The Reading Room

Hamlet

00:20

TBH: I don't see this as a particularly good topic challenge. I can think of many more interesting and more culturally relevant books that also discuss philosophy. And aside from the fact that we haven't had any questions about this particular book, this book is similar to a lot of other books on this site, and doesn't increase this site's diversity. — Hamlet ♦ 1 min ago

2

Hamlet

00:42

@BESW any interesting tweets/articles to post

(You're half the reason I check this chat room regularly).

Shokhet

01:18

@Hamlet Hot network question: literature.stackexchange.com/q/3087

Hamlet

01:29

@Shokhet no idea why that, of all the questions I've asked, would be a hot network question

scansion is pretty obscure.

Shokhet

@Hamlet HNQ doesn't work based on interest. "Hotness" is calculated based on number of views, answers, and votes divided by time. A self-answer is an instant one, and it garnered enough upvotes to meet the "hotness" threshold. Not more complicated than that.

Shokhet

01:44

@Hamlet It might be too late to complain; the month hasn't started yet, but the book was announced. I wouldn't mind Persepolis as a challenge, actually; I borrowed it from the library because the challenge suggestion made it sound really interesting. I'm in the middle of it already :)

Hamlet

02:04

@Shokhet I could see myself reading that or Grain of Wheat. Don't really see myself reading Sophie's World tbh.

Their Eyes Were Watching God is another suggestion that's worth considering.

Shokhet

@Hamlet Someone must have up/down voted something on the challenge suggestions. Grain of Wheat is now the top answer (by one net vote)

Hamlet

02:22

BTW if anyone wants to learn more about scansion, the website for better for verse is the best way to do this.

I've learned so much about poetry through that website.

BESW

04:57

@Hamlet Some disdain for Ready Player One, a truckload of comic-history listicles riding on recent film announcements, a lot of back-and-forth pieces on representation in media sparked by Doctor Who which might be tangentially relephant but I'm disinclined to share here for the same reason I rarely share Minorities in Publishing interviews here, a defense of ludonarrative dissonance that's only distantly related to literature as this site understands it... I guess this might count?

A new audio series will focus on Doctor Who's daughter: http://on.io9.com/RSVBIwL https://t.co/wNM654Nc95

Tweeted by io9 on July 20, 2017 at 10:52 PM

Hamlet

@BESW any chance you can send me a copy of the ludonarrative dissonance article? sounds interesting.

BESW

Ummm. The Raven and the Reindeer has a physical print edition now, and Richard Roberts did another Ursula Vernon folktale thing on Twitter.

The Nashville Public Library loans seeds.

The Nashville Public Library loans seeds! https://library.nashville.org/event/seed-exchange You have to have a library card, but how cool!

Tweeted by ULTRAGOTHA on July 23, 2017 at 6:13 PM

in RPG General Chat, Jul 20 at 2:12, by BESW

A defense of ludonarrative dissonance. It's about video games, because that's where the term originates, but I think it's a useful analytical tool for discussing how and why TTRPGs succeed or fail as well.

Hamlet

@BESW the claim that video games are off-topic on a site about literature is almost as annoying as the claim that you can only talk about the lyrics of songs.

I don't usually watch videos, but I'll make an exception for that one.

BESW

Mmm. To be fair, ludonarrative dissonance is not an analytical tool which bends itself easily toward textual studies--some of the principles are useful, but it'd have to be re-worked from the ground up as a tookit.

Hamlet

While you were gone, I asked and answered some scansion questions

BESW

05:08

If I can ever get my hands on a system that runs Shadow of the Colossus, I may write a monograph comparing the ludonarrative in Bioshock and SotC.

Hamlet

@BESW three minutes in and I've realized that I've been missing this term for about two years now.

BESW

In that video Folding Ideas also touches on problems with review culture that stretch across pretty much all mediums that get reviewed.

Hamlet

Unmanned is a great example of a game where there isn't ludonarrative dissonance.

unmanned.molleindustria.org

BESW

For examples of this kind of style/content dissonance in literature, I'd point at Twilight describing horrific events with romantic framing styles; Harry Potter being rife with inconsistencies yet presenting as a carefully laid out mystery to be solved; and for more harmonious examples perhaps House of Leaves and Ancillary Justice.

War and Peace is arguably famous largely because its style/content harmony works on a deep thematic level, in which the philosophies underlying its stories were reinforced by the serialized nature of its original publication.

Oh, the novels of The Expanse have a subtle but pervasive dissonance between the supposed attitudes of their first-person narrators and the kinds of descriptions the authors feel are necessary to give their IRL audience. It results in characters focusing on elements of worldbuilding which they shouldn't be focused on by the logic of their own reality.

Kinda like writing a contemporary novel in which the POV character needs to mention the fabric of everyone's clothes, or the make of their car. We notice these things, but they aren't something we need to mention or imply about everyone we meet.

As for film, the Ang Lee Hulk is an easy target; it's filmed competently and edited competently, but the storytelling through acting, filming, etc, is naturalistic while the editing is comic-inspired.

@Hamlet This comment makes some interesting connections between writing for video games, writing for film, and writing for stage productions.

Hamlet

05:32

Here, let me post the video so it one-boxes:

Ludonarrative Dissonance

►

This is a really nice video; take a look everyone!

BESW

Folding Ideas is generally a good channel to keep an eye on. It's focused on film, mostly, but in a kind of liberal-arts way that pushes out into other mediums frequently and organically.

Hamlet

@BESW I really hate watching videos though, because I can read much faster than I can listen.

BESW

Mmm. I tend to keep that kind of thing on a side monitor while I'm working.

Or if I'm not feeling thinky, something like Primeval.

Occupies the hindbrain when I'm doing tedious document conversions.

On an average day I have a lot more opportunities for peripheral audio/visual inputs than for dedicated text inputs.

Hamlet

Speaking of jargon, I wrote a decent scansion answer. It's not bounty worthy, but it should be helpful to Googlers.

0

A: Catalectic trochaic tetrameter or acephaleous iambic tetrameter? Scanning "Kubla Khan"

In a case like this, it is partly a matter of personal preference, and partly a matter of determining the meter used by the rest of the poem. To quote from Turco's The Book of Forms: A Handbook of Poetics (pp. 41-42): Epiploce. This is a term used to describe a situation when, in scansion, a ...

And that's it for me tonight. Night @BESW

BESW

ttfn

Bookworm

09:54

0

Q: How did the cat become well known?

In the second chapter of I Am a Cat, we see this: SINCE New Year’s Day I have acquired a certain modest celebrity: so that, though only a cat, I am feeling quietly proud of myself. Which is not unpleasing. On the morning of New Year’s Day, my master received a picture-postcard... I Am a C...

Mithrandir

12:26

@Shokhet - the OP did specifically ask that in the body of the question...

Mithrandir

14:33

> “Most certainly I’ll beat him. It must be all his fault that Tortoiseshell’s so poorly. I’ll take it out on him, that I will.”

sigh

'so poorly'?

Shokhet

@Mithrandir That's true, but your edit to the title of the post now contradicts the body. The OP wrote:

> What additional insight might such re-translations offer?

...someone should probably leave a comment and ask him what it is that he wants to know.

Mithrandir

@Shokhet The way I see it, that's two related questions.

That can acceptably be put in the same question.

And only one fits in the title (I tried to put both, no room).

Shokhet

@Mithrandir Well, making one question longer doesn't make more room...

Mithrandir

feel free to edit

Shokhet

Done :)

Bookworm

15:58

0

Q: Do English language poems actually have feet?

The question Catalectic trochaic tetrameter or acephaleous iambic tetrameter? Scanning "Kubla Khan" describes an interesting case when the placement of feet has no effect on the pronunciation of a line of verse. In my mind, this raises a question: what are feet actually for? Do English language ...

scansion

1

Q: How does the justice system work in Harry Potter?

I find the justice system in Harry Potter very interesting. One one hand, it seems similar to the justice system in the real world: there are trials where the accused can call a witness. 'I may be wrong,' said Dumbledore pleasantly, 'but I am sure that under the Wizengamot Charter of Rights,...

j-k-rowling harry-potter

0

Q: What is the meaning of this line in Candida by Shaw?

In Candida by Shaw, there is this line by Morell at the beginning.( Fourth speech from the beginning) Morell. Just like Anarchists not to know that they can't have a parson on Sunday! Tell them to come to church if they want to hear me: it will do them good. Say I can only come on Mondays and ...

george-bernard-shaw

Hamlet

115

Q: Shutting down recurring community self-evaluations

We've been talking a lot about the efficacy of community self-evaluations lately, both internally on the Community Team and out in the open on meta. Lots of ideas were tossed around, but the underlying theme of these discussions has been that site self-evaluations are not useful in their current ...

discussion site-evaluation

Gallifreyan

@Bookworm Why not use poetry there, @Hamlet?

Hamlet

@Gallifreyan because it's not actually about poetry.

It's about scansion.

Gallifreyan

And scansion is not applied to poetry?

Hamlet

Which can apply to things that aren't poems.

So scansion is usually about poetry, but not always.

Gallifreyan

20:01

Very interesting query - site activity including answers, questions, and votes.

This one only has questions per day, but still useful somewhat.

BESW

A great example of how much color changes the composition of a page. https://twitter.com/CoolComicArt/status/888463053158621184

Tweeted by MrTylerCrook on July 24, 2017 at 7:30 PM

Gallifreyan

20:20

Colour also matters when an old comic gets re-coloured. Since older comics were made to be printed on pulp paper and using only 4 colours, when they get digitised and coloured from scratch, they sometimes look very weird (I've seen people complaining about The Sandman, for example).

I had also taken a look at old scanned pages of Lucifer and new digital versions, and there is indeed a difference.

Hellblazer looks particularly interesting.

Thank you, Scott McCloud, for making me aware of this.

NPR's #graphicnovel readers' poll: @squinkyelo @xaimeh @BetomessGilbert @scottmccloud @dirtbagg Otomo Ware etc... http://www.npr.org/2017/07/12/533862948/lets-get-graphic-100-favorite-comics-and-graphic-novels

Tweeted by MichaelAvolio on July 12, 2017 at 5:18 PM

Nimona has been on my list for some time now.

Rand al'Thor

20:52

Just dropping in very (very) briefly to note another way story-ID questions can be useful for the site: sometimes, after an ID question has been successfully answered, its OP will reread the story and come back to ask new questions about it! That second question would never have existed if the OP hadn't found the book by asking the ID question first.

cc @Hamlet ^

BESW

21:06

@Randal'Thor It's an unpopular opinion, but I feel that in sites like this one, and scifi.se, ID questions are among the only ones which easily and clearly fit the Stack formula for actionable solutions to problems.

Gallifreyan

21:44

Moebius https://t.co/ta4dNJlx7e

Tweeted by CoolComicArt on July 24, 2017 at 7:50 PM

DukeZhou

22:41

Regarding Absurdism, I think it's the Theater of the Absurd where it really crystallizes. (Waiting for Godot and Brecht in particular.)

Hamlet

22:58

Story id's have been rehashed so many times on this site. I've said everything I want to say on meta.

Gallifreyan

23:11

Want a sneak-peek at Artemis? Well, here you go! We've posted Chapter One online as a teaser: http://www.readitforward.com/longform/artemis/ Enjoy!

Tweeted by andyweirauthor on May 31, 2017 at 5:29 PM

Bookworm

23:56

0

Q: What is the connection between Jet and James?

Jet is Rachel's best friend, and her loyal ally in later issues. When Rachel whispers her old name to her, "Bryn Erin", but addresses not Jet but James. After that, James, Rachel's friend who apparently died in 17th century, "awakens" in Jet's body. James supposedly swallowed a part of the T...

comics rachel-rising terry-moore

Transcript for