2T back in 9 hours? that would be a good deal if it makes it.

@UTF-8 not that i am aware of

@Burgi thx (you'd be aware of it, if you were him)

but i might be known in lima-city as @Burgi

aahhh

:D

do you remember nikic? he's a developer of PHP, now

people.php.net/nikic

> About me: Do not bring me on the palm. With me is not good cherry eating!

translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=https://…

you're still active? i was last active like 5 years ago

that guy is not me

he is an imposter

he has that user name for way longer, though

"More than 1 day" => "Haha you're fscked now"

you're the imposter!

@JourneymanGeek ^

@Bob ._.

@UTF-8 i was using burgi in 1998

@JourneymanGeek This is really weird. wtf kind of failure mode is this?!

The slowness?

Might be bad sectores

which is exactly where unstoppable copier shines ._.

@Bob eh, gsmartctrl... ;p

If it dosen't see it, nothing will

@Burgi hmm, k. he'll forever be my burgi, though

then you have been using an inferior, counterfeit product

@JourneymanGeek eh. 64k reallocated sectors isn't that bad, is it? :P

I'm still wondering why CDI suddenly can't read attribs

i know the P word is banned but has trump actually done anything since becoming emperor?

Lots of things.

Now, if you're asking anything good, that's pretty subjective :P

@Burgi He's talked a lot and signed lots of pieces of paper - so the autograph hunters will be pleased :)

well trump is probably keeping the lawmakers (congress) busy, so if they dont accomplish anything , because they are to busy blocking him and worrying about him, they wont be able to pass more (stupid ) laws/legislations

has he done any actual presidenting?

it is a win-win :-)

@Burgi define "presidenting"

waving, talking a lot, making real laws, improving the lives of citizens...

shrug

as far as i can tell he has announced a load of "laws" that everyone has gone "actually you don't have the authority to do that" to

he is all about sucess, given that he can wave and talk a lot, we could let him run for queen of england next :-)

I already said he's been talking a lot.

why would "making real laws" be the job of the president?

the president is part of the executive, not the legislative

i'm a bit vague on how it all works

and he was quite fast in making his promise to hinder immigration as it previously worked come true

so are we (a bit vague on how it all works), when people attribute everything done in an administration (wrong or right) to one man who doesnt have the power to do that.

which was immediately rejected

that was pretty real

it was only preliminary (limited to 90 days) and they're working on a fully-fledged policy

An executive order is a law.

> Executive Orders do not require Congressional approval to take effect but they have the same legal weight as laws passed by Congress. The President's source of authority to issue Executive Orders can be found in the Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution which grants to the President the "executive Power."

they're binding but aren't laws

see, "same legal weight as laws". not actual laws

@UTF-8 Spot the difference

well, an executive order is way less permanent

anyway i just wondered

afternoon

@UTF-8 They are permanent until they expire (in some cases) or are overturned.

> Congress must pass a bill canceling or changing the order in a manner they see fit. The president will typically veto that bill, and then Congress can try to override the veto of that second bill. The Supreme Court can also declare an executive order to be unconstitutional.

way more interesting, though: has he insulted the leaders of any country, yet?

@UTF-8 Australia's prime

nice

Mexico's head of state

in @Burgi's presidency it would be illegal to hold football matches on days i want to drive anywhere

"At one point, Trump informed Turnbull that he had spoken with four other world leaders that day — including Russian President Vladi­mir Putin — and that “this was the worst call by far.”"

haha

washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/…

Interview Questions for QA Tester

Europe as well. Pence was almost panhandling Europe after Drumpf wanted to install pro-anti-Europe ambassador

I'd also build a wall across scotland and get the italians to pay for it.... oh wait....

is that wall called the Hadrian wall...? #roftl

:)

@Burgi wouldn't it be much smarter to make them start right before you have to drive? the streets would be empty

aaand my internet connection is down, again (writing this via my phone's mobile internet)

bye

@UTF-8 no because they shut the roads to move 10,000 fans around

@burgi is taking over the star wall as well in his bid for president :)

ah, yeah, actually have seen that, too

I'll make Root Access great again!

think it will be just a bit tough to have turmp be foriegn ambassador after his term is over :-)

i'm used to mostly empty streets around the time soccer matches are held where i live, though

we cannot afford to be so politically correct! i'll turn sudo insults on by default in every distro of this great community!

@DavidPostill I'll build a wall across the stars and get the aliens to pay for it!

@JourneymanGeek Hm. What's the advantage of unstoppable copier over ddrescue?

Its file level and we can do it in windows

arstechnica.co.uk/tech-policy/2017/01/…

@JourneymanGeek Ah. Might as well give it a shot. If it at least lists the damaged files I can hopefully pull the rest from backup.

and that ;p

@JourneymanGeek In fact. All I really need is a file-level diff :P

(not data, just files)

meh

@JourneymanGeek It turns out some 50+ GB of it is ... just another copy of my music lib -_-

lol

ohh. Object of desire amazon.com/dp/B00S3G12E6/ref=psdc_160354011_t1_B00TDJ4BJU

@JourneymanGeek ?

Oh. Pretends to be an ODD?

and VHD boots without the hardware needing to know

@JourneymanGeek I wonder about doing something like that with a RPi in gadget mode :P

i still don't get why people think hardware encryption is a good idea

but then, again, there are people who use bitlocker, so ...

@UTF-8 Why isn't it a good idea?

@UTF-8 ... what?

@DavidPostill because the user doesn't know what's going on in the encryption hardware. it could drop keys onto the disks, use only a million different keys in all instances, etc.

plus, if the hardware manufacturer goes bankrupt and your device dies, you got a slight problem on your hands

Does the average user know what's going on in software encryption?

You could lose your keys...

@UTF-8 that part's where the backups come in

and your backups aren't encrypted?

but the user can find out what's going on

@UTF-8 backups are usually independently encrypted, and generally stored separately so if your device dies you don't lose the backups too

i don't care about people who aren't capable of keeping their keys available

You're assuming the user is an idiot

(and of course that includes backing up the keys)

@UTF-8 Wait until you lose your house or cars keys :)

wait, you're assuming the user's an idiot who'll lose their keys and can't learn anything from the source code of software encryption

Then you will start caring (about yourself) ...

@UTF-8 also in some cases, encryption is helpful in odd ways.

@UTF-8 I can't read source code ;p

In the case of this enclosure though, that's not the headline feature ;p

@UTF-8 What source code?

i'm totally not against encryption, i think that software encryption is vastly superior to hardware encryption and hardware encryption brings a lot of risks and very little guarantee that encryption is actually happening in an acceptable way with it

Just because the encryption is software doesn't mean you have access to the source code.

i won't use encryption to which i don't have the source code

that's part of the reason i compared it to bitlocker ... and because MS literally sent the users' keys to their servers

lol

And even if you did have you personally checked it for bugs and vulnerabilities? If you haven't it's no different to relying on some bit of hardware.

yes, it is different. that'd be like saying it doesn't matter that you're not allowed to leave town for the next months if you didn't plan to do so anyways

@UTF-8 that makes no sense. Please try again in English this time.

BLAH BLHA BLAH!!!

@JourneymanGeek I guess I'll just leave this overnight :P

saying "it's not a bad thing that you can't check the source code if you wouldn't check the source code if you had access to it." uses the same logic as: "it's not a bad thing that there's a wall around the country you live in if you wouldn't leave the country if the wall didn't exist"

no big loss if it all dies anyway

long as the drive doesn't literally catch fire

You are claiming software encryption is better than hardware encryption because you have access to the source code. Until you prove that 1/ The code is bug free 2/ The code is not vulnerable to some zero day exploit 3/ You are capable of actually understanding the source code then you haven't convinced anybody you are right.

@DavidPostill there's actually a concern around malicious compilers

@UTF-8 That's not what I said and you know it. Please stop trolling.

even if literally no one except the original developers ever read any parts of the source code, i'd still trust a software with open source code more than one with closed source code

whether either software is bug-free doesn't matter in that regard. it only matters because accidents happen (bugs are unintended). maliciousness happens consciously and is planned

being malicious is a lot harder when you provide the source code

@Bob Well that's nothing new. The Ken Thompson Hack

@DavidPostill of course, I'm just adding that to your argument

(also, not all encryption is used for encryption...)

@UTF-8 What you overlook is that even if the software is open source, there's no guarantee that the official download of the software wasn't compiled with, well, modified or additional code.

@UTF-8 wait till you see the obfuscated c contest...

@UTF-8 So you have blind faith in open source software because it is open source but not blind faith in hardware?

@Psycogeek This one looks like Alain Delon...

@Rahul2001 i don't need proof that there are no back doors to say that it's less likely that they occur less frequently in open-source than in closed-source software. it'd be nice but it's not necessary. not only is it evident but there also is empirical evidence for it

@Bob i know the obfuscated C contests. i wouldn't embrace software written like that, of course

@DavidPostill btw, brilliant short story about it: teamten.com/lawrence/writings/coding-machines

@DavidPostill i don't have blind faith in either. i'm just saying that if someone shows me how it's implemented, i trust them more than someone who hides that from me

@UTF-8 Stuff like this is more likely to happen with open-source software: dailydot.com/debug/mac-bittorrent-client-transmission-malware

@UTF-8 whoops, I meant underhanded c contest

the one where the code looks totally innocuous

Keep in mind that I'm not at all against Open Source, I'm just trying to prove your arguments against hardware-based encryption wrong

@UTF-8 it goes both ways: more eyes on it, but also easier for a malicious third party to provide a patch

that patch needs to be accepted, though. people will look at the diffs

there was the old if ((uid = 0)) privilege escalation in Linux that lasted a while

with closed-source software, you don't even have diffs

it's just a new binary blob coming your way and you better install it because the entity having provided the initial big blob claims there are security holes in that first big blob and the new big blob fixes them

and of course the (accidental!) debian openssl bug, as simple as accidentally removing a line from a seed

i'm more scared of maliciousness than of bugs

@UTF-8 and bugs slip through. bugs that can be maliciously introduced.

i'm not claiming anything is perfect

@UTF-8 any bug in an external patch could have been intentional and malicious.

just that OSS (or preferably free software) is better

sure could

I like how Swype tries to autocorrect "malicious" into "MacOS"

haha

maliciousness → microsoft

@UTF-8 and I'm saying it goes both ways, not strictly better

exceptions exist, i see that

sigh. so you're one of those people

meh

oh how dare a company tries to charge money for software!

software should just appear out of thin air, of course

i'm not saying that. i'm saying that if given both options, i'll choose the one which is better for me, not the one which is better for some company

really, there's arguments for all sides, and until/unless we're in a post-scarcity utopia, neither is strictly better.

@UTF-8 and that's your choice, but then to turn around and bash the other side... goes further than simply choosing for yourself.

i'm merely pointing out the disadvantages. obviously making a software closed-source can be advantageous for the company developing the software. but for the user's, it certainly isn't

and for a company, it's better to produce encryption hardware than it is to not produce it. obviously. but buying that hardware isn't advantageous for the users (unless there is no software encryption available, of course)

hardware encryption is a lot faster

And faster 'cheaper' encryption means we can use better encryption with less of a performance hit

but then, again, you don't know whether it's actually useful encryption. or whether it encrypts at all. i've seen closed-source software "encryption" which didn't even encrypt, so i assume that there are hardware encryption devices which don't either, and i assume that the majority of them has intentional backdoors

@UTF-8 "I've seen"

citation needed

there's actual standards for hardware encryption, like OPAL

it was on a sandisk flash drive when i bought it, afaik. i don't think i still have the software but i'll look for an article

here it is: syss.de/fileadmin/dokumente/Publikationen/2009/…

the interesting part starts at the top of page 6

it seems to have actually been encrypted (not 100% sure whether it was the same software as the one which came with my thumb drive, though) but always with the same key

very, very useful

@JourneymanGeek forgot to mention you

@UTF-8 so, its one bad implimentation

I've given a counter example of a specific, standard one

and on page 9, they say they fixed it

@JourneymanGeek if a hardware encryption device does exactly the same thing, you can't find out

and then it wouldn't get fixed, of course

sure it could.

no one finds out about it -> everything's fine for the company

you could find out

it woyuldn't be especially hard either

after all

they found out...

nope, that was software encryption

there's a single *.exe file which does the encrpyiton and decryption

I need some help with my resume...

@UTF-8 ok well, you could still find out

@PaulVargas i don't know what to say to that

If I was working an IT Consulting Company, where can i put the customers company... I mean

there's services that can help you.

Sample:

erhm, not sure you normally do

mine different, though. it was sufficient to pause the execution of the encryption software, write 2 characters signaling that the passwort has been entered correctly into a file (was in "my files" or whatever it's called in English), and let it run, again. it then thought you entered the correct password and gave you access to your files

unless they've said you're allowed to.

only 2 charcters

which always were the same

no matter the password

Ahh!!!!!

I could add one line:

is SITI your company, or the client company?

but i needed a citation and that's from the same company and only slightly less bad, so i went for it and posted that link

- Working in several companies: CompA, CompB, CompC

@JourneymanGeek ow. this could easily take a whole month to copy

@djsmiley2k My employer...

I wonder how long it'd take the drive to die :P

Paul, then I'd ask your employer for permission, carefully

'are we allowed to publically disclose our clients?' or something

Obviously not 'Hey I'm leaving, can I put our clients on my CV?'

the workplace might be a good place to ask though

@djsmiley2k Oh, good suggestion!

@PaulVargas otherwise discribe the companies as you would if you were recruiting for them

'Fast moving large online merchant'

:D

@djsmiley2k banks, goverment, etc.

large clients wi+t

woooo! i get the flat keys WC 6th March!

@djsmiley2k Thanks!

large clients within the finical sector

spelt right ofc

More Ryzen information to come by March 2.

Shor's bones, 52% IPC increase!

@bwDraco youtube.com/watch?v=hNF4OyoxwlE

fracking minion...

@Burgi He still not finished that landing page? :)

just

Also, tomshardware.com/news/amd-ryzen-7-1700-1700x-1800x,33702.html

> We’ll tell you what our benchmarks say, with official retail processors. But you will have to wait until March 2nd. Sorry.

^ Ian Cutress, AnandTech.

see that always worries me

why not let the reviews ouit early if they confirm the press fgures

@bwDraco ...that's more a statement of just how poor previous AMD arch was, tbh.

grrrr!!!!!!

The real comparison is with current consumer best (Intel). Which is looking decent, but throwing out "52%" is meaningless there.

sup @Burgi ?

we have tickets coming out of every orifice and he is youtubing!

is he on lunch?

@Bob Yeah, but that's looking at the glass half-empty.

@djsmiley2k no

then its slapping time

90-105% the performance of Intel at 50% of the price? That's probably worth making headlines over.

im presuming the youtube isnt relevent too

@bwDraco Ya, would be interesting to see how market inertia plays out there. Though I'd also want to see how the 4C parts compare - IMO, they're far more relevant to consumers.

Typical consumer use already won't really notice much difference going from 2C to 4C, let alone to 8C.

Good for enthusiast use though. Incl. business.

Would make a nice build box, probably.

@djsmiley2k idk

*shrug* still, all marketing teasers right now. Wait a week or two, then start comparing real data.

Hopefully it's not far off the marketing.

what if it is 50% better than the marketing? ;)

@Bob Why are you always so pessimistic about this?

@Burgi Then that's good.

I guess I still need to be more skeptical.

@bwDraco Because I've been hearing the same claims repeated, reposted, for half a year straight.

They could very well be real ... but at this point I don't really care until there's concrete, actionable, information.

Is my lack of skepticism a problem? Any advice for life?

Would my current behavior potentially hurt me in the real world? Is there any advice you can provide?

I mean, it all boils down to "(Ry)Zen is good! We beat Intel! Buy it!" in various flavours. Which would be good ... if it were actually purchasable at some point.

Anyway. CPUs aside, I'm far more interested in sorting out this HDD (DOID?)...

For me, the big question is precisely how well does it perform? I really need to see it go through a more thorough suite of benchmarks.

@bwDraco the only solution is the hard slog of being disappointed many, many times ;)

@allquixotic hi!

@allquixotic are your 8TB drives noisy?

@bwDraco Bulldoser was hyped to be game changing

@djsmiley2k Oh yea. That one too. My clearest memory of it was when choosing between Sandy Bridge and Bulldozer back in 2011 just after Sandy and before Bulldozer release. Lots of people said don't go Sandy, Bulldozer will knock it out of the water (8 cores!!!).

I ended up on Sandy mostly cause I couldn't be bothered waiting. Half a year later... yea, it was the right choice.

*shrug* not saying it'll be the same this time around, but always look at thorough third-party benchmarks before choosing.

@Bob I've seen it so many times with so much tech

and other things, but tech seems to go further with the misinfomation

Only thing that I can think of going worse, is the Brexit arguments

"We'll have 400m/week to give to the NHS! It even says so on the side of this bus!"

@djsmiley2k Probably because tech changes so much, and tends to be specialised enough to make it easy to cherry-pick information for marketing.

one week later "We didn't say that!"

@Bob yah

and then the stupid embargos which just make me suspecious

why not let everyone review it prior to relase?

I can't see a downside if you've got the better product...

@djsmiley2k Maximum hype and release-date impact, presumably.

If it's so awesome, it'll just build more hype, right? It is awesome... right?

There's a good chance it's true this time, because anything otherwise would totally destroy AMD as a company.

K so whjy not let the reviews come out

get the highest number of preorders ever

break records

etc

@djsmiley2k Having preorders makes things worse...

@djsmiley2k The other side is we really want to see benchmarks of retail chips, not cherry-picked ones. See the typical part the consumer gets, not the top 0.1% that comes out of the factory.

And there's just no way to do that except wait for a real release.

Then there's cases like where Kingston pulled a bait-and-switch with a certain SSD model...

Like I said, we need to see more benchmarks.

Changed NAND mid-run with the same model number. Cheaper, slower, etc., but same RRP and good reviews for the previous good stuff.

I hate variable BOMs like this.

hmmm.... ok i'm an idiot

@Bob no noisier than any other typical 3.5" HDD, that I've found. But several things prevent me from noticing that they make any noise.

@allquixotic My externals are really noisy, but that might just be the table amplifying it...

Stuck some cloth under it and it's a bit better now but I bet it'll overheat :P

(also, I might rip one of them open... looks like i'll have a free internal bay soon!)

(1) My case sits on carpet, dramatically attenuating vibration noise; (2) The case is pretty good at attenuating nearly all noise emanating from inside the case, so the only noise you really hear is the GPU fan that spits out the back of the case; (3) It's under my desk and my head is usually at the edge of the desk or slightly hunched over it; (4) Great passive isolation and active noise cancelling from my BeoPlay H9s that I almost always have on; (5) The GPU fan is orders of magnitude louder

@Burgi he's not actually working today?

when playing a game, 99.9% of the noise I can actively discern coming from my computer is the GTX 1080 Founder Edition's impeller fan thing spitting air out the back of the case

Thanks to @JourneymanGeek :P

I can't hear my PC

I keep forgetting what a PC sounds like -_-

@allquixotic ...yea I'm kinda-sorta regretting going FE, but then I don't hear it so much with the headset on

@allquixotic Ha... unfortunately, HDDs account for most of the idle noise, especially if I do data transfers overnight.

@Bob it's loud enough that when I take my headphones off after finishing gaming and heading to bed, I'm like, "whoa, that GPU is super loud!" but if I leave my PC running, within 10 minutes it's cooled off until I can't hear it / it doesn't bother me

Turns out those giant (140mm) CPU and case fans are pretty quiet...

I can't remember when I get paid

but we might actually have not blown the budget so badly this month \o/

@allquixotic HDD noise is especially bad cause it's not consistent.

@Bob you have more HDDs than me, too, and externals are going to have less vibration attenuation and noise isolation than a well-designed case with internal disks

Thin it's the arms, but there's definitely heavier bursts of noise.

I have a total of two 3.5" HDDs in daily use, and zero 2.5" HDDs anywhere

the rest of my storage is NAND

The platters spinning are also pretty noisy idle, but active r/w is much worse.

@allquixotic I keep the externals powered down most of the time now. But need to do emergency recovery tonight so it's bad :P

But even the internals... I can switch off all fans, but the HDD noise is still there :(

Pretty quiet thankfully

The externals are definitely much worse.

Hm. I need some foam pads.

@JourneymanGeek I wonder if the ~2.3 MB/s on a good file is cause that program is slow, or the disk is slow...

Might've been worth ddrescuing it. Oh well.

@djsmiley2k i missed an arg in my array

Turns out my backup was 7zipped so I can't even do a dir diff :\

...yes, I have an O: drive

@allquixotic oh yea, I also went with the high airflow case instead of the quieter one

@Bob I need that; mine lets my raid card get hot

102 F peak at one point :S

@allquixotic that's... not much

@Bob :O

@Bob 102 C I mean

oh lol

cause 38 C? that's below room temp here!

lol

holy fuck how hot is your room

I should check mine

@allquixotic well... it's cooled down now but we had a few heatwaves a week or two ago

without aircon

my room is usually 24-26 C

~35-40

ow

actually it was like that 2-3 days a week for a month+

why no aircon?

it's a nice comfortable 26 now

@allquixotic old house. we're getting one installed later but not in a bedroom

doing one split system per bedroom is overkill-ish, and the building's too old to do ducted easily

not to mention the layout sucks :\

My SATA card (no RAID) is only ~40-45 right now. But I can't get a reading on the actual chip at this angle.

nytimes.com/2013/06/16/world/asia/…

@allquixotic That's gonna do wonders for the food supply...

China wouldn't let you have an old house

lol

@allquixotic Pretty sure this one dates back the better part of a century

fairly common around here

which, of course, means it's somewhat lacking in modern conveniences

(but rennovations help. and rewiring.)

ROFL! i made my minion nearly shit himself!

the inside's more or less new but the structure and layout are old

@Burgi the one working on the landing page?

he had his headphones on and i wheeled over to him and said something about the problem he was working on and he hadn't seen me

he leapt out of his chair by about a mile

@CaffeineAddiction yes

thats cheered me up

> Speed: 0 bytes/s

lol