TRPG General Chat

trogdor

22:01

@BESW go figure right?

Metool

Well that was a dream.

BESW

Did you also have the dream about the swamp where everything was in black and white except the Dalmatian snake?

(I'm not sure how you can tell a Dalmatian snake is in color, but it was!)

trogdor

lol

Metool

No, this was a dream where I was one of a pair of Ice Climber-style fighters.

user61230

My dreams have been getting interesting lately. Maybe it's because I'm waking up naturally now.

trogdor

22:13

I am very unsure how that works

I had one just before I got up 30 minutes or so ago, I was riding the bike I had before I moved to this new house, and when I went down the hill I useually took it on it retroactively fell apart

BESW

@Emrakul My mother and I trade off; one of us will have strange, vivid dreams for a month or two while the other doesn't, and then we switch.

It even worked when we were on opposite sides of the world for a few years.

trogdor

so I got off of it, (without falling down or anything) and found each broken peice on the way back home

user61230

That's actually very surprising.

user61230

I wonder why...

BESW

Given that she swears up and down that I can hear her thoughts...

trogdor

22:17

lol

BESW

(I think she's just muttering under her breath and doesn't realize it, but she's sure she's not.)

@trogdor That's a Whedon-level dream right there.

trogdor

lol

how so?

BESW

We should add Restless to the TV I Need To Show You list.

trogdor

mk

BESW

Whedon is very good at writing a particular kind of dream logic.

trogdor

22:21

I do admit though, it was really weird,.... AFTER I woke up

before that I never seem to catch on

dream me is pretty dumb

or maybe just doesn't care

either way, I am intimately familiar with the fact that dream logic is just a completely different animal

BESW

I wear the cheese; it does not wear me.

trogdor

there were also kids I don't know who were riding their bikes first, but as soon as I got on mine they stopped existing

not in itself too strange for a dream

at least for me

Metool

22:46

gragh

BESW

Agreed.

trogdor

eh?

shatterspike1

Anybody know of a point-build system that's fairly simplistic? Balance wouldn't be a terribly huge concern here. All I can think of are Wild Talents or Tri-Stat

user61230

23:05

I had a flag declined for a statement which was outright lying to a user, and now I'm confused and slightly disappointed.

shatterspike1

Which flag?

user61230

I flagged this comment. It was declined without a reason.

user61230

The question OP is posting spam everywhere asking for the question to be deleted. Someone posted this to get them to stop, even though it's not true.

user61230

And it's just... flat out incorrect.

BESW

That gives me a sad.

user61230

23:10

A moderator declined my flag. And I held these people in high ethics.

user61230

[sigh]

shatterspike1

Far as I can tell, they banned him for the terrible crime of... being annoying.

BESW

Moderators are overworked, underpaid, flawed humans like the rest of us. I'd be inclined to give them a lot of the benefit of the doubt.

John Craven

holy cow that sounds like a bad situation in general

Metool

@BESW are you secretly a mod somewhere?

shatterspike1

23:12

To be fair, he seems to be really annoying

user61230

But... we elect moderators because we hold them to high ethical standards.

John Craven

I find it very, very hard to believe that a dude got the BANE for a whole year for just asking for a post to be deleted (which you don't do anyway)

user61230

It is the responsibility of moderators to uphold those standards

user61230

That's not what I'm talking about. The guy deserves to be banned; he's been a pain for a couple weeks, and has been spamming a bunch of sites.

BESW

@Emrakul Aye, and so I'm inclined to think it's more likely there's something you're not aware of, than that moderators are misbehaving on that scale.

user61230

23:13

I'd like to think so, but that comment is a lie.

BESW

(Even if it's just "the moderator who looked at your flag didn't get the breadth of the situation.")

John Craven

OK, it looks like he's pestering one of the mods constantly, which I can imagine is annoying

user61230

He's also been swearing at them, and has been spamming about 7 sites with requests to have this deleted.

shatterspike1

Oh

John Craven

does SE ban IPs?

I imagine it has to at some point

user61230

23:14

Yes, SE will eventually IP ban.

user61230

The problem is, I still hold moderators to the highest of ethical standards, even if they're overworked and tired.

user61230

Because that's what their job is, and if they need help with it, then elect more moderators.

Metool

^ this, yes, pretty much.

John Craven

I've yet to see really and truly egregious mod behavior from this site

user61230

There have been a couple overall. None from RPG.SE that I've seen, but I haven't been here long.

shatterspike1

23:16

The mods on this site actually seem to be ok. I haven't been banned yet for suggesting fallout 3 might not be godawful.

John Craven

BANE

I don't even really see why he wants it banned. It's not that bad of a question. Granted, it's kind of in the wrong forum (I consider myself a full-on skeptic but it's tough to wade into economic arguments, even if both sides of this argument seem to be held by saltwater guys) but it's not deletably horrible.

BESW

There is a mod here who has taken on the role of The Abrasive One, because somebody's got to be the Firm Hand, but (despite various accusations) I've never seen him overstep the bounds of modhood.

user61230

It's actually a respectable Skeptics question.

shatterspike1

Ah, is this the mod that draws the ire of certain others?

John Craven

This is the mod named BESW

Man, that guy...

BESW

23:20

Oh, yeah. He's a right hardnose.

user61230

We should really make a serious effort at deposing him.

user61230

He definitely hasn't contributed anything of worth to the site. Not at all, no.

John Craven

BANE THE MOD BANE THE MOD BANE THE MOD

BESW

But really, @Emrakul, your comment responses to that lie are not clear; they're elided and generally insulting, without explaining what it is that has you offended. If your flag was anything like that, a mod is likely right to ignore it--especially in the context of a flame war like that one.

There may also be the issue that the mod felt it was important to keep the comment alive as a visible record of events regardless of its truth value, and that the problem should be addressed in some other fashion than burying the lie.

user61230

@BESW Fair enough; that comment should have been more open.

John Craven

23:24

Also, the troll already responded to him, so I guess you'd lose the point of that response (unless it also got deleted)

BESW

Mods go rogue sometimes, but more often they have context or experience that we don't.

Metool

"It is too late to undo this operation."

user61230

Though I only left one comment after the lie; the other comment was a redirection to chat

Metool

(Someone else starred 9m ago by John Craven)

BESW

Yes, and your one comment didn't even indicate which citizen you were accusing of amorality!

user61230

23:25

I defer to the judgement of moderators from that context, but I don't see additional context, to be honest.

shatterspike1

Is there a point-buy system for Anima for Characteristics? (Completely off topic)

user61230

Yeah, I admit, it's poorly worded and not descriptive.

John Craven

The biggest problem I'm having with joining writers.SE now is... I want to get back on my novel sooooooooooooooooooooooooooo bad

Luckily, I unexpectedly got at least 2 days and perhaps all of next week off, so there is that

user61230

I guess I'll just let the issue drop... bleh.

user61230

Usually I can laugh these things off.

BESW

23:32

@Emrakul [patpat]

I sympathize, I really do. I'm just not sure that wildly accusing mods of unethical behavior is an appropriate or proportionate response.

Especially if you're doing it in a venue where they aren't around to defend themselves.

If you're honest concerned about it, there are Proper Channels for lodging complaints, and they will be taken seriously.

John Craven

Meh. I got the sense that dude was just venting. No big deal.

I don't particularly agree that this was like some outrageous and egregious display of mod abuse either, but the relative impermanence of chatrooms are kind of the place for that sort of thing.

BESW

@JohnCraven SE chat is logged and Google-botted. It's about as permanent as the Internet gets.

John Craven

Yes, but your mom.

(noted)

BESW

And accusations easily become common "knowledge" which will influence community attitudes.

I've seen it in scifi.se, where mods have to regularly defend their actions because the community increasingly assumes that any mod action it dislikes must be the result of personal fiat rather than moderators responding to flags.

shatterspike1

How long has RPG SE been around again?

BESW

23:37

Couple years?

shatterspike1

How long do you think it will take until serious dramastorms?

John Craven

To some degree, I'm surprised that these non-programmer SE sites don't get more contentious, since in many cases mod decisions are all out there in the open.

BESW

First question seems to be August '10.

@shatterspike1 In SE? We've had some fairly serious drama get kicked around. There are fascinating meta logs.

John Craven

I've been in much less transparent forums and it does seem to me that if the moderation is fair, you actually get more whinging when it's relatively more transparent than when it's less so

wax eagle

@BESW pushing 3 I think

BESW

23:40

To a certain extent, a modicum whinging is a sign of a community that feels like it has room to be heard without being suppressed; that's healthy.

But there's no need for us as individual citizens to feel like we need to be part of it just for its own sake.

On an entirely different note, I am getting a vague sense of foreboding re: Peter Capaldi.

Historically, actors who were big fans of the show before being cast as the Doctor do not make the best Doctors.

shatterspike1

Is it that they don't put their own spin on the character?

John Craven

I'd say he looks kind of old for the part but I guess that's more of a statement on the last 3 Dr. Whos than on the overall history of the show

granted that it's decidedly less outright corny and low-budget now

BESW

@JohnCraven He's as old as the first actor to play the Doctor was when he started the role.

John Craven

yeah, he looks roughly the same age as the 3rd Doctor too

BESW

(But looks a lot younger; Hartnell had health problems which meant he looked fifteen or twenty years older.)

John Craven

23:45

(I just watched a marathon of "this was Dr. Who #X" documentaries on the BBC yesterday) (well, 3 of them)

BESW

@shatterspike1 Yeah, I think they've got so much riding on being The Doctor They Want To See In The Show that they let it override The Doctor The Show Needs.

@JohnCraven Over the last month I've given @trogdor a crash course in Old Who.

John Craven

It was at a bar and I admit I was kind of getting into them but one of the owners came by and was like "HEY U DOAN MINE IF I PLAY SOME SHITTY MUSIC ON THE JUKEBOX INSTEAD DO YOU????" and I was too ashamed of my nerdiness to answer too affirmatively.

trogdor

whowhatwherewhy?

BESW

@JohnCraven Aw.

John Craven

I would like to see an older, sillier Dr. Who myself. We've had too many brooding, serious ones recently.

BESW

23:47

Aye. I'm hoping (wihtout hope) that the 50th Anniversary will reinstate Gallifrey.

With the Time Lords being gone, the Doctor has to take over their role. With them around, he can be their counterpoint.

@mxyzplk Hi!

trogdor

yeah

mxyzplk

howdy

trogdor

I question the decision to throw the Time Lords under the bus

cause the Doctor is much better character when they are around to show you how he is different from them

BESW

It was interesting, and Nine made it work, but they've milked it for all it's worth now and it's getting repetitive and tiresome.

trogdor

I did enjoy 9,... but I am wondering if that was just because I started my Dr Who watching with him

user61230

23:51

I suppose that's true.

user61230

Wrong audience, wrong time, right message. I need to work on that.

John Craven

9 was... Tennant?

Or was he 10?

trogdor

he was 10

Metool

Tennant was 10, Eccleston was 9

trogdor

it's easy to remember cause ten is in his name LOL

John Craven

23:53

ha

trogdor

thank you thank you my bad jokes are here all week,.. nope thats forever

I didn't like 10 so much

Metool

Ten was alright

John Craven

I feel I need to do some like week-long excursion wherein I watch all of the new series

user61230

Eccleston would have been better had he been given more time.

John Craven

it feels like something I would have found amazing when I was a kid, but for some reason I didn't get into it then

BESW

23:55

Nine had a great actor, but the writing was up and down, more often down.

trogdor

yeah

what you said

user61230

I don't know much about Davies' history as a writer, but that could have been because he was getting back in the motions.

BESW

Ten had similar writing problems, but the actor wasn't as strong, so the writing lets him down more: Tennant had trouble keeping the characterization consistent, and he's the least "alien" of the Doctors... which is probably why people new to the show like him, but it doesn't work for me.

trogdor

as for 10,.... Tennant himself gets some of the blame for why I didn't like that run, but the rest goes to basically everything else

BESW

@Emrakul Unfortunately, Ten's run doesn't get any better. If anything, it gets increasingly self-indulgent and un-self-aware.

John Craven

23:58

the Tennant series is the one where the show seems to be taking itself too seriously

user61230

Hm. I don't normally hear that of Davies.

John Craven

which is why I really liked 11

trogdor

mm

BESW

Eleven's actor is great at being An Old And Tired Alien, but not given much opportunity to do so.

trogdor

the further I got into 10's run, the more I regretted seeing that particular episode.

John Craven

23:59

Dr. Who actors need to realize that when they yell I'm just going to laugh at them, so they ought to at least make the yelling legitimately funny

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