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12:00 AM
Maybe ask me again in quite a few years.
I get some of it, but not all.
 
:(
@HDE226868 Close enough! Hint: It ends in vector notation ;D
 
user54412
Does electromagnetism make a sound as it goes over your head?
 
@Danu I saw that when I first skimmed it.
 
@ChrisWhite Only if you're not bald ;)
 
user54412
$Z^0_{000000}$!??????
 
12:03 AM
@ChrisWhite Hey, I defined a new symbol as soon as I could!
In fact, I'll just get rid of those anyways.
They're unnecessary
Thanks for pointing it out ;D
 
user54412
I just wanted to see ACM's reaction to all those indices
 
@ChrisWhite Hush now :P
 
@ChrisWhite By the way, I've decided to stop putting it off and use orbital resonances as the base of an answer on Worldbuilding. I don't expect it to get much attention, but hopefully some folks will see it.
 
I hope the night brings some upvotes ;D
 
Regrettably, my best source is an obscure thesis from 1968, but still, that's better than the minimal amount of other stuff I've dug up.
@Danu Isn't it already (late-ish) night for you?
 
12:13 AM
in Mathematics, 2 mins ago, by Danu
It's 1 AM now and I've got a string theory lecture at 8 :(
 
Ouch.
 
@EmilioPisanty Id be interested in know what procedure led to the selection of the films to list as candidates for their "scientific content".
In addition to the one I have selected I liked several loathed at least one and haven't seen a couple, but about half of them would never have made my list of films whose "science content" was mattered or was at all interesting.
 
@dmckee "Science" in movies is a funky thing...
 
Indeed, I am having a very hard time choosing a favorite film based on "science content", and almost as much trouble choosing a favorite at all (it's easier with certain classes or genere's, but even then...).
 
Jeez, yeah this is hard!
 
12:19 AM
Even on plain favorite I am waffling between Leon: The Professional, Das Leben Der Anderen, Ghost Dog, and Secondhand Lions. Argh!
 
I've seen two of those
Leon was not that impressive to me.
What'd you think of There Will Be Blood?
I can't pick a favorite movie either overall or by scientific content (I cannot actually think of any movie that was good in this respect)
Calling @ACuriousMind (note the asker!)
1
Q: What, to a physicist, are instantons and the Donaldson invariants?

Mike MillerI study gauge theory from a mathematical perspective. To me, one of the most fundamental ideas is the notion of an instanton on a 4-manifold. To be precise, I have a Riemannian 4-manifold and a principal $G$-bundle $E$ over it (usually $G=SU(2)$, $U(2)$, or $SO(3)$). Given a connection on this ...

 
@Danu Haven't seen it. I don't actually get to the cinema much these days.
 
Do you know something about instantons? I don't know if you do @ACuriousMind
 
Any way, I've put Dr Strangelove down as my favorite on "Science content" even though it hasn't much because the question is making my feel crotchety and cranky.
@Danu I took a summer school at JLAB once, and one of the speaker defined a instanton as "a topological soliton", at which point I knew I wasn't going to get much out of that unit...
 
@dmckee hehehe :D
 
user54412
12:28 AM
@Danu someone you know?
 
@ChrisWhite No, just a guy who I admire :P
 
Can anyone tell me what Andrei Belitsky physics.asu.edu/people/faculty/andrei-belitsky at ASU really does ? What are the principal focuses of his research arxiv.org/find/all/1/all:+AND+Belitsky+AND+A+V/0/1/0/all/0/1 ?
His papers look hardcore
 
@kevinTahN. You don't find "phenomenological and formal aspects of gauge and string theories." enlightening?
 
user54412
better than hypothetical and casual aspects I suppose
 
@dmckee I always thought "formal" meant some type of super math abstractions
hehe
 
12:32 AM
@kevinTahN. I suspect it does mean something like that in this case.
 
Gotta go sleep now. Cya!
 
@Danu nigt night . . cya 2moro
@dmckee just open any of his papers lol, then let me know if you choose to revise that statement lol
 
And phenomenology means a certain amount of just trying out different schemes for binning or organizing facts things to see if you learn something from them.
 
@Danu Have fun with tomorrow's lecture!
 
yeah, I have always wondered what pheno people really do. On wikipedia it mentions something about bridging theory with experiments and computing things with certain corrections
 
12:51 AM
In one of the papers there are pictures of "Hexagon Wilson loop decomposition into pentagon transitions." wtf does this guy study lol
 
 
2 hours later…
3:09 AM
@Danu Right up my alley indeed - I will attempt an answer tomorrow
 
 
1 hour later…
4:29 AM
Question for the undergrads haunting this place. Actually a couple of them.
(A) How would you feel if the professor wanted to randomly assign you group work partners every week or so (this is for in-class peer-learning activities where you are graded on participation)?
(B) If he said "Wheel of group-work turn turn turn, tell us with whom we should learn" in a high and sing-song voice would you be familiar with the reference?
 
4:55 AM
@ACuriousMind: Thanks, I appreciate it! I should warn that I only had a vague sense of what your comment means (though I haven't read your link yet - will do so later) so the more insultingly low-level you could write it, the better.
 
5:43 AM
Looking for help from the peanut gallery.
I need a small collection of problems suitable for students who have finished the introductory sequence (in this case out of Halliday and Resnick), but they need to require a some decision making rather than being plug-n-chugs.
So far I have adapted
2
Q: Which formula is correct to find the terminal velocity of a sphere falling through a liquid?

Harish Chandra RajpootConsider a sphere of radius $R$ & density $\rho_s$, falling through a liquid having density $\rho_l$, attains a constant terminal velocity $V_t$ then in this case the net force acting on the sphere is zero. Neglecting effect of buoyancy (see in the picture below), $$F_{\text{net}}=F_{d}-F_{\text{...

to my needs. I used the data for a ping-pong ball falling in air to force them to try both ways.
I could use two more questions at a similar level of difficulty and decision making.
Any ideas?
 
Ahem
Please do not spoil Star Wars in this chat over the next couple weeks.
10
We all like to come here to talk physics etc. It would be nice to be able to continue doing that without fear of having the latest installment of such a beloved sci-fi spoiled.
@dmckee I'm not sure I understand.
You give them data for a ping pong ball with the idea that they plug into both formulae and see if the numbers match the data?
 
@DanielSank Yeah. They don't apriori know the Reynolds number, so they have to try both and see which one gives internally consistent results.
From a back-of-the-envelope calculation it seems that ping-pong balls reach terminal velocity of about 1.5 m/s at a Reynolds number a bit over 2000 (to one sigfig in each case).
By data I mean the density and viscosity of air and the mass and diameter of the ball.
 
6:38 AM
@dmckee Do they drop the balls themselves?
 
6:52 AM
ola
 
@DanielSank Not until after they've calculated. The point of the exercise isn't actually the problems, but one about communication in physics.
These students habitually turn in homework sets devoid of written reasoning, and asking them to work on problems of this order is planned to set them up for learning what a bad idea that is the hard way.
But that means that I need problems they can do after some thinking, but can't comprehend in one go.
 
No comments on my susskind quote about Feynman's scientific style? @dmckee :-)
 
@skillpatrol Not really. I'm a greasy handed kinda guy who's slightly stoned on solder fumes. What do I know of the machination of the big-brained blackboard boffins?
 
Nothing really.
Thanks for replying.
 
 
2 hours later…
9:40 AM
@DanielSank y
@dmckee lead based solder?
@dmckee Is that for Freshmen?
 
Huy
sup @0celo7
 
Just slept a LOT, had to overcome a 36 hour day
 
Huy
nice
 
@dmckee I would have known everything except for $F_d=6\pi \eta r V_t$.
 
10:34 AM
To flag as spam, or not to flag as spam: http://physics.stackexchange.com/a/128991/71860 ?

Terrible answer (posted 6 months after the other answers, providing nothing new, sloppy repetition of things already said) and a link to a commercial website.
 
@Huy gâteaux $\neq$ cake
 
@yuggib wrong
 
tarte = cake
 
what would a yugoslavian know about cake
 
@0celo7 that is not called gâteaux in french
 
10:45 AM
@yuggib since when do you speak French
 
@0celo7 since when I lived for two years there...
I have a modest level, but I can survive
and order cakes :-P
 
@yuggib why would you live there for 2 years
 
@0celo7 to work?
 
why
there are better places to work
such as places with running water and air conditioning...
this "natural operations" book seems pretty advanced...springer.com/gp/book/9783540562351
 
in Brittany you don't need air conditioning...
 
10:48 AM
diff geo with functors is interesting
 
@dmckee Could we speak in private?
 
@0celo7 probably...
but I would need another twenty years to have time for that (and have learned the prerequisites)
 
@yuggib so: I'll get the AMS book which does introductory stuff with cat theory
I'm also taking algebra and analysis next semester...
then I might be ready for the natural operations book
@yuggib I wonder how much category theory you actually need for this...or if they just call maps "functors" for the hell of it
 
I am downloading the book
I will take a quick look
@0celo7 It doesn't seem you would need much analysis for it
but definitely algebra
and I also don't think that they use functors just for the sake (hell) of it
however since you would like to do PDEs, and you have already a knowledge of diff geo and relativity, you should look at the people working at the intersection of the two:
imho it is far more interesting than categorical diff geo ;-P
 
11:16 AM
@Huy but it seems that in Switzerland gâteau is strictly a synoym of tarte, so you may also be right...
@Slereah Would you translate gâteau by cake? I would say more 'pastry'
 
12:11 PM
@ACuriousMind as usual... references?
Pliz not the usual answer!
 
@Danu Hello, could we speak in private?
 
@Danu hmm, @ACuriousMind, why the $\pi$ there?
@yuggib what makes you say that
@yuggib 403 error
 
@Danu Oops. Ignore my comment, i thought you are a mod on physics.
 
@0celo7 strange
Demetrios Christodoulou (Greek: Δημήτριος Χριστοδούλου; born October 19, 1951) is a Greek mathematician and physicist, who first became well known for his proof, together with Sergiu Klainerman, of the nonlinear stability of the Minkowski spacetime of special relativity in the framework of general relativity. Christodoulou was born in Athens and received his doctorate in physics from Princeton University in 1971 under the direction of John Archibald Wheeler. After temporary positions at Caltech, CERN, and the Max Planck Institute for Physics, he became Professor of Mathematics, first at Syracuse...
he has a wikipedia page anyways
 
@yuggib I'm on Czech internet...censored?
 
12:23 PM
@0celo7 I don't see why the ETH of Zurich should be censored
@0celo7 because surely in the context of Weil's and Grothendieck's work the categories are important; and it seems that they review Weil's theory of something
but I do not know much about that
 
@yuggib have you heard of amazon.com/… ? Straumann (GR book I really like) recommends it for an intro to the Cauchy problem in GR
@yuggib is that diff geo book no kidding PhD level
@yuggib i.e. AoC, ZFC level
 
I have heard about it...she is surely a very well-known mathematician
but I don't know the book
@0celo7 :-D
 
I can't rate the level of that book, for I am too far from the subject
well, that definition does not seem so incomprehensible
 
12:39 PM
@yuggib maybe for you!
You're a PhD
I'm a German middle schooler!
 
@0celo7 well, it's descriptive
(even if I have no idea what it describes)
 
@yuggib I'm in the same boat
now that is 400 pages in...
so I'm sure they explain some of the symbols
 
and my level on geometry/algebra is that of an undergrad :-D
 
why do you say I need a lot of algebra for this?
to appreciate the categorical framework?
 
yeah, I think so
I once started to read this book:
it seems pretty accessible even for someone who knows nothing of algebra like me ;-)
but I went no further than the middle of the third chapter
 
12:43 PM
there's a book "category theory for scientists"
it's for biologists working in DNA stuff
 
@_@
maybe there is something on categories for cellular automata
 
if a biologist can understand it
I certainly can...
 
probably not
 
:(
 
better said: I think that no biologist wants to understand it
 
I have some doubts of its real usefulness...
but maybe you will use categories in nuclear engineering
if will ever you do that, post the paper here :-D
 
will do
what if I'm working for a company and it falls under my NDA
I could not tell you that cat theory is actually useful :o
 
well...I seriously doubt that
but in case you could at least tell me that you know it can be used
 
@Fermiparadox in general it doesn't hurt to flag, if you're not sure. But we do want to be a little more careful with spam flags since they carry severe consequences if 6 people flag the same post as spam. I'd say go ahead and do it, but if you really aren't sure, you can use a custom flag for mod attention. (That's for spam flags. For other, more mundane flags, we'd really rather people use the standard flag, when there is one, instead of flagging with a custom reason.)
 
@DavidZ Could we speak in a private chat about this issue (and another related issue)?
 
12:53 PM
@yuggib Gateau is cake, yes
pastry is more "viennoiserie"
 
@Fermiparadox something that concerns another user?
 
@yuggib rekt by the frenchman
 
@DavidZ Yep
 
@0celo7 I asked him...
 
ok, just a moment
 
12:54 PM
Oh no
 
>video games
 
A bunch of nobles were working in my cistern and someone pulled the lever to fill it
Now they won't be able to complain and send my dwarves to prison
quite a tragedy
 
@yuggib is anyone looking at categorical PDE
 
@0celo7 Ahahah luckily no
 
@yuggib does algebraic geometry have any PDE applications
 
12:56 PM
there is not an easy way to categorize PDEs
even with the non-mathematical meaning of the word
@0celo7 I really doubt so
 
what is algebraic geometry good for?
ACM doesn't want to tell me
 
there are some "geometric" PDEs, but I doubt there they use results from algebraic geometry
 
32
Q: Which nonlinear PDEs are of interest to algebraic geometers and why?

mathphysicist Motivation I have recently started thinking about the interrelations among algebraic geometry and nonlinear PDEs. It is well known that the methods and ideas of algebraic geometry have lead to a number of important achievements in the study of PDEs, suffice it to mention the construction of...

 
my friend uses algebraic geometry to do number theory
 
your friend sounds like a nerd
 
12:59 PM
not really
@0celo7 that's the opposite direction
algebraic geometry applications of PDEs
 
@ACuriousMind Geometry book that talks about a dozen different bundles and functors and more bundles also uses indices.
 
Ok, I have analysed that book, I should start with this question before the group theory ones:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_conversion
 
@yuggib huh, that natural operators book was written by profs in the town I'm visiting
 
you could pay them a visit then
 
Relevant excerpt of the book
 
1:13 PM
@yuggib and do what
@yuggib that book is 1991, I can't even imagine what they've come up with in the last 24 years
 
that is up to you
this is just one of them
 
need a password
and username
 
damn
you have not enable the remote access
 
not a grad student
 
Q1. The author said the internal conversion (laballed IC in that energy level diagram) is isoenergetic, which means there is no energy change in that transition

a. If we use what we have discussed earlier (with Acuriousmind, 0celo7, Slereah) that a state can be changed by a measurement (i.e. a suitable operator acting on the state which changes it), and energy does not necessary change in the process

how does the molecule knows it has to transit to a lower electronic state (but vibrationally excited) as after the absorption of the photon, the molecule is not interacting with anything else
 
1:16 PM
I don't have my own account yet
 
you don't need the account
it is sufficient to be connected to you institution's network to enable it for 90 days
 
I do if I want to access stuff outside of civilization!
 
maybe with zbmath it's open:
 
@yuggib how do I do that
 
@0celo7 when you access the mathscinet webpage (or the page of a journal of the AMS) from your institution
there is a link to "remote access"
and there you can pair your device with the subscription for 90 days
also APS does that for physics journals
but you have only 14 days of remote access
then it has to be renewed
 
1:26 PM
Well I didn't do that...
 
@yuggib @0celo7 @ACuriousMind
Q2.

Is my understanding of the following about group theory correct?

1. Groups are sets with a binary operatation such that associativity, existence of inverse and identity and closure under the operation are obeyed

2. For a given group, the representation of the group means you express the group elements (e.g. a symmetry operation) under a basis (such as x,y,z) and find the corresponding object in that basis (e.g. matrix for x,y,z basis vectors) that does the same outcome on some elements spanned by that basis as the group element itself
 
1 is ok
2: a representation of the group $G$ is a couple $(X,\pi)$ where $X$ is some vector space (maybe with some additional structure), and $\pi: G\to L(X)$ (where $L(X)$ is the set of linear maps) is such that it preserves the law of the group, i.e. $\pi(g_1)\pi(g_2)=\pi(g_1\circ g_2)$
3+4: An irreducible representation is one that has no invariant subspaces that are not trivial (i.e. $\{0\}$ and $X$). An invariant subspace $Y\subset X$ is a space such that for any $g\in G$ and for any $y\in Y$, $\pi(g)y\in Y$.
5: A representation is a different object from a (infinitesimal) generator of a (Lie) group.
 
1:46 PM
Ah I see.
I particularly want to make sure I understood irreducible representations right, because they are the crucial component of a character table in point groups

which brought me to the next question:
 
To sum up, a representation of a group is an instantiation of the group (i.e. of the group law) by means of linear transformations on some vector space. For example the unitary evolution group of QM is a representation of the abelian group $(\mathbb{R},+)$ by means of unitary (linear) operators.
Irreducibility means that you cannot restrict to a subspace of your vector space and still have a representation of the group.
It is useful because non-degenerate representation can always be written as the direct sum of irreducible representations.
 
Q2a:

1. It was said that a reducible representation can always be uniquely decomposed into a linear combination of irreducible representations. (which is why a reducible representation of a point group can be expressed as direct sums of irreducible representations (thus why characters in a row of a character tale can add together and these will equal to the characters of the required reducible representation. In such a case, does the irreducible representation form a basis in the subset of reducible representations $A \subset L(X)$ (because $L(X)$ also form a vector space)?
 
2:02 PM
I am doing the science in cinema form thing
and then the question is
 
1: I am not sure I understand completely. In particular, you want to consider the set of all possible (non-degenerate) representations on $X$, as a subset of what? Each representation $\pi$ is, roughly speaking, a set $\pi(G)\subset L(X)$ and it is not so meaningful to consider the set $\{l\in L(X),\exists \pi, l\in\pi(G)\}$ because you are mixing up things
 
"Which of the following films appeals to you most in terms of scientific content?"
But all the choices are bad
 
2: I don't know the subject so I can't tell
 
The closest thing to a movie that is somewhat serious about science that I know of is the Andromeda Strain
 
well, is it not the day after tomorrow a perfectly accurate scientific representation of a (possible) reality? And very appealing on scientific grounds?
:-P
 
2:05 PM
Andromeda Strain isn't a particularly realistic movie (it's about some alien virus), but it spends like 30 minutes just preparing for lab work
 
@yuggib
1. Ok it's more like this. Because of how any reducible representation can always be uniquely decomposed into a direct sum of irreducible representations. Does the set $A$ of irreducible representations form a basis for the vector space $\pi(G)$, or is it not very useful to think of it this way?
 
0
Q: How do theoretical physicists work?

Dirk BruereHow do they spend their day? Looking out the window trying to think up something new? Learning new maths? Reading other people's papers? And how is their productivity measured beyond churning out papers?

 
@Slereah
Q1. The author said the internal conversion (laballed IC in that energy level diagram) is isoenergetic, which means there is no energy change in that transition

a. If we use what we have discussed earlier (with Acuriousmind, 0celo7, you) that a state can be changed by a measurement (i.e. a suitable operator acting on the state which changes it), and energy does not necessary change in the process

how does the molecule knows it has to transit to a lower electronic state (but vibrationally excited) as after the absorption of the photon, the molecule is not interacting with anything
 
Well...any reducible representation can be thought of as a direct sum of irrep, i.e. you can decompose the space in a direct sum of subspaces, and on each subspace you have an irrep. If I understand correctly what you are meaning, I suppose (not sure) that yes, you could see each reducible $\pi(g)$ as a direct sum of operators on each irreducible subspace: $\pi(g)=\bigoplus_{j\in J} \pi_j(g)$
where for any $j\in J$, $\pi_j$ is an irrep on the subspace $X_j$ such that $X=\bigoplus_{j\in J}X_j$
however bear in mind that if $X$ is infinite dimensional, then the index set $J$ can be infinite, or even continuously infinite (i.e. you have to take direct integrals)...but for finite dimensional representations everything should be quite clear
 
It looks similar to the equation for a vector space element expanded in a certain basis, but with $\oplus$ instead of +, which is why terminologywise, I am worried I might get it wrong that we don't call the above direct sum thingy (the $\pi_j$) as a basis, but I am not really sure, which is why the question
 
2:18 PM
Kinda.
 
I would say that for finite dimensional spaces you should have no problems, and indeed you can choose as a basis for $X$ the basis elements of each $X_j$
 
makes sense. I 'll keep in mind about the infinite part subtlety
 
probably it is true also for many infinite vector spaces, for example it is true for Hilbert spaces
with the basis in the Hilbert space sense (i.e. you can allow infinite combinations)
but I would not be confident to make it a general statement
 
I see
 
One reason I want to understand character tables well is because I noticed when deriving the symmetry of orbitals and normal vibration modes, there's a lot of parallels between that and the standard model stuff shown here (e.g. we also do direct product of irreducible representations when computing the selection rules)
thus I felt lik if I can fully understand the character table, it might help me to get a better grasp on stand model and othe particle physics maths (minus QFT integrals)
both involve a lot of group theory
 
 
2 hours later…
3:56 PM
@Fermiparadox Should I assume that your chat with David Z met your needs, or is your request for a private conference still live?
 
@dmckee I think we covered it. I'll ping you in.
oh wait I see you found it
 

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