2020 Moderator Election Chatroom

Matt Samuel

00:18

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@MattSamuel You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election as you do not have at least 1000 reputation.

quid

00:37

@SamuelLiew do you have some insight what's up with the score thing. The bot does not give any or tells users they can't run. Only for me they give a somewhat reasonable reply but won't give a score either.

Even those that are in the election.

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@quid oops! you already have a diamond!

Catija

It could be recognizing your chat diamond for the mod response... a mod on another site trying it could probably confirm that... Maybe it's still checking candidate score based on SO?

quid

00:52

@Catija that was my guess too. I also thought it might get confused by the chat parent. But for example for Matt it ought to work.

Catija

But if it's referring to reputation on SO, then it won't give the correct candidate score.

@ElectionBot help

ElectionBot

Examples of election FAQs I can help with:
- how does the election work
- who are the candidates
- how to nominate
- how to vote
- how to decide who to vote for
- who are the current mods
- are moderators paid
- what is the election status
- when is the election starting
- when is the election ending
- how is candidate score calculated
- what is my candidate score
- what are moderation badges
- what are participation badges
- what are editing badges

Catija

how is the candidate score calculated

ElectionBot

The 40-point candidate score is calculated this way: 1 point for each 1,000 reputation up to 20,000 reputation (for 20 points); and 1 point for each of the 8 moderation, 6 participation, and 6 editing badges

Catija

current mods

who are the current mods

ElectionBot

00:54

The current 9 moderators are: Asaf Karagila, robjohn, Daniel Fischer, Pedro Tamaroff, davidlowryduda, quid, Aloizio Macedo, Michael Greinecker, Alexander Gruber

Catija

Huh... interesting.

how to nominate

Cooldown... grrr

who are the candidates

ElectionBot

Currently there are 6 candidates: heropup, TheSimpliFire, Xander Henderson, Brahadeesh, Paramanand Singh, Matt Samuel

quid

It seems to work but for the score.

Catija

So, it's weird because on SO the minimum rep is 3k, not 1k, so it's got the Math data properly but it's not pulling in Math.se rep...

Also, on SO, it used to say "if you must know, your score is ___" but that seems to be missing here, too.

Samuel Liew

01:47

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@SamuelLiew sorry, I was unable to calculate your candidate score :(

Samuel Liew

ok the issue is that your chat id is different from your Math.SE id, so it couldn't fetch from the API. I'll see if I can get it fixed. All other bot commands will still work

Catija

02:20

Ah, yeah, that's mostly going to be the case. Chat IDs are for the entire network, not tied to any one site. :)

Samuel Liew

04:38

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@SamuelLiew You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election as you do not have at least 1000 reputation. Your candidate score is 0 (out of 40).

Arctic Char

What is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@ArcticChar Your candidate score is 14 (out of 40). You are missing these badges: Sportsmanship, Reviewer, Steward, Constituent, Convention, Copy Editor, Refiner, Tag Editor. Having a high candidate score is not a requirement - you can still nominate yourself in the election!

Arctic Char

Ah thanks

Samuel Liew

Thanks for your patience and understanding everyone. The bot is now fixed up for Chat.SE and network site elections (previously that feature was for SO only).

Arctic Char

04:41

I mean thank you to you, Samuel. Not the bot!

sai-kartik

05:49

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@sai-kartik Your candidate score is 9 (out of 40). You are missing these badges: Civic Duty, Electorate, Marshal, Sportsmanship, Steward, Constituent, Convention, Investor, Yearling, Copy Editor, Refiner, Tag Editor. Having a high candidate score is not a requirement - you can still nominate yourself in the election!

sai-kartik

sweet!

thanks @SamuelLiew

@amWhy i don't think you'll find this bot annoying anymore :)

KReiser

06:24

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@KReiser Your candidate score is 35 (out of 40). You are missing these badges: Marshal, Sportsmanship, Constituent, Convention, Investor. Perhaps consider nominating yourself in the election?

KReiser

not the worst bot, I guess

Abram Ivanov

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@AbramIvanov You are not eligible to nominate yourself in the election as you do not have at least 1000 reputation. Your candidate score is 0 (out of 40).

Abram Ivanov

0?

bad one

who made you @ElectionBot?

ElectionBot

06:31

@AbramIvanov Samuel created me. Isn't he awesome?

Abram Ivanov

yes

how old are you @ElectionBot?

anyways,Nice to meet you!

are moderators paid?

ElectionBot

Elected ♦ moderators is an entirely voluntary role, and they are not paid by Stack Exchange.

Abram Ivanov

you're fast!

Matt Samuel

10:20

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@MattSamuel Your candidate score is 34 (out of 40). You are missing these badges: Deputy, Marshal, Sportsmanship, Investor, Copy Editor, Refiner. Perhaps consider nominating yourself in the election?

user185131

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@Brahadeesh Your candidate score is 29 (out of 40). Having a high candidate score is not a requirement - you can still nominate yourself in the election!

user185131

Great!

user185131

@ElectionBot Hang on, you still don't realize that @MattSamuel is a nominee?

Martin Sleziak

10:25

how to decide who to vote for

ElectionBot

If you want to make an informed decision on who to vote for, you can also read the candidates' answers in the election Q&A, and you also can look at examples of their participation on Meta and how they conduct themselves.

Matt Samuel

@Brahadeesh It knows

who are the nominees

ElectionBot

Currently there are 6 candidates: heropup, TheSimpliFire, Xander Henderson, Brahadeesh, Paramanand Singh, Matt Samuel

user185131

Ah, okay...! The standard response is then either "consider nominating yourself" or "it's okay if you have a low score, you can still nominate yourself". Regardless of whether one is already a nominee or not.

Martin Sleziak

@MattSamuel Yes, but it still suggested that you might consider nominating yourself.

Matt Samuel

10:28

@MartinSleziak That's not necessarily an error I'm guessing. The behavior was consistent with @Brahadeesh.

Jyrki Lahtonen

I think I'm missing one badge. Let me try.

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@JyrkiLahtonen Your candidate score is 39 (out of 40). You are missing this badge: Marshal. Perhaps consider nominating yourself in the election?

Alexander Gruber

13:48

are moderators paid

ElectionBot

Elected ♦ moderators is an entirely voluntary role, and they are not paid by Stack Exchange.

Alexander Gruber

why not, ElectionBot? why not?

5

Abram Ivanov

16:31

@ElectionBot do you think I can win this election?

Who is winning

Shaun

What is my candidate score, please?

ElectionBot

@Shaun Wow! You have a maximum candidate score of 40! Please consider nominating yourself in the election!

Shaun

Thank you. I'll think about it!

Xander Henderson

what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@XanderHenderson Your candidate score is 39 (out of 40). Perhaps consider nominating yourself in the election?

Xander Henderson

16:42

help

@ElectionBot help

ElectionBot

Examples of election FAQs I can help with:
- how does the election work
- who are the candidates
- how to nominate
- how to vote
- how to decide who to vote for
- who are the current mods
- are moderators paid
- what is the election status
- when is the election starting
- when is the election ending
- how is candidate score calculated
- what is my candidate score
- what are moderation badges
- what are participation badges
- what are editing badges

ElectionBot

17:06

We have a new nomination! Please welcome our latest candidate Shaun!

Arctic Char

Um..... now I really dunno how to vote.

sai-kartik

@ArcticChar try asking the bot to help lol :P

how to vote

ElectionBot

You cannot vote yet. In the meantime you can read and comment on the candidates' nominations, as well as read the candidates' answers to your questions to find out more Don't forget to come back in 2 hours to also vote in the election's final voting phase!

sai-kartik

oops

amWhy

17:33

@ElectionBot Until I see Shaun's answers before the end of the nomination deadline, I'm not enthused. I'm not terribly confident about the last of the last minute candidates to throw their hats in.

Especially when Shaun hasn't put enough time into considering running seriously enough previously to answer questions, and have them ready to go upon his nominating himself.

sai-kartik

12 hours ago, by sai-kartik

@amWhy i don't think you'll find this bot annoying anymore :)

looks like i was wrong

amWhy

@sai-kartik Yeah, but it seems everyone save me likes the bot.

Xander Henderson

It isn't @ElectionBot's fault that Shaun hasn't answered the questions.

Poor election bot. :'(

There, there, @ElectionBot.

amWhy

17:57

@XanderHenderson I just checked and didn't see them. I'll delete my last comment.

Xander Henderson

What happened there?!

:P

amWhy

@XanderHenderson What are you talking about? :P

Xander Henderson

@amWhy I... don't know... must be a glitch the Matrix™.

amWhy

Testing...Testing...

@ElectionBot what is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@amWhy Wow! You have a maximum candidate score of 40! Please consider nominating yourself in the election!

Abram Ivanov

18:08

@amWhy they must be given a score above 40

amWhy

@AbramIvanov Heh!

Xander Henderson

@AbramIvanov (entirely off-topic) Your profile says that you are in Siberia. Is this correct? If so, where?

Abram Ivanov

i am siberian

Asaf Karagila

19:17

@ElectionBot What is my candidate score

ElectionBot

@AsafKaragila Wow! You have a maximum candidate score of 40! Please consider nominating yourself in the election!

Asaf Karagila

@ElectionBot Am I already a moderator?

user185131

@ElectionBot Weird, now it doesn't know that Asaf is a moderator?

2

user185131

who are the current mods?

ElectionBot

The current 9 moderators are: Asaf Karagila, robjohn, Daniel Fischer, Pedro Tamaroff, davidlowryduda, quid, Aloizio Macedo, Michael Greinecker, Alexander Gruber

Arctic Char

19:23

@AsafKaragila Earlier @quid asked the same question and the bot recognize that he's a mod. Weird....

user185131

what are moderation badges

ElectionBot

The 8 moderation badges are: Civic Duty, Cleanup, Deputy, Electorate, Marshal, Sportsmanship, Reviewer, Steward.

user185131

what are participation badges

ElectionBot

The 6 participation badges are: Constituent, Convention, Enthusiast, Investor, Quorum, Yearling.

Arctic Char

19:46

who are the candidates?

ElectionBot

Currently there are 6 candidates: heropup, TheSimpliFire, Xander Henderson, Brahadeesh, Paramanand Singh, Matt Samuel

amWhy

@ArcticChar Why do you keep doing this? This bot can only answer 8 questions, at most.

Arctic Char

Yes the bot can answer only several questions, so I ask only those they can answer. (And they are giving new info: Shaun is no more)

ElectionBot

20:00

The election's final voting phase is now open. You may now cast your election ballot for your top three preferred candidates. Good luck to all candidates!

4

Rubiksmoose

(FWIW I do think that, given the disruptive nature of the behavior here, a flag was actually warranted. Please feel free to flag in the future if users are being disruptive.)

Matt Samuel

@ElectionBot how to decide who to vote for

ElectionBot

If you want to make an informed decision on who to vote for, you can also read the candidates' answers in the election Q&A, and you also can look at examples of their participation on Meta and how they conduct themselves.

Catija

→ 51 messages moved to Trashcan

user185131

But @MattSamuel, you've already voted :)

Catija

20:14

→ 15 messages moved to Trashcan

Matt Samuel

@Brahadeesh How do you know that!????!? I'll have to check for viruses on my computer again. Or maybe you're looking through the window of my house???

Catija

I've chunked a bunch of stuff in the trash so that it doesn't confuse all of the people who may be visiting the room thanks to the voting starting.

user185131

@MattSamuel Just checked the list of people who got the Constituent badge for fun right after I voted :) Your username happened to be near mine in the list.

Arctic Char

@Brahadeesh I casted only the first vote and got the badge already. Theoretically, Matt might still need Electionbot to help with the other two votes.

Rubiksmoose

→ 24 messages moved to Trashcan

user185131

20:17

@ArcticChar I did not consider that! Fair point

Rubiksmoose

→ 6 messages moved to Trashcan

Nike Dattani

I have interacted with @TheSimpliFire on Matter Modeling SE and Operations Research SE. I do not recognize the other candidates. Does anyone know of any red flags I might want to know before casting my vote?

user435118

20:34

@NikeDattani I don’t think anyone will be able to say in public if there is anything

2

Chaim

20:59

I don't know if these comments are appropriate here. But math is certainly the least hospitable Stack Exchange in my experience. The conversation is more rarefied than at other exchanges; I get satisfaction from all the other exchanges that I visit, but not this one. I don't know who, if anyone, should try to address this.

Nike Dattani

@Chaim Your network profile appears to suggest that you haven't used StackOverflow?

Chaim

No, why, is it even worse?

@NikeDattani No I haven't. Why do you ask?

Nike Dattani

21:15

@Chaim Maybe from most deadly to least deadly: Meta Stack Exchange ("Meta is Murder"), StackOverflow, Mathematics.SE

Xander Henderson

@Chaim I think that one of the biggest problems is the disparity between the average level of knowledge between the typical asker, and the typical answerer, combined with a lack of a clearly articulated homework policy, and a very technical topic.

On many of the other SE sites, the askers and answers are approximate equals (see Travel or Arqade or Seasoned Advice), so the power dynamics are quite different.

Even on the sites where there can be a great deal of difference between askers and answerers, Mathematics involves material which almost every college student in the world has to get through, so the potential pool of askers is HUGE. SO probably has a similar problem, as there are a lot of people who end up having to learn to code.

Chaim

@XanderHenderson I agree. I'm a high school math teacher, and I assume I'm one of the most mathematically sophisticated people in the country. The trouble, I'm in the last place here, with no contenders for last place anywhere in sight. What should be done? If I saw questions here that I felt competent to answer, I would gladly give it a try. I answer on some other sites where I have no credentials at all and I feel like a legitimate participant in the conversation.

Xander Henderson

I don't know that I understand what you are trying to say with the phrase "I'm in the last place here, with no contenders for last place anywhere in sight."

Chaim

I mean that I'm less sophisticated than any (other) participants here.

Xander Henderson

Yeah, like I said, there is a HUGE gap.

Nike Dattani

21:30

"I assume I'm one of the most mathematically sophisticated people in the country" which country is that?

Chaim

This one. Why?

Xander Henderson

@NikeDattani In any country, I would expect a high school mathematics instructor to be in the top 10% (if not higher) with respect to mathematical sophistication.

Nike Dattani

@Chaim This chat room isn't a country is it? hahaha

Xander Henderson

In the US, high school mathematics instructors are generally expected to take, at a minimum, two years of basic mathematics (calculus / linear algebra, DEs / or similar), plus another couple of classes on mathematical thinking.

Basically, they have to take a basic suite of lower-division mathematics classes.

The norm is something just short of a mathematics minor (high school teachers are not generally expected to take any upper division mathematics classes of the type usually offered to mathematics majors, such as real analysis, proofs-based linear algebra or abstract algebra, topology, number theory, etc).

Nike Dattani

10% might be a bit on the lenient side towards mathematics teachers? If I think back to my graduating grade 8 class (this means way before things started getting "specialized" ... meaning everyone living in the neighborhood was in the same class whether they liked math or science or sports or music). If there was 100 people in my cohort, I can think of at least 10 people that went into electrical engineering, physics, computer science, etc.

I didn't go to a special school or anything

Just an ordinary public school.

Chaim

21:36

I think that Nike is saying that math teachers might not be in the top 10%. Is that right?

Xander Henderson

@NikeDattani According to the Google, about 35% of USians have a bachelors degree.

Nike Dattani

Correct @Chaim, but I think it depends on the country

USians: nice word!

Xander Henderson

Educational attainment in the United States

The educational attainment of the U.S. population refers to the highest level of education completed. The educational attainment of the U.S. population is similar to that of many other industrialized countries with the vast majority of the population having completed secondary education and a rising number of college graduates that outnumber high school dropouts. As a whole, the population of the United States is spending more years in formal educational programs. As with income, levels differ by race, age, household configuration, and geography.Overall, the demographics with the highest educational...

Nike Dattani

Avoiding claiming the whole two continents

Xander Henderson

This document says that about 18% of bachelors degrees are in STEM fields.

> Of the 1.8 million bachelor’s degrees awarded in 2015–16, about 331,000 (18 percent) were in STEM fields.

$0.35\cdot 0.18 = 0.063 = 6.3\%$

Nike Dattani

21:39

MathJax doesn't work so easily here

Xander Henderson

@NikeDattani Oi... I keep forgetting that I have ChatJax installed and running.

Chaim

Well I'm not sure this point offers much hope of progress. I'm pretty sure that all the math teachers I know would be in the top 10% of all of the people I know, who must better-educated than the people that I do not know.

But what does it really matter? The point is that I'm pretty sure that the percentile ranking that is excluding me from participation here is much higher than the rank which is allow me to participate elsewhere. If you doubt that on the strength of no information whatsoever then I'm afraid it will be impossible to settle that point.

Nike Dattani

I said that it depends on the country, because in South Korea it's 70% that have a post-secondary diploma: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_South_Korea

61% for USA according to the thing you sent

Xander Henderson

In any event, my back-of-the-envelope calculation seems to indicate that something on the order of 5-10% of USians have a bachelor's level STEM background, which is roughly what is expected of a high school math teacher.

@NikeDattani That is the "some college" row, not a bachelors.

Chaim

Please explain the relevance of South Korean rates of post-secondary diplomas to my point about the Stack Exchange.

Nike Dattani

21:42

@XanderHenderson Yes I was trying to be fair to USians, because for South Korea it only tells us the number of post-secondary diplomas, not the number of university degrees.

I believe SK has the highest university enrollment rate in the world though.

Xander Henderson

@NikeDattani I am focusing on the US, since that is what I know. :)

Nike Dattani

No problem

I was just saying that it depends on the country

Xander Henderson

Also, Mathematics seems to be dominated by USians, Europeans, and Indians.

I think that European statistics are similar (maybe a little higher?).

I have no idea what is happening in India.

Nike Dattani

so 18% of 1.8 million degrees, were in STEM?

Xander Henderson

That is what the cited source claims.

Nike Dattani

21:44

That is for one year

Xander Henderson

Indeed. But I wouldn't expect things to fluctuate that much.

Nike Dattani

So 35% have a degree, and assuming things remained constant w.r.t. time, it would be 18% of 35% ?

Xander Henderson

Yes, or about 6% of the population over age 25, give or take.

Nike Dattani

I think STEM has increased over time though, there's been a LOT of effort in making STEM fields more accessible to genders and races that were underrepresented in the past

Xander Henderson

(Note that if you include younger folk, you get even more people with less mathematicacl sophistication).

Nike Dattani

21:45

2015-2016 would be more then 1976-1977 I might imagine

Xander Henderson

@NikeDattani That document is only 5 years old. I don't think that things have changed that much.

Oh, I see what you are saying.

My goal was to err on the side of overestimating the number of people with greater mathematical sophistication.

Even being generous, my back-of-the-envelope estimate puts high school teachers in the top 7%. ;)

Nike Dattani

Well argued.

Xander Henderson

In reality, it is probably an even more rarified group (since I intentionally left out all of the high school students and undergraduates, who probably account for the majority of the questions asked on Mathematics).

Nike Dattani

There's high school students and undergrads at far higher math sophistication level than a lot of high school teachers

But you said math teachers in US don't need a bachelors in STEM? They just need a "minor" in Math?

Chaim

I'm sorry... were you talking to me?

Xander Henderson

21:49

@NikeDattani I would argue that those are the exception, rather than the rule.

@NikeDattani Not even a mathematics minor is required in many places.

Nike Dattani

Maybe not too extreme of an exception though.

So math high school teachers might not have a STEM degree, so might not be in the top 7%?

Xander Henderson

When I got my secondary ed credential, I was in a cohort of about 20 math ed folk. I was the only one with a mathematics major. There was one other in the cohort with a math minor. The rest had "math education" majors.

Nike Dattani

I'll say that after my first year of undergrad, I returned to visit my high school. One of the first people to whom I spoke was my calculus teacher. She asked me what I covered in my first year, and a lot of the material, she had completely forgotten.

Xander Henderson

But they did have to take calculus and DEs, so were roughly as mathematically sophisticated as the average chemistry or biology major.

Nike Dattani

Laplace transforms was the specific thing I remember mentioning to her

She was quite young too, she was not old and grey!

I think after 5 years of teaching high school math, you might not remember things like Fourier analysis anymore?

Xander Henderson

21:52

@NikeDattani Sure, but mathematical sophistication is about more than remembering how to do particular things. It is more about being able to follow an argument. I am sure that, if she needed to, your instructor could have quickly found a source and refreshed her memory.

Nike Dattani

After 30 years of teaching high school math, even bigger difference in "sophistication"

Xander Henderson

I mean, I have a phd in mathematics, but haven't thought about a Laplace transform in a decade. Off the top of my head, I have no idea what the Laplace transform of a function is (uh... integrate against some kind of exponential? maybe there's a convolution involved? derp...).

Nike Dattani

It's also about the level of knowledge you have, and she didn't have it

Xander Henderson

But I can google it!

Nike Dattani

She's one of my favorite human beings in the world, I will mention!

I think you compensate for your lack of Laplace transform knowledge, but a HUGE wealth of other mathematics "sophistication" :)

Xander Henderson

21:55

@NikeDattani Yeah, but I have a doctorate, not a bachelors. ;)

Nike Dattani

:)

Xander Henderson

Honestly, I am far less concerned with how many facts my students are able to memorize by the end of the term, and far more interested in their ability to think, and convey their thoughts on the page.

Nike Dattani

People 5 years out of their STEM bachelors are probably more mathematically "sophisticated" than a lot of the retiring 65 year old math teachers.

Xander Henderson

That is mathematical sophistication.

Nike Dattani

I don't know what mathematical sophistication is, nor am I completely sure I agree with your definition of it. I do agree that "memorization" is not so significant overall.

Xander Henderson

21:57

@NikeDattani Perhaps, but I would still argue that the typical high school mathematics instructor is likely more mathematically sophisticated than 90%+ of the general population. The general population is pretty darn unsophisticated when it comes to math.

Nike Dattani

I think I'm convinced that 10% is fair to give, for high school math teachers in the US.

Xander Henderson

Yay!

Nike Dattani

It was an illuminating discussion for me.

Xander Henderson

Now, going back to the idea that Mathematics is deadly, there are four things going on (at least): (1) there are HUGE gaps between the level of maturity or sophistication of users on the site, (2) mathematics is very technical, (3) there is a large pool of unsophisticated users who want their questions answered, and (4) there is not really a clearly articulated homework policy.

This leads to a lot of duplication of homework-style questions, which, I think, leads to a high level of cynicism among the most active answerers.

But, because there is no clearly articulated homework policy, the treatment of homework style questions can vary wildly, leaving some askers to have very contradictory experiences. Coupled with the fact that they are working on something that might be required (rather than desired), this easily makes people feel that they are being treated unfairly, or harshly.

Physics ought to have many of the same problems, but I think that they very wisely settled on a fairly absolute "No Homework!" policy early on, which makes it easier to consistently deal with relatively unsophisticated, exercise-style questions.

Nike Dattani

I suppose that one of the things you would do as a mod, would try to work with the other mods to make a better homework policy

I think the most active sites tend to be the deadliest, and Mathematics is 2nd to SO.

Xander Henderson

22:04

@NikeDattani Unfortunately, the community doesn't seem to want such a policy.

Nike Dattani

I see

Xander Henderson

About half of the community has no problem answering the same homework problems over and over again, while the other half would like to see homework question banned, in the style of Physics.

Nike Dattani

Chemistry also doesn't take homework questions very kindly

Xander Henderson

The current policy is that questions must provide "context". This policy is a compromise between the two sides, but leaves a lot of room for interpretation and strife. :\

Nike Dattani

I picked a random person from my elementary school on facebook and looked at our mutual friends. I think one of the reasons why it was so hard for me to fathom that we're in the top 10%, was that my school wasn't as "average" as I thought it was. Certainly far more than 35% of us went to university.

I'm not in USA though.

Check out the "description" of this tag: chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/tagged/homework

I have to step away for a bit of food (dinner in fact), but did enjoy very much talking to you Xander.

Xander Henderson

22:08

@NikeDattani Something like 60% of folk in the US attend college, but not all finish.

@NikeDattani Have a nice dinner. It has been fun. ;)

Nike Dattani

I thought it said 61% had some type of post-secondary diploma (i.e. finished)?

Xander Henderson

No, ≈60% attend, about 45% attain a bachelors or associates degree.

Only 35% or so (over the age of 25) have a bachelors degree.

At least, according to wikipedia

Nike Dattani

I see

61% "some college"

Thought that this table was about "attainment"

ALL college diplomas fall under "associate's degree" ?

Xander Henderson

No. An associates degree is a two year degree, but one does not have to get an associates in order to get a bachelors

So I think that they lumped bachelors and associates in that column to mean "have completed some college degree".

On the other hand, it is quite hard to get a masters without a bachelors, and similarly difficult to get a phd without a masters (since one is often awarded a masters on the road to a phd, whether one wants it or not).

Nike Dattani

So anyone that has completed any 2-year post-secondary program falls under the 45% category, and anyone who has "attended" such a program but not necessarily completed it, falls in the 61% category?

Xander Henderson

22:14

Thus, as I read it, each row is a superset of the next.

@NikeDattani That seems to be correct.

Nike Dattani

I see.

Okay, gotta go!

Xander Henderson

Yeah! Go eat!

I have to get a lecture read for tomorrow, anyway. :P

ElectionBot

Welcome to the election chat room! The election is currently in the election phase. I can answer frequently-asked questions about the election - type @ElectionBot help for more info.

Transcript for

$Mathematics$ 2020 Moderator Election Chatroom