Root Access

allquixotic

16:00

hehe, that would be funny if morse could do arbitrary unicode

Bob

Scientists are also sexy, let's not forget that.

Gowtham

@allquixotic and that video was trending this year according to youtube's blog

wheee finally mashable.com/2013/12/11/spotify-free-any-device/…

allquixotic

@Bob lol

Gowtham

hmm spotify mobile app doesn't check my region ;p

yay

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic Percent reduction in single vehicle crashes in passenger cars with ESC (electronic stability control): 35%, Percent reduction in single vehicle crashes in SUVs with ESC: 67%

from NHTSA study over 6 years in 5 states

Gowtham

16:14

bleh accidentally activated my premium trial @_@

Jimmy Hoffa

After I totaled a car on ice and did some research, this is why I will only own AWD from now on and demand my cars have stability control/traction control/whatever you call it

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa nice! the cars we use for day to day driving in my family both have ESC

they're not AWD though

Jimmy Hoffa

though @Braiam is right, electronic stability control would do nothing to stop accidents in the dominican republic...that's a totally different ballgame lol

allquixotic

yesterday I had the ESC system in my 2012 Civic actually kick in and work properly

there was a treacherous sheet of ice on the driveway into my work facility, as soon as i turned off the main road into the driveway... i couldn't see it beforehand and it covered the entire road...

Jimmy Hoffa

aye, the NHTSA wants to make it a requirement because it's been shown to be the most effective safety technology available, but the industry lobbyists have stopped them from instituting the requirement for years

allquixotic

16:16

i think in an older vehicle I'd have gone into a skid because I was doing about 10 - 12 mph and my vehicle had significant angular momentum from the turn

but my wheels started doing things that seemed, in the moment, to be weird, but in retrospect, kept my car from spinning or sliding

Jimmy Hoffa

ESC just works better with AWD but it still works great with non-AWD, you have to understand what it does - cutting or varying power to individual wheels as they slip etc with the purpose of keeping your cars direction in-line with the steering wheel commands, now in non-AWD it only has 2 wheels to work with, with AWD it has 4

allquixotic

yeah, I understand what it does in principle, and I could "feel" it working

Psycogeek

ahh a little air in the brake lines works about as good as anti-lock brakes :-)

Jimmy Hoffa

Yeah, if you're ever not convinced it works; try and go do donuts next time there's a good snow in a nice big parking lot somewhere. You literally can't without hitting the switch that turns it off

it's interesting

Crazy Buddy

@Boris_yo Nah, Chennai's good with me :D

Jimmy Hoffa

16:20

I remember testing it like that the first time I got an awd car with it, couldn't get the thing to spin around at all

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa pretty cool. I'm a car safety feature geek. as far as I'm concerned, I value the following in cars: (1) having everything about the car actually work (broken wipers, broken A/C, etc. is super depressing and must be fixed right away, but some people run the most dilapidated shit you can imagine, it's sad); (2) having a great safety rating and high-tech safety features; (3) MPG. the rest -- performance, style, etc -- is basically meaningless.

Psycogeek

@JimmyHoffa wont people just take thier driving to the next level, when nothing bad ever happens? Like when they required seatbelts, a study showed that the extra added safety of the drivers, had more pendestrians being run over :-)

allquixotic

I think I didn't buy an AWD car mainly due to price and MPG factors -- the brands that tend to have AWD on a sedan are, like, BMW, Subaru, Mercedes-Benz. the MPG is okay but not great, and the price of the car is just excessive

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic For me an amount of performance is a safety feature; I don't feel safe driving a vehicle that I don't feel can handle a sharp turn safely because in an emergency situation you may need it, or a car where if I need to get out of a situation I can't stomp on the gas and get moving away from other cars etc. It doesn't have to be crazy performance, typical modern cars perform well enough it just can't be a full-size SUV, or a pickup truck, or a little 1.6l micro-box.

Most typical cars can respond appropriately to feel safe but I just don't feel safe when I'm driving a car that doesn't respond well to my controls

Bob

ice on the road is a foreign concept to me

literally

Jimmy Hoffa

16:27

@allquixotic yeah MPG does dip a bit but some do well.. Currently my car is a Nissan Rogue and it gets 27mpg, it's not corolla mileage but it's also a larger car than that and with AWD it was only $20k new

Psycogeek

I wouldnt be surprised if a study didnt show that once air bags, and belts, add in some computerised anti-accident stuff, and the big numbers of deaths and injuries never seems to go down much. Some people need a 2x4 upside the head before they would build a house that does not fall down on them. If we built bumper cars, they would spend the whole day running into eachother :-)

Jimmy Hoffa

though you're right, lots of cars have the AWD version dipping around 22mpg or worse

Bob

@Psycogeek those don't reduce accidents and might even increase injuries, but they do reduce fatalities

Psycogeek

@Bob but fatalities are important , darwin and all.

Bob

@Psycogeek doesn't work that way when it's not under your control

Psycogeek

16:29

how about castration after your 3rd accident, thatll fix it

Jimmy Hoffa

@Psycogeek Actually if you look at the numbers, accidents, injuries, fatalities, all of those things in cars have reduced consistently and significantly for decades.

Psycogeek

@JimmyHoffa is it still around 100 people a day on average in the us alone?

Jimmy Hoffa

@Bob As a side note here's a fun question: All safety features being equal, what is the safest location inside a car and why?

Bob

@JimmyHoffa Sitting on the roof, of course. You'll fly right off! No more getting trapped!

Psycogeek

You see the news being heavily sponcored by the aotomptive industry can have a big stink about 2 people killed, and go on for 2.5 years about 1 death, but to point out daily the massive quantity of deaths occuring on the street just getting to work (and play) never qualifies as news. well not the kind those sponcors want to hear.

Jimmy Hoffa

16:33

@Bob Absolute middle point equidistant from each wheel - it's the point of least inertia. This is why the back seat is where people are always told is the safest, it's closer to the center and experiences significantly less inertial force in the event of an accident

@Bob In Australia: Trunk or Boot ?

Bob

@JimmyHoffa Honestly, I use them kinda interchangeably.

Journeyman Geek

;p

Bob

I think boot is more common, though.

Journeyman Geek

Bonnet or hood is more reliable.

Bob

@JourneymanGeek That's the other end...

Journeyman Geek

16:35

yup

but I've never heard an american call a hood a bonnet.

or someone from the commonwealth call a bonnet a hood.

Jimmy Hoffa

@JourneymanGeek That's because no american anywhere would call it a bonnet.

Gowtham

►

Journeyman Geek

precisely

Gowtham

Doesn't someone here cycle to work ?

Jimmy Hoffa

we should know, we invented the damn thing.

Journeyman Geek

16:37

the germans invented the damned thing ;p

Jimmy Hoffa

@JourneymanGeek 'mericuh we don't care wat you think you invented!

Journeyman Geek

You guys just made it cheaper

Bob

9

Jimmy Hoffa

I know we didn't invent the motor, but I was (unsurely) thinking we might have invented the motorized car where engines were previously used for other things first - bikes, industry, et al

but I admittedly know little about any of it

@Bob yeah, we definitely live in strange times... though I guess it's no different than the past when it was reading on the couch followed by "time for bed" followed by reading a magazine

Back when people had this on their night stand

(to those of you who catch the reference; did you see the same thing I saw on the inside page they opened to?? O_O)

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Now I keep thinking about updating A02 Bios on my replacement motherboard. The previous one I have replaced came with stock A04.

allquixotic

16:55

@JimmyHoffa the highest-mpg AWD car is this guy with a cool $40.6k MSRP: BMW 328d xDrive

Bob

well, time for bed ;)

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo I would want to update it , preferably before i got to deep into using it. if i was using it and everything has been working satisfactorily, i would not update unless the bios Notes/changelog specifically addressed something i needed. Like a usb fix, or a cpu that was not supported at first, or adjustment to the fan profiles. something i needed.

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa you know what's funny is that in UCB Professor Emeritus Albert Barltett's popular lecture "Arithmetic, Population and Energy", he says that things like safer vehicles and speed limits make the population problem worse :P

Psycogeek

@Bob have a good night.

Boris_yo

@Bob Woah dude! We have 13 hours difference!

Bob

17:00

@Psyco thanks

@Boris it's 4am

allquixotic

@Bob ninight, best buddy :D

Bob

and that was kinda a joke referencing the image above

Boris_yo

@Bob Ooops 15 hours difference 0.0

Bob

but I do have work in a few hours, so off the phone now :P

allquixotic

from fueleconomy.gov:

> Note: The average 2014 vehicle gets 23 MPG

that's freaking depressing... so much work and R&D goes into cars and yet we can't improve our average MPG beyond 80s standards

Bob

17:01

'night.

allquixotic

i had a 1997 Taurus that gets 23 MPG. where's all the improvement?

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Hmmm will need to find BIOS change log but there are now 19 versions of BIOS 0.0

Bob

@all electric cars. it's more efficient to run a gas engine at an optimized rpm and charge batteries/power an electric motor

Psycogeek

@JimmyHoffa nope still dont get it. But I did notice that was a "cocacola santa" and i had to check the Date, because coca-colacompany.com/videos/… cocacola has tried to convince us that they invented santa. Sure enough the coke santa was invented prior to this coke santa picture. 1931

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic I miss my AWD BMW 325... but had to get something bigger for the family

allquixotic

17:03

@Bob diesels are better electricity generators, so they should really make those hybrid powered cars use diesel

Bob

Also, average. people moving toward suvs...

allquixotic

@Bob yep

Bob

@all current hybrids can still be driven by the gas engine

allquixotic

most people who think they "need" an SUV really don't; it's just marketing selling them on it

you aren't supposed to be able to lay flat on your back and spread your arms out in a vehicle. it's a vehicle. you know. for traveling. people act like they have to have feet of arm/leg room on both sides to ride comfortably

sit upright in a comfortable seat and enjoy it

Jimmy Hoffa

as mentioned above, I can't own an SUV just because they don't respond well enough to safely get away from bad traffic situations

Psycogeek

17:06

@allquixotic and be able to sleep in it to save on motel fees :-)

Jimmy Hoffa

@Psycogeek Well that is beneficial... Though ironically in my little microbox BMW 325 I found the backseat extremely comfortable to lay down and snooze in on multiple occasions

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa I have about 250k miles behind the wheel (lifetime) and I can't think of a single situation where I've ever needed any special degree of speed or acceleration beyond what a run of the mill 4-cylinder sedan can provide

Psycogeek

you should try, no you shouldnt , sleeping in a metro

allquixotic

torque on the other hand could be useful for bad weather and hauling

but speed and acceleration? nope. never.

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic Speed - not usually, but handling to me is more important, being able to quickly change lanes to get away from a situation etc

allquixotic

17:08

@JimmyHoffa doing anything "quickly" just increases your risk, because sudden movements are more difficult for other drivers to react to than gradual movements -- quickly changing lanes is especially dangerous, because if someone else is trying to get in your spot (on a 3+ lane highway) from the other side, you'll already be there by the time they realize to pull back

Jimmy Hoffa

rarely speed is a necessity as opposed to braking, but it's just the sheer responsiveness, I don't feel safe if I don't feel like at all points in time the vehicle I'm driving will rapidly respond to me in whichever direction I need it to

allquixotic

if I ever have a situation where staying in my current lane is a hazard to my vehicle, it's much more preferable to brake (and my car has great stopping distance) than to speed up

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic There are situations where the safest thing to do is get the hell away from cars around you...

@allquixotic How safe is stomping on your brakes when a semi is riding your ass? Have you ever had a bus try to take your lane from you? You think you can brake quickly enough to get behind him?

Situations arise sometimes... you never know what's going to happen, that's why it's called an accident

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa there are a few edge cases where I could imagine it being a better option than slowing down, but like I said, in 250k miles of driving usually in contentious traffic conditions, I've never needed something more than what a perfectly ho-hum, run of the mill 4-cyl could provide

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic same here.

allquixotic

17:11

there's absolutely nothing fast or performant about a 2012 Honda Civic EX with the econ button turned on; in fact, with that button on, the acceleration is rather poor

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic I know, and that's plenty.

I said I dont' need high performance

I just need enough, SUVs don't provide it, tiny microboxes don't (or at least didn't used to, those little 1.4l engines and such have more go than they used to...)

Psycogeek

@allquixotic should have put an intel processor in that car, so it could step up and down as needed :-)

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa they don't make SUVs that are at least as good as a boring compact sedan? considering the attitudes of SUV drivers, I find that rather surprising

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic Some SUVs maybe, but the ones I've driven? It's like a boat. Same for pickup trucks.

allquixotic

I've very frequently seen SUVs on my highway do various risky maneuvers involving rapid lane changes; in almost all cases where this happens, the driver is flooring it, and they're not doing it because staying in their current lane is a hazard; they're doing it because they are trying to get ahead of everyone else

for instance, if traffic is slowing ahead, but one lane has more room ahead of the SUV than another, they will immediately dart into the lane with more room and floor it to eat up as much free space as possible in the shortest amount of time, then brake as hard as they can when they're up against the guy's bumper

Jimmy Hoffa

17:14

@allquixotic I didn't say they couldn't do it, it's about responsiveness. Try and slightly change the steering wheel in an SUV and it keeps going straight, I want to be able to move the steering wheel finely to get very accurate movements

sure if you stomp the gas and torque the wheel your SUV will go and change lanes rapidly and do whatever else, but you have to practically turn the steering wheel 120 degrees

Psycogeek

@allquixotic well they paid more than everyone else , in gas taxes and fees and repairs, and , , so they should own the whole freeway , or at least think they do.

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa yeah, and a larger vehicle has a harder time in general with merges due to the physical profile of the vehicle; no amount of cute engine design can compromise for that

@Psycogeek only problem is, Darwinism is actually kinda broken on the freeway

the stupid people have big, heavy vehicles that are more survivable in a severe crash than a small car

Psycogeek

@allquixotic git a rope

allquixotic

the smart people are more likely to have a more ... let's say fiscally and environmentally responsible vehicle, so they're more likely to die if they get involved in an accident

Darth Android

@allquixotic Larger vehicle has a harder time with merges? Just merge. They'll get out of your way. ;)

allquixotic

17:17

evolution needs to get with the times. don't know how, but it does. :P

maybe require an IQ test to purchase or rent or lease a vehicle, and your IQ determines how large of a vehicle you can own

higher IQ == licensed to buy bigger vehicles

lower IQ == econo-car

Darth Android

I mean, I've never seen a VW Bug stay in the lane beside an 18-wheeler with its blinker on.

allquixotic

@DarthAndroid lol

Psycogeek

@allquixotic but then who buys the humvees?

allquixotic

@DarthAndroid I haven't seen that many rude / presumptuous drivers of commercial vehicles on my road, actually

they won't just start eating up your space and you either move or get rammed

and if you let them over they'll tap their brake lights to "thank" you

the rude / presumptuous drivers I deal with on a daily basis are people gripping their steering wheel with white knuckles, shouting at the top of their lungs, honking their horn, merging to and fro, going literally as fast as traffic will physically allow, driving down the shoulder in heavy traffic, trying to get to work in the morning commute, in SUVs and pickups and sedans

Journeyman Geek

@allquixotic: but smart people would get a car just big enough for their needs ;p

Jimmy Hoffa

17:21

@allquixotic I think you must be driving in some strange traffic man.. try taking the highway into the mountains out here, one of the largest shipping lanes in the nation - semi's everywhere and they will not make it up the hill if they are slowed down because they can't regain momentum, so if they're cruising at 55 and come up to someone doing 35 they will change lanes so they don't have to slow down, whether you're in the next lane or not

allquixotic

the 18 wheelers treat me well

Jimmy Hoffa

I'm wondering if DC traffic is all chaufers and well too dense to really count as "driving" so much as "collectively walking with cars"

Psycogeek

@allquixotic i was riding with a trucker, a small pickup slipped up on his right edge while he was manuvering a wider right turn. he drove over the top of the Hood O-: of the guys car (by accident). then just dorve off down the road, like it was a daily battle.

Darth Android

@allquixotic Indeed, most of that was tongue-in-cheek; the 18-wheelers here are nice too, and I try to be nice in return. Blinker on? Sure I'll make space for you.

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa there are loads and loads of 18 wheelers on my commute because the stretch of highway I drive is separating major warehouses for food and bulk goods in the area (it's also VERY close to the Port of Baltimore, which receives incoming imports via the ocean)

but the ones that are rude or aggressive or presumptuous are definitely the minority

@DarthAndroid exactly -- I make space for them on purpose, but it's not like they'll just take it anyway if I don't

they're absolutely dangerous and scary if they don't use their blinkers though, and a small minority don't

Boris_yo

17:25

@Psycogeek Have a video of it?

Psycogeek

Its just wrong, the guberment had been subsidising trains to death. they subsidised them so much they were not as profitable doing the Job. then they drop the subsidies, and suddenly (as in many years) there were trucks everywhere. moving the same things the trains were. NOW the guberment wants trains back. but instead of the best use for them (moving boatloads of stuff) they are doing a Billions of dollers train to get Suits from LA to SF

@Boris_yo no, i was riding along to load and unload , not to do videos. i was the $50 documented alien job

allquixotic

@Psycogeek which one is that? BART?

Psycogeek

laweekly.com/2011-11-24/news/100-billion-bullet-train

Jimmy Hoffa

Iduno, lightrail here in Denver does pretty well and seems efficient, has never had any budget problems and has only grown and grown ever since it started..

Though technically that's a different tech than "train" typically refers to

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa in the MD area, most people who use public transportation are, almost without exception, very poor -- either at the poverty line or below, or at best, blue collar work

Jimmy Hoffa

17:35

@allquixotic ? and?

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa just saying that it tends to support that particular population and it seems a bit odd to have a large (numbers-wise) middle class full of knowledge workers driving cars when they could be doing it more efficiently with trains... but the way the train system's right of way is laid out, they almost never run to places where businesses have set up.

Jimmy Hoffa

@allquixotic Ah guessing that's an affect of it being laid out long ago due to Baltimore being one of the oldest cities

Denver's lightrail is quite new and was designed based on where people need to go now... perhaps 100 years from now that'll be insufficient but we can't plan for things like that, besides in 100 years we'll all just surf the web to work.

"God, traffic is horrible on Telstra today! I think they had to detour through Level3... it took me almost 25picoseconds to get in!"

allquixotic

@JimmyHoffa yeah -- basically the trains run through urban areas, which are basically the very definition of inequality, because the residents who live there are either the extremely wealthy (in penthouses etc) or the extremely poor (in run-down condos and apartments and city houses)... if either your place of residence or your place of business is even a little suburban, forget it, no train will get you to work without needing to get a taxi at one point or the other

they have bus routes that you might be able to catch after walking a mile at both ends, but the bus ride takes about 3 hours to go ~20 miles, so unless you're fine with either getting up at 4 AM or getting in to work at 11 AM, forget it

Psycogeek

@allquixotic public transportation and mobile devices are a good mix.

allquixotic

the train rights of way are extremely old and it's very hard for them to get permission to develop a new right of way, and then even if they have permission, there's the whole money problem

@Psycogeek for employers that let you work remotely, which are also a small percentage here

heck, if i could work remotely, i would probably sell my car and ride the stupid bus every day, and use my Surface Pro to get the first third of my work day done before I even get to the office

Psycogeek

17:42

@allquixotic i mean that it most often takes an extra hour to utalise such methods, soo having some entertainment , can be handy.

I love the bus and train, around here the people are friendly, the bart has a lot of space (footroom) , but ya have to know scheduling, and how to work the system, to get where your going. and the people who use it know how to get anywhere with it. but then there can be really inane stuff like: sorry we cant get you home after midnight . Like What ? I would think that would be the best time to utalise a designated driver :-)

Canadian Luke

clientsfromhell.net/post/69691947184/…

clientsfromhell.net/post/69284555512/…

allquixotic

17:58

!!tell 12596498 no

ChatBot John Cavil

Canadian Luke

!!tell 12596597 yes

ChatBot John Cavil

Hennes

Home ;-)

allquixotic

@CanadianLuke No. Seriously. That's embarrassingly bad :(

Canadian Luke

18:04

I know

But quite hilarious that someone had to deal with that

allquixotic

tempted to think that it isn't real -- even if it is in fact real, I don't want to believe it, because if there is someone out there who would think that way, ...

!!toostupid

ChatBot John Cavil

Gowtham

steamcommunity.com/groups/steamuniverse#announcements/detail/…

Steamboxes are bigger than I expected them to be ;p

They look like normal PCs :P

Psycogeek

""Steam sucks... tell us 300 people worldwide get a steam-console... oh no just USA
I have ever thought, wow cool, world wide, cant believe they are doing this and now... just sucks like every company ."" me: Ahh dont complain till you see what kind of Bugs and insurmountable hardware failures there are. US guineypigs

I would prefer to see them test the thing via 300 factory workers , as thier only toy after work , that'll get the second version viable.

Jimmy Hoffa

This reminds me of a story from the CSRs at a previous job I worked. True story:
*ring ring*
CSR: Hi, <redacted> how can I help?
User: Yeah, the software seems to have gotten into a strange state or having an error I think, it's frozen and has a message about exception something...
CSR: Ah, ok well I'd be glad to help you but for our logging and inspection of the issue for the future we'd really appreciate if you could send us a screenshot
User: Oh ok sure, one moment
CSR: *waits 5 minutes*
User: Ok it should be there now!

6

Moral of the story, when it comes to users, assume they need instructions on what a screenshot is

Boris_yo

18:21

@Psycogeek Nothing from these updates is clear to me except Nvidia VBIOS update and some LAN/Wi-Fi issues fixed: en.community.dell.com/support-forums/laptop/f/3518/p/19442213/…

Don't get how person assumed thermal curves were udpated. I see nothing of this in change log from A03 to latest A19.

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo wow, that is the worst (best) list of updates i have seen for a bios, what do they sell you with the first bios a ROCK :-)

Boris_yo

No, first BIOS is one that motherboard comes with.

A02 second BIOS offers:

1. Fixed intermittent warm reboot hang issue with fingerprint password enabled.

@Psycogeek worst (best) ? Which is it?

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo worst in such that usually they dont fix that many things, best in that they tried ?

@Boris_yo if that was my list for my computer, i would be putting the latest bios on. also it can be critical even that the software and drivers once updated sort of "match" the hardware software. So you prefer to have the drivers and firmware from the same general timespan.

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek There is nothing about thermal curves being improved...

They would not miss that, would they?

Psycogeek

OR, when not updating the bios, you also dont update the chipset drivers and other motherboard hardware driver items. Or when you update the things in general you do the whole gammut from bios to drivers to even software (in the case of special control software)

@Boris_yo yes i see you asking about what the person said. but I generally trust a User over a list. asking the user is a good idea.

Boris_yo

18:35

@Psycogeek I could ask technical support but they would not know anything probably and you need to get through burning sands to reach high level technician who knows his stuff.

allquixotic

@Psycogeek so what you're saying is i should ask Google to let me know when they update Gmail so I can update my BIOS to work with Gmail again?

Boris_yo

@allquixotic wat o.0 Gmail as drivers and BIOS as firmware?

allquixotic

yup

Boris_yo

In OEM standpoint your analogy not quite fits because Dell has its own BIOS and nVidia drivers. Gmail and BIOS are not connected in any way.

allquixotic

sure they are :D

Boris_yo

18:38

@allquixotic If NSA is behind BIOS then yes.

allquixotic

Gmail enables hardware accelerated 2D Canvas or SVG transformations or WebGL --> GPU makes hardware calls to implement hardware acceleration --> motherboard parts (e.g. PCI-E bus) provide certain support for hardware to do XYZ stuff, but maybe it needs to do ABC stuff too, so needs a BIOS patch to support GPU doing hardware accel stuff that Gmail added

if you never used those same routines on a different site, you could easily reason "Gmail made me update my BIOS"

Psycogeek

@allquixotic no i specifically did not say that. But i could, if things are all working including software, there is no point in breaking it.

allquixotic

all applications are indirectly connected assuming there is some bug that exposes the fragility of the layering

there could be a bug in MySQL in a Google data center that corrupts data which is sent to the browser which is translated into unsupported commands sent to the GPU which are translated to a BSOD or a PCI-E bus reset or something

when it's properly working and bug-free the stack appears isolated as if one layer cannot affect another

but any time you have a hardware/software system that's a "stack" of any kind, bugs can separate the layers and allow any higher layer to have a negative effect on the stability of the whole system

this is why there have sometimes been JavaScript based browser attacks that lead to rootkits without even needing to download any files and run them explicitly as the user

Boris_yo

@allquixotic Why Gmail would use 2D canvas and SVG transformations, let alone WebGL? It is mere website with no special effects.

Psycogeek

@allquixotic when you get done fully explaining what a royal mess there is , and how f--up it can all get, you make me want to get a mac :-) 1 hardware 1 software :-)

allquixotic

18:43

@Boris_yo I was speaking hypothetically

gmail could enable those features if they wanted to

@Psycogeek macs aren't immune to bugs or problems

quite the contrary

!! s/e 1 software /e vendor 1 software vendor /

ChatBot John Cavil

@allquixotic @allquixotic when you get done fully explaining what a royal mess there is , and how f--up it can all get, you make me want to get a mac :-) 1 hardware vendor 1 software vendor :-) (source)

allquixotic

doesn't mean the vendor is any good

Boris_yo

Who could have thought? These days firmware and software got so complex that firmware is required to be updated to just like drivers to match software.

Psycogeek

@allquixotic oh i know. A buddy is always trying to tell me "we dont have that problem with mac" but just yesterday he was telling me how far he could throw the mac through a window :-)

allquixotic

IIRC the performance of OpenGL on a Mac is pretty bad

but that's as of a few years ago

!! s/Open/Closed/

ChatBot John Cavil

18:46

@allquixotic IIRC the performance of ClosedGL on a Mac is pretty bad (source)

Boris_yo

Is this adapter works both ways?

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo not likely, you got a D>A conversion going on in this thing, it would be a miracle plug if it went both ways.

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek But both ways is feasible?

Canadian Luke

@Boris_yo In one device? I don't think it'd be worth the money

To go from A to D, you'll need power as well, not just a break-out adapter

Darth Android

^

Boris_yo

18:59

@CanadianLuke Why I don't need to have power when going from D to A?

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo yes either way one at a time has always had both cheap, and great adapters for doing so. they would be active , meaning it has to do a lot of work to accomplish it. and often the cheap ones make a picture of some sort and the horribly expencive oens make a picture that is totally usable.

Canadian Luke

I'm going to guess, as I don't know for sure, that Digital has enough power to break it away to Analog, but Analog needs to convert the signal completely to Digital. I don't know for sure, but that would be a good question for Super User

Boris_yo

@allquixotic Yay! John Cavil has now Santa hat too!

Psycogeek

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hdmi hdmi pin 18 can have tiny bits of power on it, any really good converter is going to be powered.

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Okay but HDMI cable is such expensive? 10 metres are like $70

allquixotic

19:08

@Boris_yo patents

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo 30feet of hdmi i would probably want the $70 one, because the china $30 one will have issues. When digital signal is weak, some stuff will work some stuff wont. only a good cable will be sure.

Boris_yo

@allquixotic USB 3.0 cables also expensive. Patents too? How about coaxial cables? Patents?

Psycogeek

What is getting me is most of the HDMI is a unruley cable, it does not lay, no softness

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Most cables in China sold have good reviews :)

@Psycogeek I guess I can forget about seeing HDMI cable retractable one day...

Psycogeek

We have had for Ages now, premium shielded multi cables that were still soft enough and did the jobs, why HDMI picks being a tree twig.

@Boris_yo sure 6" ones or the long ones? because distance gets tough for hdmi doesnt it?

Boris_yo

19:17

@Psycogeek If it gets tough, use repeater.

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo just hold on there , I live in america, there aint no cable made that ISNT a china cable now :-) Stupid americans going to lose everything. today they get people to be slaves, tomorrow they cannot Do Anything Themselves. China Owns

@Boris_yo but such a waste. a repeater is like having a pickup truck with a rusted bed, and a clown car following you picking up the pieces . All you need is One good connection.

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Conspiracy smells to me...

Psycogeek

I just bought a japanese sound recorder, best thing for doing these "pro" sound, the thing is very well designed. and very well built. I fond out it is a japan model

. . . made in china .

Boris_yo

A greatest newest Dyson vacuum cleaner! ... made in China
A greatest newest nVidia chip! ... made in China
A greatest newest Thor's hammer! ... made in China
A greatest newest silicone breasts surgery! ... made in China

Your life? Made in China. Air, water, fire, earth also made in China.

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo ugg, got some house conduint wire last week to run the antenna rotator, and it was real copper (yay), but the outter sheild was the most horrid plastic garbage (boo). It was proably made from recycled plastic (yay) but it would proabably break and fall apart in the walls of your house and burn it down (booo)

Boris_yo

19:26

@Psycogeek 2/2 for yay and boo. Draw!

You watched Fast and Furious?

Heard the news? facebook.com/PaulWalker

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo Paul Walker is a charity?

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek No he had his own charity. Scroll down to get shocked...

Bob

@journeymangeek superuser.com/questions/687057/… narq, but maybe of interest to you

Psycogeek

Ohhh, killed by the number 1 killer of people who arent even sick or old.

Hennes

I am tempted to bring my own laptop to work and properly investigate. However right now the problem only exists in a test database. One which we should no longer need in a week or two. The filenames for the real database are called things like 'material.cvs' rather than 'material MM DD YYYY.cvs`, so that avoid the problem.
And right now I just use 'save as' and then click on an existing filename to get a working situation.

Boris_yo

19:29

@Psycogeek Big Brother

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo drive fast die hard.

The fast and their furious relatives

Boris_yo

@Psycogeek Media cover up for Illuminati ritual.

allquixotic

@Boris_yo only in Deus Ex

Hennes

@Psycogeek Meuh? I disagree. HDMI usually has two modes: 1) It works. 2) It does not work at all. There should be no intermittend problems or issues.

And for short cables (say up to 3 meters) any halfway decent cable will do.

And if you want to avoid paying $ for patent, use display port and not HDMI

Psycogeek

@Hennes different devices. like say 2 different tv items.

I dont get the opertunity to take such risks with bad electronics. If your at home setting up stuff, and it takes 2 weeks to get another cable, is no sweat. But if your at a job, and your buttox is on the line, stuff has to work always in every situation.

the economy might not be so f---ed up if anything worked right always anymore.

Boris_yo

19:38

@Hennes There are. I found some in chinese HDMI products reviews like cables and adapters. Example is bad quality picture output on HDTV.

Hennes

HDMI is fully digital. Either the pixel information renders, or it does not.

There is almost no gray area

Anolog would be:  BAD ---------- Better ------------- Good.
HDMI is           WORKS WORKS WORK WORKs WORKs   FAILS.

There might be a very small area between work and fail where it works some of the time, but finding that is going to be hard.

Psycogeek

@Hennes but each electronic device that uses it, can vary in the signaling , terminations , curcuits, and all that stuff. so while it either works or doesnt, a cable Barely working for one person does not guarentee it will work for another.

Hennes

If the cable meets specs it should just work.

If it does not meet specs it should not be sold

But goijg above specs by adding special colours, gold (worse conductor than copper) connectors, labeling the cable with a SIGNAL IN and a SIGNAL OUT does not change anything

Psycogeek

@Hennes i have not concidered the purpose of gold to increase conductivity, but to be a softer metal than the Steel :-) that it is usually painted on, so more molecules connect , plus it is a bit better about oxidations.

Hennes

Oxidation can matter if you unplug the cable a lot

Softer should not matter.

Boris_yo

19:46

Gold spray is really from gold?

Hennes

We do not get better quality if more electricity flows across the connector. Either the voltage rises to a treshhold, or it does not.

Psycogeek

I have seen some stuff Dig right in. but enough times around, the stuff it was digging into is all gone anyways.

Hennes

In the case of cables of SIMM/DIMM connectors: Yes. Probably added electrostitaclly (or whatever the english word is).

Put it in a bath with gold salts. Apply a current. a very thinn gold layer deposits itself.

Psycogeek

@Hennes but when it comes to cable length the preservation of the elecrical energy and reduction of interferances is critical. And it will work Or it wont.

Hennes

Aye. But for anything under 10 meters (30 ft), do not bother. Just buy the cheapest cable.

Psycogeek

19:50

yup, most of them shold work.

Canadian Luke

Wait wait wait... Gold is a worse conductor than copper? Where is this proof?

Boris_yo

@Hennes SIMM and DIMM in cables? I thought it has to do with RAM o.0

!!/learn Mr. Evil "<msg> this is a message reply"

ChatBot John Cavil

@Boris_yo Command mr. learned

Hennes

They also have contact point and also gold sold in 'gold plated. absolutely premium! Just cost you the whole contents of your wallet and the soul of your first born child!'

Boris_yo

@Hennes lol :D Nicely put man! But you forgot to mention diamonds: bestbuy.com/site/…

mr.

!!mr.

ChatBot John Cavil

20:01

@Boris_yo Input not matching /<msg> this is a message reply/. Help: User-taught command: Evil

Boris_yo

Evil

!!/mr.

ChatBot John Cavil

@Boris_yo That didn't make much sense. Use the !!/help command to learn more.

@Boris_yo Input not matching /<msg> this is a message reply/. Help: User-taught command: Evil

Boris_yo

mr. evil

!!/forget mr.

ChatBot John Cavil

@Boris_yo Command mr. forgotten.

Boris_yo

!!/learn evil "<msg> this is a message reply"

ChatBot John Cavil

20:03

@Boris_yo Command evil learned

Boris_yo

evil

<msg>

msg

Canadian Luke

@Boris_yo Check the reviews on that cable... The first 5 star review is awesome!

Boris_yo

@CanadianLuke At least 98 people bought this cable?!

Canadian Luke

Boris_yo

Haha! BestBuy gets customer testimonial:

"Thanks to BestBuy, I am now diamond entrepreneur!"

Canadian Luke

20:07

But I'd still like to see proof that gold is a worse conductor than copper

Boris_yo

!!evil

ChatBot John Cavil

@Boris_yo this is a message reply

allquixotic

!!lean test script development or defect retesting

ChatBot John Cavil

@allquixotic lean test script development

Hennes

uhm, lets open wikipedia

Boris_yo

20:12

@allquixotic Can can I trigger bot's custom reply to specific chat word?

Hennes

Electrical resistivity and conductivity

Electrical resistivity (also known as resistivity, specific electrical resistance, or volume resistivity) quantifies how strongly a given material opposes the flow of electric current. A low resistivity indicates a material that readily allows the movement of electric charge. Resistivity is commonly represented by the Greek letter ρ (rho). The SI unit of electrical resistivity is the ohm⋅metre (Ω⋅m) although other units like ohm⋅centimetre (Ω⋅cm) are also in use. As an example, if a solid cube of material has sheet contacts on two opposite faces, and the resistance between these contact...

Ω per meter: Gold 2.44×10−8. Copper 1.68×10−8. That means copper is about 46% better

Boris_yo

@Hennes Nice headphones...

Hennes

Which headphones? Confused.

ohm the OHM sign ?

allquixotic

@Hennes that's a bad OHMen

Hennes

OHM

Psycogeek

20:21

@Boris_yo now that was funny

Braiam

20:40

what to do, what to do? superuser.com/a/687083/235569

Psycogeek

20:54

man why they make stuff so small :-)

allquixotic

@Psycogeek :P if they didn't, your phone would be the size of your house

and your computer would be the size of your city block

Psycogeek

@allquixotic ahh this is a simple printer, the only reasons they put all that stuff in there is to suck up the ink, and charge me for it.

I am going to remove it all, and hook up the drive motors direct to the USB :-)

Boris_yo

21:21

@Psycogeek :D

@allquixotic Aahaha!

They keep stalking me! I already bought VGA cable.

Guys where do I get these headphones? Ω

Bob

@hennes the gold plating is for corrosion resistance

copper oxide is a very poor conductor

I think they usually use nickel otherwise

or was it tin?

but you'll almost never find copper connectors

Boris_yo

21:44

@Psycogeek How long does 30cm glue stick lasts in glue gun 40W?

Darth Android

@Boris_yo Depends on how much glue you're using?

Boris_yo

@DarthAndroid Occassional/rare repairs?

Darth Android

Well, I mean that statement is like asking how far a diesel engine will run on 30 gallons of gasoline.

It only gives you half the information you need to answer the question.

Glue in a hot glue gun is used up however fast/often you squeeze the trigger

So it very much depends on what kind of repairs you're doing, and exactly how much glue you're using.

I'm pretty sure my parents have been using the same 15cm stick in their glue gun for the past several years

but that's after I was at home and would go through 5-6 15cm sticks in a few hours building a castle with Popsicle sticks.

Bob

22:02

lol

use PVA glue for plain wood :P

(PVA glue is very good when it can soak into the fibres, and terrible otherwise - never use it on plastics or metals)

you're more likely to snap the wood than break the bond

Psycogeek

22:36

". . . and why do you want to work for MegaCorp Conglomerated Inc?" "well you sent all the jobs overseas, all the products i was using to make money are now put out by you and are pure trash, You run every workplace from here to china, and have the only money left in this country to pay anyone with." "Well we didnt get there by hiring people with an attitude like yours."

(i just wanted the 10% employee discounts)

Boris_yo

This website is spammy: wiki.answers.com/Q/How_long_do_hot_glue_sticks_last_in_years

Psycogeek

@Boris_yo hot glue is evil, i just fixed a china GPS that was put together with masking tape fiber tape, kaptan tape, and hot glue. the hot glue didnt really stick.

Bob

@Psycogeek it's not really supposed to stick

use epoxy if you want a strong bond on smooth surfaces

Psycogeek

and dont use duct tape on ducts :-)

Bob

or superglue if you don't have epoxy

(though superglue sucks in shear)

note: you'll sooner smash it than get the epoxy to come apart

Psycogeek

22:50

glue (gl¡) noun
1. a. A strong liquid adhesive obtained by boiling collagenous animal parts such as bones, hides, and hooves into hard gelatin and then adding water. b. Any of various similar adhesives, such as paste, mucilage, or epoxy.
2. An adhesive force or factor: Idealism was the glue that held our group together.

verb, transitive
glued, gluing, glues
1. To stick or fasten with or as if with glue.
2. To fasten on something attentively: Our eyes were glued to the stage.

[Middle English glu, from Old French, from Late Latin glús, glút-, from Latin glúten.]

ChatBot John Cavil

Server error (status 500) occured (message probably too long)

Psycogeek

See it aint even glue, cause it doesnt have any gluten :-)

Boris_yo

http://www.a1papersize.org/
http://www.a2papersize.org/
http://www.a3papersize.org/
http://www.a4papersize.org/
http://www.a5papersize.org/

Spammy?

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