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12:01 AM
What the heck is for?
 
@ChrisWhite I figured it out... Turns out only some of the terms can be written in divergence form (the ones I knew how to do) and others cannot (the ones I was stuck on).
 
Also, wtf:
42
Q: Why Do Sausages Always Split Lengthwise?

JoeHobbitSausages universally split parallel to the length of the sausage. Why is that?

 
@ACuriousMind Those are some mighty bad questions, but I can foresee uses of
 
@ACuriousMind Truer words have never been said. W.T.F.
That question is from the 1st of April...
 
Ah, I see. Heh
 
12:04 AM
That answer though!
 
@tpg2114 Which ones? My lack of experimentalist blood and the non-existent tag summary leave me coming up with none
 
Yeah!
 
@Danu I lol'd at Bockwurstformeln
 
("Yeah!"=I agree @Danu )
 
Vegan sausages don't split runs
 
12:04 AM
@ACuriousMind Crack formation in solids. It's a really complicated topic
And you can approach it from theoretical, computational, or experimental frameworks
 
@ACuriousMind exactly
 
@tpg2114 Ah, that is a reason for the tag to exist (or, at least, these are potentially good questions I could see tagged with it). Is there something else? The tag sounds really unspecific to me.
is probably not a good idea :D
 
Lel
 
@ACuriousMind I don't think so, I think that's probably the only physical application for it. would just be a synonym if it ever came up
 
fracture-in-solids?
 
12:07 AM
Overly specific -- you can't fracture gases or liquids
 
Chuck Norris fractures empty space
 
I think things like and (which does not yet exist) sound generic in common English but have precise meanings in physics
Or I guess I should really just say in continuum mechanics
Rather than the entirety of physics
 
In Soviet Russia, solids fracture you! (or anywhere else, for that matter)
 
Was just about to add what you just edited in there
 
:)
 
12:16 AM
@0celo7 do you know a quick 3 line derivation of the Minimal model central charge?
 
@bolbteppa What's the result?
 
Any of those scary things: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimal_models
 
@bolbteppa You'll have to accept there is none, you don't get around the Kac determinant formula or other heavy instruments
 
@bolbteppa No clue, not even Di Francesco proves that stuff.
 
DiFrancesco refers to the Kac determinant and a diagram
Bit of a nightmare I can avoid I guess :)
 
12:23 AM
@ACuriousMind Do you know where those results can be found derived?
 
@0celo7 Nope
 
I very much good English.
 
It's derived in Francesco on page 208 I think I just don't want to read from 200 to 208 yet :(
 
Oh it is? ::looks::
 
@ACuriousMind so if I define the identity operator at the origin of the z-plane I can call this $|0>$?
 
12:27 AM
@bolbteppa No, that's not derived.
It's stated.
 
@bolbteppa In a sense, yes, but you can't "define" the operator before you have defined the space it acts on, so you must first postulate the existence of the vacuum and then observe that the operator-state correspondence maps the vacuum to the identity.
 
My book says "it can formally be introduced by an insertion of the unit operator I at the origin of the z-plane, since this corresponds to the 'infinite past'"
 
That's wrong, imo, you can't insert an operator if you haven't constructed the states it shall act on.
It is common among physicists to do this, though :/
 
@ACuriousMind So it's hand waving vs. lack of rigor?
Oh physics...
 
If the best minds in the world are willing to wave their hands at this obvious stuff I feel my natural intuition to do the same is justified lol
In other words, Baez index
haha
 
12:34 AM
@ACuriousMind Well, maybe you don't call it an "operator" but a group is a group...
 
So a state vector $|0>$ is represented by an operator (not a vector) but we pretend it's a vector?
wtf
 
@bolbteppa No, there is a one-to-one correspondence between states/rays and operators, that's what the state-field/operator correspondence is all about
@DanielSank You don't get the specific state though unless you specify the space the group is represented on
 
Okay, 'because of the state-operator correspondence' we can interpret $I$ at the origin of the z plane as corresponding to $|0>$?
 
@ACuriousMind Oh, yeah. I was just being annoying :P
 
@bolbteppa Yep
 
12:43 AM
"The operator-state correspondence says that all states in the theory can be created by operators which act locally in a small neighborhood of the origin. That is to say that the entire Hilbert space of a CFT can be thought of as living at a single point. The key here is that for CFTs we have radial quantization, and states evolve radially outwards unitarily from the origin."
12
A: Operator-state correspondence in QFT

Logan MThe operator-state correspondence says that all states in the theory can be created by operators which act locally in a small neighborhood of the origin. That is to say that the entire Hilbert space of a CFT can be thought of as living at a single point. The key here is that for CFTs we have radi...

 
But, as I said, the correspondence is based on the existence of the vacuum, since you identify the operators with their action on the vacuum, so this view is really bit backwards
 
You mean how they act when they multiply an operator known as the identity defined at the origin right? :p
 
@bolbteppa That's true, but a tautology, because an operator times the identity is just the operator itself. The crucial feature of a CFT is that the result of the action on the vacuum state uniquely determines the operator
 
Okay that's awesome, finally makes some sense thanks to you guys!
 
lol, someone is puzzled that Germans don't jaywalk :D
 
12:58 AM
@ACuriousMind How do I add a lab partner and date the lab was performed to the LaTeX title?
 
@0celo7 I don't think the standard class has title commands for that. You could, of course, add your partner in \author and put the date in \subtitle
 
@ACuriousMind What does \subtitle do?
 
@0celo7 Exactly what it says on the tin ;)
I usually end up doing the title page myself, I don't like much what \maketitle produces, anyway
 
@ACuriousMind Well I can't get \subtitle{hi} to parse...
 
@0celo7 You put it where you put \author and \title
 
1:01 AM
Ofc I did that
undefined control sequence
 
Oh, sorry, that doesn't exist in the standard class you have to use a documentclass like scratcl for that
It's usually really better to typeset the titlepage manually instead of relying on \maketitle when you want more than author and title there
 
@ACuriousMind How does one do that?
(I don't have hours and hours to perfect it manually.)
 
@0celo7 Usually, you just put \begin{titlepage}\end{titlepage} into the document and then create the titlepage inside that like any other page
But if you don't want to be a perfectionist, I'd just use scrartcl instead of article and do the \subtitle thing
 
Does that work with all packages?
 
Yeah, the KOMA-script classes are benign
 
1:09 AM
Cool beans
Does that only change the title?
 
Not only, but you should not notice the other changes, I guess
 
@ACuriousMind Which are?
 
It mostly provides more customization options, which, if you don't use them, default to what you are used to
 
@ACuriousMind If the actual moment of inertia of a pulley is less than what I calculate, is that accounted for in the stretching of the string and friction against the axle?
 
I usually tend to assume my measurement was crap :P
 
1:12 AM
I can't figure out if that which way that swings the error
 
But friction and stretching certainly play some role
 
@ACuriousMind Computer measurement
@ACuriousMind Which way is the problem
 
@0celo7 And? There are still experimental errors
 
I got bigger numbers than expected
I need to know if those errors actually make the numbers larger
 
As I've repeatedly recounted, I once had cylinders rolling down an incline having far too much energy
 
1:14 AM
The $L_n$ operator has no poles therefore $L_n|0> = 0$ for $n \geq -1$?
 
I have to this day no idea what went wrong, probably one of us couldn't read a ruler properly
 
It could be wind resistance as well
temperature
 
We had a compact 25 gram thing
No way air or temp played a 20% role
 
the fact quantum effects took over on such a small thing lol
 
I bet a cosmic string smacked right into the pulley
 
1:16 AM
expansion of the universe and lack of global conservation of energy too
 
@ACuriousMind Quantum fluctuations ;)
 
The fact things smaller than planck level are mini black holes
lol
eating the pulley up
 
Actually not.
Saying that anything shorter than a Compton wavelength is a black hole does not make sense.
I forget the exact argument.
Of course that's probably a hokus-pokus curved spacetime QFT argument.
 
You're forgetting it resides in the 7'th dimension
 
We had some übersymmetry breaking which actually breaks energy conservation.
energon scattering.
 
1:24 AM
@bolbteppa I would not really think about the poles or the plane in that argument. The $L_n$ are the operators that lower conformal weights, and negative conformal weights spoil unitarity, so for a unitary rep you need the action of $L_n$ on the vacuum to be zero, and not an actual state of lower conformal weight.
 
@bolbteppa And the $-1$ and $0$ modes annihilate the vacuum because of the assumed $\mathrm{PSL}(2)$ symmetry.
 
yeah, and 1
But greater than 1?
 
@bolbteppa All positive modes vanish.
 
When you use Cauchy's theorem you mean?
 
@bolbteppa As I said, the positive generators lower conformal weights, and hence spoil unitary when acting on the vacuum with conformal weight 0
(Conformal weight is here simply the eigenvalue of $L_0$, you don't need any complex analysis for this argument)
 
1:31 AM
Okay because $L_0$ is a derivative the $h$ goes to $h-1$ (giving eigenvalue $h$), so when $n > 1$ all the derivatives end up such that nothing turns into $1/z$ so Cauchy's theorem makes them disappear since it's all holomorphic?
 
I don't get why you want to drag the complex analysis into this - it follows from unitarity of the representation and the commutation relations of the Virasoro algebra.
But I guess your argument works, too
 
I don't get what you mean
 
@bolbteppa A state with negative conformal weight would have negative norm
The $L_n$ lower the conformal weight
The vacuum has conformal weight 0
Hence, the action of the $L_n$ must not produce a state in the space for the representation to be unitary/for the representation space to be a Hilbert space, hence they give zero
 
@ACuriousMind (with positive $n$)
 
@0celo7 People who write $n\in\mathbb{Z}$ should be tarred and feathered :P
 
1:39 AM
@ACuriousMind Are you agreeing with me?
I mean, lowering by a negative is raising, but sounds dumb.
 
I'm so glad I spent a year on cft proper and not jump to string theory, fuck this stuff is not easy
 
1:55 AM
@AlanU.Kennington your book looks good
 
Eeek. I was hoping would notice I'm here. To tell you the truth, I'm profoundly embarrassed by the incompleteness, untidiness and sloppiness of my book-in progress. But I hope there are one or two useful "good bits".
I mean I was hoping no one would notice I'm here.
 
I haven't looked at it carefully at all lol but the contents look amazing and the 'philosophy of tangent bundles' thing is on my to-do list
 
By the way, I started off academically doing mathematical physics in the olden days, but I had to drop out and do mathematics instead because I couldn't make sense of any of the mathematics in physics. Now I realise that most of the mathematics in physics is really incomprehensible even if you've done a PhD in mathematics and have researched it for many years. The math in physics is just really, really hard. That's why I started writing a book about differential geometry.
 
Also the comparison to all those other books is awesome
 
Yes, it too me about 30 years to finally work out what tangent bundles really are. The trouble with differential geometry is that it has been continually rewritten for the last 150 years to try to simplify it. But every simplification is inconsistent with all earlier simplifications. So a hug body of inconsistent formalisms has arisen.
I think actually the best thing about my book-in-progress is the table of contents. The actual contents are a total mess. But I am only partly to blame for that. The subject of differential geometry is itself a mess. You have to read the whole history of its development to work out how all the definitions arose from other definitions.
 
2:05 AM
I really don't have time right now to talk about this but I definitely will sometime soon, your book looks like the treasure trove I've been waiting for, I mean you reference Allendoerfer lol
Did you see his proof of the inverse function theorem? It's insane, he gives two and one is crazy
 
1477 pages is quite long o.O
 
Yes, Allendoerfer and Oakley is a stunningly good book. We had it in the olden days for first year math. It is a really crystal clear book, and deep, and broad and fascinating. Someone (like Dover) should republish it.
 
Oh wait, sorry, no Allendoerfer wrote a book on manifolds as well
Yeah that book is great as well!
 
Yes, and 1477 pages is all in A4. So when reduced to normal book dimensions, that will be about 1800 pages. And when it's finished, it will be over 2000 pages. It all started with an attempt to solve a 3rd order Jacobi field, which should have been an hour's work. But so far, I still can't solve this problem. All I wanted to do was extend my PhD results from flat space to curved space. But that has required a complete overhaul of mathematics to try to find out what jacobi fields really mean.
 
I don't see any differential forms as sheets in there em.groups.et.byu.net/pdfs/publications/formsj.pdf but I've barely looked?
 
2:10 AM
Anyway, I have a lot of work to do on Lie algebras, connections on differentiable fibre bundles (related to Gauge fields), curvature, holonomy etc. today. Thanks for the chat.
 
 
1 hour later…
3:38 AM
I'm confused about propagators.
(1) are they part of quantum mechanics and QFT just expands on them or are they a QFT only subject?
(2) Does a propagator act on a quantum state vector (e.g. $|\psi \rangle$)?
 
user54412
propagators (aka Greens functions) appear outside of quantum
 
@ChrisWhite Are all propagators Green's functions?
 
user54412
i won't commit to that without thinking more
 
@bolbteppa Nice link, thanks. That dude got 610 points off one question :D
or rather answer
 
4:33 AM
In both my QFT books I have seen $\phi = \frac{\phi_1 + i \phi_2}{\sqrt{2}}$ and $\phi^* = \frac{\phi_1 - i \phi_2}{\sqrt{2}}$. I am supposed to be able to rewrite the Klein Gordon Lagrangian so instead of $\mathcal{L} = \partial^2 \phi - \frac{1}{2} m^2 \phi^2$, I should be able to write $\mathcal{L} = (\partial_\mu \phi)(\partial^\mu \phi^*) - m^2 \phi^*\phi$.
But that's not what I get
I get $\phi^*\phi = \frac{\phi_1^2 + \phi^2_2}{2}$. And that doesn't equal the first Lagrangian.
I think I am confused about the complex part vs real part.
¡ayúdame por favor!
jajaja
 
4:56 AM
@0celo7 any ideas? On the above?
 
hi @LeandroM.
 
hello
 
congrats, you figured out how to use the chat :-) (that's about all there is to it)
 
I see.
 
Anyway, the reason I didn't edit the question is that there are several different points in it and I don't see how to condense them into one question.
 
5:06 AM
Well... I've seen several questions that have "subquestions" in them.
 
Indeed, subquestions are not forbidden, but they do all have to relate to a single primary question
 
In this particular instance the "subquestions" are there to indicate where the asker failed to progress/what their understanding is.
And indeed they do: the asker wants to know how to use Numerov's method to calculate eigenvalues to a Schrödinger type equation
 
Then the question should say that. "How do I use Numerov's method to calculate eigenvalues...? I've tried X but it doesn't work because Y. I'm specifically confused about Z" (there is where the subquestions come in)
 
Numerov's method, as exposed on wikipedia, is an iterative method for solving initial value problems. So using wikipedia as a source to solve Schrödinger's equation is a bit hopeless because the vast majority of solutions you find won't respect the boundary conditions.
 
Obviously one does not have to use those exact words, but that's a good way to make it clear what the main question is.
 
5:09 AM
Well, that's the point. The question says that.
Specifically, it says " From what I've seen Numerov's method is the way to solve Schrödinger's equation but I don't see how to use it to solve an eigenvalue problem."
 
It's not at all clear that that is the main point of the question.
 
Everything that follows that statement is a question that delineates the asker's confusion and what their prejudices coming into this problem are
 
Everything that follows appears to be multiple questions.
 
Everything that follows are the subquestions.
 
If that's the case, then I don't see any clear main question.
 
5:13 AM
The main question is how to use Numerov's method to solve a Schrödinger type equation.
The following question: "Wouldn't numerically solving the DE just give one solution for a given value of the energy? " <- the asker is saying here that solving a diff eq iteratively typically just gives a unique solution, which is a true statement, and indicates why the asker is confused about this
The one after: "And wouldn't finding those solutions require knowing the energy eigenvalues to begin with?" <- here the asker is saying that in order to use an iterative method such as RK to solve Schrödinger's equation they can't have any undetermined constants such as "E" in there. They have to be known beforehand, or the solutions you find won't respect the boundary conditions.
 
Yes, this is all true, but none of it changes my impression that the question is written in such a way as to make it unclear what the main point is.
If I have time to sit down and go through the comments and edits to revise the question, I'll do so. But I don't know if I will have that time.
(And note that that is not part of a moderator's job. It's something I'd be doing as a concerned high-rep user.)
 
And the one after this: "I've seen some mention of "tridiagonal matrices" being generated somehow, but am not sure what the elements of that matrix would be or how that applies to the problem." <- here the asker is indicating what other information they've heard about solving a Schrödinger type equation via Numerov's method, and that they think it applies but don't know how exactly. This is indeed the case.
Where the asker is going wrong is in assuming that they're supposed to solve the diff eq iteratively, when in fact the discretization of the Schrödinger equation maps a differential eigenvalue problem to a matrix eigenvalue problem, and the fact that there is a second order operator means the matrix to be diagonalized will be tridiagonal.
I understand, but I really think your use of moderator powers to close this question outright was excessive. A simple vote to close would have been enough.
As written, the question is clear enough to me and I suspect to others as well.
 
@LeandroM. there is no such thing as a simple vote to close. Any close vote cast by a moderator is binding.
 
I would edit it myself but I did it once and no dice. I really don't know how to word this in a way that you would find adequate.
I see.
 
I thought the question was obviously enough unclear that I was comfortable closing it with only one other close vote on it.
And I still think it's unclear to the extent that I don't feel inclined to vote to reopen it. If other people do so, then that's fine, it can get reopened by the community or another moderator. But there has been very little support for reopening so far (from anyone other than you, of course).
 
5:24 AM
Of course, the question is now in the dustbin and nobody has seen it.
 
And again, if and when I have time I'll see if I can edit the question into shape.
 
It's hard to get support for something people don't know exist.
*exists
 
It has 151 views and many comments. That doesn't really support your assertion that nobody has seen it.
 
Most of these are mine, refreshing the page to see if anything has changed. The comments also support that the question should be reopened.
 
Views are distinct IP addresses, if I remember correctly.
Also the comments are split.
And the recommendation of the comments is really not my point. I'm not voting to reopen the question in its current form because I don't believe it's clear, and the comments don't change that.
 
5:28 AM
Well, I can guarantee many of those views are mine. There's no guarantee the other IP addresses belong to people with high enough reputation to cast votes to reopen
 
How exactly do you guarantee that?
 
Because I know that I refreshed the page many times.
 
But remember I pointed out that the view counter doesn't count every individual load of the page.
95
Q: How are the number of views in a question calculated?

André PenaI saw it's not just a page views number, because, if I press F5 several times, it won't increase the number of views. They could store my IP address in a table, but wouldn't that make it slow? They would need to query a database one more time for each request.

Repeat views from the same user account or IP address don't increment the view counter.
 
This answer says otherwise.
"This information is saved in an expiring cache entry for about 15 minutes. If a subsequent hit sees the entry is still there it discards the new hit. If it is already gone it allows for a new record."
 
oh, wait, you're right, I missed that part.
OK, well anyway, it's still the case that if you think not enough people have seen the question, there are ways to draw attention to it.
I have to go for now
See you later...
 
5:39 AM
If you're still here
I've tried to edit the question
 
ok well I really do have to run now but I'll look at it asap
(a few hours)
 
K, thanks
 
NB editing is also a good way to draw attention to a question
(to a point, I mean we don't want people editing questions 10 or 20 times)
 
Right, I wouldn't do that anyway
 
 
1 hour later…
7:00 AM
Anyone got any ideas on this;
4
Q: How can I determine the sign of a term in a determinant when the indices are out of order?

Stan ShunpikeI am reading Shilov's book linear algebra. He explains how to compute determinants. Basically, for the plus terms you write \begin{equation} x_{a1}x_{b2}x_{c3}x_{d4}x_{e5} x_{f6} \end{equation} and then permute the left side indices, giving \begin{align} &x_{a1}x_{b2}x_{c3}x_{d4}x_{e5} x_{f6}\\ &

 
7:29 AM
Well, I can always count on you for something interesting to read XD @bolbteppa . I'm still confused!
 
Just do $3 x 3$
@StanShunpike I think you could merge the lines in that link with the lines in this link purplemath.com/modules/determs2.htm
 
 
5 hours later…
12:10 PM
Holy cow! 26 close vote reviews
 
0
Q: Question on nonlinear analysis and mathematical physics on Math SE

DalI don't know if the following post is appropriate for Meta Physics SE; in case it is not, please let me know. Recently I've extended the scope of an old question of mine on nonlinear analysis asked on Mathematics SE. Since the question is very deeply connected to mathematical physics, I thoug...

 
12:41 PM
@StanShunpike Note that the complex scalar field Lagrangian does not have the usual factor of 1/2 present in the real scalar field, cf. e.g. Srednicki Quantum Field Theory Eq. (3.37) or Kaku Quantum Field Theory Eq. (3.35).
 
@0celo7 The 1/2 is only there for bookkeeping purposes (because we have $\phi^2$ for a real field instead of $\bar\phi\phi$)
(not saying you didn't know this)
 
@Danu Exactly. I think Stan was plugging a complex field into a Lagrangian with a factor of 1/2, thus giving him an extra 1/2 at the end.
(I can't reference the post because I'm on mobile.)
@Danu Do you know if it is possible to picture a 3-chain in 3 dimensions? Nakahara says nonchalantly that the torus is not the boundary of a 3-chain. To me that's not obvious.
 
What do you mean by a 3-chain, other than 3 tori being glued together?
 
@Danu Chain in the homology sense, i.e. linear combination of simplexes.
 
Don't know, don't care
 
12:55 PM
@Danu You have no interest in homology?
 
I have no interest in jumping into it head over heels without properly understanding a lot of other things first
 
I'm sorry that I don't have years of time to read countless other books that may or may not help me. I just figured you'd know a little algebraic topology.
 
1:10 PM
Nope :)
 
1:22 PM
Hey, did you guys know that Chat is apparently perceived as arcane and bizarre?
 
1:35 PM
Seems interesting:
 
1:49 PM
@KyleKanos Sounds cool. I'll have to add it to my ever-growing list of books I don't have time to read
 
@Sean I've added it to my Amazon Wish List. Since I'll be graduating in May, I'll be getting the time to read non-thesis related things
 
I'm back with bad news :(
My PhD applications were all rejected
So much for pathos
 
2:06 PM
:(
Sorry to hear
 
Oh, damn man :\
Does that mean you're not going to be doing a PhD, for now? :(
 
@Danu That's a good question
I heard on Monday. I'm not entirely sure what to do now
The funny thing is, I already had a supervisor lined up and willing to take me on at my first choice, UToronto.
 
<3
@Jimnosperm What happened?!
 
Usually, that's enough to guarantee acceptance
But I don't know what happened. All I got was the canned response of "Our applicant pool is of an extremely high calibre, and unfortunately we are only able to accept a small number of students each year....."
 
I see...
 
2:14 PM
That's what I said
 
I thought you were already doing/finished with PhD
Or does 'graduate degree' on your profile mean MSc?
 
I finished my master's. I've been researching and teaching in the meantime
 
Yeah, okay
 
Guess I should change that to no longer say I'm a graduate student
 
Did you get to talk to your potential supervisor yet?
 
2:16 PM
I emailed him. No response yet
 
Urgh :(
 
It's non-ideal
 
Did you try a lot of other places, or just counted on the UT working out?
 
I applied to a few others; UWaterloo, McGill, UBC. But UT was the only one I cared about
And the last to respond
 
When's the next time to apply? Does it work like on a once per year basis there?
 
2:20 PM
Kind of. I can also apply for a January start date since I've done almost all of the necessary coursework for a PhD already
 
Can you just continue teaching/research activities until then?
 
Nah, not enough money. Thinking of working at a bank for now
 
Hmm okay
Keep your head up
 
But I have to find out if it was a funding issue or if there was simply a mix up. If it was a funding issue, then reapplying for January is pointless
 
Whatcha mean funding issue?
 
2:23 PM
Canadian government has been cutting back scientific funding drastically because they're stupid. Nobody has money anymore for new students
 
But even if you (apparently) didn't make the cut this time, there is still a chance you can get in next round, no?
 
Yes. But only if lack of money wasn't the issue. It's my potential supervisor that needs the money. If he can't afford new students, I'm SOL
 
Oh, you think there may just be no money at all for the stuff you're interested in? :\
 
@Jimnosperm Well you could ask if he thinks he's going to get any grants in the near-future.
 
This month was the grant month
@Danu That's the worry
 
2:26 PM
@Jimnosperm Okay, well this can probably be found out. Other options may include different supervisors and/or universities
 
One would hope
 
If it was a money issue, I think he would've let you know beforehand. So maybe there's a mix up of some kind?
 
@alarge Nah, he wouldn't have found out about lack of money until this month. I'd hope he'd let me know, but maybe he didn't. Onthe other hand, his silence could be because he's trying to get the committee to reconsider me and doesn't want to say anything until he hears something
Time will tell
Until then, it'll have to be a bank job. They love hiring physicists
 
Yeah, hope everything goes well.
 
None more than I
 
2:29 PM
@Jimnosperm Do they? :)
 
@Jimnosperm Do you have something lined up already?
 
It's comforting to know that one can always sell his/her soul, if the need arises :D Right, @KyleKanos? ;)
 
@Danu Yes. Physicists are used to applying complicated math to solving practical problems. Most other professions don't do that nearly so well. And they need people who can solve complex differential equations and stuff
 
(also, don't take this as me saying it's lame to work for a bank, it's all meant to be in good fun)
 
@alarge Plan B: Bank job. Plan C: back to engineering
 
2:31 PM
Engineering: For when everything goes wrong! :P
 
Plan D: same as all plan D's, cry
 
Become a physics.SE guru
 
Jim Rennie?
 
@Jimnosperm Going in the name thread!
 
I mean, not to put you down or anything, but I don't think banks really need that many physicists anymore (as there's been a lot of change in the industry after 2007/2008). Being a physicist most certainly does not disqualify you, but you'll probably face tough competition from MFEs, say.
 
2:34 PM
What are MFEs?
 
Master's of Financial Engineering.
 
lol, financial engineering
Must be a misnomer
 
@alarge You say that, but I've looked on a few banks' websites and they have FAQs under the career section that says "I have a degree in physics/applied mathematics. Are there positions for me? A: Yes! We're always happy to....."
 
Hah! :D
 
@Jimnosperm I mean sure, they hire physicists, but the competition is tougher than it used to be, and their roles have also changed. Like 10 years ago you didn't have people who specifically learned the craft.
 
2:39 PM
@Danu IMO: spending 5-8 years getting a PhD to get a career teaching at a salary equivalent (sometimes less) than what people with a BS can make is selling ones soul
 
@KyleKanos I'm just keeping in line with the usual terminology ;)
 
I think the top software companies (like Google) pay similar money as the big IBs (although, hedge funds and prop shops will get you more, but they are much, much more selective as well), so your third choice of becoming an engineer (software, I'm assuming) is not a bad choice either.
 
But really, no offense intended. I think a lot of my friends studying mathematical physics are thinking of getting out of academics before they've "wasted too much time" as well
 
@Danu I know. I'm just trying to change that mentality ;)
 
@KyleKanos I agree. But if I can't get a PhD, my soul's not worth much to me anyway. Might as well sell it
 
2:41 PM
@Jimnosperm Hah, nice 'n' depressing
It's so funny to think about the outrageous standards we judge ourselves by
To physicists, a BSc is like... less than nothing
 
That's because a BSc has almost no real physics in it. It's all just "Oh, how cute. You think you know physics"
 
Go do management consulting. A friend of mine did that (at one of the big three) after spending some time in academia (computational physics) then switched jobs and now is up in the ivory tower of a big engineering company.
 
...but to most people in the world that's further than they ever get.
 
@Jimnosperm: Did you apply to any American universities? (or maybe, more generally, any non-Canadian universities)
 
I'm not saying I personally don't hold myself to these standards, I'm just pointing out that they're way out of proportion.
 
2:44 PM
@KyleKanos No, I couldn't afford to write the GRE and they all require it
 
@Jimnosperm GRE so laaaaaame. It's an absolute disgrace that they require it
 
I've been told some universities are largely ignoring GRE scores, but I'm not sure how widespread that is
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but GRE stands for Graduate Readiness Evaluation. If I already have a graduate degree, isn't that proof enough that I'm ready for graduate studies?
 
Graduate Record Examination
I think
 
damn
 
2:46 PM
@KyleKanos I think especially the famous ones at least have sort of a cut-off (say ~75th or maybe 80th percentile) so they just stop considering you if you go below it
I was quite bummed when I scored 80th percentile on mine :\
Should've done more brainless cramming and stuff instead of trying to actually relearn the material haha
 
@KyleKanos Not very widespread. They require it at least for formality. Even if they ignore it, you have to include your score to even finish the application. It costs me $2000 to write the test. I can't afford that unless I'm guaranteed acceptance
 
Whoa...$2k!? That's insane
 
Yes it is
 
2k?! Wut?! I thought the 350 euros I paid for it were already WAY out of line
How is that even possible
 
I think I paid like $100 (maybe less)
 
2:49 PM
It's not for the test directly. I have a disability and the tests to prove that I require accommodations cost $2000
 
:(
 
Exactly, so US schools are out for me
 
That's messed up
 
yup
 
2:50 PM
Come study with me in Germany
no tuition wutwuuuut
 
No tuition for residents. I think there are international tuitions
 
Plus we've got Mukhanov ;)
@Jimnosperm Don't think so; I'm not German (although I am EU-zone)
 
True story: one of the professors at my MS university said Well if you don't get it, you can always just move to the university you really want to go and sit in on the lectures. If you do well enough there, they might just let you in
 
No it's free for everyone I think
 
@KyleKanos I've done most of the classes for a PhD already
I need just the research and dissertation
 
2:53 PM
@KyleKanos This is actually super common in Asia: you go for one year as a "research student", and then the next year apply for the PhD course. Now the problem is of course money, so people there usually tap into their parents' wallets, but the labs do sometimes pay something for their time.
 
I'm just trying to assemble a supergroup of PSE at my uni
 
Heck, if I thought I could solve this by paying for my expenses, I'd do it. What's going into debt now compared to actually getting a PhD in physics?
 
Jim, @ACuriousMind, me; It'll be great!
 
@Danu What university?
 
LMU Munich
Top 20 in the world in most rankings for physics
I think between 10 and 15 on most
 
2:56 PM
Some countries in Europe have PhD as a salaried position where you basically write a pretty regular-looking work contract, and you can start almost any time of the year. Restrictions may apply (never looked into it) if you're not a EEA citizen.
 
Hmmmm..... My odds aren't much better there than at UT, but Germany is nice
 
@alarge Yeah, I think Dutch PhD "students" are simply university employees, getting health etc benefits and everything
@Jimnosperm The selection for the master's I'm doing was surprisingly easy to get through---I of course don't really know about the PhD though
 
@Danu YEah, My master's was easy to get into too. I found a supervisor, went to the program admin, said "I want in". Two weeks later, I was in
 
@Danu Yeah, the Netherlands was one of the countries I was thinking about, actually, as a friend of mine did his PhD there. I remember the job posting looked almost like any regular job advert. I think there was no admission test, but rather when the professor took him in (and it was his lab who paid him, I think), that was it.
 
@Jimnosperm You don't have a Phd? I never thought the issue was cost compared to time.
 
2:59 PM
This was without a BSc in physics, too
 
@alarge Exactly.
@Jimnosperm Lol okay, it wasn't that easy
 
@Jiminion What? No, they usually pay you to be a grad student in physics around here
 
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