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11:00 PM
But editors are purely preference. All you definitely want, @Danu, is an editor that is designed for TeX work. TeXmaker is such an editor.
 
@SeanAllred Debatable!
:D
 
@SeanAllred yeah, I'm pretty sure something like emacs is not what I'm looking for
 
@KyleKanos Let the flame wars begin!!
 
Come on, guys. He's just trying to get a pdf with an image in it.
 
@DanielSank And he's trying to do it the easiest way possible
 
11:00 PM
*puts on flame proof undies.
 
In all fairness, I feel like the command line is much more intuitive than any graphical interface, but this is proven to not be true in the general case.
 
@SeanAllred: As a Windows->Linux convert, I agree.
 
@SeanAllred I'm pretty sure it's a matter of age, lol
 
I do find it useful to look at what the IDE's are sending to the command line though. This is actually a good learning tool.
 
I didn't grow up using the command line
 
11:01 PM
@Danu How old do you gander I am? XD
 
I use the command line a whole lot nowadays, but I still whole-heartedly prefer an IDE
 
@KyleKanos: yes, but don't you ever need to fall back to check things/
 
@SeanAllred ..or level-of-being-into-computers. I never liked computers or programming, so didn't do anything with it as a kid
 
@KyleKanos For you I would recommend a professional editor such as emacs/vi/sublime. It's an important step forward.
@Danu :) It's all about what your interests are. Your interests define how you spend your time, and your time defines how good you are with it.
 
@Danu: This is all irrelevant. I would recommend continuing with us to get something working on the command line.
 
11:03 PM
@SeanAllred yeah, that's what I mean
 
@DanielSank Yes, which is why I'm comfortable using the CLIs when necessary
 
@KyleKanos: Kudos all around :)
 
I actively avoid computing tasks even in physics; I strongly prefer working by hand
Of course, I'm in the wrong neighborhood right now
 
@SeanAllred I'm not a fan of any of those (the latter least of which because it lacks good support for Fortran). I prefer nano
 
@Danu: That will change as you progress. That's exactly what happened to me.
 
11:04 PM
@Danu yay whiteboards! y'know, real computer scientists agree with you :)
 
@SeanAllred Wrong. blackboards and chalk are the only acceptable option.
 
@KyleKanos please let him be trolling me hard
@Danu We change our minds much more often about how to solve a problem, I suppose :)
 
@DanielSank no, really, it won't. I already took some courses on computational methods and stuff... nope.
 
If I open a file I am damn sure that I want to edit the file (otherwise I'd just cat it out)
 
@Danu: That's not what I mean.
 
11:06 PM
@KyleKanos I literally have every editor on my machine symlinked to emacs. Keeps my coworkers out :)
 
@SeanAllred That's actually funny
 
@Danu: I'm an experimentalist. I have never been a "computer person". However, as I progressed through grad school, I just found that there are some tasks which you need a computer for. I learned out of necessity, as in most things.
 
@Danu I'm not going to pressure you into pursuing computation stuffs, but I would advise you not to discount its value.
@Danu Would you like me to create a gallery chat room so we can sort out the TeX issue without interruption?
 
@SeanAllred I certainly do not. I love that people can and do do it. It's just really terrible on me
 
@Danu: All I'm saying is that you should not be prejudiced against any tools. Tools are tools; they solve problems.
 
11:07 PM
Anyhow, everything of course works fine on my brand new TeXmaker install
 
@Danu: Great.
 
lol
 
@Danu XD
 
@Danu: Enjoy texmaker.
 
just one small thingy; can you tell me how to switch to using biber/biblatex/whateverthenamewas in this editor?
 
11:08 PM
yeah
 
@Danu Your problem with TeXstudio is almost certainly using latex instead of pdflatex. There are likely several layers of indirection that TeXstudio goes through when actually getting to the compile commands -- this is very confusing.
 
Options->configure texmaker
 
@DanielSank I'm specializing into a subfield that is very much based on analytic by-hand type stuff, although you can't completely outrun simulations
 
One second, @Danu
 
@SeanAllred It's very strange though, I'm fairly certain I never touched that setting. Oh well.
 
11:08 PM
21
Q: Biblatex + Biber + Texmaker + MiKTeX

Bob PWill someone please help me to both configure Texmaker and use it so that I can use the backend=biber option with biblatex package. I am using MiKTeX 2.8 and Texmaker 3.1. Please do not simply tell me to read the manuals as I have spent most of the afternoon on them and the "working examples," ra...

Praise be to StackExchange, index of answers to all of life's important questions
 
I approve of the edit to that comment :D
 
@Danu :)
 
@Danu: In any case, take a look at options->configure texmaker. You will the commands texmaker actually invokes when you click the build buttons.
 
Thanks for wasting your time on my crap :)
(Kappa for Kyle)
@DanielSank So, the same as texstudio I guess
 
@Danu: more or less.
 
11:10 PM
TeXstudio started as a fork of TeXmaker
(a fork is on offshoot of a project -- something that starts from the same code, but separates off)
Kindof like how mathematics separated itself from physics when you guys started scaring us :)
3
 
We just like to have some real-world use to the mathematics we do ;)
 
@KyleKanos: Speak for yourself, _theorist_.

*disappears into shadows with maniacal laughter*
 
@SeanAllred mmmm... more like the other way around lol
 
Then of course, there's those half-breeds "mathematical physicists" who insist that there exists some middle bridge ;)
 
@KyleKanos Yeah, bunch of losers ;)
 
11:14 PM
@Danu The way I see it, mathematics, philosophy, and physics were in this great blub of greek hipster-celebrities trying to figure out how the world works physically (physics) and metaphysically (philosophy) via logical reasoning (mathematics).
 
What?
Descartes, Kepler, Newton, etc were not Greek
 
Some say mathematics is a tool and not an end, but the beauty of mathematics -- these grand, algebraic structures -- are an end in themselves
@KyleKanos Not a physics guy by any means, but those are the founders of modern physics
The study of natural laws well predates history
 
@KyleKanos ...also weren't really the first at doing math. or physics. You could consider visiting History of Science and Math for some schooling in these matters ;D (shameless plug)
 
So you want to ignore like 1600+ years?
European science in the Middle Ages comprised the study of nature, mathematics and natural philosophy in medieval Europe. Following the fall of the Western Roman Empire and the decline in knowledge of Greek, Christian Western Europe was cut off from an important source of ancient learning. Although a range of Christian clerics and scholars from Isidore and Bede to Buridan and Oresme maintained the spirit of rational inquiry, during the Early Middle Ages Western Europe would see a period of scientific decline. However, by the time of the High Middle Ages, the West had rallied and was on its way...
 
Even into antiquity -- the psalms record decently sophisticated studies in astronomy, now an entire branch of physics
 
11:17 PM
@KyleKanos When talking of origins, yeah...
 
Science in the medieval Islamic world (also known, less accurately, as Islamic science or Arabic science) is the science developed and practised in the Islamic world during the Islamic Golden Age (c. 750 CE – c. 1258 CE). During this time, Indian, Asyriac, Iranian and Greek knowledge was translated into Arabic. These translations became a wellspring for scientific advances, by scientists from the Muslim ruled areas, during the Middle Ages. Scientists within the Muslim ruled areas were of diverse ethnicities. Most were Persians, others were Arabs, Assyrians and Kurds. and Egyptians. They were also...
 
lmao, Kyle going all out
 
@KyleKanos Chill man XD I'm not saying progress wasn't made between the greeks and the golden age, but the greeks made it popular for lack of a better word
 
Don't forget who you're talking to polishes moderator badge
 
either that or the babylonians
 
11:18 PM
@Danu It actually bothers me that people have this idea that it was Aristotle in the BCs and then Newton 1800 years later and nothing in between
 
@KyleKanos Dude, do you really think that's what's going on here?
 
That is the inference I am reading
 
@Danu I don't blame him, really -- there are a whole lot of people that don't do any more study of history than what they have to for the test
 
Sorry for the misunderstanding; I'm well aware of medieval science.
@SeanAllred ...but he knows I'm a mod over at HSM
 
@danu remind me what that stands for again?
 
ahhh
 
Another topic that irks me: the supposed "dark ages" that was debunked like 20 years ago that's still promulgated :/
 
One of the most recent SE's
 
@Danu Emacs.SE being another :) I like the direction the network is heading
 
I think recent is spelled B-O-R-I-N-G :D
 
11:20 PM
@KyleKanos This could be made into a very interesting question on HSM, honestly
 
@KyleKanos To be fair, europe was pretty much the dumbest place on the planet during that time
 
The question of why it's promulgated or something else?
 
we're a pretty eurocentric culture, so it makes sense that it's still represened that way
 
Ah, that face makes me laugh so hard every time
 
I have no idea the reference
 
11:21 PM
@KyleKanos He just looks like a geezer, nothing more to it
 
Geezer? You and I have different meanings of the word
 
@KyleKanos Yes
 
geezer, goober, completely-vacant
 
As far as I know, in the American language, Geezer is an old person
 
@KyleKanos the type of person that would say "U wot m8?!"
 
11:23 PM
@KyleKanos In most of the US, yes :)
 
@KyleKanos Eurocentric, remember? ;)
 
I'm Cathlo-centric, which means I'm partly Euro-centric, no?
 
In my world, "geezer" = "old person", too
 
@KyleKanos Only certain parts; the Catholic faith has been losing ground for quite a while
 
Hah, 2.5 against 1.5
 
11:24 PM
@KyleKanos Ah, haven't you heard? Europe went Anglican ages ago :)
 
@ACuriousMind I guess you guys don't listen to British rap music ;)
 
@Danu I don't even want to hypothesize on what that sounds like
 
I honestly feel like religion, in general, is losing ground in Europe
 
@Danu Who told you that absolutely confidential information?!
 
11:25 PM
True facts, and it's a bit unfortunate / scary
One wonders who or what man will turn to
 
(I was unaware of the very existence of British rap music until now :D )
 
I wish I could be unaware again.
 
@SeanAllred I have to say that I view it as a strongly positive thing, but maybe we shouldn't get into that right now, I don't really care for debates on religion
@SeanAllred This music is, in fact, highly regarded by the great majority of serious music critics.
 
@Danu Agreed. Just to be clear, I think it's great people are beginning to question things that have gone unquestioned for so long. :)
 
If I hear any more implications that being atheist is something defective/scary/bad, there will be a rant in this room.
 
11:27 PM
@ACuriousMind I think atheist is a bad term. [awaiting rant]
 
@Danu Maybe in some parts, but the global population is increasing
 
That's the great strength and influence of science -- it shows people their right to question the world around them
 
@SeanAllred Only England went Anglican. So unless England = Europe, then no ;)
 
@KyleKanos Again, Eurocentric :D
 
@KyleKanos The global population is increasing, period.
@KyleKanos Fair, fair :)
 
11:27 PM
@SeanAllred Also true
 
haha oh god there is no end to this. Glorious :D
Also yeah Sean, most of Europe doesn't actually count the UK as part at all
I guess that's an achievement of UK politicians, in some sense ;)
 
It seems geezer has actually quite an interesting word history
 
@Danu Is it just kind of off in its own little puddle up there?
 
@SeanAllred Kinda... and it doesn't like us
(but depends on us all along, they just don't wanna admit it) :D
 
@Danu Ha! I guess... welcome to america? XD
 
11:29 PM
Wait...what's with the rap music above?
 
@KyleKanos It's about geezers. In the correct sense ;)
It's also really good music IMO
 
Old people?
 
@KyleKanos Incorrect
Original Pirate Material is the debut album by the English rapper and producer Mike Skinner, under the name The Streets. The album is a unique take on UK garage and lyrics dealing with everyday circumstances and occurrences. The album originally rose to #12 on the UK Albums Chart in 2002, and then peaked at #10 in 2004 after the release of the second Streets album A Grand Don't Come for Free. The album has received a large amount of critical acclaim. In March 2003, NME placed Original Pirate Material at number 46 on their list of the "100 Best Albums of All Time". They subsequently placed Original...
 
Starers?
 
@KyleKanos If you would listen to the song, you'd probably get it
 
11:30 PM
No speakers
 
@KyleKanos Damn, that's unfortunate
 
I'm also proctoring an exam with "extended time" students
So they need their silence
 
LOL, I can imagine you sitting in front of a bunch of people trying to pass some exam, just having this conversation on your laptop haha
 
No, I'm on a 24" Mac desktop thing
But I am sitting in front of them typing away
 
I think this excerpt gives a good impression: "By now you want to leather this twat
And forever your gonna regret that, your choice of path
So mash his head up and your girls now fed up
But stop to think and it's never gonna be the Jackie Chan scene it could have been to end up"
 
11:32 PM
I peer out, make sure they're not cheating or anything
 
@KyleKanos I once had a TA just stand up and tell us we could discuss amongst ourselves if we wanted to. It was a glorious day, and A's were had all around :)
 
That would probably get me yelled at
Probably not fired
 
@Danu It is the polar opposite of theist. I don't see why it would be a bad term. (Note that just as not all theists need to be unshakably convinced that there is a personal god, so atheists do not need to be unshakably convinced that there isn't a personal god. "Fairly certain" suffices to be counted into either category.)
@Danu And, lol
 
But I wouldn't get this cushy TAing gig next semester
 
@ACuriousMind I think it's naive to say that you can conclude much about the matter at all. Agnosticism is the only logical conclusion (also, not caring is an important part of what I think is a reasonable stance)
 
11:35 PM
@KyleKanos Why, is there someone supervising you supervising? ;)
 
@ACuriousMind: He's not present, but I do have a supervisor
 
I don't think the students would yell at you, at least
shout your praises, more like it
 
The students wouldn't yell at me, but my supervisor would
Ugh worst text from my wife just now: Dinner is cleaned up. Forget what I said about leftovers
 
@KyleKanos how would he find out?
@KyleKanos shiiiiite
Can you cook?
 
@Danu Man, now you're making me fire up my jams
 
11:39 PM
@Danu By the extraordinary grades these guys would get compared to what they normally get
I can cook
 
@KyleKanos Lol, just grade them on a curve ;D
 
But not very well
 
@SeanAllred your jams being ...? :)
 
I'll probably just tell her when I'm on my way home and she'll whip something up for me
 
@KyleKanos I can give you some pointers?
 
11:40 PM
0x0012FA63?
 
actual rap music XD you probably wouldn't like, but I recommend a listen: lecrae
 
Ah. I try to get everybody to cook as often as possible
 
particularly the track misconception
 
@SeanAllred Never heard of him, interesting (I own over 6500 hip hop songs)
oh wait, he strongly identifies as christian... this may be why I haven't heard of him lol
The song is decent
 
@Danu Likely the reason :P That track in particular is really, really good though
 
11:44 PM
The third verse is not very good though
The guy just really doesn't flow.
 
Ten (or twenty? Time flies…) years ago it was said that "The greatest single cause of atheism in the united states is Christians – who acknowledge Jesus with their lips, walk out the door, and deny them with their lifestyle. That is what an unbelieving world simply finds unbelievable."
@Danu It's four different speakers
 
@Danu That doesn't make atheist a bad term, it just means that you aren't one ;)
 
@ACuriousMind I think the only good term would be antitheist, because that is effectively what the word means nowadays
 
Strange, I actually like the third guy :) I also grew up heavy into music though, so I have a weird thing for weird rhythms. One of my favorite pieces is 13/8.
@Danu Atheists exist and it's not a null term in and of itself, but it's an inaccurate description of many people who identify as atheist.
 
@SeanAllred ...but he really isn't doing an interesting rhythm there, as far as I can tell. It's just that he has awkward silences at the end of almost every sentence, which contrasts with the much more fluent rapping styles of the first 2 verses
 
11:47 PM
@Danu Oh, these are two different things. Atheism is a matter-of-fact statement about what you think about the existence of god. Antitheism is a (mostly moral) statement about what you think about the existence of theism.
 
@Danu And that's where he messes with time. I dunno if he realizes it, but he's skipping the beat. I personally like the effect, but it's highly subjective :)
@ACuriousMind Precisely.
 
@SeanAllred ...I don't think it's on purpose :P
 
@Danu Meh
@Danu How'd you get on with biber?
 
When I just saw that, I thought I read,
Justin Drew Bieber (/ˈbiːbər/; born March 1, 1994) is a Canadian singer and songwriter. Bieber's current manager, Scooter Braun first discovered him through his YouTube videos in 2007. Braun was impressed with the videos, and contacted Bieber's mother Pattie about wanting to work with him. After convincing Bieber's mother, Braun arranged for Bieber to meet with Usher in Atlanta, Georgia. Bieber was signed to RBMG, and then to an Island Records recording contract offered by record executive, L.A. Reid. Bieber released his debut EP, My World, in November 2009. It was certified platinum in the United...
And was totally confused
 
@SeanAllred it was... too easy?
 
11:58 PM
@Danu hehehehe
 
@KyleKanos I get on pretty well with Justin (Kappa)
 
See, computing stuff is easy :D
 
@SeanAllred literally just typing biber instead of bibtex
 
...I think we were all struggling not to make that association, @KyleKanos :D
 
I haven't actually used it yet
 
11:58 PM
@Danu Most things with TeX are easy when you don't bork things up :)
 
@KyleKanos Only in Mathematica (just saying this to provoke you hardcore guys)
^but it's actually true
 
Mathematica's a baby's language
 
Why do you guys keep writing Kappa at random places in the conversation?
 
@Danu Psh I love mathematica
@KyleKanos lies
 
@ACuriousMind twitch
google kappa twitch
 
11:59 PM
@KyleKanos Mathematica is a pretty acceptable lisp
 
I prefer my Fortran and doing things by hand
 
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