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00:00 - 22:0022:00 - 00:00

00:03
My players finally kicked the bucket. After more than two years of bi-weekly sessions.
Sadly, it was a result of a string of bad choices. Wasn't as climactic as I'd have hoped, but they were satisfied, which is what's most important. :)
They're super hyped for their new characters, so now I just have to come up with a good story. I got notes and lists of all the things they did, so hopefully I can make that play into the new story.
It's crazy to come in here and not seeing BESW online or any messages from BESW either. :P
Oh, I just had to scroll up far enough :P I was getting worried for a minute.
00:18
@trogdor [turns up] schwaaaaa?
Oh I see.
I haven't seen that episode. Will check it out later.
0
Q: Which of the Arcanist's features lets it swap out its prepared spells?

doppelgreenerI've heard that the Arcanist, Pathfinder's Wizard/Sorcerer Hybrid, has the batspit insane feature of being a Wizard that can swap out its prepared spells during the day, effectively being a Wizard with none of the drawbacks of being a Wizard. However, now that I look over its class features and ...

Someone please let me know if I am thinking of completely the wrong class so I can pre-emptively make this question sane if it is insane.
00:59
Looks like I had the right class. Phew.
 
2 hours later…
02:53
Fiasco status: successful. 3 out of 4 NPCs dead. The worst one sort of won.
@Magician Beautiful. What happened? (I don't know much about Fiasco other than... it's a fiasco, for everyone, and the lucky people wind up only slightly worse off than how they started.)
Do you want the short version, or the long one? The long will require some setting explanation, I suspect.
(also, PCs played Fate. It was NPCs who had a session of Fiasco)
Oh. XD
Short version?
PCs paired up with NPCs via compels. They all wanted various things from one another. It was all happening in the Grand Sanatorium, the retirement home for the... not-fully-dead. In the end, one NPC got his revenge and jumped off a cliff. Another failed to torch the entire place as he wanted, because his peg leg had been stolen. But he burned a wing down, with himself in it.
Third one dissolved into goo after being poisoned with the nasty substance that was hidden in the peg leg (that was the revenge). And the fourth one almost got dismembered for spare body parts by the third, but escaped unscathed, tossed the head doctor into the flames off-screen, and is positioned to take charge of the Sanatorium now.
PCs got what they wanted and are ready to sail away forever.
03:12
So, I watched that episode of gravity falls, took notes, and now I'm struggling to write the answer :/
Also, damn, Magician. Did the PCs see all that, or was it behind the scenes?
The PCs accomplished most of that, even if they didn't always know what it was they were accomplishing.
Setting up a situation where a bunch of people want things from one another, but lack the capacity to get them, and throwing PCs into the mix, worked out wonderfully.
hey @Smurfton
04:03
Hey @Shalvenay.
@Smurfton how're things going?
I'm going to answer a question! yay
Doesn't happen often
heheh
sidenote: what systems do you play in/want to play in?
Actually played:
Paranoia XP
D&D 3.5, but fairly light on the rules
Want to play:
D&D 5 sounds interesting
Fate sounds cool
nWoD has a nice setting
ah.
sadly, the only stuff I have in ready-to-run shape is a one-shot 3.5e dungeon that's well...rather weird and somewhat rule-bendy :) (it inspired multiple Stack questions, even)
04:11
I'm more here because I enjoy learning about RPGs I haven't played, if that makes sense
yeah
I want to get into a GURPS or perhaps Burning Wheel game sometime, but just haven't found a group for that
also, I've been told I should give Fiasco a shot, and it might help me if I actually played FAE instead of half-heartedly GMing it
lol
Good luck getting a group together
right now, I play 2e, 3.5e, and 5e...I also have some 0e (i.e. D&D in it's pre AD&D state, best I can tell) experience, and have dabbled in RFS
@doppelgreener eh, it was worth a shot
Pre-D&D is Chainmail, iirc
@trogdor I've watched that episode and taken notes. That question is being answered as we speak
04:17
ah, cool
:)
@Smurfton there was a phase of evolution between the wargaming origins of D&D and what was published as AD&D
names for it vary, though
(the dead giveaway that you're dealing with D&D pre-1e is that the classes are only open to humans)
@Shalvenay Yes, in pre-AD&D (or 1e/2e era basic D&D) races were the same as classes. If you wanted to play an elf, you took the elf class.
@Adeptus yeah, what's the name around here for pre-AD&D D&D btw?
27
Q: How many editions of Dungeons & Dragons are there?

RS ConleyHow many editions of Dungeons & Dragons are there?

(related)
OD&D, BECMI D&D, B/X D&D, Holmes D&D, Moldvay/Cook D&D, Mentzer D&D. First three most commonly.
04:33
@Adeptus nods
04:55
@trogdor If you're still here and interested, I answered that question.
ah cool
will read it now
Ben
Ben
Afternoon all
Evening.
05:23
[wave]
Ben
Ben
[continues the wave]
Evening to you to.
Eveingin to everyone
Ben
Ben
wait, we're not doing the wave?
[wave]
05:25
well it is too late now we broke it
I guess not
sorry
Ben
Ben
dammit @Magician we've told you before... you need to keep your power in check!
oops
Ben
Ben
[sigh] It's ok. You just get over excited sometimes :P
05:34
bah. silly internets.
I can't see that
still
What was it?
random godzilla gifs, of course
Ben
Ben
@Smurfton Tidal wave
@Ben The chat line that says silly internets was supposed to be apicture, but it wouldn't load. I can see the tidal wave just fine.
Ben
Ben
Ah. indeed. I missed the context there
I ruined the joke T-T
05:38
huh?
Ben
Ben
Nevermind haha
0
Q: Last year's narrow Community Ads are still being served

SevenSidedDieThe community ads from 2015 are still being served. I don't know if this is normal during some kind of transition phase or if it's a legit but, as I never would have noticed were it not for the new ad sizes. In any case, this is definitely not a 2016 ad: That comment link resolves to Communit...

06:06
@eimyr What secret?
06:20
@trogdor It was! I've seen a lot of episodes of that show, chances were good I'd seen that one :D
yeah
you had mentioned watching it before
so I did not know what percentage of show it was, but I was certainly sure it was more than me
I have only seen like, clips of it
06:59
@Ahriman when you edit a Google doc you leave your Google account display details.
ah
[adds eimyr to The List]
 
3 hours later…
09:31
@Ahriman many people just use a fake name or a nickname. Nevertheless, it's like Facebook too.
True
Nothing to do about it now
Yeah. Sorry about it.
It's the first time someone used one of my Docs while logged in. I didn't know it would log someone not as "Anonymous [animal]"
@Miniman I did some poor man's optimisation!
@Miniman My conclusion is that there is absolutely nothing that a Valor bard can do that a Lore bard can't do better at any level if he's smart about it.
This is why I have two Google accounts, and one of them says I'm Eric Merit Fairchild.
09:46
Where does the name come from?
Did you just decide to make it up or does it have significance, @BESW?
It's a collection of in-jokes from my past.
cool
I only assume mine says Eimyr .
Not entirely sure this is correct.
10:33
@eimyr Except use a weapon, surely? Extra Attack doubles the power of the attack action, and that's hard to beat.
@Miniman Except use a weapon, but using a cantrip instead scales better (Extra attack vs mutiple damage increases).
@Miniman before lvl 6 or after lvl 11 there is no reason to use a weapon over a cantrip unless you have really high attack and a magic weapon or all your cantrips target saves the enemy is great with.
10:49
gotta think of who you want to RP first
rather than focus on stats, imo
11:02
> Paizo's SRD is exemplary.
The PRD or the third-party-run d20PFSRD?
@GuidingLight d20pfsrd (thought the PRD is not too bad either)
@eimyr As far as I can tell, average damage on weapon attacks is higher at every level than cantrip damage, even if you max your casting stat first.
Depending on the weapon, cantrip damage could be higher at level 11, but not any other time.
11:19
For a 16 DEX bard with a rapier an attack deals 1d8+3 dmg
even if I go to 20, that's 1d8 + 5
Also, unless I've missed something, Lore Bard AC can't touch Valor Bard AC.
Vs 1d10. It has a higher average and is much more reliable.
1d8+5 averages 11.5
At level 11 Fire bolt has 3d10, averaging 15.5
1d8+5 x 2
Thanks
don't forget those extra attacks
well extra attack not multiple
11:22
But I only get one extra attack
at lvl 17th it's 4d10, which is 22 I think.
yea but that's 23 damage at 5/6
that's without any magical weapons to boot
I think that Valor has great advantage at lvl 6, but then the cantrip catches up
+1/2 magical weapon and it takes off even more
@eimyr Ok, at level 17 the cantrip wins. But at level 17 this kind of thing is not really worth thinking about anymore.
Agreed.
But!
Valor bard has trouble using his bonus action consistently.
11:26
They both do.
Generally, you want to use it for music, unless you have Cutting words, where you can burn a reaction to do the same.
(almost the same)
valor also gets to add bardic inspiration die to damage if they want
and at high levels can attack as a bonus action on top of a cast
At high levels you want to attack with your Bigby's as a bonus action.
Cutting Words is a defensive tool, while Valor's +damage is offensive.
And Lore could get Spiritual Weapon at lvl 6
Good point! But offense is almost invariably superior to defense in D&D.
Yup
11:29
which would be a poor man's Bigby's Hand
and you won't always have spells available
Spiritual Weapon at level 6 is a fair point, but I don't think it's enough to say Lore is objectively better.
Maybe I've been swayed by me perception of the character's role.
my*
My impression was that you wanted to be a gish.
In general, the Bard's role is pretty much whatever you want it to be.
at 14th I think that an attack after a spell as bonus is... wel... underwhelming
11:37
Oh, I agree. I just don't think it's something to judge the whole archetype on.
I mean, I have a whole rant on why the Eldritch Knight doesn't work. The Valor Bard is pretty tough to come up with good complaints about.
@Miniman What's your main problem with EK?
Not one I'm going to try to get into on a mobile phone with bad reception that's rapidly running out of data, right before I need to sleep.
lol no worries
Generally my stream of thought was like that: A cantrip is almost as good as a single attack at any level but it's ranged and safe. With War Caster, I can use it for attacks of opportunity as reaction, which is great and I can hold a Whip (even without martial proficiency) just to threaten a huge area while not using it to attack and blast people instead. Getting cutting frees my bonus action to get even more oopmh turn after turn.
I also need less +2 ability improvements (because I'm not attacking and don't need as much DEX), so I can grab Moderately Armored and turtle up just like Valor. This brings my defense on par.
Meanwhile, I get 2 more spells at lvl 6th Magical Secret, will be proficient in a lot of skills for RP awesomeness and still have an option of grabbing a crossbow or something and shoot quite competently as a backup.
See that just seems cheesy to me
11:49
The whip trick doesn't work, the ranged thing is better with a longbow, staying at range and AoOs are opposite goals, and Moderately Armored comes way later than when it's most effective or slows your casting stat down.
Holding a whip for the extended range on aoo
Why doesn't it work?
Doesn't work since the errate, anyway.
Of which I was unaware. What does it say?
2ndly AoO are not as prevalent as in Pf/3.5
11:50
Reach only extends your reach for attacks with that weapon.
Not for AoOs with that weapon?
makes sense
otherwise monsters can have some stupid reach for AoO
this one says otherwise...
is there an errata to this errata?
No. But you're reading it differently to me.
It adds 5 feet to your reach for AoOs with IT.
Great.
W hen a hostile creature’s movement provokes an

opportunity attack from you, you can use your reac-
tion to cast a spell at the creature, rather than making

an opportunity attack. The spell must have a casting

time of 1 action and must target only that creature.
11:53
You don't get to trigger AoOs 10 feet away then take them with something else.
From War Caster
Hmmm...
I find it reasonable, yet I can't put a specific rule that I know that would say so.
It says it in the reach property.
I thought that the whip would cause the creature's movement to provoke an AoO, then instead of making an attack with the whip I cast a cantrip.
I get why I couldn't do it, but maybe I just lack the hard reading ability for DnD.
rules as written you are right eimyr
Not sure that's true. Reach adds 10 feet to your reach for AoOs with a reach weapon, not for provoking AoOs.
11:58
as a DM i'd be going no not happening, you're not even proficient in the weapon therefore trying to use it in that manner is not fitting
If that's the case I can't use it even with a whip - basically my AoO threat would be 5 feet, even if I could use that AoO with 10 feet range.
Reach (p. 147).
This property also determines your reach for opportunity attacks with a reach weapon
That would mean the threatening range of AoO
otherwise would be useless to mention that
because you would only ever threaten the 5" around you
@eimyr I think you're separating provoking and taking AoOs where the system doesn't.
@Miniman Yes, I think I do.
Would that mean I get to AoO with the whip anyone in 10', but with a spell anyone within 5' only?
I think so? Pretty sure it's what was meant, at least. It's definitely a bit disfunctional.
12:03
It's weird.
I actually think it would make sense for the War Caster feat to work whenever I get an AoO, not only movement related.
As a "Aha!" moment for you.
It does work whenever you get an AoO. But there are some weird "AoOs not labelled as such" that it doesn't work for.
e.g. it wouldn't work with Sentinel.
Nor Mage Slayer, yeah.
Which is even weirder.
Also, enemies won't run away from a caster when they are already within 5', that's just stupid.
Unless I use some sort of fear condition.
Depends on the caster, depends on the enemies.
12:20
Wow, I gotta sleep. Talk to you guys later.
 
1 hour later…
13:41
Ayyy gang
Hey @eimyr :)
Still min-maxing your bard?
14:32
Yup
15:15
Been playing around on the Kobold Fight Club web page (KFC allows you to calculate appropriate challenge ratings for PCs in D&D encounters). The party size menu only goes up to 12 PCs, but it's easy to extrapolate to bigger parties. For example, a group of 720 1st level PCs would find an Adult Red Dragon (18,000 XPs) an Easy challenge!
That seems about right. A local lord would have to raise a sizeable army of 1st level fighters to take on a big dragon like that. And if a fraction of those troops are killed in horrible ways by the dragon the rest will likely flee.
lol
It'd take a long time to get to your turn again
15:32
Yes - hmmm if DMing a combat encounter like this, think I'd make it a dice roll-a-thon with no turns. How many men can surround a dragon on a hex map? Maybe 20? The PCs start rolling 20 d20s and damage dice at the same time, while the DM rolls for dragon attacks. Everyone rolls at once & keeps track of damage inflicted/casualties.
15:52
Actually, couldn't a lot of "theater of the mind" low-level mass combats be handled this way to expedite gameplay? A lot of area effect magic spells could be handled on the fly since they often amount to rolling a bunch of save & damage dice.
Apparently, rapid rep gain is incredibly distracting. I have no idea how high rep users get anything done
How so?
@RobertF Yes. Faster combat and removing useless rolls is great :)
I hit the daily max yesterday with ome answer. I was struggling to stop staring at my rep the whole time.
Might be partially because I was close to being able to see review queues
Can we cash in our rep pts? Or sell them to other posters? :) I mean are rep pts really worth anything in the real world?
15:59
nope
you can use them to get answers
super-bounties
Yes, obviously. Rep is proof that someone on the internet thought you were .... cool.
2
@RobertF It lets you interact with the site in a much more meaningful way. Which is why I don't have much input into the site.
That too
16:01
@Polyducks - I'll sell you 500 of my rep pts for $10.
Deal. Gibbe passwerd
Well I was thinking we'd contact one of the Stack Exchange sysadmin people to conduct the pt transfer after you mail the $10 check to me. :)
Maybe posters with low rep should be able to form a union & pool their rep pts?
I can imagine exactly what kind of response you'd get from SE sysadmin for such a request.
To be honest, I don't like how SE works, but I know why it does and that it's very effective. It's just not a social media platform like people want it to be.
How much do mod accounts go for these days
I'll take 10.50
More seriously, try suggesting edits, @Polyducks. It's slow, but you get 2 rep per. Shouldn't take too long to reach 25 that way.
16:13
I think by using rep pts, SE is trying to avoid the more unruly posts & responses at other forums like rpg.net.
In truth, for some of the SE sites (like statistics/machine learning in CrossValidated) I bet a high rep would be worth something more tangible. Say if a potential employer reads your posts.
@smurfton ah, I've done that. There are countless typos everywhere which make answers unreadable - however you need to change at least 5 characters for it to be an edit.
@Smurfton I'll try snatching someone else's answers though. Thanks!
@RobertF I wouldn't want a potential employer going anywhere near my web presence!
Yeah, and it's a nice system. The only problem, and it isn't much of one, is that rep favors the knowledgeable and questioning over the dedicated.
I think that's the point.
It doesn't do much for a positive feedback loop though, which is why people can get really frustrated with the site.
It's methodical and computed, not empathetic and caring
Although if someone pisses you off (who gave me a -1 on my response?) you can give someone negative pts just to be spiteful.
Comments get nuked on this site which I don't like - on the Sci-Fi/Fantasy SE you'll see 10+ comments for some questions/answers.
What I mean is that if someone couldn't come up with an answer or question to save their life (after a while), even if they dedicated ten hours a day to helping the site, unlike, say, a wiki, they wouldn't actually be able to get much done.
16:21
You mean if you've upvoted a lot of posters on the site, but not asked any questions, you're stuck in a low rep limbo?
Ooh. Yeah, good point.
I suggest a new system where we just press buttons to hug each other.
Well, if you dedicated ten hours a day to a wiki, just to clean things up, you'd end up a mod by the end of the week.
@RobertF Comments are supposed to get nuked on old questions, outside of meta, unless they improve the answers. (With the assumption that old questions no longer need clarifying)
@Smurfton - Are the pts you've earned on comments nuked as well when the comment is deleted?
You don't get points from comments. Badges stay, though.
Besides, high rated comments survive purges, for the most part
@Polyducks - Not a bad idea actually - what about buttons that signal to someone: "Awesome question!" or "Great response!"
16:28
Isn't that what up votes are supposed to mean?
@Smurfton - I can see how posting numerous comments with a friend could be abused if the pts did stick.
You don't get rep from comments
Srsly
Well I meant a more personal positive message or an emoticon rather than an impersonal upvote.
Oh, right.
You can upvote comments - but those pts just go to earning badges is that right?
16:32
Yes
Am I the only person who (before they could see votes) would see the number of votes go down and think that someone down voted them, even though it was a not refreshing thing?
You mean if somebody retracted their upvote?
No, if you hit back on your browser, the value from when you loaded the page the first time is displayed, even if you had seen it update.
That too, I guess
When does the day transition for SE?
@Polyducks there's some low hanging question edit fruit right now, actually
I have seen my question upvotes not sticking when I browse to a different webpage and then return.
Yes, that.
16:48
I don't know why that happens.
Maybe there's a slight lag while the SE server updates rep scores for questions/answers?
Maybe
I thought it was browser caching
17:02
God Damn, Seven Sided is fast.
I don't know, the question is bad, but the answer is good.
17:20
@sevensideddie I dont think this is salvageable
0
Q: What's the difference between Monster Manuals for different editions of D&D?

kubariumI own 5E Monster Manual. I also have Monster Manual I, code number 2009 from 1E. I can see the difference between these two versions but I'm wondering about what's been added and removed in the versions between 1-5. I do understand the monster stats would look different depending on each version...

No, not really.
Only time I would feel that way is if a tool rec question came in
@Smurfton by the way hello I don't think we've met before
No, I dont think so. Nice to meet you.
@JoshuaAslanSmith Unless I'm not seeing something, aren't you contradicting yourself?
Tool rec only recently went out of scope and it's something I believe we did well and 2as within our ability to operate whereas idea generation questions are really off base I feel
I have resisted the urge to answer tool recs that come in out of respect for the order of the site
Impressive.
17:34
What rpg.see can be and is sometimes is worth the compromise, specifically if I want to have positive influence
2
An idea for that question is to change it to stylistic differences between books. Can't make that happen without prompting, though
@Smurfton thats certainly a better question for the MM question to be but it still might be opinion based, and closed as such.
Really? How so?
I'm not seeing the opinion involved in identifying differences in writing
And major formatting changes, I suppose
@Smurfton an aesthetic judgement is intrinsically subjective even if there could be a consensus (we are not a great platform for consensus forming) The issue is he doesn't seem to be asking about the mechanical differences which would be something we could answer (even then comparing all D&D editions would get tedious and probably end up like a list )
@Grubermensch wave
@waxeagle D&D thursday?
0
Q: community promotion ad to run on worldbuilding.SE

nitsua60Many of us enjoy the work of our friends over at worldbuilding.SE, and their ad here has been well-received. I wonder if we'd like to reciprocate with an rpg.SE ad to run in their community promotion? (Monica Cellio has invited us to do so.) The thought I had was something that blends imagery na...

17:53
@nitsua60 great idea on the ad
I'm surprised we don't already have one
@JoshuaAslanSmith yes! voice is much better, and shouldn't have to work.
@TheOracle are they graduated?
ah, predesign graduation, good for them!
Seems like it
28
Q: Worldbuilding Site Design

Kurtis BeaversI'm Kurtis, a product designer at Stack Exchange. First off, congratulations on your recent site graduation! Graduation and Your Site Design Graduation comes with a few perks. We have already begun work on your site's design based on the community's ideas so that the design gives you a unique t...

Happened yesterday, if you don't feel like looking.
Wait, I'm dumb
71
Q: Congratulations, Worldbuilding is graduating!

Grace NoteIt's a big day. You've been cleared for graduation by the Stack Exchange Community Team! Worldbuilding met our threshold for graduation-worthy sites and after a review, the Community Team determined that you're good to go. Reaching 'mature community' status is a big milestone, and you should be v...

Two months ago
 
3 hours later…
21:22
Is it acceptable to post something as an answer on meta in order to use images?
Even though it isn't, strictly speaking, an answer
Images such as this i.sstatic.net/zUqli.png
It's better cropped than the current suggested version of the rpg.se ad has it on this question
3
Q: community promotion ad to run on worldbuilding.SE

nitsua60Many of us enjoy the work of our friends over at worldbuilding.SE, and their ad here has been well-received. I wonder if we'd like to reciprocate with an rpg.SE ad to run in their community promotion? (Monica Cellio has invited us to do so.) The thought I had was something that blends imagery na...

Also, Hi, BESW, how's life?
Hi!
I'm actually running around getting ready to go teach a class I'm not prepared for.
Good luck!
Which is about exactly how life is, overall.
21:26
tru
I do have a lovely new challenge with my RPG group, though: too many players.
Any thoughts on posting an answer that doesn't so that I can provide materials for image editing to anyone who has the time?
In the last month I've doubled the number of people who are liable to show up on any given week.
wow, well done.
Well, actually, it's one of my players who started inviting her friends.
@Smurfton Do it, but make sure you include context so people know what you're doing.
21:29
Thanks.
21:41
@Smurfton I'll be getting the originals from the artist over on WB who made their ad, so I'll post all of the constituent images in meta, also.
@JoshuaAslanSmith thanks--I'm in no way a real designer, so all feedback/criticism/do-it-yourself-ism is welcome =)
Jawa scavenger/outlaw is a completely valid RPG character concept. THIS IS A SUBTWEET DIRECTED AT MISTER SCOTTERICK VON WEGENER.
The Buttolph Collection of historic menus has content even more awesome than its name is giggle-inducing.
21:57
@nitsua60 Well, I kind of feel like I wasted the last hour now. Oh well.
@BESW you take more on board?
I'm pretty sure that if you said "Oi, RPG.SE folks, come play with me eh?" you'd get a nice and orderly queue.
Barring timezone constraints, but you get the idea.
I'm actually pretty sure there would be at least one person adjusting their daily routine to fit into your game.
00:00 - 22:0022:00 - 00:00

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