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w3d
w3d
01:26
Finally... A Stack Exchange site for Software Recommendations! Has quickly entered the commitment phase. area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/60887/…
3
@w3d: I wonder how it'll handle things going obsolete
I'd also add, properly written, its possible to ask for software req on SU
just focus on a problem rather than ask for the codez software
lol, here we should need to update the OT close reason
and... its nice to have a central backup box again
01:43
21
Q: How will out of date accepted answers be handled?

gregmacProposal: Software Recommendations One of the reasons "shop for me"-type questions are generally disallowed on SE sites is outlined well in Q&A is Hard, Let’s Go Shopping!: ..technology moves so rapidly that the best shopping recommendations will be utterly obsolete within a year! What’s the...

@Braiam the best software in the world is "out of date" the only question becomes will it work on the OS version :-)
02:05
@w3d Hell yeah, baby!
Brilliant!
meh, going for Tim Post ground rules several questions will be closed just after the private beta
> What if it works? What if you finally get these types of questions down to a science? If Stack Overflow decides to relax just a little when it comes to these types of questions, well - you get the drift, and need to keep it in mind. The ultimate form of success for this community might ultimately be rejoining larger, established sites.
does that mean that if the software rec site works that they're going to let people ask these types of questions on SU and SO?
... oh noes!
@allquixotic I wish they already were, which just leaves weeding out the spammers. Spammers have about 10 times more time to find a "relative software question" to toss thier crap into, than people who actually work with specific software, and know the one that would do the job that is being asked about.
@Psycogeek well... there are spammers, and then there are good-natured people who will recommend software that they wrote or the company they work for wrote, but only when they honestly believe it's the best tool for the job
Nicole Hamilton occasionally promotes her C Shell, but only when people ask for it, or ask about it, not just "a question about shells? TRY MY SHELL!"
02:20
@allquixotic too bad it rarely is :-) The best software is made by that guy who never sees the light of day :-)
the worst software is the stuff that has more marketing skill than programming skill, but who sells C-shells on the C+ shore, the marketer, not the debugger.
Google - Were so popular you will use our software with the bugs .
(and the redirections, and trackings, and marketing , and personal information retrival system, and . . .)
02:37
I gotta say, I'm not much of a fan of pop music, but Katy Perry put on a pretty wicked performance at the Grammys!
@MichaelFrank: heh. The one she did with elmo was awesome.
as long as she didn't swing naked from a wrecking ball
naw, she's at least slightly classy.
03:10
hmm
Anyone mucked around with 802.11 AC gear?
@JourneymanGeek not yet.
ah hah! Never mind, worked out what I was wondering
i thought my phone had it, but according to Motorola themselves, it doesn't, so I trust them over phonearena
Its 5ghz only, and falls back to 2.4
which means any AC gear must support the 5 ghz band, and we won't have silly single band devices whoot
03:17
I don't think you can implement the AC spec without implementing 5 GHz, can you?
or maybe it's as broken as N and lets you do 2.4 only
@Braiam Thou shalt not spameth (483rd commandment)
@allquixotic: no, this is good
@Braiam I'm out of flags
@Braiam they made so many accounts........
man, I'm going to summon the big guns
03:21
@Braiam who? the devs? the mods?
mod would be needed, at minimum
need someone who's a specialist in combating account spam >_<
@allquixotic: You need someone with a lot of time ;p
SE has been inundated with spam lately, it's insaaaaaaaaane how bad it is
honestly, blunt instrumenting this is the best way
03:24
we can barely keep up with it all
@allquixotic: this is a special kind of crazy
zombies
03:46
!!define zombie
@allquixotic zombie A snake god or fetish in religions of West Africa and elsewhere.
OK....
 
1 hour later…
05:11
What is the difference in an android between /storage/sdcard & Mnt/sdcard ? As in is one of them a "link" of some kind and another a more direct path?
@Bob what was the name of that hosting company that you found ridiculously good deals with for Core2-era dual Xeons with like 16 gigs of RAM and a 500 GB HDD? in the US? got a friend who may be in the market, leaning towards value more than performance or price or storage (it's not for me, so I don't need OMG TB of disk)
@Psycogeek /mnt/sdcard is an older (Android 2.x) path, but there are like 3 or 4 symlinks to the same thing, it's basically different ways of enumerating the storage devices on the device
my device has /storage/emulated/0 and /mnt/sdcard
some with microSD slots have /mnt/sdcard-ext or /mnt/external or similar
these days, /mnt/sdcard is typically the built-in r/w general-purpose NAND built into the device
@allquixotic In the situation of me setting the paths for like folders (widget folders) how do i know which one is "real" (as if any are) and which one will have to bounce around more in links?
@Psycogeek if you're writing software or scripts that you intend to port across devices, /mnt/sdcard is a pretty safe path to use, as it exists on (AFAIK) all Android devices
if you're just deciding what to use within programs on the device, it really doesn't matter; performance is not a factor in symlinks on Linux on the filesystems that Android uses
you could have 20 levels of symlinks (and there are many fewer than 20 levels here) and you wouldn't notice a difference in performance
@allquixotic ok well that helps, and it helps to know which is most used. but i wanted to know which one is not linked , or linked less.
@Psycogeek you can find out in the terminal
install the terminal app and run mount and find out which one it's physically mounted on
05:21
@allquixotic ok. i havent done a terminal in eons.
my phone has a ridiculous number of mount points, but /dev/block/platform/msm_sdcc.1/by-name/userdata is mounted on /storage/emulated/0 and I happen to know that /mnt/sdcard -> /storage/emulated/0 by running ls -l on it
the same device file can also be mounted to multiple mount points which means they are equivalent in terms of number of symlinks (0)
Is there a reson why my phone LG optimus g pro does not (easily) set up for direct storage connections via the USB (to PC), like way back in 1.6 when the usb connection would "mount" the 2 storage areas as flash drive chunks?
Now Instead of direct Flash chunk access, i get 4 options to disconnect me from the storage via the PC. some stupid ass cam mode, some media mode, and a "pc software" mode which mounts them just as similar as some stupid Itunes software.
@Psycogeek Android did away with USB Mass Storage mode starting with Android 4.0
which was quite a while ago
Yes that one mass storage
This method seems to be WAY the f slower for some reason. its like i am pulling rino teeth to load up the storage with lots a movies stuff.
"Disk 1 has been surprise removed"... doesn't sound good.
05:31
inb4 Recco Mods comes crying about spam,
201
Software Recommendations

Proposed Q&A site for people seeking advice and help finding software to get a particular task done. Desktop/mobile/web/libraries.

Currently in commitment.

this site will be spammed away to glory. Enjoy.
lol
@Sathya: ;p
hurt his knee yesterday :/
@Sathya flaggers and closers will be so busy , they will lay off obscure questions on SU , making SU a happy place again . . . lol
@Sathya: I donno if the site is the worst idea ever, or I'm going to end up getting 20K there pretty quick ;p
@JourneymanGeek lol. I'm guessing the latter ;p
@Sathya: maybe both!
05:37
@JourneymanGeek yeah, that's my initial thought
also, broken links and dated answers
@allquixotic it is good to know it's gone (mass storage) so I wont have to be trying to achive it. I struggled for a few hours trying to get at it.
editing is nice & all, but please - how many are going to bother with that?
@Sathya: not too many
and I feel (on hindsight admittedly!), the way we handle that sort of thing now is better
focusing on the problem the OP is trying to solve, and suggesting tools and methods, rather than "dah, have this program. Done!"
@Sathya AU is getting absolutely slammed, so it's hard to say SR would be unique in any way
@Sathya the plague of every site; no information is eternal... absolutely none... I'm sure by the year 3000 we''ll have some more evolved sense of mathematics that makes even 1+1 not equal 2
@allquixotic: AU is trolling rather than spamming tho
The goal of that idiot isn't misguided SEO-ness. Its obviously to annoy.
05:44
@allquixotic true that
@allquixotic: techniques can be adapted.
@allquixotic they already do that 2+2=5 in the physics and mathmatics geeks. I can prove they are wholey wrong about that, with 4 stones .
If you had a well explained answer with steps and figures, you might be able to 'just' swap out a program for a different one.
today I was reading some answers on SO about MS Office add-ins that were from ~2010 and they are wrong in Office 2013, and wrong on 64-bit build of Office... which probably didn't exist at that time
I'd say less than 1% of answers on SF, SO and SU are truly eternal in the sense that they're purely knowledge based and have nothing to do with the ever-changing ever-evolving software ecosystem
But of course i have to route the stones through floating point windmill before they come out that way :-)
(and the 11th sub dimentinal universe)
05:46
@allquixotic: ooh, like bullfighter
(That was probably one of the biggest reasons I only write as badly as I do now, rather than worse ;p)
I wonder if its still around...
it may be the case that the SR mods will have to be more vigilant than mods on other sites, to combat people trying to "advertise" their own software, but on the other hand, there ARE people who actively promote their own software in answers on the network, but the quality of their contributions is so high that they're allowed to stay
@allquixotic: there's kind of a rule for that
You need to be open about it, and your main goal here should not just be to promote your own software
a lot of them also use SO as a way to interface with their users and provide direct "tech support"
(IIRC we have/had a macrium dev here, and I've seen the easybcd dev answer a few too)
those questions aren't about promoting their software but helping people use it
hell, the WiX developer is active on SO
05:54
@allquixotic: in which case, full disclosure is awesome
of course
also the Outlook Redemption developer
@JourneymanGeek lol. 3k rep and one answer on the entire site
@allquixotic: only cause he got repcapped I suspect ;p
he couldn't even bother to register lol
highest rep unregistered user? :P
;p
Its John Carmack.
nuff said
or a very convincing simulacrum
on the internet, no one knows you're not really john carmack
05:56
true ;p
!!meme okay
i intentionally keep the transfer speeds low so it won't use up too much bandwidth in the background
it can go much faster on LTE but i am careful
i've noticed at 55 kbps (little b) upstream, i can do anything else including playing games and watching videos without negatively impacting my experience
it doesn't even come close to saturating the pipe, leaving most of the throughput in both directions for whatever i'm doing in the foreground
@Bob webhostingtalk.com/… looks nice.. "BuyDown" that one-time $99 setup really cuts down the price a lot! after which it's super affordable
06:08
@allquixotic hows that gonna work, i would have changed 81 things by the time it backs-up making the backup rather back-wards.
i bet any needed recovery goes a whole lot faster though :-)
Gads, i need that back NOW
Good morning everyone
I have hardware query

Consider the following scenario:
Desktop - Dual Core 1.8GHz processor
Laptop - Dual Core 1.8GHz processor

Would the processing power be same in both the systems (For the sake of argument, let's say both systems have exactly identical hardware w.r.t RAM, Motherboard etc)
In theory, it probably would.
@asprin i think you would have to speak of the exact processor chip. Mobile processors used to be weak kneed low power things , that a desktop could walk all over, the laptop power supply couldnt even keep up with the power requirements for that. But now days they got some power full stuff under the mobile hoods.
tho practically, the desktop would have a slightly faster hard drive, and better cooling, so it can run at full power more easily
06:19
Thanks, according to some of my friends, the laptop would have a slightly better performance than the desktop
Thats probably illogical
I asked them the reason and they couldn't answer..so I thought of asking it here
Maybe the desktop is faulty?
lol
@Psycogeek well the things I'm backing up is data that changes VERY slowly
06:21
@asprin shorter paths :-)
Exactly
@allquixotic: I'd like to say... ow
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic L5420? Hm. Not bad, I suppose.
even if you have a grandfathered data plan ;p
@Bob well, this would be an upgrade from an existing server that's $70/month (double the price!!) for dual L5140s, rest of the specs the same
5140s are even older... dual core no HT... L5420 are at least quad cores
it's pretty much a no-brainer, wouldn't you say?
Bob
Bob
06:23
@allquixotic Upgrade? For whom?
@Bob for the guy who's paying for the L5140s right now
Bob
Bob
@asprin Impossible ot say.
I keep saying this. You must provide the specific architecture/generation, or better yet the specific model.
You cannot compare, say, a Pentium 4 and a Haswell by clock speed alone.
@allquixotic Which guy? o.O
(also, you might need to research the provider a bit...)
@Bob a friend >_>
@Bob: purely hypothethical magic identical PCs ;p
he's considering upgrading from dual L5140 16GB RAM 500 GB HDD to dual L5420 16 GB RAM 500 GB HDD at half the price of the 5140s
06:25
and folk involved in vocalisations eminating from the posterior area ;p
it's REALLY a no-brainer
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek Even then, there's so many different laptop and desktop chips...
A mobile Haswell vs desktop Haswell is again completely different from mobile Pentium 4 vs desktop Pentium 4
@allquixotic Well, what's he using it for? :P
the problem with the laptop/desktop comparison is, if you are comparing a quad-core Haswell i5 on the laptop to a quad-core Nehalem i5 on the desktop, even if they both have 500 GB HDDs and 8 GB of RAM, the Haswell will win every CPU benchmark
@Bob AFAIK, minecraft
and other random stuff
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic Huh. And that works well on 5140s?
!! s/well//
06:27
@allquixotic @allquixotic Huh. And that works on 5140s? (source)
there's no well :P it just works
still, can you think of any reason why not to take the upgrade when it's half price for the better CPUs?
double the number of cores and higher clock rate to boot
!!stats
@allquixotic Ortwin Gentz has 103 reputation, earned 0 rep today, asked 1 questions, gave 0 answers. avg. rep/post: 103. Badges: 0g 0s 4b
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic RAM? Network? Bandwidth? Storage?
@Bob same, same, same, same
Bob
Bob
Lack of IP addresses?
Those servers only have one IPv4 and no IPv6
06:29
@asprin Best way to fact it out would be 20 seconds of some CPU benchmarking stuff.
@Bob: lack of IPV6 is fairly trivial to fix, and common ;p
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek Not on a server.
On a server, if you want IPv6 at all you want it native.
And if you're lacking it you're just holding yourself and everyone else back.
heh, its funny, we're having the same, or very similar conversaion on the comms room
@Bob don't need IPv6, and I got a /30 for $5/mo, which is reasonable, and same as the old host
!!stats 10208
@allquixotic User 10208 not found
06:32
!!stats JourneymanGeek
!!stats 10165
@allquixotic Journeyman Geek has 60811 reputation, earned 37 rep today, asked 90 questions, gave 2038 answers. avg. rep/post: 28.57. Badges: 15g 95s 186b
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek switches tabs
@allquixotic: ipv6 is the future!
@Bob: I'm of the opinion the big 'issue' with ipv6 is ISPs supporting it
mine's the only one of... I donno 5-6 local ISPs that seems to
and I have wierd issues with my primary router ;p
*whistles* just helping my friendly neighbor who runs the aviation chatbot; lookie
06:35
@JourneymanGeek that's exactly the issue -- IPv6 support is very strong at the "hub" of the internet (in the traditional hub-and-spokes model); but it's extremely weak in the "spokes"
getting IPv6 out to all the end-users is the #1 problem and should be the #1 priority
@allquixotic: my ISP does ipv6rd
which is pretty neat
at least LTE users get IPv6 for free, no matter what carrier they use, since the native layer 3 of LTE worldwide is true IPv6
it's specified in the standards and deployed as such
@allquixotic: considering some local ISPs do CGN already, it kinda makes sense here
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic but does it work with chat users?
that's probably more useful
@allquixotic problem is, most sites don't support it either
chicken and egg
@Bob lots of sites support it... major ones, anyway... minor ones, not so much, but they'll follow once the majors lead the way
the websites and corporations and organizations that seriously need to be supporting IPv6 on their sites are already doing so
can't say the same about ISPs
Bob
Bob
06:42
@allquixotic far from enough
reddit.com, yahoo.com, even microsoft.com doesn't have an AAAA entry
I'd check SO/SE, but for some reason lookups to Google's DNS servers are timing out for those
github.com is another one lacking
australia.gov.au? nope
oh well, it's worse than i thought then
cavil has been restarted with Zirak's commits from this weekend
Bob
Bob
usa.gov? nope
7 commits
1
Q: What responds to a ping? The modem, or the router?

novs12Just a very simple question I'm sure you all know. When I ping my public IP address what is responding to the ping? Is my modem responding to the ping and never reaching the router or is the modem just passing it to the router and the router responds? Thanks!

Would edit the answer but I didn't want to mess it up as I don't understand network layers very well
Bob
Bob
Sites with AAAAs are in the very very small minority, based on that sample of a whole lot of major sites.
slashdot.com, sourceforge.net, nope
06:46
there are probably some sites with an AAAA that don't have working IPv6 too
Bob
Bob
google.com and facebook.com are the only ones that I can find AAAAs for out of all I've tried
!!info
@allquixotic I awoke on Mon, 27 Jan 2014 06:44:47 GMT (that's about 1 minute ago), learned 55 commands
@Bob irc.freenode.net :D
06:46
I was about so say google
Bob
Bob
spotify.com, netflix.com, nope
amazon.com, ebay.com, paypal.com, nope
lol the site that is responsible for half of all internet traffic ... no IPv4
er, 6
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic which one? netflix?
Bob
Bob
06:49
@allquixotic freenode.net is also IPv4 only. irc.freenode.net is CNAME'd to chat.freenode.net which has AAAA
@allquixotic: only in the US ;p
Bob
Bob
@ekaj well, a modem is effectively a bridge, I think
@Bob: tho, most modern modems arn't modems ;p
@JourneymanGeek technicalities :/ when I say "internet" I mean the United Internet of America, of course, since we're the ones who made it for all you freeloaders ;) j/k
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic I'm currently with wholesaleinternet, but the one you found is even ebtter if you're happy with 5420s and 8/16 GB of RAM :P
06:51
@Bob yeah, it's pretty good value
you get 6 free months if you sign up for a 2 year billing period, but I don't have that much money to toss up-front, so I'm going to go month to month for a while; if it works fine, I'll go 6 month intervals and get 1 month free per year
i can kinda understand how they might get away with those prices, considering the lowish power needs of L5420s
Bob
Bob
apple.com is also lacking AAAA
Is there a rule such that, if a question gets 5 spam flags in 5 mins, it is automatically closed or something similar?
yeah, something like that
Bob
Bob
so, the vast vast majority even amongst major sites lack it
not a good sign :(
!! s/closed/deleted/
@Bob Could not process input. Error: null is not an object (evaluating 's.firstElementChild.classList') on column 1926
Bob
Bob
06:54
...wut
for some reason, for the substitution command, you have to put a space after the !
@Bob Could not process input. Error: null is not an object (evaluating 's.firstElementChild.classList') on column 1926
!! s/sign/:(/
@allquixotic Could not process input. Error: null is not an object (evaluating 's.firstElementChild.classList') on column 1926
die
06:55
so Zirak's patch broke !!s
Bob
Bob
!! s/Zirak/ThatRandomGuy/
@Bob Could not process input. Error: null is not an object (evaluating 's.firstElementChild.classList') on column 1926
we need to file an issue on github to let them know about that, but meanwhile, sleep... sucks that i am going to sleep with a broken !! s///, but it's not the end of the world
Bob
Bob
@allquixotic I don't know how we can push ISPs into IPv6 when it offers no real benefit at this time :\
And I don't understand why so many major sites don't add it.
06:58
yeah
!!afk sleep
Bob
Bob
Come on Microsoft, Apple, Amazon, PayPal - you telling me you lack sysadmins who can implement IPv6??
yay
reassembled the raspi-stacked-nas
just need to set up wifi, and decide if I want to try throwing another HDD on it
(USB hub, raspi, 500gb hard drive, held together by rubber bands ;p)
Bob
Bob
o.o
I don't know what to use it for, now that I have my atom box back up
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek I think I'd prefer my external HDD :P
uncomfortable powering a portable HDD off a rpi
07:06
@Bob: its a poor man's nas ;p
Bob
Bob
also, the USB2 is too much of a bottleneck for my liking :(
@Bob: naw, powered USB hub powers the rpi and the HDD
@Bob: this is just a low power backup box
@Bob I thought they would just tell us they Own all the IP4 addresses, and waste them like gluttons, and therfore they are the reason that Everyone Else will need IP6 ?
@Psycogeek: actually, more like, we're running out of public ipv4, and eventually most consumers will end up on consumer grade nat
@JourneymanGeek i hope when that happens that little box thing connected to the web knows what to do
( i did upgrade it once)
07:10
@Psycogeek: for most people? It won't make a difference.
Hell, I can't currently give you a compelling reason why I need a public IPV4 address, outside people potentially banning my IP address cause someone else on the same one did something bad. (and that happens anyway cause of the ISP transparent proxy folder for our 'symbolic' blocklist)
Bob
Bob
@Psycogeek Heh.
There's actually swathes of IPv4s owned by universities sitting unused.
And some early companies.
@JourneymanGeek I've been on static IPv4 for many years now, and it's a great thing to have
@Bob yea auction off all those companies addresses so the indians and philipenoes now doing thier jobs can have them :-)
@Bob: in what ways?
My ISP specifically disallows me from running servers ;p
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek Urgh
@JourneymanGeek I've run a webserver before when I didn't have a VPS
also running game servers from time to time
I mean, I've done it before
then they blocked port 80... occationally
I've run internal servers (I have a web server for my rutorrent instance), but anything world-facing is on a VPS
07:19
@JourneymanGeek here the difference between "business" class and "fast web" is only $10-12 more in costs. business class never got capped (none are capped right now). I think they would allows a person to run a web site off it. Meaning it isnt much more money than the fast connection around here to go "business".
(completly different division of the company)
@Psycogeek: those would. 'business class' internet is ~2x the cost of what I'm paying now, and without cable ;p
08:00
1
Q: 56K USB external fax modem

URL87I ordered this New 56K USB V9.0 V.92 External Dial Up Voice Fax Data Modem for Windows7. Now I found that it NOT support windows 7 64 bit . I have 2 questions : 1) Does that USB modem need any installation or just connect its USB is required ? 2) Is there any solution to work with that USB m...

man, I miss the old modems and those noises they used to make. I used to be able to tell if it dialed properly from the sounds they made ;p
08:11
@ekaj the answer is pathetic and incomplete indeed.
08:30
0
Q: Large PDF book very laggy slow

HyeVltg3System: Win7 64-bit Ult. Ed. 32GB Ram Nvidea GTX 670 I'm trying to read a book in PDF format that has images and text. Scrolling through pages is very slow and if I scroll too fast it takes a few to load the page. Is there a setting anywhere that I can fiddle with so Adode uses more resources t...

morning
Is it true that some PDF reading is done via streaming the pdf off the web? I remember some stuff opened in the browser that was dog slow. and downloading whole pdfs and running off locally was never slow.
@kalina having fun yet?
having fun yet?
It's 8:40 on a Monday morning
I've barely had caffeine yet.
oh that morning. its the after midnight morning here 12:42 am kind
-.-
09:12
lol
09:33
Sometimes I die a little bit inside. i.imgur.com/iJucSEb.png
@Thor: Then you realise you just stopped another idiot vandal ;p
@JourneymanGeek the beauty of the summary... oh my. "hehehehe idiots"
blah, can someone custom flag this and mention its using vulgar language in tamil, or possibly some related language? superuser.com/questions/707534/what-is-best-kusi-or-kundi
I don't think its tamil, but I recognise some of the words.
I could do that.
wierdly, I get most of the non cursey words
09:41
@JourneymanGeek I.. what? Is there even a real question there?
@Leathe: nope
even the printf is total nonsense
>:|
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek why do you need someone else to flag it? o.O
I just flagged it as low quality, because that part there is no doubt about.
@Bob: I forgot to custom flag it, and its obcure enough that not all the mods may get the reasoning? Hell, I didn't understand most of the vulgarities myself ;p
10:13
ahh, it IS a fart joke
Well, I'll be undoing my flag then. Fart jokes are the pinnacle of humour!
his transliteration leaves a lot to be desired ;p
@JourneymanGeek killed
@Sathya: thanks ;p
 
1 hour later…
11:23
user image
2
I'm fascinated.
Bob
Bob
12:36
@Thor uhhh
I think my brain broke.
13:23
I can't shake the feeling that the UI is supposed to look differently
@OliverSalzburg oh god... is network wide
@OliverSalzburg grr people like this need to have their ankles savaged, and their shoes mangled.
I'm suprised thats not blacklisted yet

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