The h Bar - 2015-07-08 (page 1 of 2)

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1:13 AM

Why do I do Helder the favor of assuming he'll get the point if I point him at relevant physics?

It wouldn't be so bad if he didn't phrase things like a troll (e.g., How can this standard theory be right!?)

2:15 AM

why are crank physicist wannabes always wannabe theorists?

@paisanco It's cheaper? Or the ones that actually try experiment get a harsh lesson? A little of both?

5 hours later…

6:59 AM

@0celo7 "academics break" ? I thought voluntary breaks were for 40+ professionals who're fed up of their jobs who take refuge in the forests. To take refuge in video games, that's unique.

7:54 AM

@paisanco because you don't know the ones that go into math...papers proving all open conjectures are quite common in math professors mailboxes. Important math journals has to put restrictions and the necessity of endorsements to send a paper for evaluation there o.O

at least from non-professional mathematicians

5 hours later…

12:28 PM

@ACuriousMind when do they teach you GR at the university? I have the Modulhandbuch but I don't see any GR?

12:39 PM

Found it! I didn't expect it to be in english...

1:00 PM

what did you expect?

Lubos Motl's blog is actually really good...

@skillpatrol to be in german cause it is a german university :)

@0celo7 though I didn't particularly like his attitude towards global warming

@gonenc ok, that makes sense :)

@gonenc Haven't gotten to that. I randomly decided to read his commentary on Greece, and it's quite interesting.

@0celo7 and gotta say the markup aint so good :(

1:07 PM

@gonenc Markup?

"We may divide these insane views to two fuzzily separated groups:
1. it's just OK to pursue policies that make the growing debt unavoidable
2. it's just OK when the country defaults – a happier future follows after that, anyway"

Very well put.

@0celo7 the green background etc

@gonenc Didn't notice it.

are we talking about this site?

@0celo7 motls.blogspot.com.tr

Yes

"Motl is known to exhibit strong verbal aggression on the web to anyone who he considers to be "intellectual garbage" (everyone who doesn't embrace string theory and doesn't deny climate change).["

1:10 PM

@gonenc Of course people who don't accept the truth are intellectual garbage.

hi

@0celo7 I followed his blog for a while, it does provide an interesting perspective of a European's opinion of the world.

@0celo7 who doesn't deny

@gonenc I can read.

I'm not @KyleKanos, after all ;)

@0celo7 do you think the climate change is nonsense?

1:11 PM

@gonenc I would say I'm not informed enough to say either way.

@gonenc IMO: climate change is worth studying. The mass hysteria over "doomsday" models is complete BS though

@KyleKanos Pretty much this.

IIRC, all those doomsday models from the early 2000's all said by 2015 we'd be like 4 degrees C hotter than it is now, the oceans would be encroaching by dozens of meters, etc

@KyleKanos Yes.

Stefan Molyneaux has some great material on climate change. He kills the "97% of scientists agree" quite thoroughly.

@KyleKanos they are but it is a fact that CO2 emission is increasing, which is a greenhouse gas, which causes the earth to warm

1:14 PM

@gonenc Warm by how much?

Global warming has been blamed for cooler-than-normal temperatures and hotter-than-normal temperatures for the same data set

The Earth is warming naturally.

How much of that warming is human made?

@KyleKanos I think this has to do with wind and oceanic current patterns.

I don't recall the source at the moment, but there was someone who showed that the global warming researchers actually fudged data

@KyleKanos i think this has to do with the statistician who reads the data

@gonenc I know, but claiming the same cause for opposite effects is kinda BS, no?

1:16 PM

@0celo7 I guess it is around .5 .6

@gonenc Guess?

@KyleKanos well there is a nice example that explains it

@0celo7 there is a poll that my father gives in his lectures about statistics

the poll is about cola vs pepsi

and pepsi statisticians say that people prefer pepsi and cola statisticians say people like cola

the actual evidence is as follows

%5 likes cola %5 likes pepsi %90 dunno the difference

@0celo7 looking for the source

@KyleKanos hence the person who is against or for GW may have used such a trick. I dunno, one needs to see the data first

@0celo7 "The global average (land and ocean) surface temperature shows a warming of 0.85 [0.65 to 1.06] °C in the period 1880 to 2012, based on multiple independently produced datasets." -wiki

I'm amazed at how ardently people defend GW/CC when they aren't working in the field.

Do you see laypeople defend one form of cancer treatment over another?

@0celo7 you dont have to work in the field to have an opinion though.

@gonenc I never said the Earth was not warming.

1:22 PM

@0celo7 as if it is the same thing.

hi?

@0celo7 no i just provided the source

Of course the Earth is warming, I don't think anyone reasonable argues against that.

Deniers argue that humans are not the dominant factor in this warming.

okay, sorry for interrupting your private chat

Santigo got offended I think...?

1:24 PM

brb breakfast

@0celo7 mfw it is 1624 here

@gonenc Everyone knows there's only one time-zone and it's 0925 :D

^^

@KyleKanos well europe aint in that time zone

@gonenc Well then Europe's not part of the world :/

1:33 PM

@KyleKanos ¯_(ツ)_/¯

3rd world confirmed

Why doesn't everyone just conform to Murrica East time?

@0celo7 I think the world should vote on that

though then the chinese people would win...

No, America should vote

Only people who matter get a vote.

@KyleKanos oh god, the troll has awoken

12662 (or whatever)?

Or do you mean you?

No, me

1:37 PM

@KyleKanos what's that number

You don't want to know

Ah, it's actually 12262: physics.stackexchange.com/users/12262/user12262

@0celo7 people who use imperial units.. :P don't make me start talking

The guy is basically trolling us over "notation," preferring to use his nonsense notation over standard notation

And then is just plain awful at math

He believes QM is at the heart of every measurement, including classical & relativistic ones

And factors of $\hbar$ can just disappear (because of math) to make these quantum computations classical

user image

@KyleKanos he has more rep than me though

1:44 PM

@gonenc Due to sheer volume, not quality content

He's answered about 100 more questions than you

And has ~500 more rep than you

He's basically averaging 1 upvote per post while you're averaging 2

@KyleKanos how do you get that data?

1889/159 = 11.something, 1399/59 = 23.something

It's all in your profile

The number of questions & answers you've posted plus your rep. It's just division

I also was only counting answers, not questions

@KyleKanos I see I thought you were doing something fancy :D

Yeah, sorry

I'd have to do some more work to figure out average number of upvotes, and I like the lazy approach

Both of you answer more than you ask, so more weight would be on the A's side anyway

@KyleKanos who doesn't like the lazy approach :D

1:49 PM

@gonenc Mathematical physicists

@KyleKanos they don't count

15 mins ago, by 0celo7

Only people who matter get a vote.

@KyleKanos so what?

@gonenc Imperial is superior for every-day use.

@0celo7 that is such bs.

I can't get my head around with all those conversions

I like multiplying with 10 though...

1:53 PM

@gonenc Just thought it was funny.

@KyleKanos it was funny :D

@gonenc Then don't convert.

@KyleKanos I hate writing online I sound much more serious and cynical

Those who voted "No" expressed a certain kind of perverse pride – pride about their and their nation's being the ultimate losers among the EU member states, pride about their most unhinged communist government. Czechs have lived under communism for more than 40 years but I assure you that our nation has never supported the communist overlords this enthusiastically.

Lol, communist overlords

I don't even need to ask who wrote that

(aside from the fact that he says "our nation" in reference to Czech)

1:56 PM

@0celo7 he writes too blatantly but i guess it is kinda ok

@KyleKanos My mother is a Czech immigrant and has said exactly the same thing.

2:11 PM

When too many people like that appear at a territory, it is extremely dangerous. They don't feel the need to preserve their nation's banking system or the economy – because they own almost no fraction of it. It doesn't mean that they haven't ever been given money. But as typical drug addicts, they immediately waste all of it. The Greek governments have behaved in the same way. Interesting...

This shouldn't have happened. Scum like this should have no power and any significant increase of their power is a sign that someone has made some serious mistakes.

If I didn't know at least about the 40% of the "Yes" votes, all my data would be compatible with the assumption that the Greek nation is a homogeneous body of parasitic savages brainwashed by Marxism.

I, for one, would prefer a carpet bombing of Greece. I liked everything up to this point.

@KyleKanos Together we hold all but one of the starred comments :D

Now we've got a monopoly

o/

@KyleKanos Or is it an oligopoly?

Probably that one

2:27 PM

Still crunching data today?

Sorta. Trying to get MS Office installed via Wine but it's not being nice

Wine?

As in, get drunk and try to install it?

Drunk computing must be the new thing.

Wine (software)

Wine (recursive acronym for Wine Is Not an Emulator) is a free and open source compatibility layer software application that aims to allow applications designed for Microsoft Windows to run on Unix-like operating systems. Wine also provides a software library, known as Winelib, against which developers can compile Windows applications to help port them to Unix-like systems. It duplicates functions of Windows by providing alternative implementations of the DLLs that Windows programs call, and a process to substitute for the Windows NT kernel. This method of duplication differs from other methods...

Recursive acronym? Cool I guess.

You're running Unix?

Or is Linux Unix?

Running Linux (specifically Linux Mint 17.1)

2:31 PM

@KyleKanos My refund has not fully processed yet, I was unable to get FF7 last night.

Or Saint's Row The Third. (I decided to get 3 because it has better ratings and is $10 cheapter than 4.)

Borderlands 2 complete edition is $40, that's nuts.

It's 4 years old.

IDK anything about Borderlands

I know everything about borderlands

@JimsBond Should I get it next time it goes on sale?

Borderlands 2 is my favourite game ever. I have over 600 hours played on it. $40 for the complete edition is an amazing deal

I'm not paying $40 when I have $100 of other games I have to finish first.

2:36 PM

It has replayability, humour, and great game mechanics

In particular, I hope FF7 is playable on battery power.

That would be pretty awesome.

Actually, Morrowind is in principle playable on battery power.

300fps/3=100fps=good

@JimsBond 600 is crazy.

That's almost as much as my BF3 time, and that ruined my AP scores for 2 years.

Plus >100 on Borderlands 1 and >300 on Borderlands The Pre-Sequel

But 2 was the best

It had just enough of everything and not too much of anything

is there an easy way to calculate the riemann tensor w/o computers?

@gonenc Yes.

@0celo7 I'm listening...

2:41 PM

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@0celo7 haha...

seriously there isn't any is there?

There is.

-6

A: Remote EEG detection / reading

It's possible, but its a secret. Otherwise you could defend yourself against the Zionist governments.

Kidnap a genius and force him at gunpoint.

@gonenc I put that in the "not even wrong" category.

@0celo7 I said no computers!

My dog is barking non-stop I can't even hear myself :@!

she is being a total b*tch!

2:50 PM

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^ handyman's secret weapon

@0celo7 I cant use a duck tape she aint no duck!

In communist Czechoslovakia, we have also had the freedom of speech. However, in Switzerland, they also had the freedom after the speech. ;-)

^^Clever.

@JimsBond I know :D

though both of them are accepted

Duct tape or duck tape is cloth- or scrim-backed pressure-sensitive tape often coated with polyethylene. There are a variety of constructions using different backings and adhesives. One variation is gaffer tape designed to be cleanly removed, while duct tape is not. Another variation is heat-resistant duct tape useful for sealing heating/ventilation/air-conditioning (HVAC) ducts, produced because standard duct tape fails quickly when used on heating ducts. Duct tape is generally gray or black but also available in other colors. During World War II, Revolite, then a division of Johnson & Johnson...

@gonenc Not in this chat.

2:56 PM

@gonenc Yeah, given the deleted answers to that question, methinks protecting it is a good idea

@gonenc Notice that article even mentions it's the handyman's secret weapon

@0celo7 one of my friends told me that it is called duct tape because the sound of the tape whilst using it is alike to a duck quacking

now I know 100% that it is an utter bs

Funny that California has prohibited its use on ducts

@JimsBond what about its use on ducks?

I don't think that is explicitly forbidden

3:38 PM

@JimsBond Animal cruelty?

@0celo7 Not if the duck is already dead

If "quantum mechanics" is redefined to cover the delusions of the anti-quantum zealots, it's great for them because they may suggest that they know something about quantum mechanics even though they don't have a clue.

@0celo7 source?

motls.blogspot.com/2015/06/…

I love how he weaves a stab at "anti-quantum zealots" into a rant on the unconstitutionality of gay marriage.

Ugh, I can only manage to stare at white-on-green for so long before my eyes hurt

3:48 PM

@KyleKanos Old eyes?

Sure.

I have an apt with the eye doctor on Saturday.

I'm already growing old...

@0celo7 have you read the whole obergefell vs. hodges case?

@gonenc No.

@0celo7 I'm not from us but with that defence it was inevitable that they lost and the ones that were defending gay marriage were damn good

and as far as the case goes, there is no redefinition of the word marriage

at least not as in the case lets define 2+2 to be 5

3:57 PM

@gonenc How so? Does it not allow "marriage" between two people of the same sex?

For the life of me I cannot remember "marriage" being in the Constitution, however.

@0celo7 that was the entire defence

@gonenc So if "marriage" was previously defined as between two people of not the same sex, then the definition was changed, no?

what was wrong with calling it a "civil union" or something like that and giving that all the same perks as marriage?

defining it between man and woman would defy 14th ammendment.

@JimsBond In my AP Gov class, this is what our Rep. party did (I was chief of staff).

4:01 PM

@JimsBond As a matter of law, marriage is a civil status. It grants a whole slew of rights and privileges before the law.

@0celo7 I didnt see any definition of marriage in constitution

@gonenc I didn't either. I said that above.

So giving it a different name would be to imply exactly that is was a lesser status.

It might be in there, but beats me where it is.

The beef the traditionalists have here is that they used to have their cultural expectation encoded in the law and now they don't any more.

4:02 PM

@dmckee Okay, so what prevents them from inventing a differently named civil status that grants the exact same things but isn't restricted to opposite sex partners?

@JimsBond who are them?

one could call it the superset

say marriage was a special case scenario. Or just get rid of the term itself. Give it back to religion

The very fact that people are freaking out about the word that is used instead of the status shows that the traditionalist care about the word as much as the same-sex couples who wanted to be wed not unioned do.

foxnews.com/opinion/2015/06/26/…

@JimsBond i think that would create a whole a lot confusion

4:04 PM

@JimsBond This they could do. Covert the law to refer only to unions.

say you are religious and want to get marry

In fact some politicians in Oklahoma were noodling around that idea late last year. Didn't go anywhere.

lets call the new term supermarriage

so are you allowed to have both marriage and supermarriage?

what would it even mean?

Marriage was a religious sacrament originally. If they made it a purely religious thing again, then the government could wash its hands of the matter and the churches would have to deal with this matter

you know, separation of church and state

@JimsBond Legally sound. But it won't fly.

4:06 PM

@gonenc I think marriage would be a type of supermarriage. One performed by a minister of faith

@dmckee Indeed

@JimsBond This is what Libertarians, e.g. Rand Paul, have argued.

@gonenc This is my superspouse.

It would be like SUSY terminology...

Superring...superdiamond...superchild...

as a matter of fact, the only problem was a legal recognition but people got carried away because of some prejudice etc.

@0celo7 Wouldn't it indeed be super?

@gonenc It would be fabulous.

I mean think of this, taking the example of a hetero partner, you spouse, wife whatever is in hospital and you are not even allowed to stay with her and make medical decisions

4:09 PM

bah humbug. I'm too Canadian to really care about semantics. Just let them get married. Don't argue about it. That's what we do

@JimsBond that is what everyone should do :)

Is there a way to tell who has the most starred comments?

@JimsBond not too long ago a white person could not marry a black one

Question 1: Will what you propose prevent me from drinking beer, watching hockey, or complaining about the weather? Question 2: Does it actively harm others in a measurable way or interfere with their rights? Question 3: Is granting the request impolite? If the answer to all these questions is "No", go ahead and do it, I don't care

@JimsBond 1: Hockey, really? Way to play into the stereotype.

4:14 PM

^^ this logic +1

3: You darn Canadians...

shoot I meant jims logic :D

Also, whoever starred that should be shot.

@JimsBond Please delete.

@0celo7 why?

@0celo7 indeed why?

4:15 PM

@JimsBond The Kanos-0celo7 oligopoly was disturbed.

@0celo7 too bad u'd've taken a SS.:P :D

@0celo7 That fails on Q3 and Q1

@JimsBond I said please, sorry, eh?

Also 1??

If anything it fails 2.

@0celo7 How can I complain about the weather when I know I had to delete this comment?

@JimsBond ???

4:18 PM

I don't know how to make that more clear

3 hours ago, by gonenc

@0celo7 and gotta say the markup aint so good :(

@JimsBond ???

tfw you floss popcorn out of your teeth and you haven't had popcorn in a week

@JimsBond How familiar are you with asymptotic limits in Minkowski spacetime?

Specifically, the first theorem in chapter 11 of Wald.

I've never read that text

off-hand, I'd say I'm not as familiar with it as with other things, but ask your question and I'll give it a shot

@JimsBond How does one show that a massless Klein-Gordon field goes like $O(1/\lambda)$ as $\lambda\rightarrow\infty$ along every null geodesic?

Yeah, I definitely need more context

4:29 PM

The proof says to construct the conformally equivalent unphysical spacetime and solve for $\tilde\phi$ at null infinity.

$\tilde\phi=\phi/\Omega$, $\Omega$ is the conformal factor.

I'm guessing $\phi$ is the field?

yes

Wald shows that $\tilde\phi$ can be extended to the conformal boundary.

and $\lambda$ is the path parameter?

Affine parameter, yes.

Wald then says to simply translate this result into a statement about asymptotic limits in Minkowski spacetime

okay, so what result did you get?

4:35 PM

I don't have a result.

I think one has to examine the conformal factor.

One has to show that $\Omega\tilde\phi\rightarrow O(1/\lambda)$, right?

looks like it

I think I have to find the coordinates of null geodesics

Eh, not worth it

My physics lingo has never been great, but this seems to turn into a trivial statement. I have no idea what statement about asymptotic minkowski limits they want other than that klein-gordon fields seem to respect the speed of light and remain either space like or time like, depending on how they start

It's not a major result anyhow

But again, my physics lingo was never great.

I can do the work, but not put it into the words most physicists expect

4:47 PM

Why are there 34 "actionable" items in the queues? Who is not doing their job?

::Jim guiltily darts his eyes from side to side and whistles nonchalantly::

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5:09 PM

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I got all the stuffs working for the data test

And? What does the data say?

It's just bits on my computer, it can't talk

Not with that attitude

And given my rational fear of Skynet, I don't want my data to talk either

PSA: Dr Strangelove is on Amazon Prime

5:27 PM

@KyleKanos We have to take back the star board.

Don't let it drive you bonkers

I believe Daniel Sank once got the entire board to himself

He probably hacked the system

I think we also had covered it with only XKCD links

@0celo7 Nah, one of the stars was something like, "no one should star these"

Just met a group of high school students in an elevator.

They're so tiny and young.

In your mind, they're probably embryos.

Er, I do have 4 kids

All under 6

I don't consider them embryos

5:31 PM

Zygotes?

@0celo7 I've had the star board all to myself once. It will change again. Artificially starring messages to ensure only particular people are on the board is probably not a good idea

@JimsBond Fine, it can be a triumverate.

@0celo7 how about we not worry about it and just let it manage itself

@JimsBond Et tu, Jime?

Not sure how I betrayed you

5:36 PM

says the man holding a bloody dagger

We've got a Shakespearian scholar on our hands, it seems

@KyleKanos 1,500 years off, bub.

::facepalm::

....

really?

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5:39 PM

Julius Caesar (play)

The Tragedy of Julius Caesar is a tragedy by William Shakespeare, believed to have been written in 1599. It is one of several plays written by Shakespeare based on true events from Roman history, which also include Coriolanus and Antony and Cleopatra. Although the title is Julius Caesar, Julius Caesar is not the most visible character in its action; he appears in only five scenes. Marcus Brutus speaks more than four times as many lines and the central psychological drama is his struggle between the conflicting demands of honour, patriotism and friendship. == Characters == == Synopsis == The play...

I'm a 3 year old, mentally.

Once again, I have no words. Words fail me

2

@JimsBond Say that you forgive me.

Maybe just this once

I just had an awesome Caesar salad.

5:51 PM

I had yogurt for lunch

Raisins, crushed walnuts, honey & cinnamon in it too

@KyleKanos I had froyo for lunch yesterday.

It was delicious

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?

I was really hungry by dinnertime.

Frozen yogurt.

@0celo7 How could that be if you ate a hobbit?

It was really expensive.

@KyleKanos ?

5:52 PM

I know they're child-sized, but that's still like 40 lbs of food

The hell are you on about...

I'm ignoring your correction to fro-yo

And going on about Frodo

I never wrote Frodo...

That's why I added the question mark under Frodo

wat

5:54 PM

It all makes sense

Go compile some data or something

It is compiling, that's why I have free time to talk

Actually, I am sorta

Well it's actually running

It's kinda complicated when it comes to interpetted languages

But I'm geohashing

Lol, you both are running stuff?

yes

5:55 PM

I need to calculate the force necessary to hold a particle stationary in a static spacetime.

I don't wanna

waaa

0

Or in some reference frame probably

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