Language Overflow - 2016-08-30 (page 1 of 2)

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3:57 AM

> In Persian, the decimal mark is called momayyez, which is written like a forward slash

4:18 AM

> The citrate- and phosphate-based compositions were excluded from further study, because aggregation at 6% PEG content indicates insufficient colloidal stability.

I'm not sure how to properly formulate "aggregation at the PEG content of 6%" (could this be better?)

I probably need no comma before "because"

4:45 AM

@DEAD I found it: "Acetic acid ad pH 5.0" - in chemistry, we can use the Latin ad to indicate "up to"

I totally forgot that I asked a question about it on Chem SE

2

Q: Meaning of "ad" in a pharmaceutical patent: "Acetic acid ad pH 5.0"

Can the abbreviation "ad" mean "up to" in pharmacology? I saw a translator translate the Russian line "до pH 5.0" ("pH level up to 5.0") in a table describing the composition of a drug product as "ad pH 5.0". The meaning of the Russian record was "the content of the excipient in the product may b...

(or "I have totally forgotten"?)

5:33 AM

> The positive results are marked with green, the negative results are marked with red.

This is a description of a table with data.

I'm not sure about "are marked with green". Maybe it's better as "are colored green"?

6:12 AM

Sawasdee khrap again!

> The histidine-based samples with pH ranging from 4.5-5.0 and the acetate-based samples with pH ranging from 4.0-4.5 were found to be the most stable.

Can one cut out 'ranging from"?

> The histidine-based samples with pH 4.5-5.0 and the acetate-based samples with pH 4.0-4.5 were found to be the most stable. (like this)

6:58 AM

@CowperKettle Green indicates positive results, red negative.

@CowperKettle Sawasdee khrap!

@JimReynolds Or "Positive results are shown in green, ...", I think.

@CowperKettle You don't need this comma. "aggregation at 6% PEG content" should be okay. I think I'd go with "aggregation at 6% PEG".

@CowperKettle Sounds fine to me. I might use at instead of with, though.

@Araucaria No, it would've been Oh, trousers! (Just kidding, BTW. :P)

7:27 AM

@DamkerngT. A matter of style preference, I think. I strongly prefer plain, simple language (relative to context, genre, the message, etc.). Passive voice sounds more scholarly to some. It doesn't strike me as better here. Indicate replaces are shown in and seems goodly conciser to me.

@JimReynolds I didn't think of it as a better alternative, just something probably more "faithful".

@DamkerngT. Ah. Right!

BTW, good afternoon!

You know, I want to make everything mine. I was also going to change green to gold and red to upside-down italics. A table with some flair!

Haha!

7:30 AM

And hi, yourself.

Emphatic reflexive pronoun!

Okay, hi, me! :-)

:D

7:48 AM

Hi owerflowers!

Hi! @V.V.

8:34 AM

Thank you, @DamkerngT.!

I wonder why

"Within the error margin of the method" would be easier to pronounce than the clumsy "within the margin of error of the method"

@CowperKettle FWIW, this is the first time I've ever seen error margin, so maybe it's something to do with the other alternative being more commonly used.

Wondering of the day: how strong is it when someone calling a person a bigot?

I know it's quite strong, but I'm not sure if it's downright rude. It's probably not.

9:03 AM

Can we screen for something good?

Or is it always for something bad?

In Russian, we can "screen" a series of compositions to find the most stable one.

> We took the following excipients to screen for a stable pharmaceutical composition

But I looked up dictionaries, and am unsure about English

Now I don't know which word to pick in the stead of "screen"

Hmm... interesting. I'm not sure. The main sense of screen for me is like to review, to check, if the subject passes the criteria.

@CowperKettle A simpler word like test should work, I think.

nods

I found "screening for a job"

> To select a stable pharmaceutical composition based on the histidine buffer by screening, we took the following excipients:

9:32 AM

Question of the day: When we personify sun in Persion, we consider it as a female. How is it personified in English, Thia, Russian, and Indian?

@Avicenna Probably male. It depends on context, but either neuter or male.

(I mean, in Thai)

I guess it's the same in India.

user227867

@dam I have 200 rep on ELL, yay!

@JasperLoy Congrats!

10:02 AM

@CowperKettle I will guess. Conceptually, statisticians are concerned more often with whether or not a value lies within a margin or falls outside of it. What defines the margin might be of secondary importance in some sense. Someone might say The car's in the yard behind the house instrad of The car's in the back yard when they are emphasizing that the car's in a yard rather than a garage. Sometimes we stress or spotlight in nuanced and complex ways.

Or there may be multiple types of margins stats people think about, and phrasing this way fits a pattern used to distinguish?

In summary and conclusion: Beats me.

10:19 AM

@DamkerngT. It is generally a strong pejorative. It's often used in the sense of a person who is racist, sexist, etc. I think it carries the attack power of racist. It's a harsh epithet. Whether it's rude is an interesting question. If you call someone a murderer, is it rude? If they are a murderer, is it politer to use a person who deprived another of their life? Yes polite. But people seldom want to be polite when delivering that message. Context. Context.

@CowperKettle We screen to let good or qualified in, and keep bad or unqualified out.

@CowperKettle This is simply an awkward sentence. Try substituting simple, everyday terms for the technical ones, and reconfigure it in a few ways.

@JimReynolds I think you're right. I was surprised to see racist as one of the synonyms of bigot.

I used to think of bigoted as a much stronger version of narrow-minded.

@Avicenna We generally don't personify it. I guess it has been in ancient religions and mythology, but maybe none of them is dominant enough to give a shared sense of gender in general US society. Earth is female.

Thank you @DamkerngT. , @JimReynolds .

10:35 AM

@DEAD he he he

Hi folk

@JimReynolds We do it in our literature works. Mainly in children stories!

Hi @Cardinal!

And also bye @Cardinal!

> Overhead the albatross
> Hangs motionless upon the air
> And deep beneath the rolling waves
> In labyrinths of coral caves
> An echo of a distant time
> Comes willowing across the sand
> And everything is green and submarine.

10:51 AM

Thank you, @JimReynolds!

user image

> (A hand-made Anakonda 2 poster in a Russian movie theater)

> Of all their agony not a sound was heard.
The glory of the Earth is more than they.
She asks her lovely image of the day:
A flower grows, a million boughs are green,
And over moving ocean-waves the bird
Chases his shadow and is no more seen.

@CowperKettle Man, you're digging into some obscure corners of the anthology -- I never even heard of Trumbull Stickney.

@JimReynolds You think I need to go back and footnote my Pr.Pf time expression rule to explain why you can have visited Vermont when the trees were flowering?

11:23 AM

I"m not sure if We've visited Vermont when the trees were flowering is really grammatical, and assuming that it's grammatical, and I understand its meaning correctly, it's an interesting way to phrase it.

I think I'd express the same idea (if I'm not mistaken) with We used to visit Vermont when the trees were flowering.

FWIW, I don't think She's told me this when we met the first time is grammatical.

12:01 PM

@StoneyB I wondered if it violates the rule.

@DamkerngT. If asked, Have you visited Vermont when the trees were flowering? You'd doubt it's grammaticality or its meaning?

Have you travelled around Bangkok before the mass transit train system was built?

Being a non-native speaker, you can degenerate the sentence as far as Had you visited Vermont when the trees is making flowers? and I'd still engage in the conversation more than I'd think about grammaticality. :P

@JimReynolds How about Have you ever visited Macau when it was New Year this year?

12:17 PM

That's possible, but unlikely because of the situation. And partly because the US New Year (holiday) is not an extended period.

nods

Well, hmmm...

Before and when are not the same, I think, BTW.

Have you visited Berlin before the reunification? Yes. Many times.

Have yoy danced in East Berlin when it was controlled by the communists?

Basically, it's indefinite past.

Have you been to Berlin on the first day of the Fall of the Wall, I mean, 9 November 1989? -- I suppose many speakers would think this sounds wrong.

12:24 PM

Well, what was it that @StoneyB said?

Yes. Agreed.

There is something about the time period "so far (in your life)."

That calls for or allows the pp.

And something about repitition or extended sstates or actions.

Yes, I've been several times (so far).

When (past condition) was true.

The leaves turn every year.

> Following the freeze-thaw tests, the impurity content in the compositions containing proline increased by an average of 2%, as detected by SEC HPLC. (is this okay?)

@JimReynolds These are tricky borderline utterances that were discussed quite a bit back in the 80s. Past references are acceptable when the temporal expression (when the leaves were turning, before the train system was built) doesn't really locate the PrPf construction in time but describe the situation which was experienced.

Good evening, @StoneyB! I even asked a question about Stickney's poem once here.

Ben Kovitz fired off two brilliant answers

5

Q: "But that I knew these places are my own" - meaning?

I'm not asking for a literary analysis, I just don't understand the basic literal meaning of one line in this poem (Mnemosyne, by Trumbull Stickney): It’s autumn in the country I remember. How warm a wind blew here about the ways! And shadows on the hillside lay to slumber During ...

sentence-meaning conditional-constructions conjunctions subjunctive poetry

I cannot come up with a way to rephrase this "as detected by"

@StoneyB We must eradicate borderlinishness from English, at least kind of.

user227867

I got two downvotes for my answer on the 'English teacher' question. Although I understand why people might dislike my answer, I cannot think of how to improve it. I posted it because I was unhappy with the existing answers.

12:37 PM

@CowperKettle Found might be better than detected. But I'd repackage the sentence: "After the tests, SEC HPLC found that impurity content (?why not simply impurities ?) in the compositions ... increased by an average of 2%".

This answer is basically saying the same OP is asking. — Josh Part 16 hours ago

(Probably, I think)

user227867

@DamkerngT. Yes, but my answer was the only way I knew how to answer the question. =) And it does indeed answer the question, if you read carefully.

@CowperKettle I missed that one. (And I miss the old days when I could read every question posted.)

@JasperLoy Well, people have different opinions. I'm one of the four, FWIW. ;-)

@JimReynolds Build a wall! And make Mexico pay for it!

user227867

12:39 PM

I think Donald Trump talks nonsense.

user227867

I love the design of this site. Simple but elegant.

@StoneyB Am I right in my guessing that the phrase "I remember" is loaded with a double meaning on purpose?

> "It rains across the country that I remember" vs "It rains across the country (comma) I remember" (i.e. it usually rains there, as I recall)

@JasperLoy Yay!

@StoneyB Thanks a million!

Namaste, @Man ji

Good localtime, everyone!

12:43 PM

I prefer indicating my own time in a greeting, that orients the person on the other end of the web as to my actual time. (0:

@CowperKettle Yah; but you're almost always gonna get some sort of ambiguity any time you invoke memory!

@StoneyB It's a nice wordplay then.

@CowperKettle For you especially, I can say, zdorovo! ;-)

@CowperKettle But "Good evening" and the like invite your hearer to enjoy their time, not yours.

@DamkerngT. Zdorovo bratan!

@StoneyB But it's clumsy to leave the other person in the dark about my time.

12:45 PM

Have a good evening. Have a good localtime

@DamkerngT. Bratan is vernacular for "brother"

Mark the root "bra"

@CowperKettle I guessed right! The two words sound so similar!

(0:

The stress falls on the final syllable: bratan

Ah, unlike one in English!

Hello

12:49 PM

Hello!

Hi!

What's up?

Do we say "The phrase I remember has double meaning" or "The phrase I remember has a double meaning"?

@Mattew Have you visited Vermont when the trees were flowering?, probably. :)

@DamkerngT. What?

What is "Vermont"?

12:51 PM

@Mattew We were discussing whether the sentence is grammatical (note the tenses).

@CowperKettle Either is acceptable; I prefer the version without the article.

@DamkerngT. Oh ok

@JasperLoy I think the essence of the question depends on the meaning of refer to, not the meaning of such as.

@JasperLoy I wish they'd given us a nicer face, though; Arial's sort of bland and unsatisfying, like canned chicken noodle soup. But at least it's not TNR.

I think is "Did you visit Vermont when the trees are flowering?" or "Did you visit Vermont when the trees were flowering?"

12:54 PM

@StoneyB For some reason, TNR used to be beautiful for me. Maybe it still is, but not on screen.

@Mattew It looks like Have you visited Vermont when the trees were flowering? is acceptable.

@Mattew Why do you think the present perfect isn't ok here?

@Mattew Ordinarily, yes. But here the question is probably "Does your life-experience include being in Vermont at a time when the trees were flowering?"

@JimReynolds I think It sounds good here.

@Dam For Buddhists, I'm sure @StoneyB meant lives-experiences.

@JimReynolds Hehe!

12:59 PM

:D

@JimReynolds Probably for cats, too! :)

And Buddhist cats, they really get around, and around, and around ....

Infinity cats!

@StoneyB Wow. I thought it needed the article.

Anyone knows any sites to test my English level?

1:06 PM

And be these juggling fiends no more believed,
That palter with us in a double sense,
That keep the word of promise to our ear,
And break it to our hope.

:)

And isn't a double meaning sort of self-contradictory. (Not that that sort of thing bothers GME much.)

I want a most appropriate English for "जैसे जैसे कहा था ठीक वैसे ही" for writing in this answer.

Actually I want English translation for:

@StoneyB Consider pair of panties, yet a bra.

O.O

> i.stack.imgur.com/ioqpp.png

1:08 PM

@Pandya "I just told" maybe

Oh, no! Two of my favorite battlebots are going to demolish each other!

@Pandya What does it mean?

If anyone expert in both Hindi as well as English then consider to help (translating into English) for i.stack.imgur.com/ioqpp.png

I dunno Hindi lol

From Johnson's Dictionary:

I think @MaulikV can help me.

1:12 PM

user image

<<<<< This Johnson

How did @DamkerngT. 's room become main chat room!

It happened last night!

@Pandya Which is the @DamkerngT.'s room?

@Pandya It's called language shift.

@Mattew LO

1:14 PM

Wow, a kicker won (a flipper)!

Cabin made frozen

@Pandya Link?

O dear: people are showing up. I have to go to work now. Have a great chat.

Language Overflow

This is the main chat room for ell.stackexchange.com. Welcome!

ok thx

Ah this

1:15 PM

@StoneyB Have a great day!

@snailplane has frozen Cabin

@Pandya Everyone agreed that we didn't have much activity in the frozen room, so we moved to this one.

@DamkerngT. ok

Btw, Congratulation! @DamkerngT. for LO

?

Oh, it belongs to everyone. :)

(Typing with one finger on iPad is hard! :-)

I removed star from Cabin and selected LO!

user image

1:19 PM

(My left hand is busy with crackers and chips. :-)

@Pandya Yay!

Next match: two hotshots! One's fram MIT, the other is a flamethrower and vertical spinner!

@DamkerngT. Are you sure it's just crackers and chips? lol

Um, yes!

@StoneyB do you know Hindi?

Hello

Tell me @Pandya what happened?

Is there a SE site about plots, paranormal etc.?

1:31 PM

@MaulikV chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/32002230#32002230 (sorry if my ping disturb a mod)

No problem...good that you pinged me..or else I wouldn't have come to know this!

tell me

@Pandya You can follow it area51.stackexchange.com/proposals/91130/hindi-language

@Mattew already followed

ok

Anyone know a SE site about conspiracy theories?

Hi @MaulikV, seeing you for the first time here. How r u doing? Haven't seen you lately on the main sites either

1:35 PM

@MaulikV can you help me in translating this text into English?

@Man_From_India Yeah! I'm been 'off' for quite some time

Ah, Bhagwad Geeta? @Pandya

@MaulikV yes

Okay, let me try

@MaulikV busy?

wait, lemme try that chant!

it's always challenging to translate Sanskrit! :P

1:39 PM

Why?

You're right but the text I've sent is Hindi not Sanskrit.

the words are in sanskrit!

sarvagya, grathit, ukt! @Pandya

@MaulikV oh! yes

This could be the closest: @Pandya - As God preached about the two 'Dharmas', knowledgeable Vedvyas exactly acquired it in the form of 700 chants called 'Geeta'.

yes @Man_From_India tell me

yeah...busy in some other tasks!

Okay, leaving...gotta go somewhere. @Pandya ping here whenever you need my help! :)

@MaulikV Thanks for help me for that!

1:58 PM

ell.stackexchange.com/questions/102126/… Do you think my question is correct?

2:39 PM

@Mattew Not bad, but I don't know if it's the best word.

Hullo @Maulik! Re-welcome to chat!

3:00 PM

Word of the Day: officiate

\o

o/

How're you doin

Okay, thanks! You?

Great

2 percent hyped for the election now that not much is left.

3:04 PM

Only a few hours away.

I'm getting ready to congratulate Snail and Nathan

Or maybe Snail and Colleen.

Or Nathan and Colleen

Unfortunately, we can't have five more new moderators.

in 2016 ELL Moderator Election Chat, 10 secs ago, by DEAD

379?

3:36 PM

369.

Hey @Cat. How are you two doing?

A very interesting day.

Hullo @V.V.

MAR, how much time is left?Hi.

I read 4 hours.

Will they show tbe results?

0

A: Some vs Little Water in specific cases

If we see grammatically there is difference in both there phrases. As auto_increment siad that some does not indicate any specific amount. I always use some in almost every sentence of mine in my website Examminds, in that case the quantity is not measured. For water you need to be specific as gl...

Spam?

Or what?

Just a bad answer?

3:51 PM

Advertising

His site.

> If we see grammatically there is difference in both there phrases.

Wow...

The site is Indian.

nods

@CowperKettle,privet.

Btw, I imho, present perfect with when...

don't think it is possible.

Namaste, VV!

4:09 PM

user image

(admission.aglasem.com/… via ell.stackexchange.com/questions/87554/…)

> In the following questions, a group of sentences about a single topic are given. One or more of the sentence(s) is/are grammatically incorrect. You have to identify the incorrect sentence(s).

> 11. I) Readability is crucial.
II) Be sure of the font we choose is legible and logical.
III) With all of the newest and interesting typefaces available today, it is tempting to pick one that you think looks "cool".
IV) This can work if you are going for an edgy look that will appeal to a young audience, but your copy still needs to be easily understood.
(a) I and IV; (b) II only; (c) III only; (d) II and III

Answer: (d) II and III

Really?!

What's wrong with III?!

Did you see this?

1

Q: Comma before if and usage of "were"

In equity, however, in proceedings seeking a general adjustment of the co-owners' rights in the property when the co-ownership comes to an end, a co-owner may be given credit for improvements and lasting repairs he or she has made to the property, if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly ...

Nope!

checking it out..

I really like to know the source! Just curious.

First thought, who wrote this??

(But you' e already commented on that. Well done!)

I guess not a native.

4:20 PM

nods

Or a typo.

But in and in again doesn't sound very good.

At all!

I was thinking about your question. Really what's wrong with lll?

I speculated two possibilities (that the test makers, which I think are non-native speakers) may be thinking of, but I can't be sure.

Indian English speakers may be more sensitive to the errors.

Nods!

Maybe the test maker considered and interesting wrong. They may had something like and the most interesting. But I would never choose it as having an error.

@Avicenna Mind reading is hard!

Almost impossible.

What about ll? Because of "of" after "be sure" I think.

4:31 PM

Yes. It should be because of this of.

Personally, I think Make sure is more idiomatic than Be sure in this meaning, but I think Be sure is acceptable.

@DamkerngT. Yes, I agree!

This spam?

-2

A: Some vs Little Water in specific cases

If we see grammatically there is difference in both there phrases. As auto_increment siad that some does not indicate any specific amount. I always use some in almost every sentence of mine in my website Examminds, in that case the quantity is not measured. For water you need to be specific as gl...

@DEAD I wondered that myself, too!

Someone comment please

I'm busy ATM

@DEAD what u mean by spam?

Spam: 1.Not correct, 2. Not good, 3. Both

4:43 PM

@Avicenna See the first flag option

Evening, Avi!

Evening, @CowperKettle!

@DEAD I don't want to get involved, considering the possibilities of the consequences. (I might, if I were less busy.)

:-)

@Avicenna I think I understand the sentence now, and why the comma is used there.

> ... when the co-ownership comes to an end, a co-owner may be given credit for improvements and lasting repairs he or she has made to the property, if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly were no credit to be given.

4:45 PM

It's giving an explanation ?

At first, I thought the comma is better moved to before were.

So?

Reading it a few times, I can see that it's a nested condition.

"if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly were no credit to be given" == "if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly if no credit were to be given"

I'd say a comma is not absolutely necessary, but it helps clarify the meaning.

(At least it prevents from reading the sentence the other way around, like I was trying to the first time.)

if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly were no credit to be given. I have problem with this if clause!

But you can understand this "if the other co-owners would benefit unfairly if no credit were to be given" fine, right?

4:53 PM

Hi.

Yes, stranegly fine!

Amazing Cornel West Speech at Green Party Convention

@JimReynolds Hi!

@Avicenna They have the same meaning, the were no credit to be given is an inversion.

At 3:19 and if you don't do something about it the ??? are gonna cry out?

And when you love everyday people, in the language of Sly Stone, you hate the fact that people are being treated unjustly. You loathe the fact that they're being treated unfairly, and if you don't do something about it the (?) are going to cry out.

4:56 PM

@JimReynolds I'll watch the video later. (not very convenient for me right now)

Thanks

@DamkerngT. Oh, right. I didn't notice the inversion. Thanks. :-)

Gotta go for now. o/

@Avicenna No problem!

@JimReynolds Sure!

@JimReynolds It's English and you have problem with it! I always thought these stuff are proplematic just for us, nonnatives.

@DamkerngT. Good night!

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