Home Improvement

Niall C.

03:28

@aarthi: I know you mentioned professional trade shows as a possibility for promoting the site, but are shows like this on your radar too: otshows.com/pfhs

Niall C.

03:54

(I've started seeing billboards for it pop up around town)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

13:30

@NiallC You're in OR I take it? ;)

Karl Katzke

14:08

@AarthiDevanathanΨ Rebecca still hasn't answered the question. ;)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@KarlKatzke She had a migraine yesterday. =( She said she'd get to it today or tomorrow.

Karl Katzke

@NiallC I didn't realize you're in Portland. What part? Used to live there.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@NiallC soooo question: were you planning on going to this?

Karl Katzke

@AarthiDevanathanΨ Ohh. Ouch, my sympathies to her. Migranes suck. So yes, whenever.

Niall C.

@aarthi: Yes indeed. Not that I'm expecting to see team CHAOS descend on that show, but I expect there are similar events closer to home.

@karl: Live in North Portland, near UP

Karl Katzke

14:10

@NiallC I'm a PSU grad, lived in Goose Hollow while I was going to school. Lots of friends live in your neighborhood.

Niall C.

@aarthi: probably

I generally make it to all those shows in the area (there are maybe 5 or 6 all through Spring)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@NiallC let me know if/when you decide for sure. we might send you some swag and stuff to hand or something.

Niall C.

@aarthi: OK.

@karl: cool. How long ago were you in Portland?

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@NiallC ooh and let me know if/when you decide to go to the other shows come springtime; we might uh tag along

Karl Katzke

@NiallC Ten years. My parents moved there when I was in high school (1996) and I graduated from HS and went to community college and then PSU, and moved to Texas for the woman I was seeing at the time in 2006.

@NiallC Oops. I misread. Anyway, I moved out in 2006, five years ago.

@AarthiDevanathan BTW, I wanted to apologize for giving slightly sarcastic or humorous responses to a few of the ... 'special' questions we've gotten around here. The one about the wall anchors was just funny to me. And the one about laying sod in Austin, TX right now ... is just, um, 'special'.

@AarthiDevanathan Can we add it to the question guidelines that people should mention in their question where they're from if they don't have it set in their profile? Many questions are very region-dependent.

or the answers are region-dependent, I mean.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

14:31

@KarlKatzke no worries! I...honestly haven't noticed anything, and it's @ChrisF that you need to worry about, not me. I just edit titles. ;D

but you're right; i'll bring that up with Chris

Karl Katzke

kk. The region thing has gotten me a few times trying to help people. It really is a huge difference in how houses are built when you live in a cooling climate versus the heating climate that most of the US experiences.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@KarlKatzke yeah, canada, for example, is really different. So is England/Europe, or god forbid India.

Karl Katzke

Yeah, for instance, electrical codes are slightly different in India.

Niall C.

@aarthi: will do. There's really only one (maybe two) that I'd recommend.

Which reminds me, I see a lot of the same vendors at county and state fairs that I do at those home & garden shows.

If they're showing, they must be getting some business, so there must be some number of DIYers at the fairs.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

14:49

@KarlKatzke brb loling forever.

Karl Katzke

hee hee hee

BMitch

@KarlKatzke I was actually going to mention that the sod question was asked months ago, only got an update today so it appeared new.

Karl Katzke

@BMitch Oh. I didn't notice that. It had no votes, so I'd assumed it was new too.

BMitch

Yeah, no votes because it wasn't all that great of a question

cost questions don't work all that well (prices change over time and location)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

should that move to gardening/landscaping anyway?

BMitch

14:58

@AarthiDevanathanΨ probably, let them work on the sod vs turf debate :)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

there's a debate?

BMitch

not so much debate but various edits, I think it's a US vs UK thing since I've always known it as sod.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

oh! hahahaha

BMitch

anyone ever see a witty comment that deserved a thumbs up and then see that you're the one that wrote it?

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

i think of turf as something for sports pitches

BMitch

15:00

@AarthiDevanathanΨ same here

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

lololol A+ we're on the same page

BMitch

2

Q: Why do I have two parallel gas pipes?

I've got a water heater and a hot water radiator furnace sitting next to each other, both on gas. The strange thing is that there are two parallel gas lines feeding each one of these which come from across the basement but branch off from the same gas line. Why was there a need for two lines? ...

I was about to give the "paid by the foot" comment a +1 before seeing that it was my own

Karl Katzke

Yeah, turf is for sports, or what you have if you are a master at maintaining a lawn and have grass that is perfectly maintained and trimmed. Most people have lawns, which may have some patches of turf, but are just a lawn.

BMitch

I just try to keep the weeds below knee high

Karl Katzke

Weeds won't even grow here right now. :(

BMitch

15:05

free rain available here, (you haul and package)

Niall C.

"sod" is a mild expletive in the UK, as in "sod off you smarmy git". Unlike "turf" in the US which is an accompinent for "surf". mmmm

Karl Katzke

heh. If a bunch of jacked up dually pickup trucks with water tanks in the bed pull into your driveway, @BMitch, you know what we're there for.

BMitch

@KarlKatzke outside my window I see several built-in swimming pools were apparently put in recently. I don't think they remembered to install a lining though.

Karl Katzke

Heh.

I want some rain, but if Nate comes to Texas, it will be a bigger disaster than the fires have been.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

as an aside: homg there are people in here~ makes me so happy.

BMitch

15:14

even the weather seems to be diverging to extremes in the US

Karl Katzke

I blame it on the politicians. Every time Perry prays for rain, Texas develops more of the attributes of hell. Heat, fires, plagues of insects...

We had to have the house treated for ticks yesterday. Ticks are so uncommon in deepest suburbia in Houston that our dogs weren't even on tick preventative.

BMitch

@AarthiDevanathanΨ that makes this all the more difficult, I've got to head off for a bit. /afk

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

15:30

@BMitch awww. I'LL MISS YOU

but in all honesty, i am glad this chat is FINALLY more active. it only took me 8 weeks of work ;)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

15:48

HEY DIY. Has anyone used this sander before?

amazon.com/Makita-BO5041K-5-Inch-Random-Sander/dp/B003M5IWM8/…

Karl Katzke

16:06

I haven't, but it's gotten good reviews.

About half my woodworking tools are Makita.

So I tend to pay attention to reviews of their newer stuff

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

16:32

@KarlKatzke not just on amazon?

Karl Katzke

@AarthiDevanathanΨ IIRC, it was reviewed in either Fine Homebuilding or Journal of Light Construction in August along with sandpaper.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@KarlKatzke sandpaper gets reviews?

Karl Katzke

@AarthiDevanathanΨ Yes, sandpaper gets reviews.

You would be surprised how big the difference in bottom of the line (Gator) sandpaper is from the 2nd best (Mirka) ...

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

oh wow. could you....attempt to delineate?

OR

I CAN ASK ON THE SITE

Karl Katzke

Hahahaha

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

16:35

runs off to ask

Karl Katzke

I don't have that copy of JLC or FHB with me, actually, so someone else needs to look at it to give accurate answers on their findings. The gist of it is that the abrasives on the paper are of varying durability (how long the sand lasts before it rounds off), and how badly the paper loads is a big deal too -- loading defined as how much of the surface you're sanding sticks to the paper instead of turning to dust and flying away.

FHB #221, Pg. 73

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

A+

Rebecca Chernoff

Hi folks! (:

Karl Katzke

Hi, Rebecca! How are you feeling?

Rebecca Chernoff

o: okay. why? (:

Karl Katzke

16:39

Aarthi said you had a migrane yesterday.

Rebecca Chernoff

ahhh okay. much less creepy, then. q:

Karl Katzke

Hehehehe. Sorry. I was NOT trying to be creepy.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@RebeccaChernoff lolol my bad RChern. I mentioned that you hadn't responded to the meta question yet because you weren't feeling well

Rebecca Chernoff

lol. all good, no worries. Just seemed a bit out of place without context. (:

I've answered it now though!

Karl Katzke

Thanks, I commented on your answer.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

16:42

3 hours ago, by Karl Katzke

@AarthiDevanathanΨ Ohh. Ouch, my sympathies to her. Migranes suck. So yes, whenever.

CONTEXT

Karl Katzke

context is gooood.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

i thought it was for the weak

Karl Katzke

No. That's sleep. Sleep is for the weak.

"You can sleep when you're dead."

Rebecca Chernoff

@KarlKatzke and now I have commented on your comment. (;

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

hahaha

Rebecca Chernoff

16:45

So, I mostly wanted to say I've been keeping an eye on the meta regarding a DIY blog. Don't forget that there are a couple more steps on the road to creation. (:

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

what are they again, if you don't mind?

Karl Katzke

I know. I was planning on keeping a single question open for about a week, and then we'd move on to the next step.

Stack Overflow Blog: Blog Overflow

Posted by Rebecca Chernoff on June 23rd, 2011

Every Stack Exchange site starts with a Q&A site, made up of three pieces that help bring the whole community together:

bicycles.stackexchange.com, the main Q&A site

meta.bicycles.stackexchange.com, questions about community and administrative matters

chat.bicycles.stackexchange.com, the third place for real-time collaborations

But wait, there’s more?

A couple months ago, the Super User community took it upon themselves to create a blog run by the community. This effort has been so successful that a couple other communities floated the idea amongst themselves. Internally, we recognize …

The steps are about halfway down the page. (Wish there was an anchor for them, but...)

Next step for us will be to recruit contributors.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

ahhh

well, shirlock has a bunch of stories i'm sure

RChern and I can directly contact potential contributors who don't regularly hang out in chat

Karl Katzke

Yeah, Steve and Niall seemed to want to contribute too based on last week's chat, I think.

I usually have three or four projects running between my house and my friends' houses.

Rebecca Chernoff

Eh, this can be done just through meta posts and such. Or in chat. Or maybe if a user doesn't use meta or chat then sparingly, not spammingly a comment on one of their posts on the main site linking them to the meta post.

Karl Katzke

16:49

@RebeccaChernoff SPAM? youtube.com/watch?v=anwy2MPT5RE

►

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

lololol

Rebecca Chernoff

(:

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

so rchern, how DIY-y are you?

Rebecca Chernoff

not really at all (:

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

hahaha hooray we are cut from the same cloth

Karl Katzke

16:53

Hehehe. My friends are mostly not DIY, until they realize that they can have a $50,000 kitchen for $10,000 if they are nice to me and willing to do a LOT of work.

oops, brb, gotta work for a few.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@KarlKatzke lol job? pfft lies

Karl Katzke

I know. srsly.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@auujay hey!

i haven't seen you in a while, how's life?

Karl Katzke

18:42

Hey, is Project Update Chat happening now?

If so, it's sure quiet in here!

Grace Note

Starts in 15 minutes, I believe

Karl Katzke

Ok. It's showing up on the front page now, so I just wanted to make sure.

chris

19:01

Is this actually happening?

Rebecca Chernoff

Hi! (:

Welcome to Project Update Thursday!

Anyone have project updates? (:

Karl Katzke

I'm assuming so, Chris. :)

I do! I do! We ran several hundred feet of wire in two homes belonging to friends this week.

chris

Actually no. I'm going to start my basement soon, but I'm still waiting for the mold remediation guy to finish and give the all clear.

Karl Katzke

In one home, all of the lights and outlets in the house are powered off of six 15 amp circuits

It's a 3,000 sq ft house.

There's 28 outlets & devices on one circuit.

chris

So that's a 60 amp circuit. You could stick two more circuits in there.

I doubt its a 45

Karl Katzke

19:06

No -- on one 15 amp circuit.

chris

I mean overall - House supply.

Karl Katzke

The main panel is 175 feet from the area of the house that we're working in, which is a good place to break some of the circuits down so that they can run a hair dryer and a vacuum cleaner at the same time. So we pulled three new home runs (since there are three slots remaining in the panel) and an electrician is coming out to hook them up and get the remaining rough in done.

Jay Bazuzi

Why did you choose that vs. a small subpanel?

Karl Katzke

@JayBazuzi The homeowner (not I) didn't want to go to the expense of running a subpanel, which I think would've also required a service upgrade. I'm not very good with the math for electricity; I'm better as a helper and do mainly what a real electrician tells me to do. We saved him about a grand by pulling the wire through the attic to the panel ourselves.

@chris What's the usual supply for a house that size? He's got 200A service, but most of it is consumed by two HVAC units and kitchen appliances.

chris

200A sounds good. I've got 100 in 2000 sq ft. And it's sufficient.

Jay Bazuzi

19:12

@KarlKatzke Is the water heater, dryer heat, and range all electric, too?

chris

The electrician said only go 200 for that house if I'm putting in a hot tub or sauna our other beast.

Karl Katzke

@JayBazuzi No, gas.

chris

But I think the limit is 10-12 devices per circuit.

I'm in Canada though, so AC use is much lower than in TX

Karl Katzke

@chris Yeah, the 10-12 device per circuit limitation is why we're breaking circuits in the part of the house that we're renovating. The entire upstairs is on one circuit... that'll be an entirely different project.

chris

I've got a bathroom and kitchen on the same circuit. Making coffee and having my wife dry her hair at the same time is an eternal source of conflict.

Will fix when we expose the walls when we do the kitchen.

Karl Katzke

19:14

I personally would've suggested a pony panel ... but he's already facing a huge bill for this project, and he'll probably do that when we wire the upstairs.

Poor guy, friend of mine via some other friends, decided one day to DIY gut his bathroom... and then as he got into the project he found all kinds of problems with it's structure and wiring, and so he just sort of stalled out.

So they've been showering in another bathroom for three months that has no electricity since he dinged some wires in the master as he was removing drywall.

chris

In the lower bathroom, we found an outlet that was wired to ground, because he was too lazy to run a neutral from the other outlet.

Karl Katzke

Ooh, that takes me to another project that I helped with. We roughed in electrical in a much smaller bathroom. There were a few problems...

Like this...

See that GFCI outlet? That's not romex. Wait, how'd they get a GFCI connected with just two wires?

chris

I had to view large to see what you're talking about. Looks like phone wire or low voltage wiring. There might be two very small strands in there.

Karl Katzke

@chris Nope. It was scrap copper from inside romex (14 ga solid copper).

Also, it was copper, and the rest of the house is AL.

ChrisF

Diagonal wiring. Nice :)

chris

19:22

@ChrisF: Saves on material costs, you know.

I personally invested in a wire stretcher. Saves me lots of effort.

Doresoom

I (somewhat) finished work on my ceiling this weekend!

ChrisF

Dangerous in a stud wall - positively lethal if the cables buried in plaster on a solid wall.

Karl Katzke

Heh. Hey, does that wire stretcher work on both aluminum and copper? I'd like to re-use some of this AL that we tore out of his bathroom, but I'm a few feet short.

chris

Why?

Doresoom

After 4 months of on and off work following the April tornados that hit Alabama.

Karl Katzke

19:23

@ChrisF So common down here in TX.

@Doresoom Awesome! Pictures?

Doresoom

Not yet - too ashamed of some drywall mudding that I have to improve on

It's a little wavy on one of the seams - I didn't find out until after I hung the ceiling fan.

ChrisF

If you want to drill holes for shelves etc you assume that the wires run horizontally or vertically from the socket. If they do it makes it trivially easy to miss them with the drill. If they're diagonal, and you don't know it, you could end up electrocuting yourself.

BMitch

@Doresoom drywall mudding is an art, and I'm still not an artist.

chris

Mudding is a job I pay someone to do. It involves too many hand-skills that I just don't have. I avoid all wet-work if possible.

Doresoom

I even tried the flashlight held up parallel to the ceiling trick after priming, but I guess I didn't get exactly the right angle.

chris

19:25

@ChrisF Ok, makes sense.

Doresoom

There's a reason it's taken me 4 months :)

Karl Katzke

@Doresoom I had that same problem on my ceiling in my house. And yeah, it took me three or four months. It's still not perfect, but it's down to what I can live with.

The main problem was that there was a bit of sag to the joists that the drywallers didn't notice and compensate for, so I had a bowed outwards joint that's just gonna show no matter what I do.

Doresoom

Anyway, just some more drywall finishing for an 8' seam, and then rehanging crown molding around my tray ceiling is all that's left.

chris

The other job I avoid is soldering brass. I can do copper ok, but those heavy brass settings taunt me.

Doresoom

...and recutting some extra molding that my dog chewed up while it was laying on the floor

luckily home depot carried the same profile

Karl Katzke

19:27

Hahahaha. Glad to see someone else has little "helpers"

chris

I've got two 5-year old boys that love to "help".

God forbid I leave anything unattended. They'll try to finish for me.

And they love wet-work

Karl Katzke

@chris: your 5 year old boys probably don't have 2-inch canines and enjoy chewing on wood, though. My dad let me help by pulling nails and stuff when I was a kid... that's still one of my first memories.

@chris HAHAHAHAHA

Jay Bazuzi

My son once switched the breakers back on while I was replacing a recep. Very "helpful".

Karl Katzke

(re: wet work)

Niiiiiiice, @JayBazuzi

chris

I put the panel nice and high when we had the service upgrade. Just to avoid that exact scenario.

Karl Katzke

19:30

That's true. My "helpers" haven't figured out how to operate switches yet. (Although they lock me out of the car all the time if I leave them and my keys in it.)

BMitch

@chris are these your kids?

chris

Yeah, that one's been around for a while. Thank god the parents had the foresight to snap a picture before freaking out.

I get them to put washers on bolts for me. Small one first (split ring), then the big one. Now do 10 more.

They know the difference between a wood-screw and a bolt already, which is more than many adults.

Rebecca Chernoff

@KarlKatzke Is you leaving your kids and the keys in your car with you on the outside a common occurrence? (;

BMitch

I was helping my fam build a basketball hoop (well, I was building it for them). For the son that really wanted to help, I let put on the net. It took both parents and kid together to even attempt the process, funniest thing I ever saw.

Karl Katzke

@RebeccaChernoff My kids have four legs and fur, and I leave them in the car with the A/C on because I can't take them into stores.

Doresoom

19:35

it was also fun trying to keep all the dog hair out of the mud I was using

BMitch

But it gave me time to finish installing all the bolts

Doresoom

somehow it gets everywhere

chris

I'm trying to teach them the names of tools. It's really nice to say "Pass me a red robertson driver" and actually get one.

Doresoom

I'd finally get a pass nice and smooth, and then notice there was a hair in the middle of it

Karl Katzke

@Doresoom LOL

BMitch

19:36

@Doresoom Doh!

chris

Martha Stewart would have gone with it and called it a "Textured Finish"

Note to self: Shave dog before plastering.

Karl Katzke

We had five dogs in the house, three with long coats, when I was doing the cabinet painting a few weeks ago. Talk about struggling to get a good finish...

Last DIY project I've worked on in the past week is solar screens for my girlfriend's living room. DIYing 72" high screens is ... difficult.

chris

What are solar screens?

Karl Katzke

Any suggestions on getting the screen taut without warping the long side of the frame inward?

@chris Window coverings that block a majority of light while still being transparent.

chris

Like on the windows of an advertising wrapped bus?

Karl Katzke

19:43

@chris Yeah, pretty much the same idea. Keeps the solar heat on the outside of the structure.

y'all don't need 'em in the Great White North for the most part, but down here in Tejas...

chris

Yeah, when the sun is high in the summer, the roof usually shades the windows. When it's low in the winter, we cherish every UV ray we can get.

Karl Katzke

(side note: when I reference "Great White North", I'm using a reference from an iconic film... )

(bonus points to anyone who can name the film.)

chris

Hamlet?

Karl Katzke

-2 points for being canadian and not knowing!

Hint

Jay Bazuzi

That's Hamlet.

chris

19:47

It is hamlet. Elsinore brewery. Dead father's ghost. Two bumbling idiots for comic relief.

Karl Katzke

Huh. Never heard it called that before.

Jay Bazuzi

I've been to the castle at Helsingör, but hadn't read Hamlet at the time. Too bad.

chris

The plot is a complete rip-off of Shakespeare. Why do you think they chose the name "Elsinore"

Jay Bazuzi

Back on topic: I'm working on a design for a "washhouse" to accompany the yurt. Basically a large, standalone bathroom with a washer & dryer in it.

Total around 120 sq. ft. on the outside.

Trying to think about heat source for a small space.

chris

Where are you located?

Jay Bazuzi

19:51

About 50mi from Seattle. In the woods. Marine climate.

Karl Katzke

Yes, back on topic, ignore my shame. ;)

chris

So passive solar won't do you.

Karl Katzke

Jay, what have you considered so far?

@chris Passive solar in seattle? ;)

Jay Bazuzi

If we didn't heat it at all, it'll probably hover around 50-55deg all fall/winter/spring

I plan to have propane for hot water & the dryer, so we could use that for heat.

chris

How about a heated tile floor?

Jay Bazuzi

19:53

Electric is so easy, and this is a small space. Even a little space heater would probably be enough.

High thermal mass would only make sense if we were keeping it warm all the time. But since it's a separate building, I'd rather be able to heat it up on demand.

Karl Katzke

I'm not familiar with your yurt project; do you have electric available?

Jay Bazuzi

I have a 60A subpanel close by.

ChrisF

@KarlKatzke (You can edit your last message (within a 5 minute window). Just press up arrow in the entry area)

Karl Katzke

@ChrisF Thanks!

chris

1000 W / 100 Sq. Ft. for electric heaters (baseboard style)

Jay Bazuzi

19:57

10W / Sq. Ft then?

But that's based on the goal of keeping the space warm continuously, so the heater doesn't struggle to keep up with heat less in the dead of winter.

chris

So go a bit higher - like 2000W for the room and heat it up quick.

Jay Bazuzi

I could use 500W halogen work lamps, ha ha.

chris

I'd also put it on a timer, so that you can't leave it on indefinately.

Jay Bazuzi

@chris: I agree about the timer.

chris

Or, there's those radiant heat lamps they use in hotels. That might be worth exploring.

Jay Bazuzi

20:00

A radiant heat lamp might feel really nice during or after a shower.

chris

Then you could get a small heater, keep it above freezing, and just use the lamps for comfort.

Jay Bazuzi

yeah.

ChrisF

Is it an electric shower?

Jay Bazuzi

that's not a bad way to go

No, it uses water :-)

chris

Oh Snap!

Jay Bazuzi

20:02

@ChrisF: I assume you're asking how I'm heating the shower water, and I'm leaning towards propane instant heater. I'm hoping that won't be too expensive, since the total load is much smaller than a house.

ChrisF

Ha, ha. If it used electricity to heat the water you could wire the control for the heater through the shower and a timer so it turned on at the same time and then turned off 15 minutes afterwards so you wouldn't have to remember to turn the heater off.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

hey everyone -- sorry I'm late~

ChrisF

Evening @AarthiDevanathan

chris

Are you planning on living there all year? or is it a weekend yurt?

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@ChrisF I got trapped in a meeting! D:

Jay Bazuzi

20:04

So one timing circuit for both space heating & shower hot water. Hmmm.

Full-time, year round living.

chris

The only problem is that when you go in there to "Read the newspaper" You won't be running hot water until afterwards

Jay Bazuzi

I figure, you turn on the timer when you walk in, setting for as long as you plan to be in there.

Regardless of why.

chris

If you use flow through water heating, it will be on-demand anyways. It won't need a timer.

Karl Katzke

Hmn, the on-demand thing may not work the way you think it works.

On-demand water heaters work by sensing water flow and starting the heater as soon as water flow starts.

chris

Exactly.

Karl Katzke

20:12

Now, if you were to put a recirculation pump in there so that you could start the pump to start water flow, THAT pump would want to be on a timer.

Then you'd really have "instant on" hot water.

Jay Bazuzi

I'm laying things out so all plumbing is on the same size, so plumbing will be simpler & hot water lines will be very short.

Karl Katzke

Yeah, but the on-demand water heaters don't have a tank at all. They work by heating the water as it flows through them.

So it doesn't matter how long your plumbing run is -- you have to have water flow through the heater for it to be heating the water.

And it requires some time to fully warm up it's heat exchanger, so there's still some lag before it starts producing hot water.

chris

I don't see any point in recirculating. Those things provide hot water pretty quickly. There's no noticable difference between on demand heating, and a tank system with cold pipes (i.e. the run hasn't been used in a couple of hours)

Karl Katzke

Agreed, but he was talking about timing circuits...

chris

I don't understand why we're timing the water heater. Unless you are planning a radiator system.

Jay Bazuzi

20:19

Yeah, I don't understand it now, either.

chris

Ok: Options - 2k baseboard on a timer, - Heats fast.

ChrisF

I wasn't suggesting timing the water heater - just the space heater and tieing it into the power for the shower.

chris

Smaller heater on thermo to keep above freezing and heat lamps.

How are you heating the main living space?

Jay Bazuzi

The main living space (yurt) is wood-heated.

I have an enormous amount of firewood here, gotta do something with it.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

(aside: @chris welcome to the DIY chat. It's nice to see new faces. Same to you, @JayBazuzi -- I think this is the first time we've been in the same space in realtime.)

chris

20:27

I'd pose the question on the main site.

thanks Aarthi

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@chris anytime. i (usually) try to greet people as they enter chat, but, alas, even SE has meetings.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

20:39

so uh wow this chat just died

Karl Katzke

Sorry. I had to do this "work" thing again.

chris

Yeah. I Blame Aarthi.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

Pssh, work?! No such thing.

laughs Thanks, @chris i feel so valued.

@Karl it's cool i got trapped in a meeting and so missed a TON of this chat.

:( sadfaces

Karl Katzke

srsly.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

but yeah -- so i guess i'll blather a bit

so I'm working on DIY promo stuff, which is my ongoing project that I'm doing myself. (rimshot) Do y'all have any questions about my progress or whatever?

chris

20:52

A bit unrelated, but what's the revenue model?

BMitch

@AarthiDevanathanΨ ok, I'll bite, what's the progress like?

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

@chris lol all ads from SO and Careers 2.0. and VC money. glorious VC money.

@BMitch I'm glad you asked, @Bmitch! I've been doing some more blogstalking, which as we all know has been awesome in the past

chris

Ok, but VC won't last forever. There's got to be some plan to monetize the eyeballs.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

currently, i'm trying to woo Ethan from One Project Closer into doing something with/for/alongside us.

@chris right now it's, as I said, the advertisements. we sell ads on SO, and SO brings in a lot of ad revenue.

The company's been hiring a lot lately, and our efforts mean that the other sites will eventually be monetized

chris

Ok, disabled adblock on SO. Hope that helps.

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

20:56

by "us" I'm referring to the CHAOS team, whose job it is to promote and grow sites by bringing in new users

@chris awww, yaaaay, thanks.

chris

I can see great monetary tie-ins on DIY. If Home Depot or Lowes could actually build a decent website, there could be fantastic targeted advertising for each question.

BMitch

@chris Don't get me started on Lowes' website.

chris

One of the basic questions in life is "How much does a 2x4 cost?". Lowes and Home Depot cannot answer that question.

BMitch

I don't think I've seen ads for anything other than careers 2.0. Maybe I'm blocking them. Hmm

chris

5:00. Time to go. Can't chat on my leisure time.

BMitch

21:02

@chris $2.50 for me homedepot.com/Lumber-Composites-Dimensional-Lumber-Studs/h_d1/…

I had issues with lowes, order 3 return vents (upgraded to the ones you can open and insert a filter), and the website rejected 2 of the vents saying it couldn't charge my card, but shipped the third separately without a cancel option (didn't want to pay separate shipping on each

Call phone support, they cancel, I resubmit, same error, but the shipping charge is different for the same errored order.

Long story short, cancellation department arrives after the shipping department does, and fedex is challenged in the concept of refusing a delivery

Sorry, I told you not to get me started. :)

Aarthi Devanathan Ψ

lololol i'm loling forever.

okay I adore you all, but I have dinner plans. Adios!

OOH

OH OH OH

Need licensed contractor to help with load-bearing wall / permits. Any recommendations in Richmond area? #RVA

Tweeted by younghouselove on September 8, 2011 at 8:37 PM

WE

WE NEED TO MAKE THIS HAPPEN

@BMitch YOU YOU ARE IN VA

make me a rec!

:O :O

aaaaand ok i really gotta roll /waves

BMitch

21:25

@AarthiDevanathan Don't know the Richmond area, I'm in northern VA, and I do a lot myself because I don't know anyone else :)

Rebecca Chernoff

@BMitch, extended roadtrip? (;

BMitch

@RebeccaChernoff haha, I'm not licensed, but I am an IT contractor

Rebecca Chernoff

details, schmetails!

Rebecca Chernoff

21:47

hmm, this chat sure did quiet down, eh? (:

Grace Note

Wouldn't be the first time

Rebecca Chernoff

hehe

Grace Note

23:02

> Thanks for attending Project Update Thursday! We'll see you all here next week -- same bat-time, same bat-channel.

And then because last time Aarthi did this with quotes, so too shall we do so again.

4 hours ago, by Rebecca Chernoff

Welcome to Project Update Thursday!

1 min ago, by Grace Note

> Thanks for attending Project Update Thursday! We'll see you all here next week -- same bat-time, same bat-channel.

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