always nice to see you!

The Oracle

04:52

0

Q: Why are non duplicates being closed as duplicates?

Superior Technique and Martial Adept are different rules. They are written differently and they are in different books and they cover different concepts, one being a fighting style, the other being a feat. And yet questions regarding these two completely different rules are being closed as duplic...

discussion closed-questions

BESW

Got another answer to my question. This one makes "reasoned guesses" about information which is available in the comments under the question.

(Assumption A: that an Australian zine-maker would use American paper standards.)

Bardic Wizard

@BESW Question about that question: I saw the cover art on the Twitter thread someone linked under your question, but it led me to a question I think might need to be answered first. Namely, what counts as covered? Just the center of the sun? The center and the rays? The whole ovoid surrounding the sun? And which bound are we assuming, lower bound or upper bound or average?

Also, I couldn’t afford the zine (this is not surprising), but I saw the question and thought it sounds like a cool game!

BESW

@BardicWizard These are excellent questions which I would like to know if people have well-reasoned answers for!

Honestly I suspect there isn't a definitive answer (a big part of Pidj's game design here seems to be giving players space to make important decisions like that), but there can easily be well-reasoned ones.

Bardic Wizard

05:08

I think I can reason out the last one I asked, at least. I would assume that you would use the upper bound for number of dice, since the passage cited says the sun should be completely covered. If you use the lower bound it won’t completely cover the sun, by definition

BESW

I think that makes a lot of sense, given the narrative of the mechanic.

It's a game about the sun being obscured, and over time you remove dice from the pool and that literally uncovers the sun.

It's quite elegant, really.

When my zine arrives I'm super tempted to just post an answer that's a photo of the cover with dice on it. I won't, but I'm very very tempted.

Bardic Wizard

05:30

@BESW do it!

BESW

@BardicWizard I'm more likely to do an extensive write-up demonstrating how an understanding of the game's narrative and its context adds depth to the choice.

Somebody could easily beat me to it if they bought the PDF and printed it out.

Adeptus

06:48

trogdor

lol

that's honestly my favorite section of the whole movie

AncientSwordRage

07:27

@BESW shhhh that's my idea

BESW

07:47

I can print, in theory, but in practice it's a tedious and annoying process and I'd rather show off the beautiful risograph zine.

AncientSwordRage

10:12

@BESW I looked up if there was some where I could get it printed, but the only place I can find does it in bulk (obviously), but now I know where to go if I ever want to print a 'zine (:

BESW

Riso? Yeah, it's very much a small-to-middle-size run technology. Too few prints and the cost of prep is atrocious and too many prints and you have to make new "plates" partway through or the quality goes sour.

AncientSwordRage

Yeah in Riso

Medix2

12:16

@ThomasMarkov Do you agree with the dupes I linked to in comments under this answer?

AncientSwordRage

This is fascinating to me

One Western TTRPG Dominates in Japan, and it isn't Dungeons & Dragons…

►

Thomas Markov

@Medix2 The one closed as a dupe of insect plague was wrong, but I added a proper dupe target to it.

The scorching ray one is definitely a dupe

The shield of faith one is probably okay to reopen, its the same answer as spirit guardians for the same reason, but its a self spell, rather than an AoE

@Medix2 Let me know what you think

NVM about insect plague, it was fine as it was.

I fixed it

AncientSwordRage

12:39

@AncientSwordRage the answer is that Call of Cthulhu the number one RPG in Japan for a variety of reasons

NautArch

@BESW Flagged as VLQ. It has upvotes /facepalm.

Thomas Markov

The one KRyan reopened looks fine to be open.

NautArch

yep

NautArch

14:16

@Medix2 Out of curiosity, why did you reopen the superiority die question?

I'm planning on closing it again, but wanted to ask before doing so.

Thomas Markov

@NautArch Its not a dupe anymore.

wait...

Yeah, its not a dupe anymore.

Its not a great question, but its not a dupe anymore, I dont think.

NautArch

What significantly changed? I'm trying to figure it out.

Thomas Markov

Its asking if you get the feat first, if you can use the one from the feat on the new maneuvers you get when you select battle master.

Someone_Evil

It's get the fighting style (Tasha's) first technically, isn't it?

Thomas Markov

@Someone_Evil yeah

NautArch

14:21

ah

I didn't parse that

Thomas Markov

(from taking the feat)

NautArch

Then I shall not re-dupe!

Thomas Markov

I guess as a variant human?

NautArch

But yeah, not a great question.

Thomas Markov

Oh, I guess from being a fighter derp

Slate

14:26

@BESW Hullo, it sure has been a while, yes :)

KorvinStarmast

15:00

@NautArch RL stinks. Had a chance to join a game and make a Watcher's Paladin, and then RL schedule made it not possible. sad face That's a Tasha's sub class I have wanted to try for a while now. (We have a Glory Oath paladin in a game currently, seems to be an OK flavor of that class)

AncientSwordRage

@KorvinStarmast I like that subclass too

if you ever get to play it, let me know how it goes

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast That it does. My icewind game is on hold until 9/10.

My real life game is also in a holding pattern.

Just my dungeon crawl is consistent...mostly.

The Oracle

16:17

-1

Q: Minimum Edit Changes

I want to edit this answer. It contains links to d20pfsrd.com. Since the last edit, this site has switched to https only. Which is fine. So I try to edit it to add that "s", only to get told I need to change at least 6 characters. This is a horrible requirement, which actively encourages users to...

bug

bobble

325

Q: How to overcome "Edits must be at least 6 characters"

On Stack Overflow, there was a question with an incorrectly formatted list, which lacked a newline before it and thus came out like this: 1. Hello 2. Something else 3. Goodbye I changed it to the right formatting by inserting a newline: Hello Something else Goodbye And I got the "Edits must ...

or Are we discouraged from fixing typos and misspellings on Stack Exchange sites? or Remove trivial edit restriction or really any of these

Thomas Markov

16:52

@Someone_Evil @linksassin @V2Blast got some comment flags up.

NautArch

17:59

Anyone have recommendations for a PG/PG-13 creature feature?

So far, I've thought of Jaws, Tremors, Anaconda, and stretching with The Abyss.

Thomas Markov

@NautArch so far everything im thinking of is rated R

NautArch

@ThomasMarkov That's mostly what I've discovered as well.

We did The Meg last night, and that's surprisingly reasonable.

Thomas Markov

I was gonna recommend the 1982 The Thing, but its R, and I dont remeber if its a bad R or a softer R.

NautArch

@ThomasMarkov oh sweet jesus, no.

Imma hold off on John Carpenter for a bit longer :P

But then we shall start his filmography.

I'm also very bummed no gameday tonight.

Thomas Markov

My recommendations were The Thing, The Descent, and Jeepers Creepers, but those are all R, for good reason.

Medix2

18:08

@ThomasMarkov I don't think the Battle Master question is a Dipe. Quick Toss is rather unique

Thomas Markov

@Medix2 It's still a maneuver though right?

And there's a universal prohibition on using two maneuvers, right?

NautArch

There's a lot of solid creature features that are R. My son really wants to do megashark vs giant octopus.

Medix2

Except that one answer says an exception

NautArch

@Medix2 I think that was my hammer. But it's two maneuvers.

Medix2

As is Feinting, which... I'm not even sure that can be used with another one

NautArch

18:10

@Medix2 yeah, not sure I agree with that one.

But it's still a dupe question. Could use a bounty? I dunno.

Medix2

Which is why I could see this being it's own question

NautArch

Nah, I think it's a bounty if something is new.

That Q&A should be updated if something new is here.

Medix2

Like, the specific cases of Quick Toss and Feinting are weirdly worded enough (they have nuance) that I could see a new question being made

NautArch

And that example is two separate attacks.

A bonus action attack for feint, and a regular attack for another maneuver.

So it's not two maneuvers at the same time.

Medix2

Feint isn't an attack though

And it does benefit your next attack

For me, it is unclear how either of those interact with the Maneuver use restriction, and thus, they could be their own questions

SmokeDetector

18:13

[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Link at beginning of answer (34): Playing a Half-dragon by user72379 on rpg.SE (@Rubiksmoose @ThomasMarkov)

NautArch

I on't think the feint is well supported and the general answer is still all set.

Thomas Markov

That feint one isnt actually an exception...

NautArch

yeah, it's not.

Thomas Markov

Its just using two different maneuvers at different times...

Medix2

Eh, we can leave it closed

Thomas Markov

18:16

In fact, I think the Feint one is just wrong

NautArch

I downvoted

Thomas Markov

Same

The bonus action requirement is a red herring, I think its still using two maneuvers on one attack.

NautArch

bingo

Medix2

Agreed

Thomas Markov

How many years of duplicate closures do we have to reverse if these superiority die questions arent dupes?

NautArch

18:28

ohmy

That may be a can we do not want to open.

Thomas Markov

@NautArch Yeah, gonna see if SEDE can help me get some numbers.

NautArch

It would also mean quite a sea change of difference in the way we approach dupes.

Thomas Markov

@rene Paging rene!

Medix2

What's the criteria?

Questions that ask about different features that are basically identical except in name or other insignificant things?

Oh I see, there are a lot more comments for me to read now XS

NautArch

What do y'all think of the minor illusion/darkness question?

Thomas Markov

18:38

Found the query I needed.

Medix2

I'm okay leaving it open if not just because 5e's rules on light and darkness and illusions are... blegh

But I don't think it shows significant research effort

NautArch

@Medix2 I don't understand how "can minor illusion turn off the lights" is different from "can minor illusion make darkness"

Turned off lights = darkness.

Unless you've got a different definition?

Medix2

If we do allow near-identical questions that aren't dupe closed, I could certainly prove a point by asking how X feature interacts with 500 different specific spells...

Thomas Markov

Im using this query

I see you're here, @rene, I have no idea what Im doing, but I can see that the results table doesnt have any results with 1 child, which is unexpected.

V2Blast

That said, I'm not saying these definitely shouldn't be closed as duplicates of one another... But some editing may be appropriate to make sure both cases are obviously covered by the question at the dupe target. — V2Blast ♦ 9 mins ago

Medix2

18:43

@NautArch Yeah they do seem the same. Though I suppose one asks about disadvantage on attacks but ehhhhh

Thomas Markov

hehe thanks for the idea @V2Blast

We can just edit the original target to mention both features, since they have the same wording.

V2Blast

@ThomasMarkov The issue is basically that it should be obvious to any reader (including new users) why they're being sent to a question about Y when they asked about X (especially since (I believe) logged-out users don't even see the question-closed-as-a-duplicate - they're just automatically redirected to the dupe target).

Yeah, that seems like a logical solution here

NautArch

@Medix2 That would be a different question needing to be asked. But one that's been asked.

rene

@ThomasMarkov HAVING COUNT(pd.Id) > 1) prevents that

NautArch

Of course an unseen target has disadvantage on being attacked.

Thomas Markov

18:46

@rene goodness, I should have at least been able to figure that out. Thanks!

NautArch

@Someone_Evil NOt sure why Sam is looking for darkness as the solution, other than there is already a question about creating cover?

Someone_Evil

@NautArch I wasn't sure either. That's why I asked

Thomas Markov

can you even create darkness?

doesnt it have to be an object?

Someone_Evil

"a sound or an image of an object"

Thomas Markov

I guess a plain box painted black is an object.

Someone_Evil

18:53

The limits on "image of an object" is gonna vary with DM/table

Just a blob of darkness (or actual function darkness) should be out, but I don't think that's an actual solution to them

NautArch

@Someone_Evil it's a dupe either way, tho.

Then we should close for clarification?

Someone_Evil

@ThomasMarkov Common trick within Waterdhavian theatre presumably

Thomas Markov

@Someone_Evil Im disappointed they didnt go with Waterdeepish.

NautArch

@Someone_Evil okay if I add the darkness q&a to that?

Someone_Evil

I'm not sure that would be useful, partly as major image actually has different limitations, but I wouldn't undo it if you did

@ThomasMarkov It's not Waterdeep, just Waterdeep-ish

NautArch

19:04

@Someone_Evil My dupe target was the minor illusion creating darkness - not the major illusion Q&A.

Added it, let me know if you think i'm off-base.

Someone_Evil

Oh that Q, sure, that's probably fine

I was under the illusion I know which question you were referring to

(sorry, couldn't help myself)

NautArch

Hey-o!

Thomas Markov

So what's the play here? I've got 1275 dupe targets to review for "similar wording closures". Once I have a list, do I ask about all of them as individual questions or as one question?

Someone_Evil

I'd start by sanity checking your data set (if you haven't already) with some random samples, then a single meta would probably be the best start

My gut here is that most of these probably deserve no action, but then I also think similar/same wording does mean dupe in most cases (ie. if there's no reason for them not to be the same, which does happen)

Thomas Markov

19:20

@Someone_Evil Im gonna pick through the 1275 dupe targets over the next several days first.

@Someone_Evil Right, but the way the recent meta is going has me questioning this.

Meta voting appears to be at odds with site practice, which is strange.

V2Blast

@Someone_Evil I also suspect most of them will not warrant any action (or at most, the target may warrant being edited to more explicitly cover the other thing with the same wording).

Thomas Markov

@V2Blast My recollection is that for many of these, it wouldnt make sense to edit the target to mention the features in its dupe children.

Where its stuff like "how does rule X work with spell Y", do we just add spells Y_1 through Y_n as a list at the bottom?

@Someone_Evil What time are you opening the DGtS post?

Someone_Evil

@ThomasMarkov I was planning to be (kinda) exact, and set the event to around that hour (unless I got messed up by timezones somehow)

Thomas Markov

@Someone_Evil You mean around the time the event ends?

Which is 18:00 tomorrow by the stack clock

and 14:00 eastern US time

Someone_Evil

Technically, I changed it so the event is only for an hour which is one week on from posting (thus it doesn't show as ending when it should start)

Thomas Markov

19:31

@Someone_Evil Ah, so it ends 1 hour after 18:00?

Someone_Evil

Aye

NautArch

@Someone_Evil Comment thread on that minor illusion question is turning into a discussion...move to chat?

Someone_Evil

I suppose that's not shown anywhere to non mods..

NautArch

Weird. Sam's profile says he was last seen 2 hours ago, but the question was asked just an hour ago.

Thomas Markov

@NautArch now that is odd.

Someone_Evil

19:37

That's not uncommon. You'll see it more often with uregs etc. Basically means they haven't visited since asking the question

Thomas Markov

@NautArch By time stamps, their last seen is only 6 minutes prior to asking.

Someone_Evil

Why it doesn't manage to make that the same time I don't know

Thomas Markov

You just happened to check between the two times getting rounded to the hour

If this question doesnt get answered, I'll escalate to 500. If it doesnt get answered then, I'll escalate to 1000 by stating in the bounty message that youll get another one if you win this one.

Yo, easy 200 points right here all you have to do is post an answer that doesn't cite Jeremy Crawford.

It's also basically a guaranteed necromancer badge

Yes, I dislike JC tweet answers so much that I will throw hundreds of rep at obvious questions just to get answers that don't include JC tweets.

4

Reputation cheat code: Go find good questions where the only answer is a JC Tweet answer, point them out to me, wait for me to bounty them, then answer them yourself and win the bounty.

NautArch

20:04

Am I being too harsh, or is this answer just bad? Tried to help, but they didn't want to hear it I guess.

MikeQ

It is a bad answer, however, I don't think it warrants deletion.

AncientSwordRage

@ThomasMarkov when I find a slot in my diary, sure

Thomas Markov

@MikeQ It's little better than just typing "yes" in the answer box.

NautArch

@MikeQ It's totally unsupported and the digression has nothing to do with the question. What is it's value?

Thomas Markov

That new homebrew review is HUGE

Full array of class features and 5 subclasses.

each subclass has 6 features

base class has 11 features.

So 41 features total to consider.

AncientSwordRage

20:10

@ThomasMarkov worth splitting?

Thomas Markov

@AncientSwordRage I've no idea.

AncientSwordRage

@ThomasMarkov it's not crazy long, just dense...

MikeQ

It's UA quality. I haven't read it but it should be good to ship!

Thomas Markov

I left a comment recommending triming it to a single sublcass.

G. Moylan

20:28

Now THAT's a capstone: Choose one spell of 9th level from any spell list. You can now cast this spell, ignoring cost of material components of it. Constitution is your spellcasting ability for this spell. Once used, you cannot cast it again until 7 days have passed.

Thomas Markov

@G.Moylan That's actually kinda cool.

7 days should balance it for most campaigns.

In fact, for a lot of campaigns, you wont be using it much at all.

Akixkisu

rpg.meta.stackexchange.com/questions/11668/minimum-edit-changes <- that is off-topic, is it not?

G. Moylan

and it's still cool. Getting powerful stuff for free is always welcome

Thomas Markov

I played a 1-20 campaign across 60 or so sessions and in-universe it was only a month.

@Akixkisu Why would that be off topic?

G. Moylan

whoa when did the mod indicator change?

Thomas Markov

20:33

25

Q: New Staff and Mod Labels on site metas and Meta Stack Exchange

In response to the request to Add an immediately visible indication that a user is a staff member or an employee of SE, we recently announced a new feature on per-site metas and Meta Stack Exchange (which is live as of now): Mod diamonds are replaced by the new Mod badge (which includes a diamo...

discussion design moderators display-names stack-exchange-team

Someone_Evil

They're only on meta (for now)

And you wouldn't be alone in finding them a touch loud. There's a userscript in one of the answers there which I at least found useful

Akixkisu

@ThomasMarkov because it should be asked on meta se instead.

Someone_Evil

Site-specific metas can do all that same. MSE would probably be more useful, but there are absolutely cases for site specific feature reqs etc.

Thomas Markov

@Akixkisu We handle site mechanics on our meta all the time. Are all of those questions off topic?

G. Moylan

I need to get my old userscripts back. I exported the browser profile data, I just need to sift through it to find the script parts

Akixkisu

20:37

@Someone_Evil absolutely, but that doesn't seem to apply here as it isn't a site specific feature request.

Thomas Markov

Ive got a user script for showing vote counts even if i dont have the privilege unlocked

G. Moylan

I had the pronoun script and another very configurable site overhaul utility that Moose gave me

Someone_Evil

Hypothetically if we found the need to remove that limitation just for us, asking for that might be way easier than doing it for the whole network. I don't think we would for this one, but hey

Thomas Markov

@Someone_Evil we for sure dont need to remove the limitation

G. Moylan

this is a bit of a hack-around but pasting the entire new link in would circumvent the issue, no?

Someone_Evil

20:44

There's some known ways to get around it, and if it's a good edit no one's gonna object to the html comment to make the suggestion long enough

Akixkisu

@Someone_Evil I don't think that either. If they didn't state it as a feature request, it probably wouldn't bother me as there is a concrete problem there with concrete solutions instead of this x y request.

G. Moylan

I almost feel like the paladin smite question is a trap. It seems very simple but I also feel like I'm missing something

I'm cooking up an answer for it

Akixkisu

"How can I edit this specific-question even though there is this 6 letter restriction" is something that we can do.

Thomas Markov

@G.Moylan lol it’s not a trap.

G. Moylan

20:59

@ThomasMarkov it just seems like it should be more complex than it is :P

NautArch

21:11

@G.Moylan SAC has made some odd decisions that don't always match up with the rules.

I'm especially looking at you, GWF and smite damage.

G. Moylan

@NautArch I don't doubt that but I'd be curious to see an example. I thought the whole point of the review process to get into the SAC and the retconning of other sources was to eliminate that from happening

NautArch

@G.Moylan SAC ruled that GWF does not allow rerolls of smite 1s and 2s. But the language for GWF just says damage from the attack...which smite damage is.

G. Moylan

@NautArch I believe the argument is that it isn't though, it's damage from the spell, triggered by the attack hitting.

NautArch

Yeah, but it ain't. The damage is from the attack, that's how smite works. It's one damage. If someone were to make a concentration save, it'd be on the total.

If they also ruled that smite damage is separate in that way as well, I'd be more understanding, but I still would be a hard disagree.

You can also look to JC's original tweet about it where he says that such a ruling would be to reduce time at the table by preventing rerolls.

We have a glimpse into his ruling and his intent - and I think both are wrong.

G. Moylan

well that's a mess

NautArch

21:16

Yep.

G. Moylan

I'll work on an edit

NautArch

And if some tables want to run it like that, that's fine - but at mine we generally like rolling dice (the more the better.) So rerolls aren't an issue at all.

G. Moylan

also why the hell doesn't DDB have a "back to top" button or at least tack the search bar to the top of the screen?

Hot RPG Questions

5

Q: How to make Primeval Awareness more useful for the Ranger?

I feel like Primeval aware is so underpowered as to be almost pointless. My first question then is "do you agree?" maybe I have not fully understood its implications... Beginning at 3rd Level, you can use your action and expend one Ranger spell slot to focus your awareness on the region around y...

dnd-5e spells homebrew-review ranger

Someone_Evil

@NautArch I take you're operating with a different ruling for your game?

G. Moylan

21:17

oh wow they do, I'm just blind. It's at the top of the nav bar on the left

nevermind, it's inconsistent

what a wreck of a website

nitsua60

21:36

@ThomasMarkov Nevertheless, when contemplating an action taken on a thousand posts, that definitely needs to be well discussed and agreed-upon on meta first. See also rpg.meta.stackexchange.com/q/10056/23970.

It may be a virtuous project, and you may be clear-as-day correct in the judgment, but once you're talking about a project, run it through meta.

Thomas Markov

@nitsua60 lol I’m more trying to prove a point than initiate a project.

nitsua60

If nothing else, it sends a signal to every user with less than your 69K rep (99.9% or so of them!) that they should see meta as a place to sanity-check any largish-feeling actions. After all, even you ran a double-check.

G. Moylan

@NautArch edited

nitsua60

@ThomasMarkov I can get behind this.

Thomas Markov

@nitsua60 I’ve actually got a project relating to that post I’m working. We need to reevaluate protection now that we’re a year out from that unfortunate experiment.

Mark Wells

21:42

@NautArch I think that question is not really answerable without some kind of coherent model of how illusions work. That is, if you can make an illusion of darkness, how is that different from making actual darkness?

G. Moylan

"It's not actually dark, you just think it is!" "What?"

Medix2

5e advantage disadvantage, is my reading correct that this rule change does the exact same thing to advantage and regular rolls?

Like, on a regular roll that hits, you effectively just have them reroll the attack. And on an advantage roll that hits, you have them reroll the attack

G. Moylan

@Medix2 on an attack with advantage you would roll two dice to hit, then roll damage normally

Medix2

Yeah, but in this particular question, the second die doesn't matter

nitsua60

@ThomasMarkov Protection certainly is a thing that could use a lot more discussion, IMO. For greener and I to have learned after many years on-site and chatting most days, then after two years as moderators together, that we had nearly diametrically-opposed views on it... means it doesn't get talked about enough =)

Mark Wells

21:47

@G.Moylan Right, that's the only model I think makes sense. An illusion is the phenomenon of thinking you see something. So in a dark room that contains the illusion of a lamp, you will think the room is bright. If you then try to read a book, you'll either imagine words that aren't there, or think the book is blank, or just be very confused as to why you can't read it.

G. Moylan

@Medix2 oh i reread. It seems like they're just... following the rule?

Medix2

@G.Moylan just gonna write up an answer... of sorts

G. Moylan

It's almost 5 on Friday... my brain is fried.

NautArch

@MarkWells Illusions always come down to the DM and the table agreement. They're tough to manage.

But fun!

@G.Moylan @MarkWells That's Phantasmal Force, a 2nd level spell.

@Someone_Evil Yeah, we always go rerolls on 1s and 2s for smite and any other damage from the attack by the melee weapon.

Mark Wells

@NautArch Yeah, under this model there's a well-defined answer: if you try to make an illusion of a light source being blocked, then an observer will be confused as to how they're seeing with no light source, but they will still see. But not everyone will buy into this model.

NautArch

22:01

@MarkWells It would probably be easier if there was a standard save/check timing.

Leaving it up to the character is tricky.

Medix2

Realizing my answer isn't an answer, so I'm not gonna post it :(

NautArch

@Medix2 Lovell already has the answer: They enjoy playing with it and have no issues.

Actually - would that be a legitimate answer? Or is that weird?

Akixkisu

22:47

@nitsua60 curious, did you two post those views and their reasoning anywhere?

(except for what is available in the comment section of the unprotection meta)

ah I found it, I though only one of you posted on that meta.

Ah I see why I forgot that one.

nitsua60

23:51

@Akixkisu Yeah, I can't think of anywhere other than that meta.

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