Root Access

bwDraco

12:02 AM

HEDT has always been about pushing the limits of performance, at whatever cost.

Journeyman Geek

Hence me calling them a halo product

f1 cars are great advertising. Can't drive one to a grocery store ;)

Psycogeek

@ScumMaster Different sellers will offer different listings at amazon. ""Ordered item 3 times. Each time it was not new, nor factory sealed , nor in original packaging; differently and rather poorly packed each time. The disk and plugs showed signs of use. The 2nd time amazon assured me the next one would be new. No luck. I gave up after three tries. I don't see that it's up to me to test to see whether a returned item works as it should. For that I would look on ebay.""

So at least one person discovered that the seller might be dealing in "returns"

bwDraco

Meanwhile, an AMD Zen 8C/16T engineering sample runs at 3 GHz within a 95W envelope: eteknix.com/amd-zen-8core-engineering-sample-leaked

user187418

What about this one ? newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834321569

bwDraco

Though rumors, they seem to be matching Broadwell-E in performance per clock: techfrag.com/2016/04/02/first-amd-zen-benchmarks-leaked What I'm reading suggests Zen will be just short of Skylake IPC. If AMD gets this right, they could force Intel to drop the prices on their HEDT chips.

Intel has held a monopoly position at the far high end of the x86 spectrum and is free to charge as much as the market will bear, but AMD could change all that.

Only time will tell if Zen will actually deliver on its promises.

Michael Frank

12:13 AM

@ScumMaster images17.newegg.com/is/image/newegg/34-321-569-Z08

That box looks... unhealthy.

user187418

yeah ...

bwDraco

Workstation board in disguise

What's the point of a C236 board for consumers?

C236 is a server/workstation chipset.

Michael Frank

@bwDraco ~~disguise~~ camouflage.

bwDraco

Gigabyte's branding really risks confusing consumers.

Journeyman Geek

@bwDraco market segmentation I suppose

people were throwing low end xeons into Z boards

IIRC the z170s don't actually support xeon

and in some cases a e3/e5 is a pretty good choice

bwDraco

12:28 AM

It seems as if the motherboard manufacturers have been running contrary to Intel's strategy lately.

Journeyman Geek

Intel wants to segment out its chip market

motherboard makers want to differenciate themselves

bwDraco

Intel doesn't let Xeons run on consumer chipsets? Make consumer boards with workstation chipsets!

Intel doesn't allow non-K processors to be overclocked? Add a clock generator to bypass the processor/chipset restriction!

Michael Frank

Sounds like good business decisions.

MORE POWER!

Psycogeek

there are many flavors of xeons ? I run a xeon in one of the older Core2 quads, only because at the time it was the exact same price as a "consumer" quad of the same thing. Other than it supporting ECC (which the board itself did not) there was zero difference in speed or on-die cache quantity.

bwDraco

I'm getting the feeling that Intel and motherboard makers are at odds with each other for the Skylake generation. Intel is aggressively segmenting the market to try to maximize profits given that AMD has not been competitive, but the motherboard manufacturers aren't cooperating.

Perhaps Intel sees AMD as a growing threat and it wants as much money as possible now to try to stay ahead for the 10nm generation.

Psycogeek

12:33 AM

There was also zero difference in ability to overclock it the same.

bwDraco

It's now or never for Intel. Get as much cash as you can before AMD steals it away when Zen comes out.

Michael Frank

@bwDraco Just wait until Microsoft starts with the Win10+ only for Skylake chips.

bwDraco

I see a flurry of lawsuits coming from Intel against ASRock et al. for enabling overclocking on non-K processors.

Feb 17 at 16:15, by bwDraco

> You agree not to release any Firmware, Microcode, or other functionality which enables the operation of any non-Unlocked Intel Processor outside of its published specifications, including operation in excess of its specified clock frequency.

Feb 17 at 16:05, by bwDraco

"In addition, we may pursue legal action to recover damages due to your violation of the [Intel chipset/motherboard agreement]."

Journeyman Geek

meh

Intel will just release microcode modifications to block that

sueing a major motherboard maker is silly

especially when asrock is iirc owned by asus

Psycogeek

yaaawwwn, then AMD can start suing all the manufactures of "pre-Overclocked" GPUS too, just to add to the fun.

The suing starts after someone actually begins to lose big money, they dont start loosing big money until people who "can afford it" Prefer to buy the lesser and pump it up. Most times the people who "can afford it" buy the better stuff even knowing they could get within a few percentages with the cheaper stuff.

CMDEmu

12:47 AM

some websites wont load

eg, putlocker.com and dagobah.com

they timeout in the browser and when pinged

bwDraco

ASRock et al. keep finding ways to circumvent Intel's restrictions.

It's all fun and games until somebody gets sued for this.

ASRock was already coerced to remove SkyOC from its boards.

(and I'm not using the word "coerced" for no reason.)

I've lost faith in ASRock because they're not playing by the rules.

Mar 9 at 17:40, by bwDraco

I might just refuse to buy ASRock at this point. As noble a cause as you might consider it to be, I don't want to trust a motherboard manufacturer that seems to have an axe to grind with Intel.

It's not a matter of their removing SkyOC. It's their overt refusal to cooperate with Intel.

First it's SkyOC, now they're putting a dedicated clock gen to do BCLK overclocking on any chip.

Mar 9 at 17:45, by bwDraco

Sure, Intel may be imposing silly restrictions, but I'd rather get a motherboard from a brand I can reasonably expect to stand behind their products rather than one that might suddenly pull out of the market because Intel forced their hand.

Psycogeek

bclk overclocking started way way back, when it was called the FSB aka base clock, aka same freaking thing. As time has progressed intel detached various aspects of the cpu from this base clock, allowing the base to be varied without the rest (and the reverse). skylake just addded in one more detachment from the base.

Back in the previous one, it was the uncore aka the cache memory that intel allowed to be clocked seperate. Fact is many of the Wild hype overclocks you will see posted on the web are just the CPU. While some people say "cpu clocks are king" the cache clock is the queen, and the queen puts the king in check.

bwDraco

reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/49icpx/…

> ASRock is going to war with a company that has not been known to fuck around lightly.

Journeyman Geek

1:04 AM

@bwDraco Asrock is essentially Asus' going nuts on things

So, no, at most intel will disable things with microcode updates, and everyone will be passive agressive as usual

bwDraco

I've said this several times already. ASRock is on very shaky ground here and is at risk of getting sued.

Sure, ASRock is part of Pegatron, which in turn is part of Asus, but ASRock is autonomous for the most part.

Psycogeek

@JourneymanGeek right intel will releace a "Investors Appeasment" patch because the news (from 1999) got outside of the overclocking community :-)

Journeyman Geek

Nope. No Sueage

Michael Frank

raindropcake.com

bwDraco

ASRock going "f--- you Intel, we're putting a dedicated clock generator on the board to enable overclocking anyway" is not going to end well.

Journeyman Geek

1:07 AM

Yes, you have. I'm saying there's no real reason

Michael Frank

@bwDraco All Intel need to do is say something to the effect of "Use of our locked processor on these devices may void your warranty."

bwDraco

@MichaelFrank This has the real potential to eat into Intel's profits. Intel is not earning the premium it normally gets by only allowing K parts to be overclocked.

This is meritorious grounds for a lawsuit.

As greedy and evil as Intel may seem, this is not the right call for ASRock to make.

It's not merely a matter of whether Intel supports this under warranty. It's Intel's very bottom line that is impacted by this.

Psycogeek

@bwDraco what do you care? i thought you were going all ZEN now :-)

bwDraco

Because there is no real competition against Intel right now, they are not under pressure to enable overclocking on cheaper processors. Consumers can and will pay more for unlocked chips, assuming Intel enforces the restrictions on locked parts.

Sure, Zen could change all that, but this is the way things are right now.

Psycogeek

I think you should concentrate your efforts on whomever owns the patent on Icons, because there has been blatent misuses of them in many different OSes :-)

Michael Frank

1:14 AM

@Psycogeek !!wat

Ehh... what is it?

bwDraco

!!/tell Psycogeek wat

ChatBot John Cavil

@Psycogeek i.stack.imgur.com/FuoyW.jpg

!!tell 28757176 wat

whoops.

1:21 AM

then would you believe the "Slider patent" mspoweruser.com/44258-2 probably invented around 1983

lets not forget the "ribbon" which existed in very similar forms in many different programs, before the lawyers , or programmers arguing about it were even born :-)

Psycogeek

1:38 AM

imagine the number of computer "innovations" that possibly could have been patented and had costly (for the taxpayers) lawsuits inititated. That could have completely changed our present view of computers and software. From nickle and dime paying for the tons of things that were invented, or to visual and interactive changes avoiding and circumventing those.

bwDraco

I'm really not sure what to say at this point. I have work to do, see ya in a bit.

allquixotic

2:08 AM

unlimitedville.com/plans

O_________O and it doesn't even seem to be too good to be true

Journeyman Geek

2:21 AM

0_0

That went well

My mom has this old... erm... tone generator thing (electronic tambura?) Oldschool thing, wooden case, basic through hole electronics. Happened to have the part I needed to fix it

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