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4:00 AM
I would love to learn Russian, and I started a little during July.
 
How can you ever be satisfied with broken English from non-native speakers?
Nabokov writes better English than . . . well, many.
I’ve bashed truckers enough tonight.
 
@tchrist Including the Facebook woman referenced above.
 
@tchrist He is a very well respected author. Not many people are.
 
I hope for a great deal. I expect a lot.
 
@tchrist Do you teach English?
 
4:01 AM
Nothing great was ever achieved by aiming low. Again and again and again: ad astra per aspera.
@Mitch Apparently.
 
Sorry, I don't know.
Mostly ESL then?
 
No, PSL.
 
He's Tom Christiansen, Perl guru.
 
Yeah, I know that.
But I was asking if he taught English, you know, as a language, to non-native speakers.
@tchrist Do you?
('Apparently' leads me to believe that you do, but 'No, PSL' not.)
 
@Mitch Sometimes I teach Unix, Spanish, English, Latin, literature, number theory, color theory, botany, ornithology, outdoor survival, desert awareness, photography; many other things. Depends what any given student or set of students would fain know.
@Mahnax Have you read Ringworld?
 
4:17 AM
@tchrist No, I have not.
 
@tchrist So you have a real perspective on teaching all those things, the problems with teaching to the test, lowest common denominator.
 
You meant greatest common factor.
I rest my case.
 
@tchrist OK, I'm not as good as you. You've made that clear.
You know, you could help rather than disdain me, since you are a teacher.
 
I do not disdain you.
I welcome your contributions.
 
'I rest my case' is pretty contemptuous.
 
4:20 AM
I do not welcome you pushing people down the gutter way.
Would you rather that I “added a lot of little ‘empty’ words (as the Chinese say)”?
 
@tchrist I guess I am slow or memory impaired. What is that a reference to?
 
Polonius was a pompous fool, but sometimes wit’s soul is best served by a certain parsimony of expression.
7
A: Is this correct: "Aloof the hallow things shall always be"?

tchristYes, this is the poetic device known as hyperbaton. It is quite common. See also its treatment here, which discusses the devices of lyric poetry, including in Le Guin and Tolkien. Speaking of whom, in Letter #171, J.R.R. Tolkien, responding to criticism of his ‘archaic’ style, wrote the follow...

 
argh...so I push people into the gutter. fine. I don't think I do that, you think I do. Really, if it bothers you that much you should downvote and comment to correct. This really seems like it gnaws at you.
@tchrist That is totally disingenuous hen. How can you welcome my contributions when you say I 'push people down the gutter way'.
 
Most of your contributions are worthy of the name.
Others seem to unjustly limit people to a fifth-grade reading level, denying all applicability or desirability of anything but.
I wish it were otherwise. That is all.
I am not doing a good job communicating with you, because you never get my jokes or my irony, my allusions or implications, that I lace my pithier responses with.
 
@tchrist This may sound like going in circles, but I think you misread my intention. I intend to be descriptive. I'm not trying to judge the users, which register they choose to use.
@tchrist Yes, too clever for me. I don't get your references.
I'm just giving an alternate register. I think you don't like that particular register.
 
4:33 AM
Dissecting a joke is like unto vivisecting a frog: it is a slow, painful, messy, and fundamentally ugly deed, and by the time you’re done, the frog is dead.
 
Errors certainly exist, and often. But another register is not a consistent set of errors.
 
Perhaps you could more clearly announce the downmarket, pedestrian register you’re aiming for.
This is not ESL.
This is not ESL.
This is not ESL.
That which I tell you three times is true.
 
Sure.
 
If you must do ESL, then aim for Nabokov.
 
an easy mistake to make.
 
4:37 AM
Déjà dit.
 
Frankly I don't feel I'm describing a 'gutter' register. I do think I am talking about mid-formal speech, between formal and informal, not newspaper or literary English, or highschool cafeteria English. But if you call some of my answers 'preaching the gutter way' then now I know.
 
Let me try one last time.
 
We've monopolized chat for awhile. Poor Mahnax, barely can get a word in edgewise.
...which is my subtle way of saying it is late for me.
 
I don’t care for how quick I perceive you are to disparage something as sounding uncommon.
 
I can get a word in edgewise if I please, thank you very much.
gets word in edgewise
 
4:42 AM
please tell (it doesn't need to stop). but at least reference/ping me so I'll know where to look.
 
See?
 
He knows I’ll talk to him if he talks to me.
This is not a problem.
"You’ll sound weird" is about fitting in, not being noticed, being ordinary, being boring.
I have never been worried about that. I think you have.
I don't know that all readers worry in that way.
 
I haven't worried about it. I was just giving what I expect the perception to be of that.
OK. But I see where you are coming from.
 
No, I must away. The hour of the wolf is upon us, or at least of the coyote chorus singing in the meadows behind me.
 
and with that, same here. later.
 
4:46 AM
Bye all.
 
In the words of Edward R. Murrow . . .
Good night, and good luck.
 
 
1 hour later…
5:56 AM
hi @Mahnax
 
6:30 AM
@skullpatrol Hi.
 
7:05 AM
hi
 
@tchrist I thought that was a Perl built-in, mapped to a single arcane punctuation character.
 
@DavidWallace You… You're back!
I was mildly offended for a moment.
I just happened to be focused on this tab at the time.
 
7:41 AM
^^^ ridiculous ^^^
and they call this a language chat room...
;-D
 
Hi guys, quick question, which one is correct "name something by something" or "name something with something" ?
 
What do you think of "name something as something"?
 
I am trying to edit the title of this question: islam.stackexchange.com/questions/2207/…
I am not sure if "name sameting as something" fits there.
 
What are the "something"s?
 
Naming a person with/by/as one of Allah's names.
It is for a question in Islam.SE
 
7:52 AM
@yasar11732 Naming a person using one of Allah's names.
 
@skullpatrol Thanks :)
 
8:14 AM
@yasar11 The expression you want is "name somebody AFTER somebody".
 
8:52 AM
good day!
 
hello @skullpatrol
 
@MattЭллен I just found out a bit of disturbing news about the mathematics PhD programs language requirements :(
At present, most PhD programs require their students to demonstrate proficiency in reading math in at least one if not two foreign languages; German will essentially always be an acceptable choice.
 
oh. that's tough.
You should get a group of friends together and start learning German
 
I have enough problems demonstrating proficiency in reading math in English.
 
8:59 AM
Sei R die Menge der zur verzehrenden Kekse, und S die der lechzenden Hungermäuler...
 
learning another language will help with English too
 
@MattЭллен In what way?
 
@skullpatrol learning a foreign language helps you appreciate your own by making you understand how it works
 
@MattЭллен Do you learn that by translating back and forth?
 
@skullpatrol Yes. As your learn the structure of your new language you begin to see the structure you take for granted in your native language.
 
9:09 AM
@MattЭллен Could you please give me an example of such a structure?
 
@skullpatrol I am, you are, he/she/it is, they are, we are
 
@skullpatrol why did you just say "could you" and not "you could"? Why "such a" and not "a such"?
 
exactly
 
So I have to return to my childhood mentality of asking why, why, why?
 
You don't have to. You will automagically.
 
9:17 AM
But before I get to that point comes a LOAD of memorization, no?
 
Practice is essential. It works best when you have people to practice with
 
Ideally, you don't force yourself to memorize anything, either. Your mind just remembers things for you.
 
hmm..
Thanks ;-D
 
you're welcome
 
10:02 AM
0
Q: Published at vs published on?

Boris GuéryI need to name a column in a table and I'm wondering what the best option is. Should it be "Published at" or "Published on"? I only need to store a full date and time. From some search I did, it seems that published at is used when referencing a date in the future while published on is used to...

 
 
1 hour later…
11:15 AM
Morning.
 
Are we the German room today?
 
Nicht heute. Immer.
 
I'm not. I'm el salón de Español
 
Ach so.
 
11:17 AM
Коно докки доки ва назе томаранаи.
 
You are a saloon? Nice.
 
no, a salon - I'm having hair cut
 
I am salon, I am salon, home again 'cross the sea.
 
Oh. I'm not a building.
 
that's lucky. buildings tend to collapse in earthquakes
 
11:21 AM
And, if I were, I wouldn't have hair.
 
because you wouldn't be a hip or fashionable building?
 
You don't have earthquakes either, do you?
Because I would have roof.
 
we have earthquakes!
 
Really?
 
thay're just very small
 
11:22 AM
Where?
 
Even you have earthquakes, Cerb.
 
Here are only the bigger ones.
 
<Onslow voice> Oh, nice.
Ohh we have a big one!
 
oh, sailor!
 
11:28 AM
So why don't we have tsunamis?
 
Because you live under a permanent tsunami.
 
because you're below sea level
 
It we have 'big' sea quakes...
 
11:29 AM
 
Spicy.
 
It is strange.
 
What is strange?
 
That we have no tsunamis.
 
not really. tsunamis are caused by huge earthquakes out in the deep ocean. you're not near deep ocean or really big earthquakes that can trigger tsunamis
not all really big earthquakes are of the type that triger tsunamis
although I don't remember how it works
 
11:34 AM
Hello
 
Hey, matt
I have a question
That’s just what I was looking for, even if it isn’t a threefold distinction for me personally.
IN this setence where is the other part of if
?
 
what's the other part that you're looking for?
 
Okay, then why does he swithc from past to present?
was looking for, then isnt a threefold...
 
well, if in your sentence is acting the same as though would
 
11:37 AM
So it's not the conditonal if?
 
?
 
no it's not got a condition attached to it.
 
The apodosis (main clause to the condition) is the 'that's' clause.
 
Andrew says:

It's omitted. "That's X. Even if it isn't Y, [then] it is X" (note the use of is in the if-clause though, so this is different)
 
11:43 AM
It is also in the present simple.
I don't see why it should be 'omitted': the condition just follows the man clause.
 
@Cerberus here is the example: That’s just what I was looking for, even if it isn’t a threefold distinction for me personally.
 
Hi everyone
 
@MattЭллен i am week in grammar and doing some silly spelling mistakes. So how can i improve this ?
 
Practice reading and writing. There are no shortcuts I'm afraid
@NareshSharma what techniques are you using at the moment?
 
11:54 AM
@MattЭллен i didn't have any tech can you suggest me some way to do these things
 
Read a book every day. If you make a spelling mistake in a word, type or write it down a hundred times.
 
i have started with News Paper reading
@RegDwightАΑA
 
Sounds good. Which papers are you reading?
 
@MattЭллен "The Times of India" and some times "The Hindustan Times"
 
@Noah You have marked the wrong clause as the main clause.
 
12:00 PM
@Cerberus so what is the right clause?
 
'What was' is a subordinate clause. 'That's' is the essential part of the main clause.
= that is
 
@NareshSharma what kind of books interest you? You should pick up some English language ones
 
@MattЭллен i like some story and inspirational books
 
Alice in Wonderland.
 
I am a computer programmer so most of the times reading computer books :) @MattЭллен @RegDwightАΑA
 
12:04 PM
That's neither story nor inspirational :D
Try something else for a change. Job is job, fun is fun.
 
@RegDwightАΑA Story and inspirational are my liking but computes is my need and necessity
 
@Cerberus ommm.
 
@NareshSharma Then after you've read Alice in Wonderland, you could maybe try some English Language programming books. Coders at Work is a good book, although I'm not sure of the level of the language. It's quite conversational in style.
 
@NareshSharma I'm just saying, if you constantly read books of type X, you will be pretty proficient in that domain already, or sooner or later. However, you won't be proficient in the language as a whole.
 
gotta go guys
see u
 
12:08 PM
@Noah Are you mumbling a mantra?
 
seeya @Noah
 
@tchrist Why did Constantinople get the works? That's nobody's business but the Turks'. ("Istanbul not Constantinople" was not, as some may think, a TMBG original, but a 1929 number performed by Paul Whiteman and his Orchestra.)
 
Bye.
 
@Cerberus dont much about mantra
but see u next time
 
What up, peoples?
 
12:09 PM
EL&U is quiet. And there's a question about cricket. Coincidence?
 
Friday.
 
@MattЭллен @RegDwightАΑA thanks to guide me and i will follow your suggestions.
 
Glad to help. Come back to chat if you need more help
 
@MattЭллен ya sure
 
time to fly!
 
12:15 PM
@Robusto had no idea
 
@JSBձոգչ Nor did I until I heard it in some old movie that predated TMBG, whereupon I did some investigating.
 
weird.
so i wish the new review queue gave me an option for "not an answer" other than "should be a comment"
b/c i'm finding a lot of things which aren't answers, but also aren't comments
 
1:08 PM
Laters.
 
1:22 PM
patriotism : ??? :: "my country, right or wrong" : "my mother, drunk or sober"
 
filial piety
or family loyalty, if you're feeling less confucian
 
People tell me I can be pretty confusian at the best of times.
Tag schwag:
0
Q: Meaning and origin of 'concinnity' in economical context

Xavier Vidal HernándezWiktionary reads: concinnity: The harmonious reinforcement of the various parts of a work of art. Call it corporate social responsibility at work if you wish, but we simply think that under Howard Shultz's inspired and inspiring leadership Starbucks is just a damned well-managed c...

 
we have six other questions
so long as it's not a singleton and it's actually relevant (which it is), i'm inclined to let it stand
 
What other tags should it have?
 
1:28 PM
Good, thanks.
@RegDwightАΑA Now I know what the SE sites are missing: this. 😽
 
That will be my ticket out of here.
 
@tchrist when are you going to get a real gravatar and not that silly quilt square?
 
I was thinking of getting one for my 50k anniversary.
I didn't even see them until a couple of weeks ago.
@Reg Thanks, you know. I was maybe a bit tongue-in-cheeky on emotica, but if you google up "emotica smileys", there really is a bit of prior art.
But we don’t need a cramps one, no.
It probably goes into the Vax/Vaxen bucket.
 
@Robusto My favorite version is by The Limelighters.
 
1:43 PM
There's little sense in creating synonyms proactively anyway. Even capitalisation nobody uses. People just start typing capi and the rest gets autocompleted. They probably don't even notice the spelling.
 
@RegDwightАΑA this is why i want to get rid of
 
I indeed thought of it because I saw capitalisation, and it "looked wrong". Then I checked humor/humour, and found a synpair.
 
once we kill it, people will type gramm and it'll auto complete to
 
Hm.
 
@JSBձոգչ so every question will end up being tagged , and we will have succeeded in making that tag utterly useless.
 
1:47 PM
@RegDwightАΑA and my work here will be done
 
I am somewhat surprised we don’t have a bazillion questions, and that we instead have a zillion questions.
 
actually, we're doing really good at keeping the bad tags down
 
@JSBձոգչ Why wait? I can make every tag a synonym of right now.
 
there's a significant backlog, but the number of new stupid-tagged questions is manageable, and they're getting retagged quickly (and not just by me)
 
@tchrist because spelling redirects to orthography?
 
1:48 PM
It kinda hasta: nobody who needs spelling help is likely going to be able to spell orthography.
:)
 
But it's automagic.
 
I make like a baby goat with you this morn, Vlad.
 
You start typing spel, and you end up typing spelling, and it gets autochanged to orthography.
Just like you are allowed to type grammer all you want.
 
but what if you type speling?
 
Then JSB comes along and fixes it.
 
1:51 PM
....
it's true, i admit it
hangs head in shame
 
Let me in, you stupid chat engine!
Oh.
Hi.
 
hi, kit!
 
Not by the hair of my chinny-chin-chin.
 
So I'm here early for this pointless training I have sacrificed two weeks of development to, and my trainees have no computers.
Good thing I am early, I guess.
 
Sound familiar.
 
1:54 PM
Jun 15 '11 at 12:48, by Robusto
Speaking of disappointment, I thought when I hit 40K rep there'd be, like, fruit baskets or Balloon-O-Grams or something. You know.
Same thing for 50k and 60k. No party, no streamers, no nothing.
 
Haha.
 
There will be strippers at 1M.
 
whenever the review page shows me a post by Thursagen, i delete it on reflex
regardless of its actual content
 
HA.
Welcome to ELU, Winston Smith.
 
I thought at 50k they relaxed the two-minute time-delay in the feed that non-moderators suffer, that we might all drink from the firehose.
 
1:57 PM
@RegDwightАΑA What, is he in here again? I thought we liquidated him.
 
I am talking at JSB, obviously.
 
Doesn't matter. This is a public sphere.
 
Then your confusion must be with what JSB is talking about.
 
Who says I am confused?
 
Just because you're suspended, doesn't mean your posts no longer exist.
 
1:59 PM
@Robusto Habermasian or non-?
 
And I am riffing on your 1984 reference. I'm allowed to do that, you know.
 
So are mods the only ones would get the meta feed, or was that a coincidence?
 
Aug 10 at 15:22, by RegDwight АΑA
Habermas papam.
 
@JSBձոգչ It doesn't matter.
 

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