Root Access

rahuldottech

14:00

@djsmiley2k yes you can

djsmiley2k

:OO

that's the answer then -_-

rahuldottech

@Luttinger also check out the /wait switch for start

Luttinger

@rahuldottech I tried that before. It only allows me to execute other commands in the same terminal. But after closing the terminal, everything run is killed

@rahuldottech haven't tried this

djsmiley2k

I wonder if the SSH server itself is killing everything

rahuldottech

@Luttinger start should open run.bat in a new window, which should keep running even if you close the original window...

djsmiley2k

14:05

@rahuldottech note, that disconnecting from the server may be recieved as a 'logoff' event ?

i.e. killing/pausing all command prompts, etc

Luttinger

I log into my account using the SSH client (I mean, if you look at the monitor of the remote machine, no one is apparently logged on)

Maybe it logs off the user?

But I used to do this on Linux, using sbatch XXXX.job

It's a simulation that can take days to finish

djsmiley2k

@Luttinger yup exactly.

that's what I think is happening.

I don't think ssh is what you want really

Luttinger

But when I just close the terminal (but not disconnect the SSH, or close the FTP window), same thing happens again.

I can open another terminal immediately (but that process is killed)

@djsmiley2k What are my alternatives then? :/

rahuldottech

@Luttinger idk if you're as crazy as me

But if you can run a webserver on said remote PC... You could create a simple web-based control system

Or... Since it's windows

Use this thing I made

rahul.tech/page/updatrr

It listens for when commands are updated on a remote webserver and fetches and runs them when they are

Luttinger

@rahuldottech well, I used to be when I was a little younger (high school, undergrad), but these days (grad school) I usually just want to finish my tasks with minimal headache

Boris_yo

14:20

@ThatBrazilianGuy Do you find this to be true?

Luttinger

Does newer versions of Windows (I use Win 7) support SSH natively?

Burgi

no

Luttinger

:(

Screw Windows

Burgi

just use putty

Luttinger

Is it a SSH server or client?

Burgi

14:27

client

Luttinger

I want to connect to a windows machine

Burgi

RDC

Luttinger

that's graphical, right?

Burgi

yeah

Luttinger

I want command line access

So that multiple users can simultaneously connect and run their processes on their own user accounts

Burgi

14:29

right... that can happen on windows

its called terminal services

Luttinger

@Burgi How can I execute a process remotely then?

Bob

@Luttinger 10 does

Burgi

powershell!

Bob

but there's third party ssh servers for older versions

Luttinger

@Bob ♥‿♥

Bob

14:31

powershell remoting is the more standard way

native ssh is a fairly new thing

Luttinger

@Burgi Please explain!!

@Bob ^

ToxicFrog

@Bob wait, win10 comes with an sshd?

Burgi

@Bob is it in WSFL?

Bob

@ToxicFrog it's ... complicated

@Luttinger powershell remoting has nothing to do with ssh, but it's the better-supported remote shell in windows

it should work in 7 too

the current version of windows 10 has two 'native' forms of ssh support

one is the linux sshd via WSL (cc @Burgi)

the other is a lightweight sshd that has something to do with device discovery and is more or less a dev tool (cc @ToxicFrog)

the third one, that we're still waiting for, is openssh native on windows, i.e. not via the WSL layer

well, I say "waiting" but more accurately it's pretty much usable now, I think

it's not 'built in' but it's MS-developed

much like you still need to install openssh-server on some linux distros :P

Journeyman Geek

and forked from... er nomachine's openssh port?

and that's pretty mature

ToxicFrog

14:39

Aah

Perhaps I will just continue using cygwin-opensshd for now

Bob

eh, I'd take WSL over cygwin

never liked cygwin much

but for a long-running service like sshd, WSL isn't really suitable yet

ToxicFrog

Cygwin has the significant advantage of already being installed

Bob

it has the disadvantage of a fairly unclean uninstaller :P

maybe it's gotten better in recent years

I remember it touching a fair bit more than necessary when I last used it

ToxicFrog

I have no idea, I don't think I've ever uninstalled it

vin

I am handcoding files in notepad to learn about pdf. I currently use Sumatra and Adobe Reader X and have had conflicting result so far. Testing with empty pages, Sumatra manages to correct wrong file structure but Adobe complains, however it fails to display simple text when Adobe, Firefox and Chrome all do without any complaints.

Bob

14:41

:41070612 depends which "standard" you're looking at

Luttinger

It says I have to first enable powershell remoting by opening powershell as admin and then using `Enable-PSRemoting -Force`.
All I have access to now is an (admin) terminal window, using an SSH client. How should I do that?

Bob

your best bet is something like PDF/A

ToxicFrog

I can easily believe that the installer is a mess, but it's generally the first thing I install after drivers when setting up windows and I've never had cause to uninstall it, so.

Bob

@Luttinger powershell start -verb runas powershell should get you an elevated powershell ... well, assuming your ssh client deals with UAC properly

oh wait you have an elevated cmd already?

just run powershell to get into powershell and you can enable remoting from there

@ToxicFrog way back when it used ot toggle ntfs settings, iirc, to allow case-sensitive filenames. dunno if it still does.

that makes some other windows programs unhappy :P

@vin run acrobat reader in PDF/A viewing mode

@vin or, a test suite en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PDF/A#Validation

Burgi

is <address> an inline element?

ToxicFrog

14:46

@Bob I've been using it since 2003 or so and never had that issue. I didn't even realize that was a setting you could change.

vin

@Bob Hi Bob, thanks. I am not sure why the original message was posted to you automatically. I intended it as a general room message.

Bob

@ToxicFrog maybe I'm misremembering ... but it's described cygwin.com/cygwin-ug-net/using-specialnames.html in the "Case sensitive filenames" bit

@ToxicFrog also IIRC cygwin relies on a bit of hackery to get fork working on top of Win32's CreateProcess... WSL uses a more direct approach with new picoprocesses on the kernel :P

what cygwin does works, it's just ... not very performant

but otoh WSL is new and probably not quite as stable yet :P

ToxicFrog

Oh, yeah, cygwin fork/exec is terrifying

But WSL didn't even exist when I set up this machine, so

Bob

lol

Luttinger

@Bob It requires the network connection type to be private (it's public now)

Bob

14:53

terrifying is one way to describe it

Luttinger

What is the difference? Can I just change it?

ToxicFrog

And yeah, looking at that page, they show you how to change that setting yourself but don't do it automatically, and I've never bothered.

Bob

@Luttinger blogs.technet.microsoft.com/heyscriptingguy/2013/11/13/…

ToxicFrog

I figure by the time I'm next setting up a windows machine, WSL will be mature enough that it'll be easier to run sshd in that than to install cygwin.

Bob

but it probably won't work because I think the default firewall rules that allow WinRM are only on the private profile

Luttinger

14:54

@Bob Yeah but it says it's a security risk

Bob

@Luttinger different firewall rulesets, private implies you trust other devices on the local network, things like file sharing etc are more relaxed/allowed, etc. howtogeek.com/245982/…

@Luttinger only you can decide if the network you are connected to should be considered public or private

Luttinger

It's the university network. I think It's OK

Bob

@ToxicFrog yeaaaaa... there's still the whole persistent service thing they need to sort out

@Luttinger I would generally consider a uni network to be public

never know what kinds of malware-infested crap other people bring on the network

ToxicFrog

Same

Luttinger

@Bob Yeah but what other choice I've got? :/ I need to execute my commands

Bob

14:59

*shrug*

Luttinger

Seriously, it seems like that Technology still hasn't solved my problem above

Bob

there's probably a way

but I'm also probably not going to look for it tonight

maybe tomorrow

@Luttinger try asking Bitvise (that's the SSH server you're using, no?)

otherwise you can enable winrm against advice

or you can set up a vpn and safely enable winrm through there

Luttinger

@Bob You mean contact them?

Bob

sure, why not

Burgi

i wished you lived closer @Bob, then i could bug you about C#

Luttinger

15:01

@Bob I already use a VPN to connect to the university's network. Do you mean setup another VPN on that machine to connect?

Bob

@Burgi ha, C# is one thing I'm happy to be bugged about. idk if I'll be much help though

@Luttinger docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/scripting/setup/…

basically: you can go ahead and use the option to enable remoting on a public network but it'll only work if your client is on the same subnet unless you also broaden the firewall rule which leaves you a bit more exposed (but probably not much more than a password-auth ssh server)

Luttinger

@Bob Hm, when it still needs a password to connect, Why would I worry more than when the SSH is enabled on port 22?

Burgi

@Bob you might regret that.. ;)

djsmiley2k

@Luttinger that ssh client states it supports graphical access as well, see if you can use that some how.

the 'proper' way to do it is via a service, i think

Bob

@Luttinger because generally I tell people to use pubkey auth with ssh, not password auth

if you do use password auth, you need to make sure your password is nice and long

djsmiley2k

15:08

plz don't rely on password auth alone

use a firewall of sensible persussassion

3 or 4 more 'dead' cables removed from that nest of snakes :/

Luttinger

Well, my password (for this) is a single 6 char long word, in top 3k most used words in longman dictionary :)

Bob

...that's horrifying

Burgi

@Luttinger is it superman?

wait thats not 6...

Luttinger

No :)

Burgi

you know you have told the entire internet your password right?

Luttinger

15:12

Only if they can connect to my local network...

Burgi

does your local network connect to the internet?

Luttinger

BTW, my other passwords are all longer than 15 characters and contains lowercase, uppercase, numbers and other symbols

@Burgi yes

djsmiley2k

lol

your password is like nothing compared to a key

Found 87151 6-letter words

would take like a few minutes.

Burgi

@djsmiley2k sort by usage and limit to the top 3000

djsmiley2k

depending if you've got rate limiting

@Burgi why bother?

Luttinger

15:16

Another question (about keys): yesterday I tried to generate a GPG key pair (again, on windows). But after a few hours it didn't finish! and I gave up

Burgi

it'll be quicker

Bob

@djsmiley2k the biggest difference is that a key is never transmitted

though WinRM actually kinda does that right (NTLM auth never transmits the password either)

djsmiley2k

121 hours at 5 second intervals

3 weeks

Luttinger

@Burgi Are you trying to guess my password?! I intentionally chose a simple one to tell it to other lab members if I wasn't around and they needed access!

djsmiley2k

....

/me cries

Bob

15:17

/me continues being horrified

djsmiley2k

I mean, I know there's situations where that's required at a moments notice because !!EMERGENCY!! but otherwise dear god make it stop.

ChatBot John Cavil

HAMMERTIME!

Burgi

@Luttinger complex password written on a postit note on the PC screen in the lab

lets move on before you kill @Bob

@Bob in our terrible umbraco site we have a masterpage that has a codebehind page. and in that we have C# code that is generating html. i want to move the HTML into the masterpage but i don't know how...

example method:

void mapOutput(List<StockistListItem> stockists, System.Web.UI.HtmlControls.HtmlGenericControl list, int resultlimit = 5)
{
    for (int i = 0; i < resultlimit; i++)
    {
        list.InnerHtml += "<div id='item-" + stockists[i].Id + "' class='list'><div class='details'>";
        list.InnerHtml += "<span class='name'>" + stockists[i].CompanyName + "</span>";
        list.InnerHtml += "<ul>";
        list.InnerHtml += "<li>" + stockists[i].Postcode + "</li>";
        list.InnerHtml += "</ul>";

Bob

that's also horrifying

Burgi

i know but i'm atleast trying to fix it

Bob

15:20

tbh I've not done much with ASP.NET

Luttinger

In my undergrad school, I personally tried 123456 as password for the faculty members university emails. It worked for 6 or 7 emails.

Burgi

flails

dude seriously...

this is a public chatroom, don't admit to hacking

Luttinger

I did it because they limited our internet connection speed (compared to grad students and professors). It was kinda like the prohibition era

Bob

@Burgi I believe a custom control might be the correct way to handle this ..?

Burgi

@Luttinger if your university found out you had accessed faculty emails without authorisation they would cancel your degree and throw you to the police

FML

15:23

@Burgi Trying "123456" as a password is hardly hacking... its like walking up to a PC and wiggling the mouse about to see if it's logged in or not

I mean it's still unauthorized access but lulz

Burgi

its still not done

Luttinger

@Burgi They didn't. and I graduated 3 years ago :)

Burgi

they can retroactively nullify your degree

FML

Unless you're famous that wouldn't achieve much

Burgi

@FML he could have had access to exams or amend results

FML

15:25

@Burgi So ~~could~~ did I

Burgi

but not as a student

exam fraud is very serious

FML

One of the benefits of having a staff account as a student...

Bob

@Burgi I wonder if Umbraco has their own way of doing it. Cause with raw WebForms you're more or less left with embedding the code expressions in the aspx file.

Luttinger

@Burgi Why would they do this? I just used their account credentials to connect to the Internet. And I just tried 123456, not other more complicated combinations so it was their fault

FML

A member of staff having sufficient access to view or amend exam data using "123456" as a password is very serious as well

Bob

15:27

like <% for (;;) { %>

Burgi

@FML agreed

FML

Potentially sackable negligence in fact, if it were actually possible (we enforced minimum password complexity rules)

Burgi

@Bob i was looking at something like that

Bob

@Burgi The better way would be similar to JSTL (vs raw JSP) using a view engine like Spark github.com/SparkViewEngine/spark

e.g. stackoverflow.com/a/1107920/1030702

but if you can't do that you're basically left with

Burgi

@Bob its only got to last 2 months (new site is being built in december)

FML

15:28

When I was a student I had a staff account that let me access and view all non-"top secret" details on all other staff and students, as well as login as and reset passwords for anybody's account

Burgi

@Luttinger because you could have cheated

FML

It's entirely a matter of trust

2

And the human is always the weakest link in the security chain...

3

Burgi

regardless you never admit to doing stuff like that on a public chatroom

2

FML

I'd never do anything bad myself with my privileged access but if someone were to drug me and hit me with a $5 wrench ... :-|

Burgi

agreed

duress is a valid defence

Bob

15:32

@Burgi vaguely like this

<% for (int i = 0; i < resultlimit; i++)
{ %>
    <div id="item-<%=stockists[i].Id%>" class=list">
        <div class="details">
            <span class="name"><%=stockists[i].CompanyName%></span>
            <ul>
                <li><%=stockists[i].Postcode%></li>
            </ul>
        </div>
    </div>
<% } %>

maybe with an <% if () %> before it if it's not shown every time

@Burgi eh... if you're rewriting in 2 months anyway then there might not be much point in fixing this

Burgi

its a fair point

it just annoys the crap out of me

Bob

:P

@Burgi you can think of the built-in templating engine as vaguely like PHP

(or closer JSP)

FML

Is someone else's code annoying the crap out of you?

Bob

where it's output by default but you can execute C# in the middle of it

Luttinger

@FML Before coming up with the idea of brute-forcing faculty members accounts, I used a very simple keylogger as a firefoex add-on on some of the department's PCs (which was regularly used by grad students) and could get a couple of passwords there.

Burgi

15:35

@FML yeah but its technically my code now as i've had to bodge it to get it to work properly

Bob

@Burgi see also stackoverflow.com/questions/957284/whats-the-deal

now, there's better templating engines available

but that ends up being a fairly big change that you probably won't want

FML

@Burgi If you don't learn to not allow other people's code to annoy you very soon, you're going to end up with PTSD if you keep working in IT... :-|

@Luttinger :-|

Bob

@Burgi you know how in PHP you just chuck PHP in the middle of HTML with <?? same thing

Burgi

yeah

Bob

though using the code-behind (or separate code files entirely) is recommended for more code-heavy methods

the bits that go in the template should only be for view/rendering

Burgi

15:37

thats what i was researching but i can't work out how to get my method to function

Luttinger

@FML All these happened because their Internet connections were faster.

FML

@Bob Shrug. Except on mobile devices I prefer passwords

Bob

even then it's a fairly nasty mishmash... which is why Spark (see JSTL) exists

@Burgi that's cause in the template you're not working within a method anymore ... it's file-global

Burgi

@Luttinger you need to stop talking...

Bob

if it needs to only exist sometimes then you wrap it in an if

Luttinger

15:39

@Burgi OK sorry

Bob

you can also have a bool that controls whether the if is shown, and an event handler can toggle that bool

Burgi

@Bob i'll have a play about

@Luttinger for your own protection

Bob

@Burgi the code example above should more or less work

but idk, I don't actually have an ASP.NET environment right now :P

FML

We started in first year with proxied 100/100 connections so speed was never an issue

Burgi

cheers @Bob, add this favour to the list and i'll get you another beer or two if our paths ever cross

Bob

15:41

lol, nw

Burgi

i think i'm going to end up either killing @Bob with alcohol poisoning or going bankrupt with the bar bill

3

Bob

ha, would be better to avoid AU then

but yea, without knowing the rest of the code-behind it's kinda hard to say when that method is triggered or where those vars come from :P

that's more or less what you'll need to twiddle to get that working

@Burgi Totally unrelated, but ... have you used icon fonts? fontawesome, etc?

Burgi

its a snakey wiggly file, i've moved a lot of code into separate methods just to retain my sanity

@Bob yeah

FML

@Bob I tried!

Burgi

we used fontawesome

Bob

15:44

@Burgi you know how ie11 on higher security settings can block font downloads?

did you find a way to deal with that?

Burgi

and i've played with glyphicon in WP

Bob

we kinda discovered over the last week or so and it basically breaks our app :P

Burgi

huh...

we selfhosted fontawesome

Bob

yea, doesn't help

apparently even base64 encoding the file and embedding it as a data uri doesn't do anything useful

it just totally ignores the font-face declaration :S

oh well

Burgi

it wasn't a bug we ever came across, our userbase was primarily consumers on tablets

Bob

15:48

ah

that's a whole other kettle of fish :P

Burgi

can you get a sprite knocked up and use that for IE11?

djsmiley2k

@FML I work in networks....

I have access to ALL THE THINGS \o/

!!allthethings

ChatBot John Cavil

@djsmiley2k That didn't make much sense. Use the !!/help command to learn more.

djsmiley2k

so many missing :(

Bob

@Burgi we're looking at that as a fallback, but this is a SPA so it's all dynamically rendered with a lot of possible icons

oh well, it's early saturday morning and this is better left for next week :P

FML

15:51

@djsmiley2k All the things sent over the network in encrypted form?

Bob

speaking of early saturday morning...

'night

djsmiley2k

I used social engineering, accidently, to pass bits of my degree :/

@FML swap out the certs, (thanks sysadmin!) boom.

FML

@Bob Try to avoid nightmares of bad code and hacking

@djsmiley2k I had the certs

Bob

@FML don't worry I'll have nightmares of the wedding I'm apparently supposed to attend tomorrow

ihavenoideawhatimdoing

FML

@Bob Not yours I presume?

Bob

15:52

@FML as a guest

Burgi

@Bob best ~~man~~ fox?

FML

Turn up, talk to all the pretty ladies, bring a fluffy pet fox as a talking point.

Bob

@Burgi god no. normal guest. probably sit/stand around and don't make a scene

Burgi

are you taking a +1?

Bob

nup

FML

15:54

1 min ago, by FML

Turn up, talk to all the pretty ladies, bring a fluffy pet fox as a talking point.

I had access to all the electronic things, but a lot of things were still kept in paper form. Counselling records for example.

Burgi

get pissed, hit on the bridesmaids

FML

!!s/smaids/, never get invited to a wedding again/

ChatBot John Cavil

@FML get pissed, hit on the bride (source)

Bob

I think that falls under making a scene :P

ChatBot John Cavil

@FML get pissed, hit on the bride, never get invited to a wedding again (source)

FML

15:55

@Bob No!

Bring a fluffy fox friend = makes it a cuuuute scene

Everybody loves a cute scene

Burgi

hey it can't go any worse than the wedding i went to where my friend thought because we were drunk it meant we had to "shag"

FML

@Burgi I thought that's how things worked in newcaslte

Burgi

@FML this was in jersey

FML

Was he/she a geordie?

Burgi

jersey

djsmiley2k

15:57

@Luttinger that's ok, I stole next doors car because it was faster, and the other neighbours credit card, because their limit was higher!

Burgi

as in the island

FML

But he was from jersey?

Burgi

oh, no

she wasn't

FML

Most people take social customs with them from the area they're brought up. So you can take the weegie out of Glasgow but you can't take the stabbyness out of a weegie, for example.

Or the drunk shagging out of a geordie

Burgi

i wouldn't know

i was the perfect gentleman

i made her hot chocolate and listened to her tell me all about her ex and her daddy issues and crap

FML

15:59

Yeah I've never understood how rejecting women makes you a perfect gentleman, but meh

Oh ok

That would have just made me want to shag her more

Burgi

well it was the way that she burst into tears when she asked if we were going to have sex

2

Luttinger

@djsmiley2k No, I didn't steal anything from anyone. it was just like the prohibition era. They didn't grant us high speed internet access, we had to get it illegally.

The victims could still use their accounts.

Burgi

@Luttinger we didn't have prohibition in the UK

FML

These days I only seem able to hold conversations with smart independent women with law degrees and stable relationships with non-abusive partners.

djsmiley2k

lols

FML

16:04

Not easy to get them into drunk cheaty shagging

djsmiley2k

@Luttinger lol stealing, no

accessing 'illegally'? yes

FML

Lol @Bob

djsmiley2k

hmmm

journeymangeek is going to have a heart attack upon his return D:

I know it's friyay but jeez

FML

@djsmiley2k Depends, did Bob self-delete or get flagged?

Luttinger

@djsmiley2k If you look at it the right way, the problem was with what they called legal. It was their fault no mine

It was discrimination and I said no to it

FML

16:08

:-o

I'm sure I've had those before

djsmiley2k

for answers or questions?

or you one of these people who asks no questions?

Burgi

@Bob i missed your message, i was flirting with the new receptionist

Luttinger

@Burgi Is that enough motivation for you to get to 10k rep to see deleted messages?

Burgi

@Luttinger probably

FML

16:22

R.I.P Vine

►

@Burgi He said "Don't some people pay more for that?"

Burgi

@FML i wouldn't know :)

although knowing humanity, probably

there were some monkeys a couple of years ago that scientists had trained to pay for food with silver or copper washers

FML

Burgi

while the experiment was running they found out the monkeys had invented prostitution, banking and food delivery monkeys

Luttinger

@Burgi It took humans thousands of years to invent these

Burgi

it took two weeks for resus monkeys to invent them

@Luttinger zmescience.com/research/…

FML

16:40

I'm sure humans invented prostitution before they were legally humans

Luttinger

prostitution, maybe. But banking and food delivery, not sure it took anything less than a couple of hundred years after money was first invented

I get this error on Powershell on the remote machine: Get-NetConnectionProfile is not recognized as the name of a cmdlet.....

Burgi

the monkeys would pay other monkeys to go fetch food for them

its not like they were using mobile apps to order pizza or anything

Luttinger

@Burgi lol

I'm trying to make the network type Private but the command Get-NetConnectionProfile is not found. WTH is wrong with powershell?!

Ben N

What Windows version are you on?

FML

djsmiley2k

16:54

@Burgi did you see the story about the escort who shot a guy in the head... twice... because he was terrible in bed?.

@FML vomiting poop plz

FML

@djsmiley2k Monkeys have guns?

djsmiley2k

@FML lol

they can do yes

If dogs can have mods, monkeys can have guns

google.co.uk/…

Monkey firing gun

Luttinger

@BenN Win 7

Ben N

Yeah, I think that cmdlet was introduced in Windows 10

FML

> “[The other tamarins] would just go nuts,” Chen recalls when she was introduced with all the other. ”They’d throw their feces at the wall, walk into the corner and sit on their hands, kind of sulk.”

Ben N

16:59

Oh, Windows 8, my bad

Luttinger

@BenN Is there any other way I can change the network type using command line? People sure had to change the network type sometimes before Win 10 was released

Ben N

I suspect netsh has a thing for this

bwDraco

Hmm. The system seems to be at least minimally stable at 3.95 GHz at voltages as low as 1.3625V.

That is odd, especially because it failed Prime95 at 4.00 GHz with a much higher 1.4125V.

(though only under extended test)

I'm going to try to validate for 1.3625V, and if successful after 6-8 hours, will accept it with a slightly higher voltage (to ensure stability) for day-to-day use.

1.375V is pretty safe for Ryzen especially under liquid cooling.

I'd prefer to stay within 1.4V.

(voltage adjustments work in 1/160th volt increments)

Any overclocking gurus here?

One thing I like about Ryzen is that the multiplier can be adjusted in 0.25x increments.

djsmiley2k

18:13

network 'type' ?

public, private, work ?

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