Root Access

Ash

15:00

@allquixotic While there are some answers , there is a need for an answer that would include some math and tech about how ( modern ) RAM functions (refresh cycles, etc..) and quantity (number of NAND cells, etc..) and an analysis of the power requirement of a battery to keep them alive and comparison to common (non-laptop) battery capacities.

Journeyman Geek

@Ash: my problem with that question is its theoratical

Ash

@JourneymanGeek is it legal to ask to vote to reopen a post here ?(if the question is valid ) ?

Journeyman Geek

heh

you arn't going to get into trouble for it

allquixotic

@Ash even if you justify an opinion-based answer using mathematics and physics, it's still opinion-based... the fact is, it's possible, it's not inconceivable, but the number of possible justifications for why an entire industry worth of companies never even tried to ship a product with RAM BBUs is infinitely large, so the possible answers to the question are primarily opinion-based

the question very much deserves the close status it has, even though I didn't vote to close it originally

the discussion could effectively go on forever

you can't give me a physics or math based explanation for why no one in the industry ever even tried to ship a product with a RAM BBU -- for someone to try something, they have to want to do it, and that gets into soft opinion-based territory immediately

the thing is, even if it seems like the product would work poorly (for example, very large batteries, and not lasting very long, etc), someone could've tried it at some point. but they didn't. you're essentially asking why they didn't try it, because "why don't they" is immediately answerable as "because no one tried it yet"

it's not like you're asking "why doesn't my desktop pick itself up off my desk and fly away at the speed of light?" -- what you're asking is entirely plausible/possible within the limits of current engineering and technology

there's no good, technical explanation that would exhaustively cover all possible reasons why nobody's ever tried it

Bob

@allquixotic there is battery-backed RAM, though not on general-purpose PCs

Journeyman Geek

15:09

the old palms had their storage on battery backed up ram

allquixotic

@Bob there is? cool! then the question can be closed as based on invalid assumptions, because it's asking "why doesn't X exist?" when X in fact exists

(TIL)

Bob

and there's other non-volatile RAM as well

NvSRAM

nvSRAM is a type of non-volatile random-access memory (NVRAM). It is similar in operation to static random-access memory (SRAM). The current market for non-volatile memory is dominated by BBSRAMs, or battery-backed static random-access memory. However, BBSRAMs are slow and suffer from ROHS compliance issues. nvSRAMs provide 20ns or lesser access times. nvSRAM is one of the advanced NVRAM technologies that is fast replacing the BBSRAMs, especially for applications that need battery free solutions and long term retention at SRAM speeds. nvSRAMs are used in a wide range of situations—ne...

also, if you're talking about any old volatile memory that's battery-backed, there's things like the save memory on gameboy cartridges :P

lots of people lost old Pokemon save files when the batteries ran dry

Darth Android

@Bob This is why I just moved my old saves to new cartridges :D

Bob

> Those who required real RAM-like performance and non-volatility typically have had to use conventional RAM devices and a battery backup. This nonvolatile BIOS memory, often called CMOS RAM or parameter RAM, was a common solution in earlier computer systems like the original Apple Macintosh, which used a small amount of memory powered by a battery for storing basic setup information like the selected boot volume.

> Much larger battery backed memories are still used today as caches for high-speed databases, requiring a performance level newer NVRAM devices have not yet managed to meet.

allquixotic

@DarthAndroid "just" as in recently, or "just" as in "simply"?

Darth Android

15:12

latter, a few years ago.

Bob

Non-volatile random-access memory

Non-volatile random-access memory (NVRAM) is random-access memory that retains its information when power is turned off (non-volatile). This is in contrast to dynamic random-access memory (DRAM) and static random-access memory (SRAM), which both maintain data only for as long as power is applied. The best-known form of NVRAM memory today is flash memory. Some drawbacks to flash memory include the requirement to write it in larger blocks than many computers can automatically address, and the relatively limited longevity of flash memory due to its finite number of write-erase cycles (mo...

and from back in 1999:

> Battery-backed up RAMs still account for a large percentage of non-volatile systems. With robust hardware and software support they'll satisfy the most demanding of reliability fanatics; a little less design care is sure to result in occasional lost data.

ganssle.com/articles/nvram.htm

they go into a lot of detail there

but it's pretty much old tech

newer stuff: arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/04/…

Oliver Salzburg

9 flags, 0 downvotes New record for today :P

Ash

the only reason I wanted to reopen the question was to know new things.

i am getting 'em here

:)

Bob

@Ash or, y'know, spend five minutes on google

allquixotic

in general it's pretty doggone hard to formulate a topical question that won't be closed that starts with "Why"

Ash

15:24

:)

Psycogeek

@Ash didnt do it, well they actually did. many small portable devices use(d) "ram" for speed of returning from thier version of a Sleep. The battery in the portable device was kept from discharging fully, by "shutting down" (actually thier form of sleep) the device earlier, leaving sufficent battery for maintaining the ram they used as storage.

@Ash These portable devices once the battery ran down, could be "reset" in some way to re-fill the ram. People who did not understand them (of course) would be endlessly frustrated that the device did not operate as it had, once the battery had gone down to far. The battery (barly a percentage of the whole capacity) could maintain the small ram in the tiny device for weeks on end.

@allquixotic I can think of 2 good reasons why they wouldnt bother trying to maintain the ram. Software isnt designed for it, and The systems seriously advantaged from clearing out the Mess made in it and starting over again.

Bob

@allquixotic eh, I've got a few questions (that probably should've started with 'how')

@Psycogeek it's also bloody expensive

I suppose this is kinda on-topic? :P superuser.com/questions/510178/…

maybe, maybe not

allquixotic

15:41

@Bob topical, and it seems like it's not opinion-based because there should be some kind of explanation for that behavior

Psycogeek

@Bob all my computers have UPSes, soo , i dont know. their costs were a fair percentage of the computers costs, and battery maintanance keeps it a ongoing.

allquixotic

@Bob compare: "why isn't theoretical X situation reality?" vs. "why is this stupid behavior occurring with my actual system?"

yours is the latter, and is topical imo

Psycogeek

@Bob Oh thanks :-) make me have to go look that over again! damn reality facts.

@Bob Without the write cache older intel raid stuff blew chunks (that means it was rather slow). with this new stuff my benchie also did not change much, but its a bench. Now THAT bench is Supposed to talk more directaly to the disk (to test the disk only) , like they claim that of other disk becnmarks, but many people state that these benchies havent been able to talk to the disk (without all the software in between) since somewhere around win xp and sata?

Bob

@Psycogeek but the behaviour is the opposite of what I'd expect

write-cache enabled should be faster writes than disabled, no?

especially with only a 500MB test

at least it shouldn't be that much slower

Psycogeek

@Bob There has to be a programmer around here somewhere? One that would have some idea of how they write through and use them write commands that force flushing?

@Bob One last test that i usually do is to write From To , like copying something from ramdisk, or from a single drive to the thing and test the speed that way. Because I use 2 raids and 2 raid controllers, I can actually test it like that for real. Umm, mabey i should do that a little more, it was just working at the desired speeds , sooo i was not even complaining.

Bob

15:58

4

source

allquixotic

gotta love those "test pencils" (shown at bottom) "for those who do nothing"

balpha

16:24

How do I fix the easter egg bug?

allquixotic

the... easter.. what?

I'd like to understand what exact bug exists in the easter egg

balpha

7

Q: Has the cthulhu chat egg (and the other ones) been removed?

As some of you may know, there was an easter egg available in the chat called "the Cthulu Egg". In an homage to the old "How to parse Html with RegEx" answer, sending a chat message with a fitting reg expression would display some random quotes from the answer all floating over the screen. In th...

allquixotic

(hey, Clippy didn't pop up for me there!)

balpha

@allquixotic that was the bug :)

allquixotic

do i need to clear my cache / reload the page to get the update?

balpha

16:26

yeah, just f5

allquixotic

How do I attempt to test the easter egg bugfix?

^ got it

Undo the Snowman

<(?:"[^"]*"['"]*|'[^']*'['"]*|[^'">])+>

<[^>]*[\^[^]]*>.*]

^ No worky ;(

allquixotic

@UndotheSnowman um.... what?

Undo the Snowman

@allquixotic Trying to find an easteregg.

Darth Android

It might only be active in the SO chats

Similar to how clippy is specific to SU

allquixotic

16:32

@UndotheSnowman copying and pasting the regex won't get you an easteregg

Undo the Snowman

Yeah, it's SO only.

allquixotic

unless the easter egg is that regex

Undo the Snowman

chat.stackoverflow.com/rooms/1/sandbox

Send a message of <(?:"[^"]*"['"]*|'[^']*'['"]*|[^'">])+> in that room.

Darth Android

@allquixotic Familiar with the How to Parse HTML with RegEx question from SO?

allquixotic

@DarthAndroid yep

Undo the Snowman

16:33

@DarthAndroid Not the question. The answer.

Darth Android

@UndotheSnowman I figure they're synonymous by now.

Undo the Snowman

meh, maybe.

Psycogeek

@Bob What settings should I use? In the intel manager, I went from write back to cache off. and there was so little change in my short test of assorted file items (SSD to raid0) that i cant tell nothing.

I wonder if we have to boot now to even get it to change.

Psycogeek

17:08

raid0 to intel raid0 Write Back 22.8g mosly large files windows copy :52 :52
raid0 to intel raid0 Cache Off 22.8g mosly large files windows copy :54 :56

Psycogeek

17:21

terracopy TCs own buffer ,no compare, no cache 1:36 1:36 WriteBack 1:31 1:33

(i knew i should have left that back at XP, better test the fastcopy now)

Psycogeek

17:36

fastcopy FC own buffer , full compare Write Back 1:38 1:39
Fastcopy FC own buffer , full compare No Cache 1:44 1:44
and just so i know how fast fastcopy was compared to winders, i set it to no compare, and get 1:01 Intel Cache is still off

Boris_yo

Is JavaScript hard to learn?

allquixotic

yes

Boris_yo

@allquixotic Is JavaScript hard just to read it and not code it?

allquixotic

@Boris_yo minified or obfuscated javascript is extremely hard to read, non-minified javascript still has a few tricks that are counterintuitive

Boris_yo

@allquixotic There's SEO position that requires this. Do they expect person to build and code as well?

studiohack

17:46

Playing with Windows RT for the first time

apparently there is no Admin account??

Hennes

Now if they were 4218 rather then 1218 of even HE or EE CPU.. I know someone who can still use 6 more of those on her servers motherboard.
:12718381 AQ C64 can get on IRC, so yeah. It should be trival for a 286 (and in fact I used a 386SX-16MHz for internet access back then).

allquixotic

@Boris_yo probably

@studiohack Windows RT is locked down.

think of it like (non-jailbroken) iOS, or (non-rooted) Android.

it's about that limited in terms of how much you can do with it compared with GNU/Linux or Windows for x86

Ярослав Рахматуллин

sudo say give me all your cookies.

studiohack

18:03

@allquixotic oh I know. Dumb as I am, I didn't find the desktop, it is Win8 Pro afterall

so I was wrong haha

Ярослав Рахматуллин

Could anyone please volunteer a sec to help me figure out how to configure more than one IP address on a bridged (wifi/ethernet) connection in Win8?

studiohack

surprising how much this device frustrates me, in terms of the learning curve with a touch ONLY tablet, so it will frustrate non techies a bit

Hennes

Psycogeek

@Hennes ya just can't do that without passing them around you know (-:

Hennes

So, come to the potluck evening at Philips medical systems tomorrow and I will give you a real cookie

Ярослав Рахматуллин

18:09

Ok, superuser.com/questions/410490/… . Has any one used this netsh bastard? Can it assign several IP addresses to one interface?

Hennes

No win8 here (thank god, waiting for windows 9)

No bridges either

Plenty of posts on the main site (including some of mine) on how to assign multiple IPs to a single NIC

Ярослав Рахматуллин

The issue is sometimes finding the correct keywords. And you knew straight away that netsh wasn't for win8 - I didn't.

Psycogeek

@ЯрославРахматуллин i am not a net kinda person, but both of the things he couldnt do are possible. The "range" of addresses used for DHCP for ICS is adjustable in the registry. Virtual router manager beta.9 worked , I have not got v1.0 working yet (and more people seems to be having trouble with it). You cannot already have a secondary ICS share set up with it, because it uses ICS, and mabey strangely.

Ярослав Рахматуллин

Wait, I do have netsh on the win8 box .

Holy cow it understands "help"

.. as an argument!

okay.. the usage / synapsis is a bit convoluted. typical :\

Psycogeek

@ЯрославРахматуллин On the bridging, everytime i asked about it, people said dont use it?? for Sharing the internet, it was ICS only, so i never bridged (whatever that is even)

Ярослав Рахматуллин

18:21

ICS?

Boris_yo

Gmail - Images Are Now Showing: gmailblog.blogspot.co.il/2013/12/…

That means I still have to rely on Gmail's antivirus scanner?

Ярослав Рахматуллин

Bridging in win 8 has been working for me for over 3 weeks now. I can't say the same for XP Vista Win7

It just works now.

Finally

$ netsh interface show
The following commands are available:
Commands in this context:
show interface - Displays interfaces.
------------

how the f am i supposed to guess what to give it next

where is the man page? :D

netsh interface show interface

Admin State State Type Interface Name
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Enabled Connected Dedicated WiFi
Enabled Connected Dedicated Ethernet
Enabled Connected Dedicated Network Bridge

Im a wizard

Hennes

I always thought you just had to guess numbers for windows interfaces.
Start with 1, work up to a 110. Sometimes you just get lucky.

(No documentation anywhere which explains how what why that works)

Ярослав Рахматуллин

I'm guessing this is ok: netsh interface ipv4 add address 'Network Bridge'

what is a gwmetric - The metric to the default gateway. ?

metric tonne?

lets try 0

actually it's optional. yay

the magical moment where windows does it's inner logic based on exceptions...

25 sec to set a net addr and counting..

fingers crossed!

perhaps I should just google an example

yeah.. all good except add means replace.

Psycogeek

@ЯрославРахматуллин ICS internet connection sharing, the NAT way of sharing net. Set up the "internet" nic to Be Shared, and the "home" nic connections can share this one nics net connection. From what i read he also set that up wrong (understandably) because he shared his wireless, not the wired.

Boris_yo

18:37

@Psycogeek Is this bad? ^

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo let me guess a gassed up li-poly battery?

allquixotic

@Boris_yo looks similar to the warped battery problem i had on my last phone

Ярослав Рахматуллин

Psycogeek I don't want a double NAT...

HOLY COW!

$ netsh interface ipv4 add address "Network Bridge" 192.168.0.100 255.255.255.0
$ netsh interface ipv4 show ipaddresses
(...)
Addr Type DAD State Valid Life Pref. Life Address
--------- ----------- ---------- ---------- ------------------------
Manual Preferred infinite infinite 10.3.0.7
Manual Preferred infinite infinite 192.168.0.100

WINDOWS IS THE BEST

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo . . . or you put one of hennes chocklate cookies in there to hide it from me?

@ЯрославРахматуллин If you already have a nic to the nat doing net, why not net to the nic doing nat :-)

Ярослав Рахматуллин

18:55

me 10.3.0.6 --- 10.3.0.7 win8 laptop bridge 192.168.0.100 --- wifi -- crap ISP --- internoit

detail: wifi AP - ROUTER NAT - crap ISP

Psycogeek

@ЯрославРахматуллин and now you have your own repeater too?

Ярослав Рахматуллин

I guess

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek After a while, battery could not hold charge on old Samsung phone. After dismantling it, it was very inflated like you see on picture. This is not a mere battery, but battery inside of phone's back cover. Can it explode?

Ярослав Рахматуллин

Wow is this your picture?

Darth Android

@Boris_yo I think getting hot and melting/starting a fire is more likely than exploding, but yeah, I wouldn't keep that around any longer than you have to to get pictures and report it to your phone's dealer

Anonymous

19:07

first day at $work

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo cool more pics. it could "vent rapidly with flame" but it is not likely if you do not apply power any more to it. I usually put ones in that bad of shape outside, even if it opens up, the solvent and gas is toxic and makes people and animals sick. I would crack it open, and in this case wearing a face sheild and gloves temporarily, then replace the battery.

Hennes

Why not take pictures, then start a nice fire in a buckets, set up a camera and toss the phone in it ?

Psycogeek

@DarthAndroid that is a good idea, you might be able to scare them into getting you a full replacement. They do not need that kind of advertisement :-)

Anonymous

the view

Darth Android

19:17

That's a nice view

Ярослав Рахматуллин

@PatoSáinz

Gongrats!

Anonymous

thanks

Boris_yo

@DarthAndroid My phone's dealer? Why would I report for something out of warranty?

@PatoSáinz This is your office?

Anonymous

i'm a junior/secretary/data entry

Anonymous

@Boris_yo nah, it's an open plan office

Anonymous

19:21

and i chose to sit almost next to the servers, 5 metres away from that window

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz You need 39755xp points to be promoted to senior secretary and 65320xp to be promoted to office manager.

2

Darth Android

@Boris_yo That's less of a warranty issue, more of a serious safety hazard.

Anonymous

@Boris_yo i got this summer job by nepotism ;_;

Anonymous

my grandfather is the boss and the owner

Darth Android

@PatoSáinz That's just handled as an xp credit that you apply towards your leveling.

Anonymous

19:25

@DarthAndroid i don't see any future here, lol, it's just a summer job

Darth Android

You can't win the game if you don't play through to the finish!

:P

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz He means you are stuck until you acquire enough xp. That should open portal to your freedom.

!!define nepotism

ChatBot John Cavil

@Boris_yo nepotism The favoring of relatives or personal friends because of their relationship rather than because of their abilities.

Anonymous

^

Boris_yo

@DarthAndroid I bought phone from my cellular carrier long ago...

Anonymous

19:30

the most demanding part of the job is being a junior by the open bank hours, then i just sit back, read hacker news and be here while attending calls and enter some sale orders into some horrible ERP system

Psycogeek

@PatoSáinz Ohh thats what nepotism means, i thought you jumped in bed with the lady boss :-)

Anonymous

lol

Anonymous

@Psycogeek rude

Anonymous

i hate my workstation tho

Anonymous

the hardware provided by the company is god awful

Anonymous

19:32

i think i've never seen worse text rendering in this windows xp+low res screen ever

Anonymous

it makes me miss my dual screen home setup

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Bed jumping is considered ritual for initiates by banksters.

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo well as long as it isnt necrotism (killed the last boss) all is good.

Anonymous

necrotism is the way to go

Boris_yo

!!define necrotism

ChatBot John Cavil

19:35

@Boris_yo It means I aint got time to learn your $5 words

Boris_yo

It's not $5 word btw

Darth Android

Yeah, probably more like $6.50

Boris_yo

@DarthAndroid :)

Anonymous

nah

Anonymous

5.99999999999...

Anonymous

19:37

ugly marketeers... trying trick us into believing it's cheaper

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz Yeah. Buy 1 car and get nose hanky as bonus.

Anonymous

now i actually understand "The Stanley Parable"

Anonymous

gosh traditional offices are monotonous

Boris_yo

Having fun with spam...

Anonymous

19:55

spam is so fun

Anonymous

to read

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz Game about being stuck in corporate office

Anonymous

@Boris_yo yes

Anonymous

true as hell

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz Are you affraid?

Anonymous

20:00

@Boris_yo of what?

Boris_yo

@PatoSáinz Of being stuck in corporate office?

Anonymous

also, i should so something productive, like the CPU heating thing @allquixotic did, maybe i should mine bitcoins with every available computer in the office

Anonymous

@Boris_yo i'm just amused at how hard is the traditional grown-up world (i'm just a happy teenager)

Anonymous

at least i know i won't end up here because of the choices i want to make

Boris_yo

20:13

@PatoSáinz Clarify this one please.

Psycogeek

20:29

Never Ending Scrolling Web Pages , Good or bad?

Blog bot

20:42

Blog - Stack Exchange: Who are you? Take the 2013 survey!

Alison Sperling on December 18, 2013

Hi folks, just a quick note here to remind y’all that the yearly Stack Overflow User Survey is live!

We’ve edited the questions/answers based on your feedback from last year’s survey and suggestions posted on Meta.

As a small token of our appreciation, we’ll be donating $1 for each completed survey to your choice of of one of this year’s Stack Exchange Gives Back charities (look forward to an announcement soon regarding this year’s full donations).

As always, we’ll be posting the results here on the blog once the survey is completed. …

Bob

22:06

ugh

Canadian Luke

?

Bob

bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=897160

ekaj

22:18

Stack Overflow has a low of dupes in some place >.<

allquixotic

23:11

once again SO survey ignores people who are high rep in other trio sites but low on SO

because obviously you're just dead weight if you're a knowledgable super user or SF user but don't have anything special to add to SO, right?

2

right.

Boris_yo

@allquixotic http://sorr.forumotion.net/t27-downloads-streets-of-rage-remake-ports

You are welcome.

Bob

23:57

oh wow

note the address bar

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