I'm back, and I have some more thoughts :) These are mostly smaller than my previous ones.

First: if one Chain uses a topic - "Movies", say, does that make "Movies" an off-limit topic for any future chains?

I would think no, but there should be a sufficient time in-between chains, and no answers should be re-used.

Second: at the top of the puzzle you're supposed to have "Hyperlink to series puzzles". How would that work? I'm not aware of any mechanism to link posts together in a series.

I forgot my last thought while typing out the other two. Will put it here if I remember.

(@Stiv, since you're the one setting these up)

Okay... First: Agree. No need to off-limit it, but would definitely need a cooling off period. I would encourage people who want to use a theme that's identical to another that's already been done to try and add a slightly different angle to it (e.g. MOVIES and then ANIMATED MOVIES or MOVIE CHARACTERS) so that the titles aren't exactly the same.

Second: It very much is possible using clever query strings. This link for example yields all my 'needs a name' puzzles in publish order :)

ooh, that's a cool link!

It would rely on using the titles, hence why having them slightly different (re Point 1 again) would be best.

Then the poster would only need to change the text in the title part.

Another random thought (not the one I forgot): it would be nice to have a meta post that collects links to all of the chains, even if just to the first and last/current puzzle. Then people can see all the themes more easily than trawling through chain-puzzle

I'm not sure where this post would go - in an answer to the original question, or in a separate meta question/answer?

That would be nice, yes. It could host similar links to the ones we just discussed above, linking to the full series at once. Another answer on same post probably, similarly to how they do it for the FTC.

More thoughts! - they just keep coming :) - How (non)specific can themes be? "Movies" is okay, but would "Movies by Wes Anderson" be okay? Would "Fiction" be too broad?

I assume that this chatroom would be used to discuss broadness before launching a Chain, but it would be helpful to have some guidelines.

Original, forgotten thought: I think there should be a link to the Chain Puzzle meta question/answer in this room's description.

This chatroom to discuss Chain Puzzles has turned into me throwing my stream-of-consciousness thoughts out and you responding.

Okay, here's an example. I would like to kick us off with TABLETOP GAMES as a theme. This means questions will be themed around board games, card games, tile games, etc. Hopefully within that wide sphere there will be multiple games that appeal to different puzzle setters. If I instead said MONOPOLY or SCRABBLE or CATAN, all of a sudden you've got a very niche series that might exclude a lot of people who specifically do not like (or know) that game...

okay, yes, that all makes sense

...so I would say WES ANDERSON MOVIES would probably be a step too far towards 'niche'. There's nothing to stop an individual doing their own Wes Anderson inspired series, but in the spirit of trying to make the chain appeal to as many people as possible and encourage participation I would opt for less specific.

@bobble I'll add the link now!

room topic changed to Chain Puzzles: Planning and discussion for experimental Chain Puzzle format (no tags)

room topic changed to Chain Puzzles: Planning and discussion for experimental Chain Puzzle format. Linked meta post here: puzzling.meta.stackexchange.com/q/7018/60644 (no tags)

room topic changed to Chain Puzzles: Planning and discussion for experimental Chain Puzzle format. Linked meta post here: puzzling.meta.stackexchange.com/q/7018 (no tags)

Ha, got it to work right eventually!

You fought the Formatting Monster and emerged victorious!

Should the Chain Puzzles each include a link to the meta post? I don't see one in the required template.

Now added!

Hallo, Prince! Come join the Chain Puzzle fun!

What is this exactly? Bit confused

Also I'll be hopping back and forth because I'm cooking breakfast

(Rice and eggs woohoo)

New puzzle format. Discussion ahead of launching it to make sure we iron out any bugs before we let it loose.

This room is for feedback on the proposed Chain Puzzle format, in the linked meta post

hehe we posted at the same time

Oooh cool. I'll take a look at the meta

@PrinceNorthLæraðr Rice and eggs sounds delicious

With some seaweed! It is quite delicious

Idea is for a puzzle where the solver has the opportunity to set a puzzle of their own using the answer to the previous one. Thus you get a chain of puzzles that are related to each other but made by different users - like a multi-user collaboration.

I think Stiv would appreciate feedback from people who aren't me :)

@Stiv Huh, interesting

@bobble But the new question is asked as a new question, right? I for some reason thought that it was just like a series of answers and questions from one question page :P

Exactly. Each question is entirely standalone apart from the fact that it somehow uses the answer of the previous one as inspiration.

I like it!

The main question though, is how do we prevent multiple chain-puzzles from happening at once?

Like Bobble starts a chain-puzzle post, and then I start a different one, and then Lukas goes and starts a new one

> F) No more than 5 open Chain Puzzle chains at any one time - we don't want to flood the site.

We suddenly have three different on-going chain-puzzles

There's no reason why we couldn't have more than one - after all, puzzles take time to write, so each chain will likely take several weeks (possibly months) to fully resolve - however, I would propose a limit (I suggest 5 in the meta post) so people don't get fatigue and we actually do see them to completion!

@bobble How do you display a quote like that?

A ">" at the start of a line, followed by a space, then the text you want to quote

Ah, same as main site then. Thanks!

@Stiv And the maximum is ten for a chain right?

@PrinceNorthLæraðr I would hope as well that before starting new chains people might suggest a new theme here before embarking on it, just to be sure it's not really obscure

And yeah, stop at 10 so they don't go on forever!

^ 'here' as in, 'in this chat'

@Stiv Good idea. What kinds of theme are we looking at? If jafe posts a CC puzzle and I post a linguistics puzzle based off that answer, might work but might not?

In my head, the theme would be content-led (e.g. MOVIES, LITERATURE, EUROPEAN GEOGRAPHY) rather than a specific puzzle type. Part of the fun will be seeing different types of puzzle created under the same unifying content theme. Variety is the spice of life!

And does a chain-puzzle need to like get an "approval" before its started?

RE my "final small note": I can set up a template in a code block at the bottom of the post. Would that be good?

@bobble Sure, see how it looks!

@PrinceNorthLæraðr While I don't think we'd want a formal 'approval' process (that would set up a hierarchy of sorts, which isn't cool...) I think at least gauging some sense from an experienced/regular site user that it's a good idea would be the minimum amount of effort that should be expended...

...If someone goes ahead and launches a chain themed entirely around YTTERBIUM I think it would seem to others like they hadn't put any thought into making it accessible or even possible to create subsequent puzzles. (THE PERIODIC TABLE would be sufficiently loose IMHO)

Okay, then yeah, something unofficial like that would probably be best :)

How about like a "required feedback" before posting a theme

It's like doing consumer research - check that people are going to like the product before you take it to market!

Exactly

I'll add something brief to that effect to the guidelines later, thanks :)

Not right now, I'm editing!

(Exactly, that's why I said later...!)

Are "series name" and "series theme" two different things?

Hm, I guess so

If you're referring to "[Series Name with Hyperlink to series puzzles] series, in which all puzzles are themed around [series theme]" I meant it more so people can give a short stub for the Name and expand slightly in the second bracket. e.g. Tabletop Games series, in which all puzzles are themed around board games, card games, tile games and the like

Ah, that makes sense

I'm formatting it in the template as [series name] (hyperlink to series puzzles)

Oooh! Oooooh! I have a suggestion for a theme:

Agreed

"To Serve Man"

Basically every single puzzle is related to like alien and cooking

Or I guess maybe just aliens, I don't know

But it'd have like a neat storyline and everything

'alien and cooking'??

Alien recipes, humans getting cooked, of the sort

Okay maybe just aliens

But I still like the series title as "To Serve Man"

Template is up, please feel free to fix any mistakes I made

Haha, I think ALIENS might be more wide-reaching and easily understandable - i think the series name should really be something that doesn't need too much explanation...! :)

"Alien Invasion" could work as the series title I guess. I've been dying to use that as a puzzle title though ("To Serve Man")

You can use puzzle-specific sub titles!

Oh, can we have a The Office (TV show) themed chain puzzle? :P

Again, we'd be getting a bit niche. A theme really needs to appeal to a vast swathe of the 'readership' - I think the more niche it gets the more people will be totally disinterested in it. SITCOMS would be a goer, I'd say.

Ah, I see

See, this is why the "required feedback" clause is so useful :P

Ha, clashing edits there @bobble !

The meta-question has "instils" on the first line (should be "instills") Do you want to fix?

Also would you like to remove the bit of the meta-question that asks for a chain-puzzle tag, or keep it for posterity?

i think it might be "instils" in the uk :)

The silly English

@bobble I think keep the question as it was since it was later discussed (I added an edit about the 'no obligation' part already). I've altered the answer.

PS Pretty sure you misspelled 'silky' in your last message ;-)

Since you're here, another thought. I think it should be OK for the chain bit of the puzzle (how the previous answer is incorporated) to be non-obvious at first glance, as long as it is clearly connected when the whole solving method & answer is revealed. Agree? Disagree? In-between?

Agree. After all, let's say the theme is TV DETECTIVES and the answer to Puzzle #1 is MORSE. If the solution path to Puzzle #2 relied on using Morse code I would think it perfectly natural for the puzzle not to have mentioned it, as it would give too much away. A tool in the solver's toolkit is knowing what the previous answer was - if you can't see how it's been used, look for it!

Where would a solver "express... their wish not to continue the chain themselves"? In comments under the answer, question, in chat...?

Any of those. Somewhere the last OP can receive it.

Also, I got a laugh out of the part of the template where I put "<!-- Insert puzzle here -->" I for some reason find that uproariously funny. Thought I'd mention it.

I think almost the best thing would be for the setter to ask at the same time as presenting the checkmark, making sure the solver noticed that part of the blurb

@bobble Very important to remember!

I don't think you've addressed the flip side of too-niche themes: too-broad themes. Is there a limit where you would say that a theme is too broad?

Absolutely. And I think that's why it's important to foster the idea of chatting about a series first. After all, a theme like PEOPLE could go anywhere - why not limit it to SINGERS, POLITICIANS or even the still-quite-vague CELEBRITY?

I feel like we're doing a lot of worrying about a puzzle format that (lest we forget) does not actually have a single puzzle to its name yet! The worrying is (hopefully) useful, though.

(By the way, there will at least be two chains that come out of this - I have some theme ideas kicking around that I'll bring out once the original chain is done)

Well, I think what we're actually doing is trying to get a framework in place - it's all useful thinking and we're being sure we have answers to questions that will likely be asked by others later :) I'll launch my puzzle tomorrow to get this rolling then...

And great, two chains will make for a bigger sample size to test if it really works!

I'm just worried I'm going to be too dumb to solve one, and be left out of the fun :-)

There will still be hints if the puzzle goes unsolved for a while, I assume

Seems to me any individual puzzle is just a puzzle, with typical treatment...after all, I thought a goal was for anyone to be able to jump in, anywhere in the chain, and potentially solve.

Oh you're worried about sniping! You're a very good puzzler you know - and since you have time, I'd give you an advantage on solving :)

Thanks bobble :-) A lot is just being in the right place at the right time. Like when Deusovi is asleep...