/dev/chat

@derobert Ever used the mk-build-deps command? Either it's buggy, or I'm hallucinating. I probably should investigate, but another bug report... Sigh.

@derobert incidentally, Pratchett fan - yes/no?

derobert

@FaheemMitha Yes, I use it. Haven't come across any bugs I've noticed. Of course, I'm sure there are plenty I haven't noticed or come across

@FaheemMitha What little I've read of him, yes. Reading more is on my todo list.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert might be my mistake. I wish I had a robot or an intelligent android to do it for me. AI can't get here fast enough for me.

Of course, if HW is right, this might be in the category of be careful what you wish for...

@derobert Ok. Not really a fan myself, but dislking him is a bit like disliking Big Ben. He's an institution.

terdon

@derobert you might want to change your answer there. ddate should be in util-linux but versions > 2.20.1 < 2.20.1-2 shipped with it disabled. You had to recompile util-linux to get it. See here. So, the OP probably needs to update their util-linux package.

derobert

4:15 PM

@FaheemMitha But what about The Chimes of Big Ben? Can one not like that?

terdon

And move to a site that appreciates fun more.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Sure, one can. But I suspect I am missing your point.

derobert

There was no point.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert How disappointing.

I'd actually never heard of ddate.

derobert

@terdon I have 2.25.2-6 and it's not there.

Faheem Mitha

4:17 PM

Still debating an upgrade to jessie. I'm timid.

terdon

@derobert Oh. I have it on 2.20.1-5.5

derobert

@terdon 2.24.2-1 changelog says "Upstream no longer ships ddate"

terdon

Ah.

derobert

So it's been moved to its own package, it'd appear.

terdon

$ apt-cache search ddate
postgres-xc-contrib - additional facilities for Postgres-XC
postgresql-contrib-9.1 - additional facilities for PostgreSQL
postgresql-contrib-9.3 - additional facilities for PostgreSQL

Faheem Mitha

4:19 PM

Watched a terrible film yesterday called "Lucy". By that Bresson guy. Anyone seen it?

terdon

Yes, Jessie has it in its own package, wheezy ships with it in util-linux

Faheem Mitha

oot@orwell:/home/faheem# apt-cache policy ddate
ddate:
Installed: (none)
Candidate: 0.2.2-1
Version table:
0.2.2-1 0
50 http://httpredir.debian.org/debian/ testing/main amd64 Packages
50 http://httpredir.debian.org/debian/ unstable/main amd64 Packages

Yes, looks like it. Has someone answered it?

Braiam

> Upstream no longer ships ddate

terdon

@Braiam Yeah, derobert mentioned that.

Faheem Mitha

This looks like a programming question, and so is probably off-topic here. It would be on-topic at Stack Overflow. Does your question have any content relevant to Unix/Linux? — Faheem Mitha 2 mins ago

This is called giving people the benefit of the doubt.

Braiam

4:20 PM

@terdon had to battle with the clipboard for a while

terdon

@Braiam Heh, I know that feeling.

derobert

@terdon OP is on Jessie. Says so in the question.

terdon

OK, in that case, I guess your answer is fine after all :)

Braiam

> zsh: command not found: ddate
The program 'ddate' is currently not installed. To run 'ddate' please ask your administrator to install the package 'util-linux'
ddate: command not found

?????

command-not-found you are drunk!

terdon

Are you on jessie?

Braiam

4:22 PM

testing

derobert

@Braiam maybe you need an apt-file update or something, not sure what command-not-found uses

Braiam

apt-file database

derobert

personally I use dpkg --purge on command-not-found

Faheem Mitha

@Braiam file a bug.

But yes, update apt-file first.

terdon

@Braiam If you have an older version of util-linux, it won't include ddate.

Braiam

4:29 PM

@terdon you mean newer

terdon

@Braiam Both.

15 mins ago, by terdon

@derobert you might want to change your answer there. ddate should be in util-linux but versions > 2.20.1 < 2.20.1-2 shipped with it disabled. You had to recompile util-linux to get it. See here. So, the OP probably needs to update their util-linux package.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert I don't know what a semaphore is. Is the poster trying to do something Unixy? And without including any headers apparently.

Braiam

@terdon latest entry mentioning ddate on the changelog says:

derobert

@FaheemMitha yep, that's SysV shared memory

Braiam

> util-linux (2.24.2-1) experimental; urgency=low

[...]
* Upstream no longer ships ddate

terdon

4:31 PM

OK, so you have one of the newer ones. I guess you need to apt-get install ddate.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert no idea what that is. But Unixy is good enough, I guess. And that is a valid program he wrote? Doesn't require any headers?

derobert

@FaheemMitha it needs headers and int main() { ... } wrapped around it

terdon

How do you see the changelog by the way? apt-listchanges?

Faheem Mitha

@derobert Ah. Which header(s)?

Tell him to write a valid program, then.

Braiam

@terdon metadata.ftp-master.debian.org/changelogs//main/u/util-linux/…

derobert

4:32 PM

@terdon /usr/share/doc/*package*/changelog.Debian.gz is where I got it

Braiam

or packages.debian.org/changelog:util-linux

Faheem Mitha

@terdon less /usr/share/doc/pkgname/...

is where it lives for every package.

terdon

Cool, thanks all.

Faheem Mitha

Native and non-native have slightly different formats.

derobert

#include <sys/ipc.h>
#include <sys/shm.h>
#include <stdio.h>
#include <errno.h>

Faheem Mitha

4:33 PM

Thanks.

Braiam

@derobert missing the main wrapper... sounds like he needs to learn C

Faheem Mitha

Seriously, politely tell the poster not to post non-compiling programs.

It's annoying.

derobert

@Braiam Well, sounds like OP compiled it and ran it, so...

Anyway, I put the wrapper and headers in the example—of course, it works for me.

Remember you'll have to run ipcrm -M 0x000004d2 to clean up after it.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert sounds like you should post an answer.

derobert

@FaheemMitha I don't have an answer—OP's code works for me.

Faheem Mitha

4:44 PM

@derobert oh. never mind then.

derobert

I stared at it for a bit, there doesn't appear to be anything wrong with it.

I mean, I could find a way to break it—but not on that line.

Faheem Mitha

@derobert started -> stared?

derobert

@FaheemMitha indeed

Breaking the shmget call is easy—just hit the limit on shared memory.

The others are much harder. And I have no idea how to break the detach, presuming the attach worked.

terdon

@derobert do you think that C question is worth migrating to so? I'll just close it if not. I'm not sure if it passes the crap test.

derobert

@terdon If OP adds in the error messages, then it'll either turn out to be a trivial sysadmin problem (OP failed to mention shmget failed, solution up the limit in /proc) or a question worth migrating.

terdon

4:49 PM

OK, I'll just wait then.

derobert

Yeah. Right now it's unanswerable, AFAIK.

Faheem Mitha

@terdon maybe mark it accordingly, othewise someone else might migrate it.

terdon

@FaheemMitha The only way to mark it is to say something like "This is currently crap and we don't migrate crap. Make it less crap and we might."

Faheem Mitha

@terdon well, a message for other mods, I guess. your call.

terdon

Thing is, at the moment it's even asking two questions.

I am getting more and more incline to just close it...

derobert

4:52 PM

@terdon if you put it "on hold" as unclear, I'd certainly not object. OP needs to clarify. Then it can be reopened (and maybe migrated).

terdon

Yeah, fair enough. I'll do that.

derobert

@terdon maybe upvote my 'which error' comment, or clean up comments—its currently hidden behind the show all comments.

terdon

Done

terdon

6:00 PM

Man, does the twitter bot just choose questions randomly or what?

3

Q: Ubuntu 14 server edition, how to boot into single-user mode?

I'm new in Linux and just have basic knowledge about it. In the past I've tested to boot into single-user mode in some Linux distribution by just append " single" to the boot command. However, I don't know where should I add it in Ubuntu 14, the boot command is actually a shell script. Can anyone...

Nothing wrong with that question, the OP put some effort into it and even found the answer. Kudos to the OP, but what makes it tweetworthy?

Seth

6:13 PM

17

A: How does the twitter bot work?

Looking at the Server Fault and Super User Twitter streams, it looks like each account is set up to automatically tweet a new status every 3 hours. According to this answer by Nick Craver there is a "hotness" algorithm based on views over a certain period of time. (This is probably similar to t...

terdon

@Seth Ah, thanks, I was just looking for that.

It seems to be particularly bad with U&L. Always tweeting uninteresting things.

derobert

-13

A: Community Promotion Ads - 2015

... and yet we're only at -13 this year.

terdon

@derobert Ah, yes, I forgot to vote on that this year.

Seth

"More negative than Server Fault" not sure that's a title we really want :p

terdon

@Seth I'll say!

Luckily, that's nowhere near true.

derobert

6:25 PM

@Seth Only on twitter bots! Other than that, we're much more positive than them.

We'll even talk to people who might not be members of the Monastery.

And $DIETY forbid, even to users.

terdon

@derobert Would that be the goddess of fasting?

derobert

@terdon yes, or of spelling errors.

terdon

:)

Seth

@terdon Yes!

terdon

Of course, that is damning with faint praise...

Seth

6:31 PM

@derobert We're Un*x geeks, we don't need no stink'in twitter bot! Give us a Unix & Linux BBS on the other hand...

(disclaimer: I've never been on a BBS..)

derobert

Hah, I have. Long time ago.

Maybe we need an IRC bot :-P

or finger...

Seth

do we have an IRC channel? :P

derobert

finger @unix.stackexchange.com doesn't work. Unsurprisingly

Now, if we were going to build something crazy, unix.se/nntp gateway

Seth

Why does any weird behaviour always make people think someone is spying on them -.-

derobert

6:50 PM

@Seth I thought it meant there was a virus...

kyrias

9:43 PM

@derobert That’s an interesting idea. I wonder what kind of information from the profile that would be wanted.

terdon

@kyrias Ah, I see you took my invitation :)

kyrias

@terdon I generally keep my chat elsewhere, but I figured it would be worth a try. :)

terdon

It's a useful resource for the site. Especially for issues like what you mentioned on meta.

A few of us live here and you can always ping a mod. Both slm and I are in here very often.

Faheem Mitha

10:20 PM

I'm a bit puzzled by:

161

A: How to install "vanilla" TeXLive on Debian or Ubuntu?

These instructions have been updated for Ubuntu 14.04 and TeX Live 2014, they will probably work on most Ubuntu/Debian distributions. Installation Installing "vanilla" TeX Live is not as hard as you think. Things you will need: An internet connection. About 4 GiB of free space (2 GiB if not i...

Specifically, the part about PATH.

"Now you'll have to add /opt/texbin to your $PATH variable. This can be done by editing /etc/environment"

a) bad idea b) PATH is set in /etc/profile.

@terdon @derobert ??

Tim

I'm a bit puzzled by:

0

Q: permission for accessing files are denied and some sessions are killed

I ssh to a Linux server which runs kerberos. This is the first time I met Kerberos. After some time of being idle or loging out and loging in, I found some strange things, which I am not sure if are created by Kerberos: I was denied to access my files. When I list these files, I see: drwxrw...

kerberos

Faheem Mitha

Never mind, a couple of people in the comments point out that /etc/environment does not work.

See for example:

For those wondering, /etc/environment should be replaced by /etc/login.defs when dealing with Debian, according to tug.org. In this file you can edit your path. — Clément Jul 8 '14 at 21:10

But should /etc/login.defs really be edited, either?

terdon

/etc/environment is probably a better choice. /etc/profile is the best though. Or ~/.profile.

My answer here has been checked by Gilles, so the bit about how /etc/environment is sourced should be correct.

Faheem Mitha

@terdon Does /etc/environment work, though?

terdon

It should, yes.

AFAIK

Faheem Mitha

10:31 PM

@terdon hmm. I wonder if Debian has documented it somewhere. I remember an exchange with a DD many years ago, in a bug where I complained about shell init. He helpfully remarked the whole thing was a mess.

terdon

No idea. I only just found out about /etc/login.defs and it looks like that might indeed also work.

Pretty sure that /etc/environment works though. As does /etc/profile

Faheem Mitha

Personally, I wish people would just use binary packages. It's a bit late to change the whole Unix paradigm.

@terdon Ok. I was going to bring it up on chat, but I think I won't bother.

Since I'm not going to test it myself.

terdon

I think slm once explained it to me in some detail in chat. You might be able to find it in the transcript.

Faheem Mitha

@terdon explained what?

terdon

The sequence and hierarchy of the various files sourced when you log in. In more detail that what I posted in that AU answer I linked to (which is all the detail I know)

Faheem Mitha

10:37 PM

@terdon Oh, I see. I think it might be distribution-dependent, though.

terdon

That's the kind of thing I had explained to me.

Faheem Mitha

AFAIK there is no standard about how these things are done. So everyone does whatever they like. And often fails to document it properly. It's a pain.

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