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00:00 - 18:0018:00 - 00:00

Bob
Bob
18:00
find a bingo board
buzzword bingo is fun
lol
@bwDraco I'm unsure exactly what you're hoping we'll provide
DevOps is a way of working, not something you can just 'learn'
but it's also not something you need to fire up vm's and do stuff
But I feel like I won't understand everything Docker has to offer without adequate experience developing apps. Should I work on JS or other programming languages first?
hmmmm
docker is just a container tech
it runs containers
set yourself an aim
learn what you need to, to get to that target
I know the two can go together, but I wonder if I should learn JS first.
Also installed Kubernetes on the VM.
So... how much Docker should I learn before I should declare "basic experience with Docker" on my resume?
enough to fire up vm's
possibly scriptg the whole process
/me shrugs
18:07
I don't want to put anything on my resume I cannot work with on at least a basic level.
yeah, makes sense
@bwDraco sometimes you need to let the technologies find you, instead of you trying to find technologies
I got started by:
1. using open source software
2. encountering problems
3. diagnosing, complaining about, and eventually fixing those problems
and after doing that a few times you become proficient in something, and it's literally equivalent to work experience
Hmm...
18:14
I'm an expert on Gentoo
the tech you end up working on will depend on what software you use and what breaks
never used it in a work env tho
I've filed bug reports against Firefox a couple of times.
@bwDraco that's a start; now fix them
18:15
:)
find the wiki article on how to clone mozilla central, then google your arse off about C++ until you figure it out
then submit a patch, get your patch torn to shreds, make it better, iterate, learn
god, i woudln't want to even try and look at something as huge as firefox.
I guess it helps if you start on something smaller... you're a photographer, right? GIMP isn't small but it's not as big as firefox either
learn GIMP, use GIMP, contribute to GIMP, learn organically as you go
write scripts to do stuff in gimp faster,
the nrealise you want to write a web gallery
then realise you want to host it yourself
then realise you needed to learn source control earlier
get an IRC bouncer so you're on IRC 24/7 so you can read messages people reply to you at 3 AM because you'll be working with a lot of people in Europe
18:17
amen.
@CanadianLuke or use cloudflare :D
@CanadianLuke then realise you don't, but it's kinda fun to work out how to do it, as a proof of concept
SE's original implementation of cloudflare was Amature-scale Low Availability
if anyone remembers the cloudflare woes
I do...
I use Cloudflare, but I host a much smaller-scale site than SE :P
That's starting to emulate a true job environment in a non-work setting. This isn't job experience. It doesn't provide any provable evidence of ability.
18:19
evidence comes when you work
if you're crap, they let you go.
all evidence is fakeable
Hence, one of my goals was to use the knowledge to answer questions on Stack Overflow and Server Fault, which is evidence of ability.
you want evidence? get your patches on linux.org
@bwDraco no employer cares
And build lab environments, burn them down and recreate them
about your so or sf rep.
@bwDraco sure it does; link to your patches, bug reports, and repositories
18:19
Show that you know computer stuff even outside of your job
they care if in an interview you can tell em
how you built your own home lab
If you create awesome scripts, post them on Github
I got my networking job, because i described how i designed and built my own gentoo router.
Every home lab is different
they haven't Seen my router
18:20
yeah, I've interviewed some lately and I can tell you they definitely care about your hobby experience
I need additional hardware for that. I cannot simply work on VMs for a home lab.
they've not even seen my github
you can
hahah
@bwDraco You'd be surprised how much RAM you can spare for VMs ;)
you really really can
especially with a 4k machine.
i learnt gentoo on a 166
On my laptop, I hosted 4 Server 2016's, and 2 Win 10's, all running on its own network
18:21
I thought you need bare metal to do this stuff?
it took 3 weeks to bootstrap
Nah
One or two bare-metal
I've successfully installed Gentoo on Hyper-V a few years back FWIW.
run it all in vmware.
But virtualize the sh-it out of it
18:21
i.e. virtualbox, if you can't do anything more
Learn either Xen/KVM (Linux) or Hyper-V (Microsoft)
virtualbox wil happily do virtual switching and stuff
Even an Intel Core i3 can virtualize!
@bwDraco you can have my spare server - I have a dedi in Atlanta I'm renting for $200/year with 2 x L5630 (Westmere), 24 GB of RAM and 2 x 500 GB HDD with Ubuntu 18.04 currently installed on it... I tried to use it as a Codenvy / Eclipse Che environment but repl.it turned out to be better anyway so I'm just using that
I've done Client Hyper-V before and have run class projects using Hyper-V vSwitches.
18:22
so until the server expires (at which point I'll reevaluate) you can just have my server
there you go! ^^
I think it expires around April 2 or something, not sure exactly
(2019)
go wild
Once you feel you know the GUI way of Hyper-V, start diagramming it
Then, learn Powershell!
Feb 28 '14 at 2:57, by DragonLord
...and now I need to run several Hyper-V virtual machines (at least two at the same time) as part of a "virtual hacking lab"
18:23
it has EPT, so VMs should at least be alright
script firing up machines
and tearing em down
if you wanna do web stuff, make a web ui that controls it all
now find someone on here who has an academic Dreamspark account and can get you a free Windows license, if that's what you want, and I'll give you the login details to the KVM-over-IP (HP iLO2) so you can install Windows
pinging Rahul :P
I scripted my DC environment... One script creates the 4 VMs using my Server ISO, assigns static MAC addresses, reboots them to get a pre-assigned IP, then it connects to them and adds the features I need
actually, pinging SathyaNadellaWho'sTotallyTheMSCeo
I will see what I can do with the hardware on hand. If required, I might build a basic desktop around a Core i5 and H370 board. If not, I'll just let the Demon handle it. Why put eight cores, 2.5 TB of flash, and 32 GB of memory to waste?
18:25
That's plenty
I can also learn ZFS this way, too.
Honestly, just learn how to install the hypervisor of your choice, then build up guests
I already have VirtualBox running with an openSUSE instance for Docker.
Then learn how they can break, or be made highly-available. For example, on KVM, we setup shared network storage between two physical hosts (using drdb), set the virtual hard drives up on the shared storage, and we can migrate the VMs LIVE without any downtime
Would need more bare metal for that.
18:29
Even a basic machine that you pickup second hand would work, if it's only for testing
I guess I should focus on Docker and JS first.
Once you go through the motions, it's easier to replicate on higher scale
Hmm... KVM seems to need the hardware-assisted features.
Try to steer clear of VBox once you understand how hypervisors work... It's a Type-2 Hyeprvisor, so it impacts performance at a larger scale
18:33
I've oddly had lots of problems with Hyper-V in the past. I wonder if they've been fixed in newer versions of Windows...
Alternatively... should I just spend the money on VMware Workstation Pro?
If you can, learn Hyper-V or Xen/KVM
Gotta run, brb
Also, many nested virtualization implementations rely on Intel-specific instructions, which means a new build will almost certainly be required.
(hmm... VMware Workstation supports nested virtualization on AMD hardware.)
> Virtualized HV is fully supported for virtual hardware version 9 or later VMs on hosts that support Intel VT-x and EPT or AMD-V and RVI. To enable virtualized HV, select VM->Settings and navigate to the processor settings screen. Check the box next to "Virtualize Intel VT-x/EPT or AMD-V/RVI."
AMD-V, including RVI (aka nested paging or second-level address translation), is supported on all Ryzen processors.
At least Docker does not require hardware-assisted virtualization under Linux.
(and Docker runs on my Linode servers, which do not support nested virtualization)
18:57
@bwDraco It might be a good idea to take a small amount of time at some point to email or call your local representatives in NY to voice support for the repair bill, especially if they are opposed to it currently
(see my above YT vid link)
You don't have to become a crusader, but 30 minutes to call them or email them will help
19:15
My current computer dates from the summer of 2013 (around 5 years ago).
Have processors become significantly faster since then? Or not?
@FaheemMitha if you got a new computer with the latest Intel CPU available in "summer 2013" it'd be either an Ivy Bridge (originally released in 2012 and stretched into 2013) or Haswell (originally released in Q2 2013 but many chips didn't land in products you could buy until late 2013, early 2014)
for reference, the following Intel chip generations that you can buy today are newer than Haswell: Broadwell, Skylake, Kaby Lake, Coffee Lake
@allquixotic I got an AMD.
@FaheemMitha AMD CPUs in particular have improved massively since 2013 - they've caught up to Intel a lot
AMD Socket 942, it is.
Not that that means much to me.
Intel has improved around 25-50% since 2013 (with cumulative small changes in the 5 to 10% range per generation); AMD has improved way more with their 2017 Zen architecture
but as to your original question, it depends on what you do with your computer
if you just use the web, you probably won't notice any difference
19:22
@allquixotic Once I used to do numerical/statistical computation. One day, I may do so again.
So I suppose I was thinking number-crunching.
@FaheemMitha at what scale? are we talking about using Excel to compute a few thousand numbers with addition and multiplication etc, or are we talking about big data or scientific computing type workloads?
@allquixotic The latter. I worked a bit with bioinformatics data sets.
Like processing several hundred million rows of data at once.
Which is actually quite a modest size these days.
@FaheemMitha oh... well, if it's just once-off computations, you can probably more economically spin up one or multiple AWS EC2 spot instances, which you can rent a lot of for an hour for a couple dollars USD, and do ridiculously complicated computation on dozens of CPU cores (esp. if you can distribute it across multiple boxes)
if you'll be doing it often, it's probably good to own the hardware, but if the time to compute is measured in days, cutting down your execution time by 50% could mean the difference between 3 days and 6 days, so you'll want to go with high-end I/O, lots of memory and a high-end CPU
@allquixotic I agree. I was just wondering how much number crunching has improved since 2013.
basically if the computation takes a few seconds/minutes or 1-2 hours with your current hardware, it's probably not a huge benefit to upgrade, but if it takes days and days or longer, incremental CPU improvements are a massive win
19:28
I had got the impression that conventional processors had been approaching their limits for some time. Hence all the multiple cores thing.
also, being able to distribute your workload across multiple machines and using every core on each machine will cut down your computation time a lot
if it's necessarily 100% single-threaded, a single i7-8700K will give you the best perf we can get today (and of course get a fast SSD to minimize the time spent in I/O)
but yeah, we haven't seen 10x gains in CPU performance since 2013... even AMD has only done maybe a 2-3x improvement, which just caught them up to Intel, but didn't exactly pull them ahead
@allquixotic 2-3x isn't bad.
19:54
> - Windows 10: Driver may get removed after PC has been left idle for an extended period of time.
what code could they possibly have in their wonky, overly complex driver stack that would uninstall your current driver when the machine is idle?!
@allquixotic You call that "embarrassingly terrible"? What about that time their driver would, IIRC, fry the video hardware? What do you call that?
20:30
I would recall the rm -rf / usr/ driver, but that wasn't actually nvidia D:
@djsmiley2k It was Steam.
Gamer conspiracy confirmed: the gaming industry wants you to buy more hardware.
oh man, I've been waiting for my Otterbox %%PRODUCT_TITLE%% for years!
!! s/years/%%years%%/
@ThatBrazilianGuy oh man, I've been waiting for my Otterbox %%PRODUCT_TITLE%% for %%years%%! (source)
20:54
@ThatBrazilianGuy naah
bumblebee nvidia driver on linux did it first
21:07
huium de dum
No ones summoning me in bloodbourne :<
 
2 hours later…
22:55
I have a question
You know how with default settings Windows turns off USB ports when your device goes to sleep to save power?
So, for example, an MP3 player you have plugged in will stop charging when your laptop goes to sleep?
But then, when I click my USB mouse or press a key on my USB keyboard, the device wakes up
How, if the USB ports were powered off, does Windows detect this action?
Hey guys, can you flag this answer? https://superuser.com/a/1319910/880618
Also, his nickname is inappropriate, is there a way to flag the user ifself?
Does is exclusively not power off ports with input devices plugged in?
@rahuldottech hey, you can ask that question on Superuser itself, not here
@TiagoCaldeira Actually, I was hoping to discuss this with one of the regulars
Also, flagged the post
Pinging @JourneymanGeek for the username issue
@rahuldottech Thanks. It seems no one else is here so you could ask that on Superuser, not only it will help you but it can help other users as well
23:02
@TiagoCaldeira I know the rules, I'm a regular :)
Also, I found the answer, apparently Device Manager has an option for allow this device to wake the computer for input devices, which makes total sense
Oh, didn't check your profile before ;) well, that's alright then.
Nice to hear!
I'll probably post a Q&A tomorrow
@TiagoCaldeira no problems :)
I have to update my age on my profile
@TiagoCaldeira hey, you're in 12th grade too!
@rahuldottech yeah, 18y
@TiagoCaldeira I just turned 17 a couple of days ago
Where do you live?
@rahuldottech In Portugal
23:07
@TiagoCaldeira naice
Is there a room for visual studio somewhere?
@TiagoCaldeira eh, next time don't respond to trolls
I've taken care of the user
Is this even the right site for visual studio issues? Or is that serverfault?
23:32
SU or SO might work depending
but we don't really have a room for that AFAIK
grr confusing docs are confusing
@JourneymanGeek tell me if you think I should move it
I think that's definately out of place there
but I don't code so I donno if that's a question for SO
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