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13:00
@somequixotic Yes sir?
@Boris_yo just saying hi
@slhck How would hard drive work with router and printer? You mean you can actually wirelessly transfer data and activate printing?
@somequixotic Sure sir.
What is the current world situation on AI advancement? Will we have Skynet someday our humans cannot built such complicated AI?
@Boris_yo it's a matter of philosophy
@somequixotic So you say it is science fiction and no more and will stay same always?
Strong AI is hypothetical artificial intelligence that matches or exceeds human intelligence — the intelligence of a machine that could successfully perform any intellectual task that a human being can. It is a primary goal of artificial intelligence research and an important topic for science fiction writers and futurists. Strong AI is also referred to as "artificial general intelligence" or as the ability to perform "general intelligent action." Strong AI is associated with traits such as consciousness, sentience, sapience and self-awareness observed in living beings. Some references emp...
The philosophy of artificial intelligence attempts to answer such questions as: * Can a machine act intelligently? Can it solve any problem that a person would solve by thinking? * Are human intelligence and machine intelligence the same? Is the human brain essentially a computer? * Can a machine have a mind, mental states and consciousness in the same sense humans do? Can it feel how things are? These three questions reflect the divergent interests of AI researchers, cognitive scientists and philosophers respectively. The scientific answers to these questions depend on the definition of...
13:07
@Boris_yo You can plug in a USB drive and share it over the network. Same with a USB printer.
'lo @somequixotic
@Boris_yo No; I'm saying that we haven't even decided, on a theoretical basis, whether it's even possible or not
whenever there is academic philosophical discussion over a topic, that means that the topic is sufficiently debatable as to be presently indeterminate in terms of what science is able to tell us -- we can't definitely say yes or no
@somequixotic Then we have long way.
there's no "philosophy of whether gravity exists" because we all know it does
but there's a philosophical discussion, ongoing at the present time, about whether or not true AI is possible in the first place
there are people way smarter and more learned than me who have argued both for and against the possibility of self-aware AI, and then argued various aspects of whether they would be dangerous or not, whether we could control them or not, whether they would have moral standing as a "life form" or not, etc.
Are we sure gravity exists? It might not exist and just seem that way due to the positive curvature of spacetime.
@Hennes the philosophy of physics explores that kind of thing -- I don't think the philosophy of physics will ever permanently go away because there's always more to learn about physics, something else undiscovered, same thing with math and all other physical sciences, or even more broadly, all sciences
but scientific truth operates on "truth within a framework" or something like that; Kuhn's paradigms, etc... within the current paradigm there's no discussion of whether gravity exists... the current paradigm can best be described as The Standard Model
we'd basically have to re-write the standard model if we wanted there to be a world where the phenomenon that we observe as gravity is explained under different mechanics than it currently is
which isn't impossible, but it would be very difficult to explain all the phenomena that the standard model explains, using a different theory which (1) explains everything that the standard model explains AND (2) explains some other stuff which the standard model can't explain
13:16
If ever strong self-aware AI is possible, humanity will be living in another Skynet or Matrix world.
@JourneymanGeek Corvo Attano too? :P
@OliverSalzburg Congrats with your new avatar and yes I can explain it.
@Boris_yo I don't believe you for one second!
@OliverSalzburg Light that comes up is a part of refrigerators mechanism. It lights up when you open door in order to illuminate refrigerators content.
13:27
@Boris_yo do you know what meme is that?
@Boris_yo lol That's what they want you to think!
@jokerdino I don't.
@OliverSalzburg You mean there is different propose it has? Like radiating and causing consumers cancer?
It can also have spying aspect of fridge that's bought in USA. It is NSA that spies and CIA that funded research and production.
@ЯрославРахматуллин Comrade?
someone needs to do TinEye for memes...
@somequixotic totally. When a japanese gets dishonoured, he disembowels himself. When a cat gets dishonoured, all the witnesses get disemboweled.
13:46
The comments just keep growing...
Man, I can't believe all these bad puns. Cut it out! (Ugh.. can't believe I sed that) — Drake Clarris 6 mins ago
Anyone notice that all questions related to "How do I remove file $randomFileName?" get tons of upvotes?
Yup.
Could have given a good answer. rm \`, rm -i ?, mc` and F8, etc etc etc etc
BTW, my .finger used to point to /dev/fd0
Do we want more bad jokes? yes we want! Do these geeks never sleep? I'll strip them off their comment rights soon.
But seriously, I'm going to delete the comments soonish.
14:01
oh, forget about yes
Bob
Bob
@slhck If you do, could you put a screenshot here for posterity? :P
@Bob you mean if
expected: fi
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek :)
if you do; could you put a screenshot here for posterity; done; done? fi
Bob
Bob
Actually, I might start using feeds.
14:04
All you stop or I'll take my gun and zip you away.
Guns? That is way more modern than tar and feathers .
my pen collection at work
Bob
Bob
@slhck Well now.
another victim of Markdown :P
@tapped-out you mean Ghetto Chat Markdown
Bob
Bob
14:11
No command 'stop' found, did you mean:
Command 'halt' from package 'sysvinit' (main)
(yay, formatting)
Bob
Bob
That used four different types of quotes O.O
i quite like SE markdown, actually. chat, on the other hand...
Ghetto Chat Markdown appears to be implemented using a series of extremely poorly designed regular expressions
it's not actually parsed
Bob
Bob
@tapped-out SE markdown is vanilla
@somequixotic bobince would have a fit
4431
A: RegEx match open tags except XHTML self-contained tags

bobinceYou can't parse [X]HTML with regex. Because HTML can't be parsed by regex. Regex is not a tool that can be used to correctly parse HTML. As I have answered in HTML-and-regex questions here so many times before, the use of regex will not allow you to consume HTML. Regular expressions are a tool th...

14:13
There it is, for posterity.
Bob
Bob
@slhck Thanks!
@slhck posteriority? I think you mean posterity
Yes.
Thank you.
posteriority == I don't... even know... for future buttocks?
4
Bob
Bob
lol
posterior is more 'rear' than 'buttocks'
14:15
Well, see, that's my Latin taking over.
aww, he edited his message saying posteriority
You can link to the history and pin it on the wall of shame if you like :P
what's the wall of shame?
DON'T TELL ME WHAT TO DO
Bob
Bob
> Write a regexp to match C preprocessor commands in a C program.
Urk.
I hope they don't expect me to take into account comments.
14:20
actually, one definition of posteriority in thefreedictionary suggests it could mean the same thing as posterity - just written oddly
Well, /* */ comments. Or is // also allowed in C ?
@Hennes both IIRC
or maybe that was java
Bob
Bob
@jokerdino The second one was not available in C89.
0
Q: Node.js and serial port compiling problems

aphextwinmy system is: Windows 7 64 Bit Visual Studio 2012 Express Node 0.10.15 socket.io (compiles) Python 2.7 I'm trying to install serialport under vs-console by npm install serialport --msvs_version=2012 but some dependencies are missing and I've no clue how to fix it... here´s a list of all depen...

both are allowed in C.
14:21
Microsoft compilers can parse //
is this on topic for SO?
or maybe SU?
I think SU
Comments are for cowards!
I think it's not ANSI C but I could be wrong
Bob
Bob
// is only in C as of C99, IIRC
@slhck Yea, that was C89.
can't just jump into any busy room and ask advice, tried in the Comms and they were quick to remind me "this is SFs room"
14:22
I know GCC accepts it. Then again, GCC is to C what turbo pascal is to pascal
@rlemon because it's so closely related to development, I'd say it could stay on SO, although technically it would also be accepted on SU
Bob
Bob
@Hennes Yup, standard-wise, // was introduced after ANSI C (C89).
@OliverSalzburg who(["even","comments"],"code")
@somequixotic hrm, it is hard because the answer could depict where it lives.
Bob
Bob
Anyway, there's no easy way to account for comments when trying to match preprocessor commands properly.
it is an npm issue, but it might require some code changes to fix.
14:23
@Bob there aren't many compilers these days still in use that only support ANSI C89; they'd at least support C90, and C99 support is very very common too
@Bob you need to build an abstract syntax tree; I don't think regex can handle that problem
function comment(str) {
  return;
}

comment("take that parser!"); // you will never get rid of me!
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic I think at least gcc lets you specify C89
anyways, i'll leave you back to your discussion.
void function ?
@Bob yes, but IIRC its default is either C90 or C99, with GNU extensions... meaning, you can tell it to specifically compile in C89 mode, but that hasn't (ever?) been the default
Bob
Bob
14:25
the problem is, the CSE school at my uni loves C and Java. Mostly C.
@Bob C is great with the proper libraries
Bob
Bob
I wouldn't put it past them to have a lecturer demand C89.
C and GLib is actually quite usable. more syntax jargon than Java or C#, but powerful nonetheless
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic We're specifically doing regex. I was under the impression that it wasn't possible, so chances are just consider simple cases.
with GLib + Gvfs + GIO, you can do a lot of stuff
@Bob certain regex engines with backtracking might be able to do it with 100% reliability, but it would be pretty slow, and very difficult to write
Bob
Bob
14:26
@somequixotic shudder
I think the reluctant quantifier (aka lazy) comes into play there
Bob
Bob
Also, I think we were supposed to use POSIX regex.
Not PCRE.
Meh
@Bob POSIX regex doesn't support lazy/reluctant quantifiers, so no backtracking
Not being able to use PCRE is a major pain in the butt.
Bob
Bob
14:27
Ya.
you've been given an impossible assignment and you should write a paper explaining why the assignment is impossible even in theory
@somequixotic Why collect pens when you can use them?
you'll get an A+, I guarantee it
either that, or get the teacher to officially release a proviso to the assignment along the lines of "don't worry about comments"
Bob
Bob
Best part? We were told to use POSIX regex in a course that's supposed to teach us Perl
though, I guess this is still in the early intro stages
@somequixotic Prolly overthinking - it's a quick exercise, not an assignment :P
@Bob the assignment might be a trick attempting to get you to try to interpret a context-free language using a regular language parser, and the person who tells them you cannot do that gets an A+
Chomsky classifications and all that
14:30
Don't remind me.
Bob
Bob
Also, I just realised why there's so many homework questions on SO. Our lecturer specifically linked us there. Knowing some people... shudder
@Bob I wonder if your teacher trolls SO
your teacher might even be watching this chat right now :D
Bob
Bob
:(
@somequixotic I think I posted a pic of mine some time back. LOTS of G2s in many colours ;p
@JourneymanGeek I can't do more than red, blue and black without looking unprofessional
black ink is required for signing forms so I tend to keep more black ink around, just in case I'm somewhere with a random pen and need to sign something
14:42
@somequixotic: I use black for most things. When I'm actually getting semi creative though, the plain paper and pens come out.
usually wear out my blue pens taking scratch notes at my desk, and use black ink when I'm at meetings
@somequixotic: I have 3 shades of blue.
@JourneymanGeek that's a start. add another 47 and you got a bestseller
3
those Hybrid Gel Grip K157 pens I have are excellent in terms of ease of writing and writing speed and accuracy (and they don't get dry until the ink is used up), but the ink gets used up fast, and it's pretty easy to smear recently written stuff
they're also pretty terrible at bleedthrough on the cheap paper notebooks we have here
Bob
Bob
14:44
@somequixotic I have yet to see a gel pen that dries fast.
even the sharpie pen fine point is better with bleedthrough than the gels
Bob
Bob
cleaning a pen is so annoying
the PaperMate InkJoys are new to my collection; they aren't quite as bold or smooth lined as a gel pen or felt pen, but they dry instantaneously, with zero bleed-through, and they're much more reliable than a normal ball point
Bob
Bob
that might be the one thing stopping my ink experimentation
@somequixotic eh, inkjoys are decent
I'm not quite sure what type of pen these InkJoys are; they might just be a new variation on the ball point idea
Bob
Bob
14:46
there's a couple out there
the tip looks like a ballpoint but I've never seen such a consistent ballpoint output
Bob
Bob
Bic has a few really smooth ballpoints
pricey, though
@JourneymanGeek NO
BAD
@JourneymanGeek Try Bing
14:47
honestly? Its almost unusable
@JourneymanGeek they should take the VT-x functionality out of CPUs before selling them to people like you
they should put you on a "no-virt" blacklist and cause your ISP to block downloads of virtualbox, vmware, qemu, kvm, etc. and prevent you from acquiring CPUs with virtualization extensions
2
lol
why the strong feelings? >_>
14:48
haha
I want to see Bing!
@JourneymanGeek Is Netscape still alive or only in VMs?
what if he tried to install it on gasp actual hardware!
@JourneymanGeek I'm being sardonic
blinks at bing
14:49
I actually think that's quite cool
Bob
Bob
@JourneymanGeek You reminded him of my 98 experiments
@JourneymanGeek Is Netscape still alive or only in VMs?
@Boris_yo Netscape is dead, but its codebase lives on in Mozilla... the most similar thing to Netscape that's still available is the Mozilla Suite or one of its several forks
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic 'course, that's more a token thing now
if you just want the Netscape-based browser rendering engine though, you'd use Firefox... it still has a good bit of Netscape legacy in it
that's the sucessor to the Netscape suite IIRC
(at least in spirit)
lol
thats what was preinstalled.
@tapped-out yup; Seamonkey 2.x is based on the latest Gecko engine from Firefox, but with the good old stuff still integrated :)
@somequixotic I thought it's Gecko that Mozilla uses...
14:51
What's this?
@Boris_yo Seamonkey, Firefox, and all other Mozilla related projects use Gecko, which is a descendant of Netscape's codebase
artifact of the snipping tool on Win8
@OliverSalzburg Is that IE4?
oh nm. netscape
14:52
@jokerdino do you see the gigantic "N" icons?
@OliverSalzburg Google Places returned to past.
Bob
Bob
Now I want to find a copy of Win3.1
would Internet Explorer put the Netscape "neh neh neh neh neh" icon in it?! :P
@Bob i've got one :P
@jokerdino It's part of the screenshot @JourneymanGeek posted
I was talking about the "watermark" in the image ;P
I think this is the video you guys should be watching
damn
xitami's downloads are down ;p
Bob
Bob
Wait WHAT
@somequixotic i am not part of the browser war.
@somequixotic Why is coding on that picture is so old? Everything on Google page is misaligned.
Bob
Bob
14:54
> I just recently installed the leaf theme onto my site, www.troop133.com , and it worked fine on my browser, Netscape. However, when my friend viewed it on IE, it looked very odd. What is wrong?
That was in 2006
@Boris_yo: >_>
Bob
Bob
People were still using Netscape in 2006?? As their primary browser?????
@Bob: well, netscape is still around... wierdly
Bob
Bob
Whaaaaaa
mind explodes
shambling around like a blind, toothless zombie
14:55
@Bob I think a version of Netscape based on the latest open source Firefox/Gecko code was maintained for quite a while, maybe as late as 2006-2007
for Windows mainly
it wasn't all that different from Firefox itself, except for the chrome/UI
last version was 8.1.3, released on April 2, 2007
Netscape Browser is the name of a proprietary Windows web browser published by AOL, but developed by Mercurial Communications. It is the eighth major release in name of the Netscape series of browsers, originally produced by the defunct Netscape Communications Corporation. While Netscape Browser's version numbers start at 8, it is based on Mozilla Firefox, whereas Netscape 6 and 7 were based on Mozilla Application Suite, itself a complete rewrite of the codebase developed in versions 1 through 4 - Netscape Navigator and Netscape Communicator. As with other recent versions, it incorporate...
mostly for corporations, libraries and public institutions that were afraid of "open source" but already had Netscape from before
Is Firefox open source?
@Boris_yo NO
most sarcastic comment of the day
wait, actually. there was a netscape navigator 9, which was discontinued on 1 March 2008. o.O
14:58
@Boris_yo: If it isn't clear to you, I'm running an old version of OS/2 warp and an old version of netscape 4. It... predates quite a few things we take for granted
Bob
Bob
Hm.
Netscape Navigator 9 was a web browser produced by the Netscape Communications division of parent AOL, first announced on January 23, 2007. After AOL outsourced the development of Netscape Browser 8 to Mercurial Communications in 2004, Netscape Navigator 9 marked the first Netscape browser to be produced in-house since Netscape 7. It also saw the return of the classic Navigator name, which was previously used between Netscape versions 1.0 and 4.08. The program's first beta was released on June 5, 2007, with the Beta 2 on July 12, and Beta 3 on August 16. After a release candidate, the fi...
Pretty low requirements.
@JourneymanGeek you could probably at least render google.com correctly on the last working version of netscape 8 / 9
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic Try Netscape 9 for your low-memory requirements! :P
@JourneymanGeek What's warp? OS? And what's OS/2?
Bob
Bob
@Boris_yo Try Google. It's an operating system.
14:59
@Bob hahaha
@Boris_yo: its from the dark ages
@Bob: yeah.
@somequixotic: trying to find hobbes now ;p
@Bob Okay and what's the difference between OS and OS/2? What does 2 signify?
Bob
Bob
.....
Bob
Bob
1 min ago, by Bob
@Boris_yo Try Google. It's an operating system.
15:00
It's not 2, it's /2
It means that it's half of an OS
5
@Bob Google is an operating system? :D
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic Hrm. Might be.
OS/2 Warp just means it's really fast because it's half the size.
5
@DarthAndroid by that logic, Mac OS/9 is the fastest OS in the world, since it's only one-ninth of a Mac
@somequixotic Yes, except there's tradeoffs. The problem with Mac OS/9 is you can't do anything with it!
15:02
and GNU/Linux is only as fast as L * I * N * U * X, whatever those variables represent
Bob
Bob
@somequixotic It has just enough power to load the bootloader.
@somequixotic I think there's something you want to tell us here... Google is operating system that will dominate the future?
Bob
Bob
I have no fucking clue where this conversation is going. My head hurts.
@Boris_yo um, what?
@Bob don't attempt to follow this conversation logically; it involves Boris :P
that's how Boris' brain works
1, 2, 3, 4, bee, blue
15:05
@Bob (or @journeymanGeek) is the dog that's like "AMG DEATH"
@somequixotic I don't own dogs.
@somequixotic: its not a terrier. Terriers grab death by the nearest available appendage and start shaking.
@JourneymanGeek I think it's supposed to be a german shepard
That explains it.
I don't really know the personality of dog breeds that much, except that generally speaking, big dogs are like "I exist. you are smaller than me. do I need to do anything regarding you? no. I am just going to sit here and stare off into space."
15:07
lol
and smaller dogs are like "OMG A THING! BITE! JUMP! LICK! EAT! RUN!"
small dogs are big inside, and vice versa.
you know what would be funny is if there were a big dog breed that was "skiddish" (easily scared into running away)
that would be pomerian
to see this huge dog be like "WTF IS THAT?!?! AAAHHHHH" when it sees a rat or a cat or a small dog
15:12
@somequixotic: I've seen medium size dogs do that
Was the stuff about Boris really necessary?
@DarthAndroid: hmm
I'm not entirely sure ;p
But its somewhat accurate
somewhat? don't smoke
I get that the conversation was going into the land of absurdity, but I think direct attacks were over the line :x
@jokerdino: @Boris_yo is obviously not a dog.
@DarthAndroid: honestly, @Boris_yo is often a little unusual.
and loves conspiracy theories
15:15
@JourneymanGeek that gif is still loading for me :(
@JourneymanGeek don't forget e-shopping
@DarthAndroid who attacked who? I don't think calling someone's method of reasoning illogical is an "attack"
@DarthAndroid yeah but that's only if he gets it
if anything he admits to being illogical and revels in it
that's his specialty lol
I've seen him discuss several times how not following the standard logical path can lead to surprising discoveries or results or truths, so that's merely a statement of fact that he thinks that way
I'm not saying it's bad or wrong or not welcome here; I think it adds a nice flavor
and Boris isn't offending anyone so he's more than welcome to chat here
there have been a few people here who actually did offend folks while they were being strange; those folks have been dealt with... there's a difference between (unusual and acceptable) and (unusual and offensive/unwelcome)
Boris falls into the former category
15:20
unusually unusual that we don't know if it is unwelcome or not.
@somequixotic Boris is open minded
And weird in a good way :)
Thanks to everyone for good PR.
4
i don't want any app eating my cat. ;P
@ruda.almeida Hello.
15:32
Anyone here uses Ubuntu and Netbeans?
0
Q: Wonky Netbeans dialog boxes

ruda.almeidaSome dialog boxes on my Netbeans install aren't displaying correctly, most importantly the "add new project" one (screenshot below). The loading message (hourglass icon) stays on forever. I can't click any button. It was working fine a few days ago, I haven't changed any setting prior to the issu...

@ruda.almeida Swing's attempt to impersonate the GTK theme fails pretty badly on Ubuntu with Ubuntu's GTK engine
if you can, set your GTK theme system-wide to something more standard like Cleanlooks
or set the Netbeans Swing LAF to something like Nimbus or Metal instead of GTK
@somequixotic I don't mind it looking bad, I just want it to work like it was working a few days ago >.<
@somequixotic Doesn't solve the issue :(
@ruda.almeida you changed your look and feel to Nimbus? does it look different?
15:46
@somequixotic Yes, tried Nimbus, Metal and GTK, each one a different look, same unclickable buttons and forever hourglass loading
@ruda.almeida what version of NB? have you tried the latest ?
@somequixotic 7.21 (latest is 7.31). I don't know how to install and keep the settings, will try. But I am really puzzled that the bug apparently materialized out of thin air over the weekend.
I even tried turning it off and on again, but it is not Windows and the bug won't go away :(
@ruda.almeida settings are stored in ~/.netbeans IIRC
new version of netbeans shouldn't affect
OK, downloading it and installing
> downloading
doesn't downloading take like 37 years for you?
15:55
Damn, now mods know where I work.
@ruda.almeida Yup... Congrats!
@CanadianLuke For being so dumb? :3
@ruda.almeida: and channel owners ;p
so thats.. most of the channel ? ;p
@somequixotic Anyhow, one branch where I occasionally work has about 500 PCs and a 2mbps link, the main one where I work almost daily has dozens of buildings and who knows what links and weird factors influence its status

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