Vyxal

user

00:02

@lyxal parameters named * are problematic

Can we not have that feature

Pleeeeeeease?

It would take some cery complicated code to implement

Please

This is one of those things where you half lose your sanity implementing something and it’s a mess when you’re done and it keeps causing bugs and you beed therapy at the end of it

Please

I beg you

lyxal

What's making it so bad?

user

I will try to implement the debugger single handedly by Sunday if you want but not this

@lyxal peek

If you peek over and over again it’ll just repeat the same values

lyxal

Eh

That's a problem for the program writer

user

So your code works for pop + * but not peek

lyxal

If they somehow manage to make varargs happen when peek is enabled that's a them problem

user

00:09

And idk how to make it work for peek + *

lyxal

@user ye

@user don't

user

@lyxal well you just need to use one of the forkiied functions (like +) with vararg functions

lyxal

Peek + varargs doesn't make sense anyway

I had that in mind when implementing it last night

user

I guess we could just throw an error if someone does it

lyxal

@user varargs in a fork also doesn't make sense

user

00:10

Or ignore *

@lyxal true true

We need to have a way to log warnings

lyxal

Isn't there a log setting anyway

user

Since vyxal shouldn’t throw exceptions because it’s a golflang but it should ve easy to debug

@lyxal there is, we should start using it :p

Context might need a log method for ease of use

Forgot about that totally

I assume logs would be sent to stderr?

On the online interpreter we could do console.log maybe

@lyxal Do we really want fi rof and elihw

Even bash doesn’t use rof and elihw

I thought literate mode was supposed to be pretty :(

Oh is this for auto closing

That would make sense

lyxal

It's for structure closing yes

They're all aliases of } anyway lol

So you can use end-if or just end if you want

Hell, you can even do something like if-true code end-lambda

Not recommended, but you can if that's how you want to roll :p

lyxal

00:43

@user why isn't the PR rerolling the element docs and literate map?

Steffan

@emanresuA Monaco syntax highlighters are really nice (as are CM6's). They are based on tokens

microsoft.github.io/monaco-editor/monarch.html

lyxal

01:31

user

@lyxal Wait, if they all turn into the same thing, why have rof and elihw? fi I can understand because it's a thing in Bash, but I have never seen rof and elihw

lyxal

Try not to laugh in public like an idiot challenge (impossible)

user

@lyxal cookie

I am willing to die on this hill (rof and elihw)

Unrelated String

user

@lyxal I may or may not have added the source code to paths-ignore

Unrelated String

01:33

susway cookie

user

@UnrelatedString cookie

lol it does look half sunglasses

lyxal

@user it was mostly for symmetry. I don't really care if they go :p

user

\o/

Now to find some other hill to go die on

@user It was worse than that, there is no longer a workflow for generating element docs ._.

To make up for it, I will give you a Subway cookie

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event ae9d9a60-acd1-11ed-8103-9851a07d9f9a!

user

!!/die

Vyxal Bot

01:40

@user You do not have permission to run that command. If you think you should be able to, ping Ginger.

user

Fork you

Could you please just shut up every time someone commits

@Ginger If I kick the bot now, will it be able to re-enter?

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event 18aa5880-acd2-11ed-96fe-b54fb406b67c!

user

!!/status

Vyxal Bot

@user I am doing something you'll never be smart enough to comprehend

user

!!/status boring

Vyxal Bot

01:44

Bot status: Online
Uptime: 3:49:58.535830
Running since: 2023-02-14T21:54:21.765162
Errors since startup: 7

@Ginger An error occured while processing event a568c590-acd2-11ed-9b2e-e98a6eaec2b6!

@Ginger An error occured while processing event da2104a0-acd2-11ed-9c20-3550a2caddd1!

emanresu A

lol

hyper-neutrino

me when vyxal bot was kicked from vyxal and cannot return for 1 minute

user

I just need to make a commit right now

Wait nvm tests failed so I can't commit

Did not need to kick it lol

Vyxal Bot

02:01

@Ginger An error occured while processing event 9d297ee0-acd4-11ed-8f10-42635498c9bf!

lyxal

Gigner's gonna wanna fix this anyway

Because that's a lot of pings :p

user

lol yeah

Btw, I made it so it doesn't generate literate mode mappings and insted just makes them at runtime

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event cdd9f150-acd4-11ed-9ece-55b76cc4cc33!

user

Just in case the workflow stops working in some subtle way at some point and we don't notice

lyxal

Hopefully that doesn't add too much extra start up time to the interpreter

user

02:03

We could make it lazy

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event 1a706b20-acd5-11ed-9d97-2eaf87c0bab1!

user

We should really temporarily ban the bot or something so it stops bothering Ginger

lyxal

!!/die

Vyxal Bot

@lyxal You do not have permission to run that command. If you think you should be able to, ping Ginger.

user

oof

lyxal

02:05

Well

Apart from bringing 20 thousand mods to this room because of three chat kicks, I don't think we can do anything

user

We can ask hyper to kick the bot for longer

Or, even better, put the entire room in a time-out

emanresu A

Which we can talk through lol

I think?

This room was placed in timeout for 20 seconds; yes

lyxal

You'd have to un-RO the bit first lol

*bot

emanresu A

True lol

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event b9a105f0-acd6-11ed-87ba-aacbc286cd00!

user

02:16

Gah

Right after the timeout

lyxal

Also, a time out means that new people or non-ROs would be unable to talk though

user

Oh the bot is an RO

lyxal

@user bot is RO

Ninja'd

user

@lyxal Yeah, never mind that idea then

Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event f452cf80-acd6-11ed-9bb5-750931e11fcf!

lyxal

02:18

we'd need to figure out how to crash the bot

!!/help

!!/status

Vyxal Bot

I'm Vyxal Bot 2.0.0 made by Ginger and hyper-neutrino.
All of my commands start with !!/
If you want help for a specific command, do !!/help <command name>.
New to Vyxal? Try !!/info for more information.

Command list: amiadmin, coffee, die, help, info, maul, status

@lyxal I am doing a fire safety drill

user

!!/amiadmin

Vyxal Bot

@user You are not a bot admin.

lyxal

multiple requests at once doesn't work

!!/amiadmin

user

!!/maul yourself

Vyxal Bot

02:19

@lyxal You are a bot admin.

                                                               YOU CAN RUN, BUT YOU CAN'T HIDE, YOURSELF
                                                     ___._
                                                   .'  <0>'-.._
                                                  /  /.--.____")
                                                 |   \   __.-'~
                                                 |  :  -'/
                                                /:.  :.-'
__________                                     | : '. |

lyxal

@VyxalBot I'm sorry what

user

If he's an admin, why can't he do !!/die

Stupid bot

!!/coffee

Vyxal Bot

Sorry user, I'm afraid can't do that.

lyxal

!!/die

Vyxal Bot

@lyxal You do not have permission to run that command. If you think you should be able to, ping Ginger.

lyxal

02:20

> am admin

user

It seems the bot has broekn free of its shackles

lyxal

> can't !!/die

user

Ginger is not responding

I'm afraid the bot must have subdued them

We must take down VyxalBot2 before it destroys humanity

Who's with me?

lyxal

@hyper-neutrino any mod actions you can take?

user

I wonder if we can manually send messages to the bot's server pretending that we're the bot

Or something

Actually, no, Ginger's probably secured it against that sorot of thing

lyxal

02:25

Big brain idea that probably isn't possible: get a mod to change the email/password for the bot acount

user

Yeah let's not do that

lyxal

!!/status borin

Vyxal Bot

Sorry lyxal, I'm afraid can't do that.

lyxal

!!/status boring

Vyxal Bot

Bot status: Online
Uptime: 4:33:56.083763
Running since: 2023-02-14T21:54:21.765162
Errors since startup: 14

hyper-neutrino

02:28

@lyxal wait what do you need?

lyxal

the bot to not be in this room

user

The bot to be DEAD

lyxal

or to be able to not post things

11 mins ago, by Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event f452cf80-acd6-11ed-9bb5-750931e11fcf!

that's why

user

Wait hyper could temporarily change Ginger's name so that the bot can no longer ping them

Le Ginger

lyxal

it still posts messages on every commit though

user

02:29

I think this is a very good and ethical idea that

Steffan

...

lyxal

Is that Vue or the generated JS from scala?

Steffan

Vue

Monaco is apparently big

user

Can we make it opt-in or something?

Steffan

Surely monaco wouldn't make it that big though

That's literally two megabytes

Well apparently it is monaco

github.com/microsoft/monaco-editor/issues/2730

CM6 is starting to convince me :F

hyper-neutrino

02:32

alright I suspended the bot for 416 days

just ping me when y'all want it unsuspended :P

lyxal

you couldn't make it 420?

Steffan

Monaco is pushed to the repo, but I'm thinking we should switch to CM6 ...

This is just unacceptable

user

Isn't codemirror really hard to work with though?

lyxal

@Steffan I'll leave the editor choice up to you. I'm fine with either, so choose the one that works best for you

I sure do love closing all the tabs

good fun :p

@user so now that * doesn't have to play nice with peek mode, can the branch logic be simplified in executeFn?

because what's in the else branch works regardless of whether there's * or not

also, I just realised that having any amount of parameters isn't going to be good in peek mode

because something like lambda x, y, z -> ... end is just going to set $x, $y and $z to the same thing

and lambda 2, 3, 4 -> ... end is going to repeat things too

hey I just realised - if : was an alias for | in literate mode, you could have something like lambda n: n + 4 be a polyglot with python :p

Steffan

02:54

CM5 was hard to work with but CM6 is much better and realy nice. I'm going to switch

lyxal

in The Nineteenth Byte, 11 secs ago, by lyxal

Rate my lambda syntax: lambda n: n * 0

cheeky prank :p

Steffan

Now the bundle size is only 530 kB

The theme rn is One Dark, idk what else y'all want npmjs.com/search?q=codemirror%20theme

lyxal

very cheeky prank

Making the : an alias of | is one of my best ideas yet :p

(this is actually a thing btw: it's on the lambda branch :p)

Unrelated String

03:16

nice

lyxal

extremely cheeky prank

user

@lyxal It doesn't work if popArgs is false, actually

@lyxal Which is why I made the other branch above the else one

lyxal

Oh

user

@Steffan idk about everyone else but I really like One Dark personally

Can I get an f in the chat for Atom

@lyxal Holy heck we can actually do lambda n: n as an identity function now

This is genius

@Steffan Maybe Dracula?

lyxal

@user very cheeky prank

You can troll all your friends now :p

"hey look at this python ha just kidding it's vyxal 3 literate mode"

user

03:27

@lyxal Done.

I trolled them all and when I revealed to them it was actually Vyxal and showed them literate mode they decided to join Vyxal

Oh no, they found Jelly, turned into unicorns, and exploded

lyxal

@user You're a bit of a prankster I see :p

user

Anyway, my Pomodoro timer is done, o/

lyxal

o/

Steffan

@user yeah it really nice

lyxal

Ah the website looks a bit narrow on mobile

Steffan

03:42

I haven't worked on it for mobile yet

The sidebar will be at the top as well

LOL WHY IS THE RUN BUTTON GRAY

it's supposed to be white lol

lyxal

@Steffan dark mode extension

Steffan

Lol it ruins it

Maybe i need !important lol

But shouldn't the dark mode extension know not to mess with it since it's color-scheme: dark?

lyxal

/shrug

This is dark reader for Firefox btw

That's without the extension

Steffan

Nice buttons that don't do anything (yet)

lyxal

Fancy

It's already looking nicer than anything I could have come up with

It'll be even better once it's done :p

hyper-neutrino

03:54

is it just me or are those buttons slightly too far left

Steffan

The screenshot is just off

It's correct in the actual thing

I'm terrible at taking screenshots lol

hyper-neutrino

no I mean I am looking based on the lighter grey track

or did you cut off part of the left

Steffan

I cut off part of the left lol

I can't select

hyper-neutrino

oh okay lmao

Steffan

04:19

The buttons are working (and live)!

The links themselves don't work yet tho

user

05:00

Could you add some padding below the flags?

user

05:15

Oh wait, Monaco doesn't support mobile? We should definitely use CM6 then

Why were we even considering Monaco if it didn't support mobile?

lyxal

Where'd you read that?

user

05:45

github.com/microsoft/monaco-editor/issues/246 and microsoft.github.io/monaco-editor

> The Monaco editor is not supported in mobile browsers or mobile web frameworks

lyxal

Interesting

Their playground seems to work on mobile (albeit with lag)

blog.replit.com/codemirror

Some interesting points on why they use CM6 over Monaco

mathcat

06:01

How big is CM6?

lyxal

3811kb

So ~3.9mb

For reference, Monaco is 69mb

That's uncompressed raw github repo size

user

06:27

@lyxal Never mind, we definitely need to use Monaco then

lyxal

06:55

Okay so I've been doing some thinking, and I think the current if statement should actually be called a ternary statement

And it's literate mode syntax should be ? code : code end

Or whatever branch alias you want to use

user

👍

lyxal

That's because while I was doing my cheeky pranks, I realised that the if keyword doesn't really flow like a normal if statement

And extending the ternary statement to be if elif else with multiple branches doesn't feel consistent

Hence, [...|...} is ternary and #:{...|...} is an if statement

(#:{ is subject to change, but it can't be #:[ because that's variable unpacking)

(and it can't be #[ either because that's lists)

An odd number of branches in the new if statement represents cond1, body1, cond2, body2... elseBody

An even number of branches in the new if statement represents cond1, body1, cond2, body2... condN, bodyN

I'll handle implementing this because I've also been doing some thinking about that (something like a while loop will be used to iterate over branches, stopping on first truthy condition or end of branches)

But I would like some feedback on whether the rename should also apply to v2 or whether that just gets left as-is

And of course, syntax feedback is good too

Also, I figured out why the bot is suspended for 416 days (which seems arbitrary at first) - that's 9999 hours, the longest suspension period available (I think)

source

mathcat

07:51

@lyxal pip does something like that too :p

lyxal

08:04

I've been doing a bit more thinking about other things and I think there should be a VNil type

This nil type has the special property that it can never be pushed to the stack

If you try to ctx.push a VNil, it just silently ignores it

"What's the use of that" I hear you ask

Well it could make lambdas that operate on the stack work a little nicer for everything without having to special case such lambdas

So if you try to map a stack function over a list, it just returns whatever is on the top of the stack under where the Nil would be

It doesn't have to be accounted for in types, and only the push method of Context would ever need to know about the type explicitly

Although saying that, things returning VNil would need to know about it

Meaning it probably would have to be placed under VAny

Which leads to a whole bunch of yucky "uh this match statement isn't exhaustive 🤓" warnings

Still, it's a more elegant solution than special casing stack lambdas everywhere

@user during thinking about a new type, I also thought about how you suggested removing the VAtom and VVal types and I think keeping the VAtom type is a good idea

Because it's nice to have a type for "scalar" values

(I know functions aren't exactly "scalar", but they aren't lists, which is where checks for scalar would be used)

Maybe it could be renamed to VScalar?

(for reference, v2 has a "scalar" type that's used for checks where a list and a non-list are needed)

What do y'all think about that bout of thinking?

Oh yeah, also while I was thinking about the VNil, I was thinking that implementing peek parameters for lambdas is just popping all relevant arguments and then pushing them back to the stack

That should be equivalent in theory

tl;dr: Ternary and if statements as different things, Stack lambdas should return something that gets immediately popped, VAtom should be kept and peek is just pop but push everything popped when done

Ginger

11:59

!!/status boring

and it crashed

cool

lyxal

well duh

of course it crashed

@Ginger do you know why it crashed?

Ginger

I'm working on it

lyxal

12:15

I don't think any amount of work will fix it

Ginger

I'm sorry what

lyxal

Did you not read the transcript? :p

Ginger

what is going on here

explain yourself

lyxal

the bot pinged you every time we made a commit

and we couldn't turn it off

so we had hyper suspend the bot

Ginger

well, that feels like overkill

lyxal

12:16

10 hours ago, by Vyxal Bot

@Ginger An error occured while processing event f452cf80-acd6-11ed-9bb5-750931e11fcf!

you would have had 17 messages in your inbox

Ginger

that was intentional lol

lyxal

and !!/die wasn't working

Ginger

those messages are so I can review my logs and figure out what went wrong

lyxal

10 hours ago, by user

We should really temporarily ban the bot or something so it stops bothering Ginger

Ginger

I can just mark all as read :p

it wasn't bothering me

lyxal

12:18

11 hours ago, by user

Could you please just shut up every time someone commits

Ginger

right, I'll fix this in a little while

lyxal

it was bothering us :p

Ginger

sorry!

lyxal

ping hyper to unsuspend the bot when you're ready

Ginger

> Errors since startup: 26

:/

lyxal

12:18

10 hours ago, by Vyxal Bot

Bot status: Online
Uptime: 4:33:56.083763
Running since: 2023-02-14T21:54:21.765162
Errors since startup: 14

that was the last full status check it got

oh hey maybe caird can help out

mathcat

13:02

@lyxal wait why do we need an if-statement now?

lyxal

because you can extend it to elif

mathcat

And the ternary statement just has two branches?

lyxal

correct

it's like expr ? true : false in JS

mathcat

nvm that's pretty dumb lol

lyxal

you mean expr ? true without a false?

mathcat

13:05

yeah

lyxal

[...}

no branches

that's like default behaviour lol :p

if an else-branch isn't provided, it's assumed to be empty

well not assume, is

mathcat

@lyxal ik, just realised :face-palm:

lyxal

This'll be in a different branch to the lambdas btw

because I have a few other non-lambda structures I'd like to implement along side a new if-statement

Feb 20, 2022 at 7:13, by lyxal

Ṣ<relation>|<initial terms>;

Feb 20, 2022 at 7:15, by lyxal

it would be a structure type instead of a lambda because n and m would refer to the last term and second last term respectively

Feb 20, 2022 at 7:19, by lyxal

Ḍ<predicate>|<container>;

Feb 20, 2022 at 7:19, by lyxal

Which is, does there exist an item in container such that predicate returns true

Ginger

13:23

alright, let's see here

@lyxal do you have an email address? I've got an idea for keeping this from happening again

mathcat

@lyxal interesting

Ginger

basically, you can make a request to a specific URL on Vyxal Bot's server, which tells a monitoring process to forcibly restart the bot

lyxal

Ginger

but to make sure it's actually you I'm going to send you a key

cool, one second...

@lyxal actually, do you have a public key I could use to encrypt this and send it over chat? I've got some doubts about this anonymous email sending service q:

lyxal

I do not

and it is way too late to be setting one up

Ginger

13:26

fricknuttery

@lyxal do you have access to a computer with openssl on it?

if so I can give you step-by-step instructions to do this

lyxal

4 mins ago, by lyxal

and it is way too late to be setting one up

Ginger

:|

ah well

lyxal

I'm going for the night now anyway

Ginger

we can do this later ig

o/

lyxal

o/

Ginger

13:32

:/

oooooh

I think I found the issue

Ginger

13:51

yeah I found it

mathcat

What was it?

Transcript for