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03:00 - 17:0017:00 - 00:00

5:01 PM
@CountZero: I love your comment in Heiko's answer here: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/68571/latex-web-browser :)
 
@PauloCereda I'm frankly astonished that that comment garnered up-votes. It's basically asking for every copy of every package ever written because someone somewhere will have written a document using it. That's not just the 2Gb of TeXLive. That's the 2Gb of every TeXLive plus all the updates in between.
And for what?
 
@AndrewStacey I think @CountZero underestimates the issues here, quite apart form the problem that as you end up with something 'rigid' there is little gain over a PDF.
 
@JosephWright Exactly. I mean, I'm all for using LaTeX to author web documents, but the idea of being able to take any TeX document and plonk it on a website is ludicrous.
 
I was looking at Gonzalo Medina's solution (tex.stackexchange.com/a/33084/10898) and was making a little tweak to his initial environment like so:
\newenvironment{MyFrame}
{\par \llap{$\ulcorner$}\vskip-\baselineskip\hfill\rlap{$\urcorner$}%
\vskip-\baselineskip}
{\par\vskip-\baselineskip\llap{$\llcorner$}\vskip-\baselineskip\hfill\rlap{$\lrcorner$}\par}
But for some reason or the other it doesn't look quite right.
 
5:18 PM
@AndrewStacey Maybe the cloud is the culprit here. There is some fuzz in CS about the super awesome power of the cloud that magically invalidates every counterargument. It's like, "the cloud can 'cause it mixes with love and makes the world tastes good". :)
 
@PauloCereda The air suddenly smells of Gibson novels...
 
@StephanLehmke Oops! :)
 
Uh... There even is Count Zero in there :-) :-)
2
 
@PauloCereda I'm a big disbeliever in the cloud. For years, they've been selling me ever faster and faster computers and now they tell me to ignore all that and send everything into the cloud. Why? would I want to do that?
 
@AndrewStacey Ask Patrick :-)
 
5:22 PM
@AndrewStacey I share the same ideas. :) Besides, I'm not a fan of black boxes that work in a need-to-know-basis. :)
 
@AndrewStacey When people keep using TikZ for everything (including defining math operators), even the fastest single computer will be too slow to compile a simple document soon.
7
 
@StephanLehmke So I need to use distributed computing power to compile my TikZ documents? Okay, now I'm convinced. Move over SETI, here comes TikZI.
 
@StephanLehmke Why not initiate/propose the creation of such required fonts and there variations? I can't but i guess there are those who can do the fonts.
 
@AndrewStacey Similarly to RMI (Remote Method Invocation), we could come up with a RPI (Remote Package Inclusion), so the required package would come from somewhere in the network. :P
 
@azetina Now that you're saying it, maybe problems with TikZ-made symbols could indeed be solved by some sort of caching mechanism (store every generated symbol in a box and use that box instead of re-generating it), or by compiling a TikZ symbol "library" into a font...
 
5:30 PM
@StephanLehmke I agree
@StephanLehmke It can be a project TeX.SX can take and with all you guys around here supporting the community, I bet it can be done.
 
Cookie monster's father. <3
 
@azetina At least I see a real need for this kind of thing. Every question for some odd-shaped symbol tends to be answered with some TikZ code here on TeX.SE. If someone happens to use this symbol 20.000 times in a specialised document, that's a real performance problem.
 
hi there
@StephanLehmke good point ;)
 
@CountZero Hi. We were discussing the proposal to put TeX in the cloud. Your suggestion of every version of every package seems a little ... large.
 
5:47 PM
@AndrewStacey I guess it is... and I see you are skeptical the cloud could deliver
 
C is for cloud, as well as cookie: youtube.com/watch?v=EVg4mxMG_1Q
 
@AndrewStacey There is this story about Gibson that he never saw a real computer in action until he got an Apple II as a present when he started writing Mona Lisa Overdrive, and he was really appalled how such a thing worked in earnest. There is some sort of morale in there... ;-)
 
(Gibson stories go over my head - I think I've only read one)
@CountZero Yes, I'm skeptical as to whether or not it could. I'm sure it would be possible, but extremely difficult and bloated. And I'd really like to know why this would be desirable. I can't think of a single reason to farm off TeX complication to "the cloud" instead of on my local machine.
 
You can only imagine a cooler reality by ignoring the real one - but if it's cool enough people will make it the real one (or rather - the real one it ;-)
@AndrewStacey "TeX complication" - now was that a freudian or not?
3
 
@AndrewStacey for one thing I believe that users would never ever care again about maintenance (with all the blessings and curses that brings about)
no more package updates/installations for example
 
5:54 PM
@CountZero Every dark cloud has a silver lining. :)
 
@CountZero ... and this might retroactively disintegrate problems with diverging installations - voila, cooler reality.
 
@StephanLehmke :)
 
@StephanLehmke exactly my point! :)
 
I want my 3D glasses for typing TeX. :)
Sadly other problems like privacy might arise from that, but I won't be too pesky now. :)
 
@PauloCereda why not Johnny Mnemonic style glove-keyboard while we're at it?
 
5:56 PM
@CountZero ooh that's an even better idea! :D
 
@StephanLehmke Oh! :)
 
@PauloCereda Which is keeping whom from using Google Docs?
 
@StephanLehmke :)
 
6:24 PM
@CountZero Except that as TeX development is community driven, there will never be a set that is satisfactory to all. So I'll want bleeding edge PGF, but others will prefer stability and want the official release. Ergo, need all versions of all packages and possible for users to pick and choose. Very, very complicated to maintain.
 
@AndrewStacey I'm aware of that - hence my comment that it might be nigh impossible... in practice
As we all know, in theory there is no difference between practice and theory, but in practice there is ;)
 
6:38 PM
@PauloCereda Hi there! After our scripting experiences on Saturday (remember the replacing newcommands?) I've been working on a script that 'tidies up' the indentation on chapter files
 
@cmhughes ooh it sounds great! :) Any planned release? :)
 
@PauloCereda well, it has lots of limitations :) would you like to try it? It works well for chapter files: it indents environments (which you can tweak), and it also aligns environments that have tab delimiters (e.g tabular, align, etc) I'd love to release it once the kinks have been worked out though :)
 
@cmhughes Yes, please! :)
 
@PauloCereda ok, cool :) should I just post it here in chat, or would I get flamed for taking up a lot of space?
 
@cmhughes I think you can post here. :)
 
6:42 PM
@PauloCereda ok, here goes!
#!/usr/bin/perl

use strict;
use warnings;

# scalar variables
my $defaultindent="\t";
my $line='';
my $delimeters=0;

# array variables
my @indent=();
my @lines=();
my @block=();

# hash lookup variables
#
# if you don't want to indent an environment
# put it in this hash table
my %noindent=("pccexample"=>1,
"pccdefinition"=>1,
"problem"=>1,
"exercises"=>1,
"pccsolution"=>1,
"widepage"=>1,
"document"=>1,
);

# if we have rules for particular environments
my %indentrules=("axis"=>" ");

# environments that have tab delimeters
2
if you save it as indent.plx then you can use it as indent.plx myfile.tex>output.tex
 
@cmhughes: Fantastic!!!!!!! :D
It works like a charm!
 
@PauloCereda phew, glad it worked! :) It has lots of limitations, but it does work in quite a few cases
 
I bow before your awesome Perl skills @cmhughes! :D
@cmhughes: can I ask you a favour? :)
 
@PauloCereda you're too kind :) I'm sure a perl guru could write my code in about 5 lines :)
@PauloCereda of course! :)
 
@cmhughes Would you like to write a blog post about it? I think it's a very impressive code that might benefit several TeX users. :)
 
6:50 PM
@PauloCereda @cmhughes What do you think about providing a question/answer at the main site? I think this small script is really useful.
 
@PauloCereda wow! I'd be honoured!
@MarcoDaniel cool, thanks a lot! :)
@PauloCereda @MarcoDaniel I'm just a little worried about its limitations :)
 
@cmhughes: first step: tex.blogoverflow.com/wp-admin :)
Then leave the rest to us. :)
 
@PauloCereda I clicked on approve- is there anything else? Have I just signed my bank details across to you?
:)
 
@cmhughes Now just sit and relax while I kindly bug @JosephWright to add you as a blog author/editor. :)
 
@PauloCereda sweet, thanks a lot! I'm excited :)
 
6:54 PM
@PauloCereda Can't see it
 
@MarcoDaniel Instead of a Q/A, @PauloCereda suggested a blog post- what do you think?
 
@MarcoDaniel Hm?
@cmhughes: do you have a GitHub account? (or other source code provider?)
 
@PauloCereda Not presently. I have pastebin and a sourceforge account
 
@cmhughes Ah I see. :)
 
@PauloCereda what would I need the GitHub account for? :)
 
6:57 PM
I'll try to generate a batteries-included .exe file from your Perl script for Windows users. :)
 
@PauloCereda oh, cool idea! :)
 
@cmhughes Nothing. :) You could create a repository to hold your script. :)
 
@PauloCereda oh, ok :)
 
If you have a github account I will follow ;-)
 
Stalker. :P
 
6:59 PM
@MarcoDaniel ok, I'll look into it :)
 
@PauloCereda Our new club name ;-)
 
@MarcoDaniel LOL
 
@PauloCereda how will I know about the blog post- should I just keep checking in? :)
 
@cmhughes I'll ping you, don't worry. :)
 
@PauloCereda sweet, thanks a lot! if it turns out to be useful then we could see if we could release it with texlive
 
7:22 PM
This one can be closed as too localized: tex.stackexchange.com/q/68641/3954 ? I don't know because in standard classes there's no need to process twice to get footnotes but in revtex4 processing twice is needed to resolve footnotes!
 
7:43 PM
Dear friends, how do I make my AMS subsection numbers come with \S# instead of #?
 
7:55 PM
Stealth is on TV tonight. Now, is it worth it?
 
@GonzaloMedina I'd say it can be answered, it is not too local in time nor in matter :)
I mean, it can happen more people
 
\renewcommand*{\thesubsection}{\textsection~\section.\subsection}
works well.
 
@KannappanSampath Yes, generally modifying a macro \the... is the right way
 
True, I agree.
 
If you wanted the change only in section title, but not in \refs, then it can be done, too
@EVERYBODY Tell me, it is really impossible to do anything un-expandable inside tabularx?
 
8:18 PM
@tohecz I see. atm, I have no issues like that. And, I'm typing someting up for tomorrow's talk, (lazy, :() I'll get back to this later.
But, thank you for telling me.
 
@PauloCereda Done
 
@AndrewStacey No, it's not.
 
@JosephWright There is an unusual amount of spam. Shall one kill the messages?
 
@KannappanSampath Huh?
 
@JosephWright 22 spam comments, I was talking about that.
 
8:25 PM
@KannappanSampath Oh, I never worry about that
 
Oh, OK.
I was thinking of clearing them, but, yeah....
 
9:20 PM
@GonzaloMedina Saved me from a fate worse than ... AI
 
I was just about to flag this one for "change to comment", and then I realized it probably answers the question :)
0
A: How does LaTeX find package files?

YinI met the same problem. But I occasionally found it in my case that I have to change the file permissions for .sty files. This could be the answer.

Btw, the three users active there have the same avatar colour :)
 
 
2 hours later…
user19161
11:03 PM
@tohecz I really dislike my default purple one.
 
11:41 PM
@JosephWright Thanks. :)
@cmhughes: welcome to the blog club. :)
 
@PauloCereda: Need a help!
 
@HarishKumar Sure! :)
 
Gave a hand to @cmgughes code in windows. Grand failure. I don't know how to run it? Have any exe with batteries ready. If so pl. mail it. or pl. educate me how to run a perl code from windows. This is my first kiss with perl.
@PauloCereda: :)
 
@HarishKumar Oh I tried to generate an .exe wrapper, but I failed. :) Do you have a Perl interpreter in your machine?
 
@PauloCereda: I just installed strawberry-perl-5.16.1.1-32bit in my PC. But even perl -v isn't working. disgusting :(
 
11:49 PM
@HarishKumar Hm did you include the Perl path to your path? :)
 
I think so. Lemme check. Gimme a sec.
@PauloCereda Err. No. The installer asked and I said yes. But it didn't. By the way, what is the default directory where perl things get installed?
 
@HarishKumar Oops I don't remember. :) I customise everything. :)
Try C:\strawberry\perl\bin\perl.exe
 
@PauloCereda: Giving the next try Will be back in a minute.
 
@HarishKumar :)
 
@PauloCereda: Which is better? active state or strawberry pearl/
 
11:57 PM
@HarishKumar I dunno. :) I chose Strawberry because I read good things about it, but my Perl books are yet to arrive. :)
 
@PauloCereda: :). I follow you.
 
@HarishKumar /me blushes
 
03:00 - 17:0017:00 - 00:00

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