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14:02
I have one USB 2.0 and one USB 3.0; I was able to narrow down some of my problems to the fact that my USB 2.0 mouse totally flips out when it's connected to a USB 3.0 controller with other USB 3.0 devices, so I have the USB 2.0 hub connected to a USB 2.0 port on the motherboard, and the 3.0 hub connected to a 3.0 port
Bob
Bob
Speaking of OSes, I've actually had a better time getting scripts and programs (from source) designed for Linux running in Ubuntu/Linux in Windows (via buggy-WSL) than on BSD on macOS :\
several of my USB 2.0 devices behave fine connected to the 3.0 -> 3.0 path, but my mouse specifically does not
Bob
Bob
homebrew can also go DIAF
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic hm. I don't think I have that problem, but my mouse (and keyboard) are directly connected to ports on the mobo anyway
@allquixotic thanks
ach, not powered
14:03
?
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic any chance you can check the chipset? (if on Windows, devices by connection, trace down the USB 3.0 root controller, and check the VID & PID of the hub)
both are powered
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic oh. optional...
I looked at the first pic and thought it was meant to be a portable one :P
the j5create sits on top of my mATX tower and has things like my microphone, Imperial BART 1 and Verizon Jetpack AC791L connected to it
the Belkin 2.0 hub has my mouse, keyboard and occasionally iphone
yeah one sec about the chipset
Windows is great til it breaks, and then you google and pray
OS X is great til to breaks, then you deny it ever broke and continue to buy a new one
Bob
Bob
14:05
if it's a VL812, I might as well grab one of the million other hubs using it
probably easier than trying to find one of these in AU
Linux is great til it breaks, at which point you blame yourself.
Bob
Bob
@djsmiley2k -site:answers.microsoft.com
greatly improves google results :P
Okay, and just for your info, my Gigabyte Z170M's only XHCI root is a PCI\VEN_8086&DEV_A12F&SUBSYS_50071458&REV_31
I think it's not custom, it's gotta be built into the PCH since it's the only one
@Bob -site:chat.stackexchange.com "Ben" :D
so it's basically what every Z170(M?) would have
14:07
@Bob yeah it helps, but not always
and a lot of it is the same thing repeated over and over again (they need dupe flagging)
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic 8086 is Intel, so yea :P
@djsmiley2k uh, -site removes a site from results :P
oh haha
USB\VID_1A40&PID_0101&REV_0111
site: adds it then?
meh, too used to linux ;)
Bob
Bob
@djsmiley2k it restricts to that site
@allquixotic smells like VIA
14:08
USB\VID_2109&PID_2812&REV_9090
Bob
Bob
> Terminus Technology Inc.
o.O that's a new one
@allquixotic ...that one's actually VIA
least it's not a 'Manufacturer Name Here'
Bob
Bob
> VL812 Hub
@allquixotic can you tell which one's which? maybe by what's connected to it...
okay, so the j5Create hub is VL812
Bob
Bob
urk
14:10
the Mass Effect hub is Belkin
Bob
Bob
it's actually an older one, hmm
@allquixotic lol
"Terminus Systems" ... lol ... totally Mass Effect
Bob
Bob
my... mwave? hub has the same VID and PID, but REV 9091
@allquixotic read this as jsCreate
@Bob Considering that upgrading my VL812 Anker hub bricked it, I feel like the quality of VL812 in successive revisions has gone down
Dog
Dog
14:11
How much wood would a wood chuck chuck if a wood chuck could chuck wood?
Bob
Bob
amazonbasics PID 8110
description: Desktop Computer
product: To Be Filled By O.E.M. (To Be Filled By O.E.M.)
vendor: To Be Filled By O.E.M.
version: To Be Filled By O.E.M.
serial: XXXXXXXX
width: 4294967295 bits
capabilities: smbios-2.8 dmi-2.8 smp vsyscall32
configuration: boot=normal chassis=desktop family=To Be Filled By O.E.M. sku=To Be Filled By O.E.M
Like that? ;p
Bob
Bob
which is also VIA, but known as "Hub"
urk
@allquixotic sooooo maybe I'm supposed to find an older revision? o.O
here's Anker claiming their upgraded version
haha
'mmm bacon' hat
@JourneymanGeek *guy solders shit together in his basement* "IT WORKS! SHIP IT NOW!"
Bob
Bob
14:12
I wonder if anyone's posted the hardware ID of the Anker hub
@allquixotic Its an asrock ;p
Actually nice piece of kit
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic how does one upgrade firmware on a usb hub anyway?
Its my gigabyte that was an unreliable piece of shit
@Bob via USB :D
get it? pun? HAHAHAHAHA
via
IIRC there was some (non-Anker) website that linked to the firmware and actually made you check your hardware revision to verify compatibility.
they had a bespoke flashing tool, or maybe an industry standard one that happened to be compatible
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic Plugable? They have tools for their own hubs.
> VL812 B2 Chipset:

(latest available firmware version is 9091 or 9095 depending on product)
O_O does that mean I have a VL812 B2 in my mwave hub?
14:14
my Anker hubs, one of them was VL812, one was VL812 B2
both sucked ass
ffs
parents!
they are fracking hard work
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic yea, Anker's amazing "upgraded" one is a B2... my mwave hub is pretty old...
@Burgi is fracking even legal there?
yes
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic how so?
my 9090 firmware seems to be magically great though, as long as I don't plug my mouse into it :P
@Bob reliability problems - random dropouts and such - and one had an extremely loose power plug
Bob
Bob
14:17
maybe I should go with Plugable if only because they're the only company that seems to post about firmware updates
oh and every time I'd reboot, my mouse and keyboard would probably not work
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic yea... that's my problem right there
they'd work on a hard power-on, but not a soft reboot
Bob
Bob
well, not random. usually during a large transfer.
@allquixotic I have to reconnect my SSDs in a specific order after boot :P
Dog
Dog
Ass-rock
14:18
also, take my good experience with a grain of salt; part of the positive nature of my experience might be due to me upgrading out of Ivy Bridge and my old USB root controllers, which were ASMedia and Intel Z77
Bob
Bob
wait. mwave is a shop.
mbeat. godammit.
the new Intel root controller might be able to de-fuck whatever stupid shit is wrong with the VL812
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic yea, I guessed yesterday that it might be a via + first-gen renesas incompat
probably my current biggest reason for the planned mobo upgrade :P
@Bob you might be able to solve most/all of your problems by ensuring 2.0 -> 2.0 -> 2.0 / 3.0 -> 3.0 -> 3.0 "purity" in your USB topology
@allquixotic the same root controller I use now XDXD
Bob
Bob
14:19
then I started looking at pcie cards, but putting that on hold cause it'll be kinda useless soon
meaning... 2.0 devices to 2.0 hubs to 2.0 ports on the controller
tho I hardly use usb 3.0 so...
3.0 devices to 3.0 hubs to 3.0 ports on the controller
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic currenly I have no USB 2.0 devices attached on that tree
Dog
Dog
How much chuck would a chuck wood chuck a if chuck wood wood chuck could
Bob
Bob
14:20
only USB 3.0 drives, and a bunch of hubs
there's a USB 2.0 drive attached on the mbeat hub, but switched off
> Does this product compatible with USB 3.0?
Does this support article compatible with English?
Bob
Bob
> Why my external hard drive keep dropping constantly?
This is a typical problem happens when user trying to use multiple hard drives that draw too much power from the USB port.
... ... ...
!!is this support article compatible with English?
@allquixotic Absolutely not
Bob
Bob
External/desktop HDD = has own power supply = trivial draw from USB power
14:22
a woodchuck would chuck no amount of wood since a woodchuck can't chuck wood
:P
@Mokubai do woochucks attempt to woo other woodchucks into chucking wood? or mating, perhaps?
if so, how do they accomplish this?
With great aplomb
Bob
Bob
I'll just gripe about the lack of USB hubs by big manufacturers.
@Bob who would you like to produce USB hub chipsets? .............. Intel? :P
silly Bob, don't you know, Intel only produces extremely high-margin chips. They got out of the mobo business because it didn't make them enough money
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic Sure! I was more thinking Asus, MSI, Gigabyte, Razer, Logitech, etc.
I really hate that btw. If a product line is netting you significant money in profit, why would you dump it just because it isn't growing fast enough for you? bleh.
@Bob asmedia = asus
Bob
Bob
Well, Logitech has some.
14:24
how many good products get chucked because they're not absolutely exploding in growth
Razer dosen't really make their own chips
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek They make the controllers. But not the hubs.
they do a heck of a job catering to a specific market tho
Bob
Bob
I don't care if it uses a VIA chip, if it has decent support...
@Bob maybe I can find a way to read off my 9090 firmware at the block layer? nah, it'd probably not be compatible with your hub for some reason
Bob
Bob
14:25
@allquixotic Not really something I'd want to test right now :P
@allquixotic 0_0
I can see VIA's internal CVS repo of VIA USB hub firmwares' commit messages now (and yes, they must use CVS because they're such shit)
Bob
Bob
Anyway, I'm getting a new backplate to bring out the internal USB 3.0 ports (header)
so I'll connect the new drives direct to those
Commit #X: Fix a bunch of shit
Commit #X+1: Release firmware 9090
Commit #X+2: Break a bunch of shit
Commit #X+3: Release firmware 9091
Commit #X+4: Oops
Bob
Bob
then revisit hubs in March with the new motherboard :P
14:27
lol
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic TFS
I'm still trying to find a compelling reason to upgrade ;p
@Bob nonono I've got it! Visual SourceSafe! :D
with Visual C++ 6.0
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic firmware_9091_fixed(2)_really_final_release(5) - Copy_beta.bin
@allquixotic Oh yea... I meant VSS -_-
@allquixotic text files, in a large tree.
Bob
Bob
14:28
TFS isn't that bad
with recursive symlinks
Bob
Bob
And the firmware is directly edited as binary
compilers? bah.
Bob
Bob
> Arriving Thu, Jan 12
On the way
New guy hires on -> "HERE IS HOW YOU EDIT FIRMWARE" -> old hand types vi firmware.bin then types :%!xxd -> "GOOD LUCK" -> old guy retires, new guy commits suicide
Bob
Bob
14:30
Knowing my luck, the backplate won't work at all.
Why is it always the dodgy no-name Chinese brands -_-
lol
I donno
@Bob speaking of, I think my mom accidentally purchased a knock-off Contigo traveling coffee mug (or else an extremely defective one) for me for Christmas
Old one: coffee/tea would still be warm 6-7 hours after making
I mean other than the cracked smartwatch (which they immediatedly agreed to RMA o_O) I've had reasonable luck with my dodgy chinese crap.
New one: coffee/tea is cold by 10 am, and cup is extremely hot to touch immediately after filling it
Bob
Bob
14:31
Yea, that sounds broken
@allquixotic Does it rattle when you shake it?
If I have the time tommorrow, I need to bitch about the 'pre interview' at my possible next job.
(SOMEONE FINALLY GOT BACK TO ME!)
@Bob personally I prefer to purchase things from European countries if at all possible. I've had incredibly good luck with everything I've bought from, say, Germany, UK, Denmark
@Bob yeah, the problem is I get killed too fast before I can get a feel for the maps etc. Bots work well for that
Also I got a 2$ USB hub
14:33
Beoplay headphones. Sennheiser. Imperial BART 1.
and to no one's surprise it only detects only 1 connected device
My headphones are russian ;p
It does power both tho
@JourneymanGeek does that mean it automatically translates everything to russian for you?
14:34
although my favorite device is one that was designed in California and made in China
*runs*
@Burgi NO TOVARICH! IT PLAYS GLORIOUS SONGS OF REVOLUTIONARY PEOPLES!
2
or are they soviet era headphones which are basically just huge speakers strapped to the head?
@Burgi they're modern, pretty nice, and apparently made in the PRC
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic I just grabbed what I could find on Amazon. Don't think any European countries make cards like this either...
Bob
Bob
@HackToHell I think it's a hub in the Ethernet sense.
@allquixotic THOSE SUBTITLES!
Bob
Bob
Link the wires together and hope for the best.
omg!
i just found a picture of @JourneymanGeek wearing his headphones
user image
2
i'm sure i've linked that in the past...
@Burgi funny thing is my first pair broke, I bought a new pair, and then found out they had spares. And bought spares which came in damaged, and replaced the spares and I'm using the old pair again. So I have a new pair in a box
Bob
Bob
@Burgi probably!
chat loops!
Now I need an actual photo of me with headphones ;p
and not that one with my old EH150s and a crew cut ;p
@Bob The package says you can run 4 devices off it tho
@HackToHell anything electronic worth $2 that claims anything on the package, I'm not going to trust
@JourneymanGeek Either ash has shrunk or that headphone is huge
Bob
Bob
@HackToHell you should open it up and see if there's an IC in there
@HackToHell that's a really old photo
I think 07?
Bob
Bob
14:45
"hey, we should make usb hubs. it can't be that different from network hubs!"
We stopped the really hair cuts too ;p
I am doing that, there's an IC but I think they forgot to add in the required extras.
There's two empty spots ...
@HackToHell maybe they removed parts until it stopped working, and added the last part they removed back
@HackToHell crystal oscillator and a capacitor...
14:47
According to that, I seem to be missing a crystal oscillator
lol @Mokubai beat me to it :D
I get so pissed when they melt the ICs in devices. Makes fixing it impossible
eww. That board
What's the point of having a IC if they don't include those both -.-
Might as well have removed it
Bob
Bob
@HackToHell UMMMMMMMMMMM
REMOVE ALL THE THINGS!!!!!!
Bob
Bob
14:49
@HackToHell that's exactly what I was talking about
they... connected all the data lines... to each other
12 mins ago, by Bob
Link the wires together and hope for the best.
open VPN uses UDP port 1194..if the great firewall of China blocks this port, will they able to prevent OpenVPN users to bypass filter?
On closer inspection, they have @bob
Bob
Bob
First thought: "aren't you meant to match trace lengths so differential signalling works?"
Dambit
Bob
Bob
Second thought: "wait, did they connect the same data lines to ALL the ports?!"
it's so ridiculous I didn't even notice at first
whoever designed that has literally not a single clue what they're doing
14:51
The fact that it got mass produced and shipped to another country without probably a single person testing this is mind blowing
Bob
Bob
this is no better than soldering four USB cables together and hoping it works
@JourneymanGeek in this case, they would've done well with removing a few more things
like, three of the ports...
@Bob I can't figure out what the IC is doing there
@Bob they probably only removed one
@Rahul2001 its a blob
literally its a basic IC too cheap to have a proper packaging
Bob
Bob
@Rahul2001 there's no evidence of an IC actually existing under there
@HackToHell also, the data lines in that cable don't look to be twisted pair as they should be
so it's not even a decent extension cable
@JourneymanGeek Someone once told me that you get a blob like that when you melt the IC, for whatever reason
Bob
Bob
14:54
@JourneymanGeek I don't think it's an IC at all. Just a random epoxy blob.
@Rahul2001 They don't intend you fixing it, you should just buy a new one. It'd probably cost you less than the actual chip anyway
@Rahul2001 that's not really true ;p
Bob
Bob
It's only in contact with one power trace and one of the differential data pair.
61
Q: What kind of components are black blobs on a PCB?

drxzclIn low-cost mass-produced items I often run into black blobs of what looks like resin applied directly on top of something on the PCB. What are these things exactly? I suspect this is some kind of custom IC that is layed out directly on the PCB to save on the plastic housing/connector pins. Is t...

Bob
Bob
There's... no way for an IC there to do anything.
Unless it's a multilayer board (no way...)
So, yea. Random epoxy blob with nothing under it is my guess.
@HackToHell can probably try scraping it if he wants. I don't think this 'hub' is much use...
The Y1 marking on the front side is not connected to anything... the pads aren't connected to any traces.
14:57
sigh, I can probably use this to power the mi usb light and fan at the same time :D
Yeah, prolly only suitable for power
I don't think I can use this for anything data :/
Bob's right, that thing looks dodgy as hell
I don't think you can use it for anything ;p
14:58
Maybe I can power both my Galilio and edison at the same time with this
But can't take the risk of frying them
Sigh
@HackToHell It don't use it power any expensive devices
No indication that it's a multilayer PCB, just a cheap multidrop cable with a blob of epoxy on it
Its a single sided PCB to boot. and the traces are pretty clear.
0_0
What's the point of the test pads I wonder
Bob
Bob
@Rahul2001 I wouldn't even trust it for that...
2 mins ago, by Rahul2001
@HackToHell It don't use it power any expensive devices
Yeah
15:01
Under that blob of epoxy is probably just a termination resistor to make it appear as a high speed device to a computer
What's a termination resistor?
Okay maybe I should have opened it first before plugging it into the computer
@Rahul2001 pulls the data line to +ve or -ve so that the computer thinks there is something there
Ah, okay, that makes sense
15:03
Now I'm curious what's in my Amazon Basics Hub...
@HackToHell How much did you get that hub for anyway?
100 INR :D
xD
That's about 1.3 USD, btw
Got it mainly because I walk past that store daily and I really wanted to try it out
15:05
Not even 2$ I sppose with the sky rocketing exchange rates
I think I have a cheap, almost functional 4 port hub with a blob chip
Assuming I haven't thrown up all out. I'll take a photo if I find it ;p
Bob
Bob
oh wait speed ID is a pull-up... o.O
:34417734 it is, but you do actually need a termination resistor on the receiver to indicate device speed.
We found that out the hard way at work
It's usually done right next to your usb device
Bob
Bob
@Mokubai ya, hence the message deletion :P
Ah, didn't see :)
Spent half a day wondering why we had no USB comms, previous incarnation apparently had the termination in the dataline ESD supressor, new one didn't.
Amazon Basics 4 port hub looks almost professional:
15:16
@Mokubai probably is
and probably designed as per the reference implimentation for that chip
(and yeah, that's a fun thing to do ;) - looking up datasheets for small devices)
I had assumed it was going to be the same as @HackToHells monstrosity
lol
its unlikely amazon would cheap out that badly
True, Amazon have always seemed to want to do the right thing. They might want to hoover your wallet dry, but they at least give you value for it.
@Mokubai I have an excellent, long-lasting paper shredder by Amazon Basics that has been a staple of physical security for our household for like 4 years now
that said, I anti-recommend Apple's tablet hardware, except for the Kindle e-readers
the Fire HD tablets are awful; their "HDX" line has decent specs but is a bit overpriced and very infrequently updated and/or abandoned (no updates since 2014)
the regular "Fire" was on sale all month for $39.99, which is ridiculous for a tablet, so the value is there, but it's quite a horrid, crippled little device
and the larger Fire HD tablets are the worst thing ever; they've got low-end, 2012-era MediaTek chipsets and still sell for $200+
I basically never return electronics due to dissatisfaction alone (I only return it if it's broken), but I got a full refund for the Fire HD 10
lol
@allquixotic my kindle has a bit of a bug. My parents keep borrowing it ;p
Bob
Bob
15:34
@JourneymanGeek I could send you mine... used twice in as many years
@Bob I'm mostly fine till the next job
especially if its down in changi
Even then, I could read off the stream or the blade stealth
(also its a bit of a joke since they both seem to claim they don't need it, and they use it more than I have lately)
My kindle was/is awesome
it's one of the 3G ones
I'm slowlyturning it into a kind of e-ink display
Dec 21 at 4:05, by bwDraco
Kernel panic - not syncing: Attempted to kill init! exitcode=0x0000008b
I was wondering what 0x8b meant.
0x8b = 139 = segfault :p
In other words, abrupt removal of swap (see context) crashes init with a segfault, causing the kernel to panic.
@bwDraco which init? systemd?
Yup—the machine was running openSUSE Leap 42.2, which uses systemd.
15:47
interesting; you'd think systemd would be robust enough to handle that
is it a yank of a swap or a umount?
It's a hard removal. It was attached via USB and unplugged without notice.
The system's own swap on the HDD was purposely disabled, and memory artificially limited to 1 GB on the kernel command line.
Dec 21 at 4:21, by bwDraco
user image
16:00
@Mokubai That's a lot of stuff ...
pretty sure any abrupt removal of swap is deadly
I'd be supprised if anything can survive it
if you did swapoff && sync first, then should be fine as long as the h/w supports hot swap
128 = core dumped, 11 = SIGSEGV
Hence 139, or 0x8b.
It was a test to see what would happen.
Did you have any hypothsis?
(I knew what'd happen on openrc as I've accidently done the same previously).
Windows does not allow swap on external devices, and even if it did, the machine would crash with BSOD 0x7A KERNEL_DATA_INPAGE_ERROR if you removed it.
How do you define 'external' tho :/
especially if you have hotswap
Bob
Bob
16:12
@djsmiley2k if usb, then Windows goes by the portable flag
@Bob what sets that?
It's determined by the drive.
hah
that sounds reliable XD
@bwDraco You can change it.
33
Q: Flipping the Removable Media bit -- alternatives to BootIt?

jglouieThere's a utility called the Lexar BootIt utility that flips the Removable Media Bit on certain USB flash drives. I want to flip the bit on my USB flash drive (it's supported) but really am not too comfortable downloading this utility from random file-sharing sites, nor do I see a license anywhe...

Free boots?
16:24
0
Q: External Hard Drive being incorrectly recognized as Internal Hard Disk

Mr.XI have a 3TB Seagate GoFlex External HDD. When I first got the device, it would show up as Removable Storage in My Computer where I could right click on the drive and eject it when I was done. However after creating some partitions and formatting the drive stopped showing up as Removable Storage....

"flip the bit"
lol
Why does Apple not allow to downgrade to earlier iOS indefinitely?

Is it their way to make iOS more complicated and hardware resources intensive in order to force consumers to buy new device every year?
Learned I have iOS 10.0.2 and expected original 7.0 because it is faster and does not have useless features that new has.
Now it makes me frustrated I can't downgrade.
Breaking jail does not work? ROM erase and switch? Something?
Dog
Dog
16:54
So Amazon have filed a patent for a airborne warehouses at 45000ft that launch fleets of airships to local areas that launch fleets of drones to make deliveries to their customers.
This is consumerism and capitalism gone mad... even if it's technologically pretty exciting
@Burgi I once ate soviet-era chocolate. Tasted LIKE GLORIOUS COMMUNIST FREEDOM, I mean, really nice.
So there's this site I'm banging my head until it resembles a real site developing.
For some bizarre reason, the social media widgets would only show up when logged in.
When logged out, the damned things would disappear. The divs were there, but not its content
And it only happened on firefox
Turns out private tabs activate "do not track" by default and those disable fb and twitter widgets
I'm not crazy (yet)
5
17:23
@ThatBrazilianGuy This is normal Firefox behavior. Disable Tracking Protection to prevent this from happening.
Yeah, it's one of those little facts that make sense when you know them, but if you don't, it's crazy
17:38
lol. UK supermarket co-op is already selling Easter eggs ...
17:53
82
Q: Why shouldn’t I use Unicode characters to simulate typographic styles (such as small caps or script)?

WrzlprmftUnicode contains various characters that look like typographically stylised variants of characters of the basic Latin alphabet and that allow one to write texts in the corresponding typographic styles without resorting to mark-up or similar. For example, one can simulate: Small caps: ʙᴇʜᴏʟᴅ...

I really need to spend more time learning this stuff.
Back to ZFS, or what?
Unicode is not designed for this use. It's meant to encode semantic information about the text, not its formatting. This semantic information may be used by machine as well as by a human user; improper use of Unicode special characters can cause applications like screen readers to misread the text or fail altogether. — bwDraco 18 mins ago
Dog
Dog
!!caaaat

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