The Bridge

Frank

2:00 PM

@KevinvanderVelden Doesn't it? I've always had an IP contract to sign for all my previous jobs.

MBraedley

@Frank Pretty sure work for hire doesn't need to be explicit.

Kevin van der Velden

>
(1) a work prepared by an employee within the scope of his or her employment; or (2) a work specially ordered or commissioned for use as a contribution to a collective work, as a part of a motion picture or other audiovisual work, as a translation, as a supplementary work, as a compilation, as an instructional text, as a test, as answer material for a test, or as an atlas, if the parties expressly agree in a written instrument signed by them that the work shall be considered a work made for hire. (17 U.S.C. § 101)

Frank

@KevinvanderVelden Might be worth mentioning I'm in Canada.

Kevin van der Velden

Oh I thought america

Work for hire isn't a thing there apparently

MBraedley

2

Q: What part of your work does a company own when you program for them?

Say you're a software engineer, what does the company actually own of your work? Do they own the source code, the binary, both? What about code you do outside of the workplace? Do they have any claim to that? I was just wondering from a legal standpoint how that all works.

legal

4

Q: Intellectual Property for in house development

My company is a sub contractor on a major government contract. Over the past 5 years we've been developing in house applications to help support our company and streamline our work. Apparently in 2008 our president of the company at that time signed a continuation of services contract with the ...

intellectual-property

@Frank I'm sure there's something similar here

Frank

2:05 PM

8

A: What part of your work does a company own when you program for them?

It depends on your terms and contracts. I had to sign a legal agreement on my first day saying what does and does not belong to me. If you signed something like this, it should be on file in legal or HR. If you didn't, you should consult with your HR and/or legal departments to get something draw...

Without it being stated explicitly, I think it boils down to whatever the government says it is.

It's reasonable to assume anything I do during work hours on work equipment is the company's.

But what about if I whiteboard stuff, or mock up some prototypes at home?

That's where things get dicey.

Kevin van der Velden

Yeah

Frank

I figure it's better to just get it spelled out explicitly, rather than having to deal with the legal gray area.

Better for the company, for sure.

Lazers 2.0

0

Q: How are Battlepacks awarded?

How are Battlepacks awarded in Battlefield 1? Are players chosen at random at the end of a match, or is there some skill/merit involved in determining who gets a Battlepack?

battlefield-1

Kevin van der Velden

Yup, I wonder what the laws regarding that are over here

MBraedley

@Frank From what I can tell, the only major distinction between Canadian and American law for this particular discussion is the author of the work. In the US, the employer is often listed as the author whereas in Canada, the employee is still listed as the author. The employer is still often the owner of the copyright. I think that's the de facto state that can be explicitly released, but I haven't seen anything that actually supports that position.

Frank

2:13 PM

@MBraedley Owner of copyright is one thing. Owner of the intellectual property is another, since you can't copyright code.

MBraedley

@Frank You would be wrong in that respect.

Frank

@MBraedley Eh? I thought code was code.

MBraedley

copyright is the only reasonable IP protection available, since you can't trademark or patent (usually) code.

Frank

I don't think copyright is really applicable to the discussion, though.

I'm talking about things I do at home, on my own time, that might be work related.

Yuuki

Well, my professor (of what I assume is the equivalent of computer ethics) said that when in doubt, always talk to your employer about code you write even at home.

Frank

2:17 PM

The company can't copyright concepts I come up with or techniques I use to solve issues.

MBraedley

@Frank But they own the copyright to any code you produce.

Frank

@MBraedley On work time.

Yuuki

Because if you talk to them, worst thing that can happen is they say you can't tell anyone or market it or whatever. If you don't, worst thing that can happen is that they sue you, get the rights, and you have to pay penalties.

MBraedley

@Frank implied

Frank

@MBraedley This is why I want it to be spelled out explicitly. :P

Kevin van der Velden

2:18 PM

@Yuuki law over here is pretty clear in case of an employment =p

Frank

On call, at least, I've dealt with. And that's going to be something I have to bring up if and when they want me to do that.

Yuuki

@Frank Not sure about Canada, but in America, work-related code even written off work time belongs to the company. Or at least the company has grounds to sue for it.

MBraedley

They can't control what you do outside of work, unless it competes with work.

Kevin van der Velden

@Frank Oh yeah, writing code on call has weird edge cases

Yuuki

And depending on how big your company is, even if it's not related to your job at the company, it could be related to the company's interests.

Frank

2:20 PM

@KevinvanderVelden Well, on call in general is massively employee focused, at least here in Manitoba.

Without a company on call policy, getting a call counts as being called in.

And all the fun pay implications that has.

MBraedley

So I have a standard non-compete clause in my contract. That doesn't mean that any solution to a minecraft command block problem or that elevator simulator javascript game belongs to the company.

Frank

@MBraedley Some contracts I've seen state that anything you write, from the time you start there, is theirs. Period.

I had one of those, actually. First actual coding job out of college.

MBraedley

@Frank Yeah, and those are clearly unenforceable and excessive.

Kevin van der Velden

I could never agree to one of those, that's my main hobby

Frank

@MBraedley It also had a clause that said, "We realize that parts of this contract may be unenforceable and/or illegal. In that case, we reserve the right to change it so that it is enforceable and legal, and you retroactively agree to the changes made."

Yuuki

2:24 PM

So my desk chair just broke.

:D

MBraedley

@Yuuki You're happy about this because?

Kevin van der Velden

@Frank that is (fairly sure) also unenforceable and illegal

Yuuki

@Frank At least part of me thinks that's against contract law.

Frank

@KevinvanderVelden Doesn't stop them from trying, though.

Yuuki

@MBraedley Well, I got a replacement that was lying around, so no standing/kneeling at my desk.

Frank

2:25 PM

I caught that after they updated the contract and wanted us to sign the new one. I read that and refused to sign it.

Yuuki

Plus, I didn't fall onto the ground or anything, so no injuries.

MBraedley

So anyways, I did find something about Canadian works made for hire:

> Accordingly, even though it is not a requirement in Canada that an employer stipulate contractually that the employer is the owner of copyright in any work, it is usually wise to set this out explicitly, along with the parameters of the employee’s employment and responsibilities regarding the creation of works.

So employer ownership is implicit.

Frank

@MBraedley So, yeah, it's basic common sense, but a good idea to get it spelled out anyways.

MBraedley

link, btw