Conversation started Feb 16, 2013 at 19:08.
Feb 16, 2013 19:08
Next topic? Copyright?
@MadaraUchiha yeah
@MadaraUchiha yes
Okay then, @Mysticial, begin
At one extreme, we can ban all mention of fan-subs. At the other extreme, we allow everything.
Obviously neither is gonna work too well.
Agreed.
Feb 16, 2013 19:10
Although I mentioned it before I restate my position here:
As long as a reference to a fansub group is posted with no intention to violate copyright, it should be allowed.
@Mysticial First describe the problem please, for those of us who aren't well versed :P
@MadaraUchiha Where's that example we had from before?
@Mysticial you meant without, right?
@JNat fixed
My position: Linking to (or embedding) fan subs or scanlations should not be allowed, but as you said, benign mention of them should be fine. "____ fansub said this, but ...?"
Feb 16, 2013 19:12
@Eric That was initially my position as well, but it also rules out references to fansub forums.
So mistake's made in the fansubs should be able to get questiond here ?
@Mysticial What would be the purpose of such a reference?
The law thinks differently though
@Dimitrimx Under my position, that would be allowed.
@Eric I agree with you
Feb 16, 2013 19:13
@MadaraUchiha Obviously whatever the law says, that overrules what we decide here.
The intention doesn't matter, it either violates copyright, or not.
@Mysticial But wouldnt a reffal link to the fansub be needed for full support of the issue then ?
So does it violate copyright to link to a site that does?
Google does it.
@Mysticial Here's an example where I linked to a post on animesuki (which is a very questionable site in terms of copyright), and the post is by a fansubber, but the post itself isn't violating anything:
@MadaraUchiha providing a link may violate, but refering the site I think not, right?
Feb 16, 2013 19:14
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A: What's written in Ayatsuji Tsukasa's notebook?

Logan MThere is no mention of the exact contents of the notebook in the original VN or the anime. There are a couple of short sequel games which I have not gone through, so in principle there could be some explanation there, but given how important this is I doubt they'd want to relegate it to a side-ga...

My position is this.
If it contributes to the question/answer in question, it's fine.
@MadaraUchiha Embedding a scanlation might contribute to the answer or question, but definitely should not be allowed.
@MadaraUchiha Unless of course the question is: "Where do I illegally download fansub Anime?"
That alone won't be enough. But otherwise, I'm with you.
@MadaraUchiha embedding too?
I think we need a more official opinion on this
Feb 16, 2013 19:15
Maybe refer to it whitout actually showing the source ?
@Dimitrimx with that I agree
Would make for questionable answers though.
Can we ping a community mod in here?
@Eric I think embedding a scanalation can qualify as fair use if we restrict appropriately.
@Mysticial I've invited one
Feb 16, 2013 19:16
@LoganM Only in the USA, though. Aren't we also bound by copyright law in the country of origin?
@Eric Obviously some countries are gonna be more dickish about copyright laws than even the US. So it's gonna hard to satisfy everybody.
@mysticial Easyer said its impossible.
@Eric I don't think so. AFAIK we need to follow US law, but other countries we don't need to worry about. Admittedly that's just from what I could glean off of Wikipedia's anime articles.
SE has DMCA safe harbor
@Eric here's the short for the DCMA: if you are a foreign copyright holder and think you might ever want to sue in the United States for infringement, you should register your works with the USCO and keep those registrations up to date
Feb 16, 2013 19:18
@Mysticial We don't need to satisfy everyone.
so, you can, but don't
We only need to satisfy the country which hosts the SE servers.
@Krazer So anything international but under the USCO can be considered under Fair Use? (If it would fall under there otherwise.)
Copyright stuff uploaded on SE only needs to be removed if they submit a DMCA takedown request
Hey @AnnaLear, thanks for your time
Feb 16, 2013 19:19
3
Q: Remove the " characters," "character-abilities," "variations," and "plot-explanation" tags

KrazerAs per discussion in chat, we feel that meta tags are affecting SEO traffic to the site. Our reasoning is that since SE automatically appends tags to the title, if none of the tags are already in the title, it will take the most popular tag and add it to the title. This is great if there's only...

1
Q: What is the status of meta tags?

MysticialAs part of the 4th chat discussion, we covered the status of meta tags. Examples of meta tags are: characters character-abilities variations plot-explanation The questions we discussed are: Do we need them? Do they contribute anything? If not, should we just eliminate them. (and blacklist ...

Buuut, again, better not to go there in the first place :)
@MadaraUchiha No problem. Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer and I don't even pretend to play one on TV.
I Think we should stick to allowing whitout refference
@AnnaLear Basically, we're talking about what is considered legal or illegal to have in questions/answers
Do we allow embedded scanlations? YouTube videos of episodes or parts of episodes?
How about we find out what the US Copyright Law allows for, from the SE team or mods for example?
Feb 16, 2013 19:20
@MadaraUchiha especially regarding linking to clearly violating sites
@AnnaLear So the question are we allowed to link to sites that violate copyright. For example, an answer references a fansub forum. But the fansub group facilitates illegal content distribution.
@Deidara-senpai SE team is here already. @AnnaLear is one :)
(Quick introduction for those who don't know me: I'm a community manager at Stack Exchange. Hi. :))
She's also a cat
@Manishearth Right, but they don't seem to know the Law too well.
Feb 16, 2013 19:22
@AnnaLear Hello :) pleased to meet you!
or so they claimed.
@AnnaLear Nice to meet you :D
Let's keep chit-chat to a minimum please. Remember this conversation is bookmarked.
FWIW here's an example where I included scanalations in my post. IMO it helped, but the amount might be excessive.
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A: What's the significance of Kanon becoming "invisible"?

Logan Mlooper's answer is correct but not quite complete. This answer will be based on the manga, mostly because I don't immediately have access to the anime, but also because I'm not sure how much of this is explained in the anime. Kanon's arc is flags (aka chapters) 7-10 in the manga. As the other an...

Our usual policy is that moderators are not lawyers and are not responsible for enforcing any laws. This includes copyright.
8
Feb 16, 2013 19:22
I personally think it's fine as long as the fansub/scanlation isn't the subject of the question or answer, if ppl do cite them as sources they should be tertiary at best
What happens if the scanlations are hosted in some other country where it does not violate any copyright?
@AnnaLear So basically... We don't care until a threatening email arrives at community@se?
We provide instructions for reporting copyright violations directly to us at the end of the Terms of Service. This allows the copyright holder to reach us if they want to dispute anything.
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@AnnaLear so this discussion is moot?
@Deidara-senpai They can't do a thing. The worst case is that they block anime.SE Then it boils down to risk evaluation. Allow content and risk loss of ad revenue from getting blocked?
Feb 16, 2013 19:24
@JNat More or less.
@AnnaLear I think that answers it pretty much completely. We should allow these things as long as it's relevant. If it's irrelevant we shouldn't allow it anyway.
3
such a easy answer.
So far as your site policy goes, you should decide what you all are comfortable with. Some sites, for example, explicitly disallow questions about hacks or pirated software.
If there is a problem with some type of content that is regularly posted here, we'll come talk to you about it and adjust the site's policy at that point.
@AnnaLear Likewise, we already have a defacto policy of disallowing questions about where to illegally obtain copyrighted Anime.
We should do that as well. Question asking for "Where do I watch X online" or "Where do I read Y online" shouldn't be allowed.
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Feb 16, 2013 19:25
I think that's a good policy to have. Like Krazer said, as long as it's not the subject (like: "Where do I find scanlations of _____ manga?"), it should be permitted or at least considered.
Okay then, this settles it.
@MadaraUchiha Those kinda fail the "list question" rules as well.
We will allow embedding content in a post as long as it helps answering the question.
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... or asking the question for that matter.
A line will be added to the FAQ (in the "don't ask this" section) regarding questions asking for illegal material or where to find it.
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Feb 16, 2013 19:27
@MadaraUchiha sounds good
Far as embedding clips of Youtube videos goes... youtube will probably be way more on the ball than anyone else about shutting down anything that violates copyright. :) With that in mind, I suggest discouraging answers that are nothing but a Youtube link.
@AnnaLear Link only questions are discouraged anyway
@AnnaLear I agree on both points. They should definitely be a last resort as somewhat-copyright-issue-ish stuff is often removed. More content-based answers are always better.
@MadaraUchiha That they are. But when folks link to a video, they usually don't feel like summarizing it because it's all visual.
@AnnaLear Alright, noted.
I'd like to thank @AnnaLear for her time (she is, of course, welcome to stay), and for helping us resolve the issue.
 
Conversation ended Feb 16, 2013 at 19:28.