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01:06
grumble grumble
I still can't believe my math teacher is testing us on integrals even though we've literally only studied it for like 2 days
And like half of the class was also absent that day because of APUSH, and the other half was absent the other day we did integrals because they were doing their WHAP exam
And like Riemann sum and cries
There's too much stuff and she hasn't even posted any of the units back up so I have to go through the entire fricking textbook just to get sample questions
I just hope the final is as easy as our review worksheet
I mean, she can't possibly test everything, because there's like 8-9 units and there's only 21 or 22 questions to do in like an hour
But I have to review everything just for the chance it may come up
The uncertainty and the unclarity is just so frustrating
I literally just need the worksheets from the unit because they give me a really good indication on the types of questions
;-;
Tree is stressed out as heck, borg
Bird offers hot chocolate and a hug
It's too hot in socal for hot chocolate
But hugs are good
01:26
May I offer a cold fruit smoothie instead? :p
It's getting hot here too, hit 80-ish today
01:50
Ooh wow
@PrinceNorthLæraðr feel free to ask me if you want help - i should be pretty free
Okay, thank you :)
I'm just trying to get through all of the past units first
and yeah, that sounds stressful :/ i absolutely know what unclear expectations are like and it is Not Fun
Yeah
Yeah, it's just very frustrating
Because there's literally like nothing. Just one review worksheet
She says to "look over your notes" but like... (and maybe this is my fault) but my "notes" are just a bunch of scratch work everywhere
It's also 500 pages long because I used a single binder to do math classwork, notes, and homework
i mean, you had no way of knowing it would be a notes-only test
that should have been established
01:58
What do you mean by "notes-only"?
as in, no study materials would be given
Oh yeah
I will repeat again, the practice review worksheet is seriously concerningly too easy, because it's like really simple versions of the topics
Like while I was going through analytic trig I was like
"oh yeah, there's the entire spiel with product-sum formula and also inverse trig and simplifying stuff like cos(2arctan(x))
at least you don't have to deal with these
Hehehe
breathes a slight sigh of relief
My friend already downloaded everything before so he's sharing some of them with me
02:28
@Deusovi Okay hold on, tell me I'm not crazy when I'm solving this problem
that expression above
It's not... it's not just cos(x-2x), is it?
I initially was expanding it and I was like
Hey, this looks like one of those expansions of cos(3x) and I was like, hm, it can't be cos(2x+x) because stuff added inside of a cosine is cos(x)cos(y)-sin(x)sin(y)
looks good to me
cos(A-B)=cosA cosB + sinA sinB
if A=x and B=2x, that works
Huh
Imma double check by expanding it but
I didn't realize it was that quick lol
yup it is just that simple
03:15
Haha! I remember how to do parametrics!
you take a doctor's D and replace it with a TR?
(paramedic -> parametric, hehe)
Sid
Sid
@PrinceNorthLæraðr be a little careful. Hidden tricks in trigonometry is that you should try to list all possible answers in a given interval
Yeah
Thankfully it's multiple choice, so
The final, that is
Sid
Sid
Ah. Objective questions. That's good.
03:23
Yeah, that's at least one thing going for me
03:38
1 message moved to ­Trash
3 messages moved to ­Trash
 
2 hours later…
Sid
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05:16
@PrinceNorthLæraðr If you have questions that have more than one correct answers, then you should be careful with trigonometry
Yup
I just ran into that with this question actually
sigh the stress only builds
I initially was like
"Hold up, both C and E work"
Sid
Sid
Keep calm. Stress only increases errors.
And then I realized
Oh yeah, arcsine's domain or range whatever is restricted to -pi/2<=x<=pi/2
Sid
Sid
Here's something to calm you down.
I had my last exam on Friday. One week before the exam, the prof told us that "the questions would be mostly objective type with one case study question to solve."

2 hours before the exam, she finally gave the entire modalities of the exam and that's when we found out that she had completely changed the pattern and it was 100% subjective.
Eeeeek
How's that supposed to calm me?
Sid
Sid
05:21
Literally all of us, in the class group chat started laughing.
Objective as in multiple-choice and subjective as in....?
Sid
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@PrinceNorthLæraðr What you're feeling right now, is that the questions in the final would be far more difficult than the worksheet you're solving.
Sid
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But you know the patterns. You know the basics. You know the type of questions that will be asked.
Hopefully
I need to do more vector review because I'm not very confident with those
And then I need to hammer away on summation and integrals tomorrow, which I've been putting off because they've been making no sense
Sid
Sid
05:24
If you know all that, trust in yourself. You're a smart kid who is solving these problems rather seamlessly imo(I have occasionally taught some Maths to high school students(of course, only here and a very limited number) but you're doing really well from what I have seen).
"here" as in the city where my Uni is located
Well, I can't take too much credit -_-; everyone in here has helped a lot
Sid
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@PrinceNorthLæraðr You will be fine. Don't stress out too much.
Sid
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Stress -> errors -> more stress
@Deusovi Will you be free tomorrow? I'm gonna need a lot of help understanding how integrals work tomorrow
Sid
Sid
06:08
@PrinceNorthLæraðr Subjective means we write it in a paper and then scan it and upload it
 
2 hours later…
08:06
@PrinceNorthLæraðr yeah, i should be free!
 
14 hours later…
22:28
@Deusovi Okay, are you free?
sure - eating dinner in about 20 minutes, but free other than that
Okay
So I'm not sure how to start for number 1
what rules of summation do you know?
Hm (pulls out list)
sum(aj+bj)=sum(aj)+sum(bj)
sum(k*aj)=ksum(aj)
You know what these are really confusing
sounds good - can you apply those here?
22:30
I'll just paste it in
Oh okay well
I could split the first into sum(20)-sum(k/4), but I'm not sure how that helps
Namely, I'm not sure how sum(20) would work
what do you think it means?
or generally, what does "∑[k=1 to k=80] (stuff)" mean?
Urrrrrrr
The sum of all the (stuff) added together
From (in this case) when k begins at 1 and for the next 79 terms?
"all the stuff" - specifically, a copy of "stuff" for each given value of k
so, here "stuff" is 20
Right, but with no given value of k
no, you have the values of k! they're 1 to 80
so you check to see what "20" becomes when k=1, and what it becomes when k=2, and so on
and add all those up
Hm, well in this case... wouldn't it just be 20*80?
yep!
22:34
Ah, I see
Because it's just 20+20+20+20+etc+L 80 times?
yep, exactly
That's a little weird to conceptualize, but summation symbols are confusing anyways
when k=1, the (stuff) under the ∑ evaluates to 20.
when k=2, the (stuff) under the ∑ evaluates to 20.
...
when k=80, the (stuff) under the ∑ evaluates to 20.
and so you add up all the results
just like any other sum! except the stuff under the ∑ happens to always be the same
22:36
I guess my thing was just "there is no k inside the summation" and then I realized oh there doesn't need to be a k
yep, that confuses a lot of people! i found it confusing at first too
Oh, okay and to the summation with the k in it
but the "simple, dumb" cases of things are still important, and they help you understand the regular cases better
Right
sum[k=1 to k=80](k/4) is (1/4)*sum[k=1 to k=80](k)
And that looks like a Gaussian addition thingy if I've ever seen one
looks like that to me too!
22:39
Wait, it's n(n+1)/2, so it's 80(80+1)/2?
Seems like a rather large number
yep, it's pretty big
the sum from 1 to 100 is 5050, so it should definitely be at least half of that
Ah
wow, that's a big number O_O
well, you're summing a lot of things together! k=1 to 80 is a lot of things to add
Fair. I just didn't realize how quickly it all adds up
(Also, how did Gauss even like figure this out? I was still eating paper back in like grade school)
(I wish that was a joke, but I legitimately ate paper when I was younger)
Anyhow, that's 3240, but divided by 4, so 810 +20(80)=2410
hold on, i believe it was subtracted?
22:44
Oh, you're right. Silly me
sigh it's silly stuff like this that I'm going to lose points out on in the test ;-;
write down every step you take
i'd write it like this:
∑(20- (1/4)k)
= ∑(20) - ∑(k/4)
= ∑(20) - (1/4)∑k
= 20·80 - (1/4)(80·81)/2
= 1600 - 810
= 790
(technically you would want to include the limits in every line - on a test, though, i'd just write ∑ₖ )
Ah, I see
Okay, so how would i start #2?
21 mins ago, by Prince North Læraðr
user image
well, do the same thing
one important thing to keep in mind is that n does not depend on i - so inside the sums, you can treat it as if it were a regular number like 100 or π
hm, okay
So should I distribute the 3i/n in or take it out?
you can't take it out completely - you can't pull anything with an i out of the sum because the i is your variable
22:53
What do you mean ohhhh
Because i isn't a constant term
(it's what you call a "bound variable" - it doesn't mean anything outside the sum!)
(Interesting)
but you can either pull the 3/n out or distribute it, up to you
(all these different letters doing different things)
Taking th 3/n looks easier, so I'll do that
Distribute the i
this is where I'm at now
looks good to me!
22:57
Not sure where to go next... the first one looks like a gaussian but
Do I just plug in n(n+1)/2?
Oh, do I just plug that in for the expression sum[i=1 to n](i)?
yep! you know that sum(i=1 to n)(i) and n(n+1)/2 are equal, so you can plug in one for the other wherever it appears
Hm what about the right summation?
Oh, is it... 5(n)?
yep!
Because it's 5 added n many times?
Ah interesting
Yay! 18+3/n
eek
(can't check right now, give me a minute)
23:03
Okay, this next one is weird
(nah, that's the right answer)
(I have the key next to me :P)
"Okay, this next one is weird" - all of advanced math
(ah cool)
So.... sum[i=1 to infinity]((6/n)*((i/n)+1))?
@bobble Does this count as advanced math...?
@PrinceNorthLæraðr you see the trick is, you just declare everything you've done so far as "elementary math" and everything you're doing now "advanced math". Because for you, in comparison, it is
this would be "advanced math" for most adults
"Elementary, my dear Watson"
(gimme a sec, getting a drink)
(No problem, take your time)
I'm assuming... this might require like my sequence formula?
I know that the first term is at least uh... 2
Wait, hm
No, I don't
I know that the first term is ((1/n)+1)
Or (1/infinity)+1)??? Gahhhh
Hm, is it just one? Because as n approaches infinity, i/n gets really really small
(The first term, atl least)
(ok back at computer, done eating)
23:09
(wow, that was quick)
(i was eating during the last problem)
so anyway, let's break it down first to simpler components
Okay
(hehe, now that you mention food I'm getting a little hungry but dinner is prob in 2 ish hours so I don't want to spoil my appetite)
So we can take the 6/n out of the sum to put it like
(6/n)sum((i/n)+1)
(I know I left a lot of components out but for the sake of me not having to write everything)
l-a-z-y
23:11
sure
(not that I would ever do that, definitely not)
(no siree)
@bobble (Yeah, yeah, you try typing everything up and not getting it confusing :P)
(man i wish chat had latex support)
(Doesn't Math SE?)
(okay we're getting off-topic :P)
5
Q: TACUC - The ATaco ChatExchange Userscript Collection

ATacoA collection of Userscripts focused around Stack Exchange's chat. To install these, you need TamperMonkey, although GreaseMonkey apparently works. GitHub Auto Chat Jax This userscript simply implements MathJax across chatrooms automatically, in almost the exact same way as the Bookmarklet. ...

no one has it officially, but there are userscripts
23:12
So exactly what's up with the lim(n-->infinity)sum?
not quite sure what you mean by "what's up with it"
it's the limit of a sum
No I meant like
What does it mean?
Is it like
(sorry trying to find a way to phrase it)
∑[i=1 to n] ((6/n)·(i/n + 1)) is a different value for each n
and then you want to see what that value approaches as n goes to infinity
23:14
Oh, so it's like one of our geometric summation thingy
The
a_1/(1-r) where it's asking for the sum of all term?
would it be easier to say f(n) = ∑[i=1 to n] ((6/n)·(i/n + 1)), and then lim(n-->infinity) of f(n)?
@PrinceNorthLæraðr not quite, because the things being summed depend on n
bobble's explanation might help too - you're basically looking at this quantity that depends on n. the quantity happens to be a sum, but the limit sign doesn't know or care
the limit sign just says "whatever is inside this, see what happens as n goes to infinity"
So we don't know the value of n
23:16
n doesn't have a value - it's another bound variable, this time bound by the limit sign
if you're only working inside the limit sign, you can treat n as constant
and then you evaluate the limit and see what happens when n increases
Hm, okay...
So within the limit n is just some term (within the limit), and then we see what happens when n increases
So it's like a two-parter?
yep!
exactly - just like in a sum
when you take, say, ∑[i=1 to 5] i²
inside "i²", i is just a number
and then the ∑ sign looks at the behavior for different values of i, and gives you a result based on that
So we're basically isolating n in the summation and then taking the limit of that
That makes more sense
Okay so here's my work so far
(or actually my answer, if I'm understanding this correctly)
(6/n)sum((i/n+1)
(6/n)[sum(i/n)+sum(1)]
(6/n)[(1/n)sumi+n] <---- sum(1)=n
(6/n)[(1/n)*n(n+1)/2)+n]
(6/n)[((n+1)/2)+n)]
(6/n)[3n+1/2]
(18n+6)/2n
(9n+3)/n
9+3/n
So the limit of 9+(3/n) as n approaches infinity is... 9
Since 3/n will approach zero
23:25
haven't checked your algebra thoroughly, but yep, that sounds good to me!
Ah, so that was the general idea
Answer key agrees with me :)
Though my teacher solved it in a slightly different fashion
Okay, so the other summations look pretty similar, so I'll work on those later. Time to get to the one I've been dreading
Integrals!
integrals!
Okay, so here are the first three slides (mostly for context but I'm not understanding what she did in the third slide)
(Why is she testing us on this when half the class was literally absent ;-;)
Okay so first two slides make sense. We're basically finding the "maximum" potential area of the curve in a way that makes sense
What's up with the third slide though?
you're finding a better maximum there
23:30
the area under the curve is going to all be contained in those two rectangles, right?
Right
But how do we find the height of the first rectangle?
Oh, through the equation above
well, the height of the graph at x=2 is-- yeah
woah, okay now what is she doing?
So she's taking the intervals at... 1/2 lengths?
the same thing, but with 8 sections this time!
yep
Okay, and then she does the same thing, but in reverse, by under-approaximating
Okay, I have zero clue what these slides are talking about
23:41
so basically
@PrinceNorthLæraðr this technique provides a pretty good approximation
but what if you wanted to make it exact?
instead of cutting it into 1 strip, or 2 strips, or 8 strips, use a variable -- cut it into n strips
I see
And then divide that by the distance, which is b-a
hold on, ignore that for now
23:42
your teacher seems to be going a tad fast here?
(i imagine it made more sense when it was explained in person)
(Well, except, I wasn't there that day (confetti) she "taught" an entire calculus concept in two days)
and then, as you cut it into more and more strips, you'll get a better and better estimate of the area. so if you take the limit of your estimates, as n→∞, you'll get the exact area!
make sense so far?
Yes
Ah, okay, I see. Those riemann sum stuff were preparing us for this
yep, exactly
this is called the Riemann Integral
so! how do you actually calculate this, given a function?
well, it's the limit of your estimates
so we want lim[n→∞] (estimate with n strips)
what's your estimate with n strips? well, it's the sum of a bunch of single strip sizes
so that makes lim[n→∞] sum[k=1 to n] (area of strip k)
what's the area of strip i? well, that's the width times the height
23:47
Hehe, you answered my question
since we're cutting it into equal size strips, the widths will all be the same - (b-a)/n, which we can just call "Δx" for convenience
and the height of the strip will be the function's value on the right-hand side of that strip
(uh i have now retroactively changed my summation variable for Reasons™)
the exact location of that right-hand side... well, it'll be the left-hand endpoint, plus Δx times the strip length. so the first one will be a+Δx, the second endpoint will be a+2Δx, and so on
and the last endpoint will be a+nΔx (which, if you do the algebra, becomes b!)
so, we have these n "sample points" x₁,...,xₙ, where xₖ = a + k·Δx
for any strip, our width is Δx, and our height for strip k is the function's value at xₖ
and that gives lim[n→∞] sum[k=1 to n] ( f(xₖ) · Δx )
and hey that's the big equation up there! now we've found a formula to represent our idea of "getting better and better estimates by choosing smaller and smaller strips"
Oh, I see
So "technically" our area is of each individual strip is going to be a tad too small or tad too big, but it's gonna get so small to a point where we shrug and are like "close enough"
Is calculus literally just the math of "eh, close enough"? :P
yep, basically!
because we keep getting thinner and thinner strips, our undershoots and overshoots are going to get smaller and smaller
@PrinceNorthLæraðr and so when we take the limit, those disappear, just like 3/n disappeared up here
Ahhhh
So applying this to our original problem
(oops, gotta go - my math teacher is holding a session in four minutes, but I'll be back. Do you mind if I ping you once I come back?)
(don't mind at all, go ahead!)
(thank you :))

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