Root Access

Bob

09:13

Humble Bundle support is slow, but... amusing.

> If you have managed to fix the issue yourself or the mercenaries invading your quaint mountain village have retreated, reply to this email with "#resolve”.

HackToHell

09:26

blog.onedrive.com/onedrive_changes

2

Screw you microsoft

Journeyman Geek

lol

"Unlimited"

That word

it does not mean what you think it means

Bob

@HackToHell It's more of a "this is why we can't have nice things"...

Psycogeek

@HackToHell translate, we pulled our head out of our butt, and realised that our high faluting claims of offering the world free unlimited was outrageously stupid , and the idiot in marketing who dreamed up this scheme has been relegated to mail boy.

Journeyman Geek

And too little users using too much space

since the game was all about market share.

Psycogeek

we are sorry that we spent so many hours lying to you, and getting you hooked on our services, as a compensation for your losses, you can pay us.

Please remember for next time, "if it is too good to be true, it usually isn't"

DavidPostill

09:38

@HackToHell What do you expect when people abuse the system? " In some instances, this exceeded 75 TB per user or 14,000 times the average." Some people are just too greedy.

Bob

@DavidPostill To be fair, they did offer it.

@allquixotic Interesting that the only current way to gain root on Marshmallow is to flash a modified boot image :\

Psycogeek

in america , well lets just say that microsoft has been sucessfully Sued more than a dozen times in huge class action suits, for saying things that are not true, and doing things that are illegal.

Bob

(Way I did it on Lollipop is by flashing a modified system image. "standard" way is to flash custom recovery and install using that recovery.)

Psycogeek

without even knowing it , microsoft has sent me free money :-) to settle 2 of the lawsuits, i did not even remember regestering for the OSes , and certannly did not join the suit.

Leathe

o.O what

Psycogeek

09:45

truth can be so important in the US, that a 1Lb loaf of bread, cannot have 2oz of extra bread in it :-)

DavidPostill

In America people get rediculous compensation for trivial complaints.

Remember McD and the idiot spillling hot coffee?

Bob

@DavidPostill Maybe you should read up on it more.

Psycogeek

The FTC (trade comission) will get ticked off if you say Strawberries and flakes , if there isnt more strawberries than flakes :-) Things like that seriously work out good, because with all the fake pictures, and false statements, you usually "know what your buying" which can be a win-win.

Bob

> Liebeck, who also underwent debridement treatments, sought to settle her claim for $20,000, but McDonalds refused.

> During discovery, McDonalds produced documents showing more than 700 claims by people burned by its coffee between 1982 and 1992. Some claims involved third-degree burns substantially similar to Liebecks. This history documented McDonalds' knowledge about the extent and nature of this hazard.

McDonalds also said during discovery that, based on a consultants advice, it held its coffee at between 180 and 190 degrees fahrenheit to maintain optimum taste. He admitted that he had not evaluated the safety ramifications at this temperature. Other establishments sell coffee at substantially low…

It wasn't as simple as merely spilling hot coffee.

> The jury awarded Liebeck $200,000 in compensatory damages. This amount was reduced to $160,000 because the jury found Liebeck 20 percent at fault in the spill. The jury also awarded Liebeck $2.7 million in punitive damages, which equals about two days of McDonalds' coffee sales.

Post-verdict investigation found that the temperature of coffee at the local Albuquerque McDonalds had dropped to 158 degrees fahrenheit.

The trial court subsequently reduced the punitive award to $480,000 -- or three times compensatory damages -- even though the judge called McDonalds' conduct reckless, callou…

DavidPostill

@Bob I am well aware of the details. She opened the coffee in her lap and spilled it. That is stupid. I know that McD is partly to blame.

Bob

09:51

@DavidPostill It more or less ended up as a "yes, it was her fault for spilling it, but no, it should not have resulted in such severe burns regardless".

Whether she should have been assigned only 20% of the fault and not more? I don't know.

DavidPostill

Agreed. The damages in such cases are still excessive.

Bob

@DavidPostill Compensatory damages aren't that much.

It was mostly punitive damages, and I expect that to have mostly been because McD knew about the hazard.

Psycogeek

punitive for trying to lie thier way out of it, and ticking off the court and jury with many sleezy lawyer tricks :-)

Bob

"Yes, they knew about it, they received complaints about it in the past, but they ignored those."

> it held its coffee at between 180 and 190 degrees fahrenheit to maintain optimum taste

So, basically, they earned more money (or made their product look better) by creating a safety hazard.

A similar famous case: the Ford Pinto case.

That one had an explicit cost-benefit analysis from Ford where they had previously calculated it was cheaper to pay compensation for deaths rather than recall/fix all cars.

"$200,000 in compensatory damages" <== probably from severity and costs of hospitalisation/recovery. We all know healthcare is particularly expensive in the USA.

DavidPostill

Comparison: UK compensation for losing a leg 100K UKP, Loss of one eye, max 36K UKP.

Leathe

09:57

huh. didn't know 180-190ºF liquids cause 3rd degree burns

Bob

Then the actual compensation amount awarded comes back to the calculation of fault, which I'm not going to comment on.

@DavidPostill UKP?

Leathe

probably £.

DavidPostill

Yep.

Psycogeek

hmm, not worth 45k US to have my eye poked out.

The leg , well :-)

DavidPostill

But 480K for some burns ...

Psycogeek

09:59

people hold thier coffee between thier legs :-)

Leathe

3rd degree burns in your private area ;P

Bob

@DavidPostill More like 200k USD at 1994 exchange rates.

DavidPostill

bottonline.co.uk/guides/…

Bob

Actually 160k after considering fault. Which is close to 100k GBP at the time.

The punitive damages were on top of that, but should be ignored because you're currently comparing the amounts awarded for compensation.

HackToHell

Oh crap, I have more than 5 gb in One Drive

I have 8 gigs of stuff in there

Bob

10:01

And punitive damages are based on far more than just the damage done to that person.

HackToHell

o0

And I have 40 gb of storage

Bob

> Punitive damages are a focal point of the tort reform debate in the United States, where numerous highly publicized multi-million dollar verdicts have led to a fairly common perception that punitive damage awards tend to be excessive. However, statistical studies by law professors and the Department of Justice have found that punitive damages are only awarded in two percent of civil cases which go to trial, and that the median punitive damage award is between $38,000 and $50,000.

Interesting that she originally only requested 20k anyway.

Not entirely sure how they determined the 200k compensation.

HackToHell

@DavidPostill And have a dman good bandwith

Psycogeek

the jury only eats at jack in the box.

it was payback for all those Burger pics on the menu, that (when you actually get them) look more like cardboard 50cent pieces.

Bob

@DavidPostill Seems like the UK doesn't really do punitive damages for cases like this. Same with AU but not much case law here.

Debatable whether that's a good or bad thing.

DavidPostill

10:06

And for a really wacky case a US judge sued the dry cleaners for losing his trousers. He asked for $67 million. ;)

Bob

o.O

DavidPostill

Pearson v. Chung

Pearson v. Chung, better known as the "pants lawsuit", is a civil case filed in 2005 by Roy L. Pearson, Jr., an administrative law judge in the District of Columbia in the United States, following a dispute with a dry cleaning company over a lost pair of trousers. Pearson filed suit against Soo Chung, Jin Nam Chung and Ki Y. Chung, the owners of Custom Cleaners in Washington, D.C., initially demanding $67 million for inconvenience, mental anguish and attorney's fees for representing himself, as a result of their failure, in Pearson's opinion, to live up to a "satisfaction guaranteed" sign that...

Bob

@DavidPostill Yea, now, that is clearly excessive :P

DavidPostill

"On June 12, 2007, the trial began. Pearson broke down in tears during an explanation about his frustration after losing his pants"

Bob

> Over time, the Chungs presented three settlement offers in the amounts of $3000, $4600, and $12000, all of which were rejected by Pearson. D.C. Superior Court Judge Neal Kravitz stated that "the court has significant concerns that the plaintiff is acting in bad faith."

No kidding.

DavidPostill

10:08

It almost went to the Supreme Court on appeal ;)

Psycogeek

youd'a think he would have sewed them hisself , if he was that overwrought about them.

Bob

@DavidPostill Seriously sounds like mental issues though.

How could anyone possibly believe $67m will be awarded over this?

Psycogeek

ask for a mile get an inch.

Bob

> $15,000, which he claimed would be the cost to rent a car every weekend to drive to another dry cleaning service

?!

What, they were the only dry cleaners in the whole city?

Leathe

how does it cost $15,000 to rent a car over a weekend?

or is that the total amount over the course of.. well, until he stops going to the dry cleaners

Bob

10:17

@Leathe "every" weekend

Psycogeek

or finds out that buying new pants, washer dryer, or buying out the cleaners down the street even, would be cheaper.

qasdfdsaq

11:00

Fuck I've done it again

I've broken a question.

Journeyman Geek

Go fix it

;p

@Leathe: I'm pretty sure he could buy a new car every month for that no?

Oh

THAT ONE

I'm pondering deleting my answer

qasdfdsaq

:sadface:

Journeyman Geek

And yes

there's a few big holes in the question as written

qasdfdsaq

Ah man four questions in a row where the answer is "You're doing it wrong"

Journeyman Geek

and yes. I have NO idea how that damned thing works

qasdfdsaq

11:04

Sure the question is bad, but it wasn't completely broken until I made the OP shout "You don't belong on StackExchange!"

Journeyman Geek

He did?

qasdfdsaq

Yeah

I have a vague idea how that thing works, it's a fairly common form factor for micro-atx (micro as in small, not the uATX standard) DC-DC power supplies.

Journeyman Geek

yup

But carputers are wierd

Leathe

that whole question is a mess

DavidPostill

11:20

which question?

Leathe

superuser.com/questions/995341/…

argh

why aren't you pasting it properly

Bob

...well, at least it's not a troubleshooting question.

@Leathe You need the http://

-1

Q: How does the motherboard PW switch operate, exactly?

I have a special miniature ATX power supply, and it has the PW output pins that are supposed to be connected to the motherboard so that the PSU can turn the system on or off. But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard, and I need to understand what it is that the PSU does with t...

Hm :P

Leathe

there we go :P

Bob

@Leathe You have some funny extra characters at the end

Leathe

wut o.O

Bob

11:23

...dunno

they were coming up as URL encoded when I pasted your link

and yours doesn't onebox

Leathe

ah. it's a /

Bob

...but they're done now

@Leathe I tried deleting the / already o.O

Leathe

hmmmmm

Bob

Got it to onebox by navigating to the question and copying the link again. But odd that your link doesn't.

Leathe

aaand now I can't edit it anymore :P

Bob

11:24

shrug

Leathe

I think it's because I added the www infront of it before adding http

Bob

-1

Q: How does the motherboard PW switch operate, exactly?

I have a special miniature ATX power supply, and it has the PW output pins that are supposed to be connected to the motherboard so that the PSU can turn the system on or off. But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard, and I need to understand what it is that the PSU does with t...

motherboard atx

Hm. Odd.. I tried deleting the www too... it didn't work earlier but it works now

shrug and blame Ghetto Chat Markdown

Leathe

:P

Bob

Top two are the same... but only the top one works :S

qasdfdsaq

Wow 27 minutes to make tea

Leathe

11:26

hm. maybe it doesn't properly update it after an edit?

qasdfdsaq

@JourneymanGeek Carputer, there's one I haven't heard before.

Bob

@Leathe Nah, it should.

@qasdfdsaq I can't decide if that should be made of wood or in the shape of a car.

qasdfdsaq

@Leathe I think because the link contains "metadata"

-1

Q: How does the motherboard PW switch operate, exactly?

I have a special miniature ATX power supply, and it has the PW output pins that are supposed to be connected to the motherboard so that the PSU can turn the system on or off. But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard, and I need to understand what it is that the PSU does with t...

motherboard atx

Bob

@qasdfdsaq Heh. Told ya it was broken.

qasdfdsaq

Huh, editing that worked...

Leathe

11:27

what did you edit?

qasdfdsaq

Removed the www.

Leathe

kay

Bob

(Now if someone could pass along my request for him to unignore me -- that makes for rather awkward conversation. I promise to not bring up the earlier argument :P)

Journeyman Geek

computer in a car

@qasdfdsaq: Bob's asking if you could unignore him. He promises not to bring up the earlier arguement ;p

and I only know about carputers cause EWF

Bob

Hm. On a completely unrelated topic: Anyone here with a PayPal account willing to test with Humble Bundle?

DavidPostill

11:34

"The model X5-ATX is an intelligent automotive ATX power supply for in-car applications with maximum 180 Watts output, designed to provide power and to control the ON/OFF switch of an ATX motherboard based on ignition status."

Journeyman Geek

@DavidPostill: I ~~know~~ suspect its broken

DavidPostill

"But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard, "

Bob

(would cost 1c but I can send that amount to you if you want -- I'm just curious if I'm the only one getting an error)

Journeyman Geek

@DavidPostill: original question didn't say what the device was even.

DavidPostill

It doesn't matter, it is the wrong power supply for the "what ever it is that is not an ATX motherboard"

Bob

11:36

@JourneymanGeek thanks

@DavidPostill Eh. It's a power supply. It's a cheap way of getting a decent amount of 5V or 12V (or 3.3V) power.

Not designed for it, sure. But, hey, easier and cheaper than getting a proper bench supply.

Hm... that makes me wonder how well protected a cheapo PSU is in the event of a short.

Journeyman Geek

lol

DavidPostill

"But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard". VTC to close as unclear what your are asking.

Journeyman Geek

ka-boom

Bob

A 20 A short does not sound fun.

Journeyman Geek

Its painful.

Bob

11:40

@JourneymanGeek ...speaking from experience?

Journeyman Geek

yuuuup

Bob

I've played with high voltage (capacitor fun), but never really high currents

Psycogeek

I would ignore the dood when he feels that the hardware in question is irrelevent, and when the statements became self contradictory, although i am sure that is just an issue of full explaination of what he is actually doing..

Bob

did have a 1A-2A short going on my desk for a bit though.

I'm surprised nothing broke.

Journeyman Geek

Mains

13A I suppose?

I've also had...

Bob

11:41

(cheap pebble charging cable has contacts sticking out a bit far -- magnet connected it to a pair of scissors and the whole thing got pretty warm)

Journeyman Geek

2 power supplies have blown fuses, and one actual explosion.

Bob

@JourneymanGeek 10A in AU, I think it might've been 15 in the US

Journeyman Geek

Maybe

We do what the brits do

Bob

Giant plug and all :P

Journeyman Geek

proper plugs.

;p

Bob

11:43

@JourneymanGeek You and your fancy giant fused plugs...

DavidPostill

Until we know what the device to be powered is we cannot answer. And it may well be off-topic "Questions about electronic devices, media players, cell phones or smart phones are off-topic, except insofar as they interface with your computer" when we find out what it is

Bob

@DavidPostill I'd actually be fine with answering "how do I power on a standard ATX power supply without a motherboard"

qasdfdsaq

@JourneymanGeek Sure... how?

Bob

We don't really have to care what else he's powering... could see a valid case of testing a PSU

qasdfdsaq

Ah, done.

Journeyman Geek

11:44

Good question

qasdfdsaq

Hey Bob. Sorry. It's not you, it's me.

Bob

@qasdfdsaq Thanks (testing, testing, 123)

qasdfdsaq

People who don't agree with be bring out the worst parts of my personality, and I don't like it.

Bob

@qasdfdsaq Sorry, I probably carried it on a bit far too.

Let's just forget that and move on? :)

qasdfdsaq

So I use "block" as a mechanism to reduce my anxiety

Journeyman Geek

11:45

heh

I totally understand

though I just take a break from the internet

Bob

(As JMG said earlier - we do tend to have quite a few technical-and-otherwise arguments here. They usually don't get quite that heated, but they do happen. shrug)

Journeyman Geek

Worst I did was 3 days ;p

qasdfdsaq

Also I totally understand how that PSU works now

Journeyman Geek

Do you know why it dosen't work?

Cause damnit, I'm curious

qasdfdsaq

It's a logic output pin, so it doesn't actually short the power switch pins, it just pulls it to ground.

Journeyman Geek

11:46

So it dosen't actually do anything?

DavidPostill

lol dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3301529/…

Journeyman Geek

That's why I told him to check voltages

qasdfdsaq

Notwithstanding the fact the documentation isn't clear whether it actually powers the MB on rather than just off... the "pull to ground" is hacky way to simulate a button press

Bob

@qasdfdsaq Isn't that what a button does?

qasdfdsaq

A real switch would short the two, which a real motherboard would detect as the + pin being pulled to ground (because, it is).

Journeyman Geek

11:47

yup

Bob

Assuming your PSU has a common ground with the MCU?

Journeyman Geek

which it might in this case

qasdfdsaq

However this achieves a similar affect by not shorting it but setting the output pin of the microcontroller to "Low"

Bob

(I think I've had this conversation before, actually o.O)

qasdfdsaq

Now some motherboards may detect the switch press by detecting the ground pin is pulled up

Bob

11:48

Oh yea. It was Wil last time

He was trying something similar with an Arduino

qasdfdsaq

But really, simulating a button press isn't the best way to ensure a safe shutdown.

@Bob Interesting, did he manage?

Bob

@qasdfdsaq He had some trouble but somehow got it to work

> so, changed the code to this:

digitalWrite(9, LOW);
delay(500);
digitalWrite(9, HIGH);

the high and low were the other way round eventually... I did this out of pure frustration, and, it is working perfectly... I just have no idea why...

qasdfdsaq

@DavidPostill Hah, @DavidPostill spots the missing link again!

@Bob I've set a computer on fire in the past with a 20A short

Bob

@qasdfdsaq Actually - couldn't you rig up a NPN BJT to do something similar?

(to simulate a momentary button, not set a computer on fire)

It gets all the more fun when your micro doesn't share a ground. I wonder how that works.

qasdfdsaq

@Bob Yes, but it doesn't - the documentation says it's a logic pin not a transistor/relay.

Apparently 240v mains here has a floating neutral

Bob

11:53

Ah. Wait, what are we talking about? :P

Journeyman Geek

there is documentation?

Bob

I thought we're talking about starting an ATX PSU

qasdfdsaq

Well, the mumbo jumbo on the product page

@Bob We are

Bob

...product?

I'm missing something

Journeyman Geek

vaguely

qasdfdsaq

11:54

@JourneymanGeek That's about all the documentation I've ever come to expect from an Aliexpress item

@Bob The specific "carputer" ATX DC-DC supply in the question earlier

It's not a normal ATX supply

Psycogeek

@qasdfdsaq which would include the possibility that the thing doesnt even work to begin with.

Bob

Ohhh

Journeyman Geek

;p

qasdfdsaq

(Also confusing: The power supply sends a signal to the MB, not the MB using the PWR_GOOD pin to power on the supply)

Journeyman Geek

yup

Bob

11:55

@qasdfdsaq I didn't read the comments on the answer

qasdfdsaq

@DavidPostill Ermm, all the upskirts, downblouse photos, and public drinking shenanigans warranted a NSFW warning on that IMO.

Bob

Don't think that one was mentioned in the question itself... whoops

qasdfdsaq

@Bob The comments on the answer were where he said I don't belong on stackexchange <sadface>

Journeyman Geek

lol

I'll clear them up

Roomie's keeping me busy

Bob

@qasdfdsaq wait if it's not a "normal" ATX supply is it an ATX supply at all?

Journeyman Geek

11:58

not really

Bob

(On phone right now so looking up datasheets is a pain)

Journeyman Geek

its a dc/dc power supply

Bob

Does the output conform to ATX standards?

qasdfdsaq

@Bob shrug

Journeyman Geek

donno. Can someone link the question? ;p

qasdfdsaq

11:59

@Bob shrug. Most high-end ATX supplies don't conform to ATX standards, you'll have to be more specific

-1

Q: How does the motherboard PW switch operate, exactly?

I have a special miniature ATX power supply, and it has the PW output pins that are supposed to be connected to the motherboard so that the PSU can turn the system on or off. But I have a different device to power up, not a motherboard, and I need to understand what it is that the PSU does with t...

motherboard atx

Journeyman Geek

thanks

Bob

Ugh. That aliexpress site has a sidebar permanently taking up three quarters of the screen on my phone

@qasdfdsaq well, the standby/power-on behavior is most relevant. I've not actually looked at those standards (don't even know if they're de facto or actually published) so I'm not sure how modern supplies deviate

(yes, it says infinite tabs :D)

qasdfdsaq

@Bob I'm pretty sure there's a published standard. Basically +5VSB should always be on, that's about it. Anything else is up to the motherboard's discretion.

@Bob Gotta love retarded web design.

Bob

@qasdfdsaq yea looks like there is one but it's pdf... I'll take a look a bit later

Gotta be some common standard for arbitrary modern PSUs to work with arbitrary motherboards and peripherals

Psycogeek

"when battery level drops below 11.2V from more than one minute, X5-ATX will shut down and re-activate only when the input voltage is larger than 9V." thinking how that would work :-)

qasdfdsaq

12:08

@Bob Didn't notice the PDF. Just scrolled down the web page.

@Psycogeek Yeah... >_>

Bob

I mean pdf for atx

Can't view that aliexpress page at all

qasdfdsaq

Ah

Bob

@Psycogeek obviously it's on and off at the same time

Schrodinger's PSU

Or it just restarts every minute :/

Psycogeek

it is probably like my cell phone, waking up to tell me the battery is low, which really makes the battery low .

These things work correct in china though, as it is on the opposite side of the world.

Leathe

@Psycogeek What

Psycogeek

12:13

things like batteries have 5 times as much power there , and electrons flow in reverse.

its like how toilets flush in austrailia counter clockwise, well if the water jets are aligned that way anyway.

qasdfdsaq

@Psycogeek Mine just flushes downwards...

Bob

lol

Psycogeek

I want one of them french ones , that flushes up , boudoir ?

no wait thats not it, Bidet

Bob

American toilets are weird, with that whole siphon flushing thing and the high water level

Psycogeek

Boudoir only sounds french :-)

Bob

12:18

And apparently they also overflow a lot so I guess that counts as flushing upwards?

qasdfdsaq

Japanese toilets...

@Psycogeek A bidet is not a toilet

Psycogeek

@Bob what you still using an outhouse outback?

qasdfdsaq

Oh man, the conversation in here has really gone down the toilet...

Bob

@Psycogeek you should try it sometime ;)

Psycogeek

@Bob i did and there was something alive down there.

Bob

12:22

But, yea. Strange how different regions have different toilet designs.

@Psycogeek were you in a death star?

Psycogeek

no it was on some builder site

qasdfdsaq

@Bob Asian toilets...

Journeyman Geek

squatters?

qasdfdsaq

Yep

Oh I have a gold badge

Journeyman Geek

12:40

I find them odd too

qasdfdsaq

When I was a child the toilets we used were a row of pits in the ground and we picked up newspaper from the streets to use as toilet paper.

We rejoiced when once or twice a week a teacher gave us like, two sheets of real toilet paper...

Journeyman Geek

I've dug my own crapper

;p

Psycogeek

well one of us is prepared for the apocalypse. that is the one thing i hate most when hiking in the wilderness. not to mention the plastic mini shovel your supposed to dig into rock hard california clay with.

Thank god for fox holes :-) which has nothing to do with army

Journeyman Geek

meh, ET tool

ours suck

If you're lucky you get an auger.

Nice deep hole

if you are not, you dig a small hole, poop, then bury it.

HackToHell

12:56

adriancourreges.com/blog/2015/11/02/gta-v-graphics-study

Bob

@Psycogeek Oi! :P

@qasdfdsaq I never figured out how you're supposed to use a squat-toilet without making a mess :\

4

At least WCs (sitting-toilets) are becoming more common there.

Journeyman Geek

@Bob: VERY carefully

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