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00:00 - 16:0016:00 - 00:00

16:00
I say this is "correct" because "Windows 8 Preview" is not a final product, and is now fully deprecated and obsoleted and should no longer be used -- so it has exactly zero value to keep information on SuperUser about Win8 Preview
so the short answer is yes, a question that duplicates the same essential content as a question is a duplicate. But the question which was asked earlier (or which has better answers) should be edited, re-tagged, and the answer should be re-evaluated to determine its accuracy with the final release
@allquixotic make an answer of it.
hi everyone
@DanielBeck hey
@DanielBeck hi
@HaydnWVN hello
16:17
heya @DanielBeck :)
my NAS arrived today! \o/
Now I just need to get drives for it. Any recommendations?
@DanielBeck 3.5"?
@allquixotic Yes. SATA.
16:22
3Gb/s or 6Gb/s?
I thought the WD RE4 4TB might be a good choice, but am concerned about the noise for an in-office NAS
and what is your preference: energy efficiency + low noise + cost effectiveness with low performance, or energy-hungry + high noise + costly with high performance?
higher RPM adds cost, noise, and power requirements but significantly improves throughput and seek times
you're also less likely to find high RPM in very high capacities
be very careful with buying any 4TB capacity drives right now, Thailand had an earthquake that set back the production of 4TB hard drives by many months, and they've been selling them almost exclusively as external HDDs, which means that if you purchase a 4TB that's been ripped out of an external enclosure by the seller, it comes with NO manufacturer warranty
they basically halted production of 4TB retail internal HDD kits for about 6 months and used the few assembly lines that were operational to produce external HDDs since they get better revenue from tacking on the sale of the enclosure
@allquixotic If someone could tell me how loud 8x 35 db(A) in a metal enclosure is, that'd help. Wikipedia wasn't that helpful.
I got "burned" and bought warrantyless 4TB HDDs... I'm okay with them because I'll probably ditch them before they have a problem and they're not very likely to have a problem during the 2 year warranty period they'd have anyway, but still, I wouldn't recommend that anyone else follow my path
@DanielBeck does the enclosure have any sort of padding inside?
@allquixotic Nobody uses server drives in external enclosures (except WD's external Raptor drives), do they?
16:27
eight 35dB disks (7200rpm?) would probably be extremely loud, although most of the noise would be in the lower ranges, so it would add a sort of background noise rather than the jet engine effect of running a Radeon GPU's fan at 100%
@DanielBeck My bet would be 35db :D
@DanielBeck no, I don't think so -- if you're going for server-grade drives then you probably don't need to worry about them being ripped out of enclosures
but you can check the serial number with the manufacturer when you get them, and if they register as being external, immediately dispute the payment or get a refund from the seller if you can
Me thinks I should buy 4 of them as a consumer, test them, and if they are tolerable enough, send them back and buy again for the company :-/
my WD 4TB drives are the 7200rpm desktop/consumer variant; the drives are exactly identical to what the internal kit product would be, minus the warranty, and the fact that they've had their WD retail enclosure ripped off of them
@DanielBeck what you could do (if permitted) is get some kind of... enclosure enclosure :D a cabinet or something where you can install the enclosure and mostly seal it off from the environment around it... not sure how that'd impact cooling though
the lack of padding in a metal enclosure means that the drives' noise isn't going to be attenuated at all, so it would be at least as loud as having the disks in a computer chassis with no noise padding
probably louder because the sheer size of a computer chassis, plus the whirring from the CPU and case fans, drowns out a lot of the HDD noise
@DanielBeck evening
16:32
the amount of ball bearing clattering you hear will increase as the drives age, too
brand new drives are almost silent when doing I/O, but very old drives, even super high quality ones, clatter like hell
it's inevitable due to the wearing of the hardware
@OliverSalzburg that sounds quite insane
@OliverSalzburg cool
@HackToHell Well, it's from 2003. I'm currently seeing how to apply it in Windows 7
Clicking Shutdown does not present a dialog ;D
and there's no shutdown dialog in Windows 8
I'm sure you can make some COM or WinAPI call to do it, so maybe Nirsoft tools can do it properly
check out nircmd
16:36
@allquixotic I'm not looking for a way to restart explorer. I just came by this blog post and was unaware that there seems to be a built-in method
> keep the Ctrl and Shift keys pressed and simultaneously click on an empty spot in the lower left corner of the start menu with the right mouse button.
lol
what is this madness with holding down multiple modifier keys and clicking on weird places
Hmmm... I have a 3TB Hitachi Deskstar 7k3000 drive installed in the NAS temporarily. Sounds pretty tolerable to me, with 29 dB "idle" noise... 8 drives with 35db(A) each should be... 4 times louder or so?
16:40
What the... :D
@allquixotic So you don't do it accidentally and have no idea WTF is going on
windows 8 probably has it so you can press WinKey (since that's the new trend) + Ctrl + Alt + Capslock + press the scroll wheel while hovering the mouse (or finger) over the start screen
@OliverSalzburg sounds like a cool thing to do on a public computer that they think is "locked down" :D
nice
Works like a charm btw
@DanielBeck noisemeters.com/apps/db-calculator.asp 35+35+35+35 dB = 41 dB
16:42
not in Win 8 though
8 * 35 dB = 44.1 dB
but 44.1 dB isn't 26% louder than 35 dB :P
@OliverSalzburg yeah
I forgot about that
@HackToHell Did you just shut down?
@allquixotic my poor friends are going to die :D
@allquixotic Still doesn't tell me a lot. And I don't want to buy a noise meter to get values for comparison...
@OliverSalzburg yeah <_<
@HackToHell Luckily I tried it in a VM :D
44 dB is the sound of bird calls (although bird calls will be higher frequency and thus harder to block out as background noise)
the delta between 44.1 dB and 35 dB is 9.1 dB; the "perceived loudness" of moving up 10 dB should be about double the loudness
so if you have eight HDDs pushing 35 dB it should only be twice as loud as one of them
Ctrl+Shift+Right-click task bar on desktop
For Windows 8
Shows "Exit Explorer" in the menu
16:50
lol, awesome
i want to know how to do that from the winapi
5
Q: Win32 API - How to kill processes by name?

dikideraBasically, I have a program which will be launched more than once. So, there will be two or more processes launched of the program. I want to use the Win32 API and kill/terminate all the processes with a specific name. I have seen examples of killing A process, but not multiple processes with t...

@OliverSalzburg ah yes
But that wouldn't be the same I guess :\
not just kill the process, but "properly" restart Explorer
@allquixotic Yeah, I guess you could send it a WM_QUIT?
16:53
is that what the Exit Explorer function does?
@allquixotic We'd have to check. But sending a WM_QUIT is a perfectly fine way to ask an application to exit cleanly, isn't it?
it's app-dependent
does MSFT follow their own semantics? :P
window messages are no better than signals, when they are merely advisory/cooperative, so you depend on the receiving process to do the right thing
@allquixotic Right
But trying if that works takes like 10 minutes of coding. So that would be my first try before doing any investigating :D
does taskkill use TerminateProcess if you omit /F (forcefully kill)?
or maybe it also sends WM_QUIT
@allquixotic Would have to check
17:06
@allquixotic Educated guess: "bwhahaha no of course not"
@Paul, which ASIC did you order, and what is the reason you got it? performance per watt? throughput?
10
Q: How to gracefully terminate a process?

Daniel RikowskiI want to terminate a number of processes, but I want to give each process the chance to save its data, ask the user about saving a file and even ignore the close request. So TerminateProcess is out of the question, because it kills the process instantly. Another way would be to use SendMessage/...

Guess I was a little off :D
Neat-o. Official docs \o/ support.microsoft.com/kb/178893
17:21
Anyone got tips on getting the back cover of an HP IQ800 off? I followed HP's instructions, but I can't get the top part off
hometime cya o/
@Luke more force!
@Luke no specific experience with the IQ800, but usually when I get into this situation it's either some clip that needs to be popped open, or a screw, or just using more force (sometimes you need ridiculously strong fingernails to do it, or a special tool)
I broke a 64GB microSD by sticking it into a SD adapter and it got stuck and I tried using pliers to remove it and it wouldn't come out, so I physically cracked the chip in half
since it was my fault I had to eat the cost :/
I got a spudger from iFixIt, but I feel like I'm going to break the clips at the top off with it
there's my "more force" story
17:40
@Luke The cover over the USB slots and such?
I was working on one of those recently
The solution was, indeed, more force
But I remember checking the manual beforehand. Because I wanted to check if the thing I was pulling on is even supposed to come off :D
FYI guys, I notice that the volume of new questions being asked is accelerating in the wake of people ordering things for Black Friday / Cyber Monday and trying them out and hitting issues. This may actually be as big as the Windows 8 deluge. If everyone (self included, hrhr) can spend a little more time answering 0-answer questions, I think it'd be hugely helpful this week.
17:59
ubuntu downloaded 2536 packages today :D
and it's installing it for the past two hours
dist-upgrade?
18:12
yeah
19:04
What the heck a blog post of mine landed on Reddit
That's awkward
19:27
@OliverSalzburg Got it,then lots of customers came in
Extra force necessary
@Luke Nice :)
19:56
@allquixotic I ordered a BFL Jalapeno, for the faster hash rate. Out of curiosity more than anything. These asics may never see the light of day though.
@Paul how do you know they won't keep your money if they never ship though? :S
Jesus. 1500 GH/s for the mini rig...
wonder how long it'd take to recoup $30k investment at 1500 GH/s
@allquixotic There is nothing about bitcoin that doesn't entail some risk, it is an experiment. So I figure it like any other investment - you only put in what you are prepared to lose, hence the jalapeno, the lowest cost asic they had.
I get 0.5 GH/s on my radeon, so 3000 times more bitcoins, in the time it takes to generate 0.22 BTC, I could have 660 BTC
what's a typical value of a BTC in an exchange pre-split?
is it more than a dollar?
@allquixotic I see the problem as being the asic take up will increase pretty fast, as the overall hash rate increases, the difficulty goes up, and finding blocks takes longer. Only those that get in at the start will get any rewards, and fairly soon, GPU mining will be a thing of the past
A BTC is around $12 at the moment I think
dang
so by running that $30k BFL miner for approximately 80 hours you could make $7920... it'd pay for itself in a couple weeks running 24/7
20:03
Does that include cost of power used?
even if it were $3 per bitcoin I could still use that to churn through its upfront cost in like 3 months
@Hennes nope, and I guarantee a $30,000 miner is going to draw a ton of electricity... this is profitable for people who have a wind farm in their backyard or something
and no, you may not take my get rich quick scheme and use it yourself :P
step 1: buy lots of land in a windy part of the united states and wind turbines
Or who can pLug it in in the server room at work.
step 2: buy as many $30k BFL miners as you can
step 3: ???
step 4: profit!
@allquixotic Only at current difficulty and reward. The halving will happen before any of these ship, so halve your rewards, and the difficulty will go up as soon as these hit the market, so bitcoins will take longer to mine
@Paul what's the point of it, anyway? what actual useful work is being done by calculating these hashes?
20:07
@allquixotic It is the same as mining any precious metal that doesn't have a secondary purpose - the mining is just for the value of the thing mined
i guess you could ask the same about stock market derivatives investors, and we have a huge industry around those
@allquixotic I don't know if you have gotten your head around the bitcoin algorithm yet (it took me a while) but it is designed so that a new block take a certain amount of time for the network to mine. So if there is greater computational power in the network, the 'difficulty' goes up until the amount of time to create a block gets back to the right amount of time
@Paul does this mean I can give bitcoins to someone as a wedding gift, to ask them to marry me? :D
@allquixotic Heh, it is no more arbitrary than a metal torus :)
20:25
@Paul isn't it finite though?
@soandos A ring?
@Paul bitcoins
What a great conversation to come back to
Marrying for bitcoins... <3
@soandos There is a finite amount of units of whole bitcoin - 21 million, but a bitcoin is effectively endlessly divisible. Currently to 8 decimal places, so you could argue that a single bitcoin represents 10,000,000 units of currency
You have to think slightly differently with btc
I read a paper about it from an economic perspective
Its one of the the only currencies where inflation is totally predicatable
20:34
Lets say the US dollar suddenly became worth 1000x its current value - people would just deal in microdollars
generally speaking you change the currency at that point (see zimbabwe)
@soandos You would for a normal currency, but btc is designed from the outset to work fractionally
How do you avoid currency manipulators?
@soandos How do you mean?
What prevents someone from taking bitcoin into or out of circulation, thereby dramatically increasing or decreasing its value?
(like soros did to the bank of london)
20:38
@soandos Most bitcoins are out of circulation - there aren't many markets available to buy or sell using btc
also, deflation is generally considered a bad thing
@Paul doesn't that lead to problems?
@soandos There are so many threads at bitcointalk that discuss the pros and cons of a deflationary currency, most conclude "meh"
Is that because it is only a secondary currency?
@soandos It depends - btc isn't like other currencies, so I think it isn't possible to say right now what the inherent problems are, or at least, it is out of my scope to be able to comment on them :)
I think I should continue along the path of treating it primarily as a means of heating my room... Watts in, BTC+BTU out... weirdest chemical/thermodynamic reaction in the universe (so far)
they never taught me that you can convert watts into BTC and BTU in high school
but that means i can't run it during the summer when it's actually going to increase my A/C bill by using it
20:45
@soandos I really don't know, my assumption is that if you have an endlessly divisible currency then having a circulation cap is less important than with other currencies. And also that as btc is not tied to any state, the impact of its value decreasing doesn't impact the economics of any state versus any other. In that regard, you could describe it as a primary currency - like gold, and all others are secondary currencies
21:21
stupid steam: http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2716465
no way to throttle it's download speed
can anyone tell me other usecases for Netlimiter ( netlimiter.com ). Need more motivation to install it
hmm, Traffic Statistic/Charts might be fun
damn it; now I'm tempted to buy a 30$ app that I don't actually need
I want a way to increase steam download speed. Not throttle it
Usually it stops near 8 or 9MB/sec
@klyonrad Heh, I usually have the opposite problem, where it goes far too slowly.
It's always maxing out my 1,2 MB/s
and obviously an user can't make the download faster without hacking into Valve's servers :P
complaining about 9 MB/s being too slow shakes head
Thank you for buying total war. Estimated download time at 9MB/sec...24H ours
Speaking of which, I want a single core XXXX GHz CPU for this game
Starting it takes 2-3 minutes, one a modern desktop (I7 920, 18GB RAM, 400plus MB/sec read from HW RAID), ....
Apparently it is bloody inefficients, CPU bound and utterly single treaded.
22:16
anybody knows how to convert Virtual Box virtual OS files into vmWare Player files?
i have 2 vmdk files
and should get something like vmx
Uhm
vmx is the file that I open in vmWare PLayer
ISn't vmdk a VMware DisK already ?
vmx is the virtual machine configuration file
22:18
Please... It's VMware
the vmware disks are .vmdk
but there are 2 virtual OSs in my PC
One is played in vmWare PLayer
and the second one in Virtual Box
One looks like this:
and the other one looks like that:
^ is the solution
.vbox vs .vmx ?
i am gonna try it
22:59
if I boot off a clonezilla cd, which might look at a hard drive on some level, is it OK to just power off? or do I have to unmount anything?
get chuck norris to take a leak over it
23:20
I hate it when I'm asked by the boss to do something and then he has someone else do it in another, technically-inferior way and takes their solution over mine without ever mentioning to me that what i was asked to work on i wasn't expected to actually finish
Let livid = True
i need a 50 point bounty awarded to me so i can have 6,666 rep... and screenshot it and put it in my profile or something
or 5 upvotes
@barlop If you did not mount it, just power it off. If you manually or auto mounted it RW then it is cleaner to shut down correclty
How do I used bold in a comment?
Hmm ... so it is 8 bytes wide. I thought it was 4 bytes wide. Because you have main incrementing from 16 to 16. Are you sure? — Alkerak 4 mins ago
If I try 123455**6**789 then that does not work
23:39
@allquixotic That's why I left my last IT job
On speakerphone, she asked another IT guy she "knew"
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