Language Overflow - 2016-01-31 (page 1 of 2)

« first day (226 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (3023 days later) »

5:53 AM

@Araucaria's question here has me energized! What's a sentence? What's a complete sentence? Any simple answer seems a created one to me.

6

Q: Is "A Star Shoots" a complete sentence?

A star shoots. I read something like this somewhere. Can this be thought of as a complete sentence? How does one analyze this, grammatically? It looks as though it is missing some phrase. On the other hand we do say shooting star, so it isn't very clear if this is a complete sentence or not.

complementation transitivity complete-sentence

Er, I mean Araucaria's answer, comments, and bounty have energized me.

Breathes into paper bag--for six hours!

6:27 AM

Hey. :)

Hi lek

Help me out with something.

I was walking about the entire house.
I was walking the entire house.

Is the latter grammatically correct, and mean the same as the former?

It would be seen as grammatical by many experts, in my opinion.

We would be less likely to use that exact wording, however, as you probably know.

Wait. I realized something.

I think we tend to use walk the place to have a special meaning.

As in patrol or to check thoroughly.

I could counter that concept.
I've seen people use, "walk the streets", like "I was walking the streets the other day."

Yes. I was just getting started!

My point is just that both are grammatical, but we would tend to choose one over the other to communicate different meanings of walk, at least sometimes!

6.
to go about on the earth, or appear to living persons, as a ghost:

6:35 AM

of course you were. xD
I should've known. xD
Go on.

The murdered grandmother WALKS THE HOUSE TO THIS VERY DAY

I think that would be idiomatic, so to wander.

Wander the streets.

Walk about the streets. Also fine, though, and with the same meaning, generally. It seems to my "ear".

So, do you have a particular issue for some communicative purpose, or are you mainly interested in the wider concept at this point?

(of a tool, pointer, or pen of a recording device, etc.) to glide, slip, or move from a straight course, fixed position, or the like:
*A regular drill bit may walk on a plastic surface when you first try to make a hole. When the earthquake started, the pen on the seismograph walked all over the paper.*

concept.
:p
I'm usually using the internet 24x7, so i often come across certain sentence constructions that intrigue me. :P

These definitions and now the example, are from dictionary.com

I think those two examples would be strange, at best, if we just said drill bit may walk a plastic surface or ... the pen walked the paper.

:-)

We walked the fields.

The first thoughts that come to my mind are for some purpose, like to inspect.

okay.
How about this.

He was walking on the sidewalk the other day, and i bumped into him.
He was walking the sidewalk the other day, and i bumped into him.
He was walking about the sidewalk the other day,........ .

Should i take it that all the above three sentences mean the same.

?

Number two is questionable.

6:42 AM

why do you say so?

I suppose that something like the following is in operation:

Most commonly, when we use walk with a direct object, we are taking the object for a walk!

I walked the dogs.

Perhaps, and I'm just theorizing here, we would tend to avoid a similar pattern unless it's somewhat idiomatic: a familiar expression like walked the streets.

When I read "was walking the sidewalks" I get a ?? feeling!

Yes!
I see now.
It didn't occur to me till now how we use walk with a direct object.

It seems unnatural, uncommon, strange. Though I don't think it can properly be called ungrammatical.

i see how inserting a preposition that follows the object would be a better choice to go with.

In contexts where a reader won't be confused, I might not notice it as strange.

But there are certain expressions that tend to leave it out.

To walk the building would be a standard phrase that would be meaningful between two security guards working in a building.

And I am quite sure they would choose that expression over "walk around/though the building"

grammarphobia.com/blog/2014/02/line.html

6:48 AM

So, it basically depends on the what situation we're in, and other aspects concerning the situation we're talking about.

i'll check that link out right away.

Yes. At least sometimes.

give me a few minutes, i have some other doubts.

Ha! He walked the streets and He walked about the streets seem to generally have about the same meaning. I think the first would be more common because it's earned a reputation as a somewhat set phrase.

Of course, situation would usually provide a lot of information to guide our interpretation and our choice of constructing messages.

@V.V. Hi

There is an idiom: "to walk the line". I think someone on a language forum has defined it well:

forum.wordreference.com/threads/walk-the-line.102569

See Hairbrain's answer, particularly.

A classic US American song: "I Walk the Line" by Johnny Cash

Johnny Cash - I Walk The Line 1958

Yes, i've heard it. xD
And i went through the forum as well.

You are all over it.

7:02 AM

xD

oh.
here's something.

Preparing self.

Is it too much to ask.
Is it too much to ask for.

What's the difference between the two?
Would the former be grammatically incorrect?

The former is much more common.

Both are ok.

If i asked for your number, would it be too much to ask for?
If i asked for your number, would it be too much to ask?

i see. :3

#2 is much more common

7:08 AM

yes, i see people using that one way more.

What occurs to me is that if we are talking about an amount, we would more normally use for.

I want a raise of $XX. I'm going to talk to my boss tomorrow. Do you think it's too much to ask for?

I see.

If i asked for your number, would it be asking too much?

Another choice.

another thing that interests me is how we often omit certain words from constructions of sentences.

A complicated topic.

And I'm not sure if there's much guidance on how to learn, except getting a lot of exposure to authentic language.

7:13 AM

Yup.
I've had a lot of practice playing guitar.
I've had a lot of practice with playing guitar.

is the first one correct?

Yes

I'm going to practice guitar now. OR I'm going to practice the guitar now. OR .. my guitar!

O.O

the first one is what i'd go with. :3

I think there might be some AmE/BrE difference with the or [no article] in front of musical instruments.

Anonymous

For isn't omitted. It's just another way ask can be used: You're asking a lot of me.

Interesting correction!

7:14 AM

i know. xD

Well, clarification.

i just asked that because i felt the for at the ended wasn't needed. :P

It corrected my thinking, I suppose.

:p

it's like how people use "Where're you at?"

Anonymous

That's different.

7:16 AM

As a non native speaker, certain constructions just gain my interest. :p

Anonymous

That's great! Happens to me, too :-)

:)

@JimReynolds thanks for helping me out so much as you have.
I really appreciate it. :)

I'm going to have to take a leave now, for chopped of leaves, and other green stuff have been served to me in the name of lunch. :3

off*

We'll leave you to your leaves then.

Anonymous

Do you play (the) guitar, Jim?

No. I had piano lessons briefly, as a preadolescent.

I think I could be ok if I took it up again. The guitar ... it's like I've decided that it would be beyond my capacity. I have no idea why!

Stupid preconception, really.

7:29 AM

I thought it was always the guitar.

The guitar is actually not very hard to learn to play at basic level. (or "the guitar"?)

Good morning all! (0:

I guess it's more of a free choice for US Americans, then. Can you play guitar? I have to practice piano, then I can play outside.

1 hour later…

Anonymous

8:53 AM

@JimReynolds Anyone can learn to play! :-)

Anonymous

A lot of people think they can't learn to play, or only children can learn to play the guitar, but it's not true.

Anonymous

@CopperKettle Good morning!

I learned to play in the late 1990s. I bought a multimedia learning course on a CD, and went as far as "Take Five", but not as far as to play chords to accompany singing. (0:

Then I learned to read music notation and memorized four or five simple pieces for the piano. That was all. (0:

@snailboat The very top of the morning, Snails!

9:57 AM

If someone is just a user in ELL, will they be notified if I ping them in here? Is there a way to invite someone to chat beyond using a comment on a post?

10:23 AM

@JimReynolds,hi,

Hi! I'm running out the door right now, but I was thinking of encouraging you to post an answer for the "least consequence" question!

We can help you make your answer pretty in here, if you'd like! :D

Anonymous

@JimReynolds Not for regular users. You can only ping someone who's been in the current chat room recently.

@JimReynolds,Pin when you are back,we will discuss that

@snailboat, hello, how are you?

I'm here. In a taxi and so maybe on and off, but we can make some progress!

@snailboat Thanks!

10:43 AM

@JimReynolds, I 'd rather not answer that question because it's not interesting. The expression just coincides with that in my language, so I even don't have to consult a dictionary. But the other guy mentioned something about the structure which deserves more attention.

It isn't -I meant.

I left comments only because I thought they would close the question and the poor asker would never know what it meant.

See you later.

Anonymous

@V.V. I'm doing well this morning, and you? :-)

11:06 AM

Yes,wonderful weather after severe frosts, you remember.

I am fine, thanks.

@V.V. I understand. I guessed you were being shy!

@Araucaria I'm not sure how to best proceed with the discussion in the comments. In here, or our own chatroom?

11:40 AM

0

Q: There are _ beautiful flowers,wish I could have brought camera

There are ____ beautiful flowers, wish I could have brought camera Answer options given: many so such all My Approach: b) to show extreme feelings or an opinion about something I have used such rather than so because so is used to show fact (usually with a result or con...

sentence-construction

Sometimes I wish we had another close reason: "the example sentence in the question is not well-formed"

> There are __ misformed sentences, wish I could have another close reason.

:D

(0:

12:21 PM

Though I didn't downvote (yet), I don't think this question fits ELL, and perhaps it's better to be posted at a stack or a discussion forum that is specific to that ORM software. IMHO, the programmer (whoever wrote that piece of code) overlooked something. — Damkerng T. 23 secs ago

People shouldn't believe anything a piece of software tells them more than themselves, whether that piece of software is deterministic or stochastic.

(Yes, I mean all grammar checkers out there, too.)

When I have a chance, I sometimes look into the inside of such code, to see how things work. It's like "show me your guts", and most of the times I find myself thinking (about that code), "your guts are not that great".

So, I'd say we should be aware of the limits, how far we can trust them those codes.

Argh! Can 'code' be in the plural?

@DamkerngT. Limit questions are usually hard in exams.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. That's another kind of "limit"!

@DamkerngT. I'm just saying that I'm aware of the limits.

Hey, my first meta.SO post didn't go too bad.

My first first post on an SE (sub)site that's not crap. O_O

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Yay! (But where is it?)

7

Q: Two tags pointing at the same thing: [farsi] and [persian]

Excuse my ignorance for not coming up with a punny title unlike many meta posts about tags, but I'm a native speaker of Persian/Farsi and I just noticed that both the tags persian and farsi exist and I have no clue why. "Persian" is the English translation of "Farsi". (The article proceeds to dr...

discussion synonym-request languages

12:32 PM

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. Oh, I wonder if there is thai on SO!

There is!

There we go . . .

Wait, what?

Burninate both! — bjb568 16 hours ago

5

A: Two tags pointing at the same thing: [farsi] and [persian]

Both tags do not help to categorize questions. The same is true for all other real languages like French or Polish.

O?

(scratching head)

P.

Well, I'll leave it to them. My only job is to catalyze.

I think some software problems are language-specific.

I think I agree.

You can always come help catalyze @Dam. (IOW comment)

12:37 PM

Now I have to check the scope of SO.

It's about all the programming crap in the world.

Large waste basket.

"Stack Overflow is a question and answer site for professional and enthusiast programmers."

nods -- So language-specific problems in programming should be relevant.

@Dam you sure you'll find anything useful in [tour]? :P

:D

There's no kit-kat. ಠ_ಠ

12:41 PM

Okay, I pitched in with my idea.

In my humble opinion, some software and programming related problems are (human/natural) language-specific. In other words, questions tagged with a (human/natural) language tag are not necessarily unhelpful. — Damkerng T. 1 min ago

In my humble opinion, your humble opinion is humbly well-phrased in that humble comment.

Oh no, @BJB's here.

How close are Farsi, Dari, and Tajiki?

Mmm

Does my question make any sense?

A lot, kinda.

@DamkerngT. Yeah, if the question "how close are British and Martian English?" makes sense.

12:48 PM

Hah!

Do we have Martian English?!

Since when have we colonized Mars? I must've missed it!

So well, for the case of Farsi and Tajiki and Dari, it's like three dialects that now have changed a bit so they're not as distinct as three languages, but are not as close as two dialects either.

Hmm... interesting...

@DamkerngT. @JimR is a native speaker of Martian English. Ever wondered why he's so incomprehensible?

Can a Tajiki and a Farsi speaker talk to each other without any problem?

Yes, Tajiks are quite proud to carry basically the same language.

12:50 PM

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. A-ha! That's why! :P

It's like ((BrE-AmE)/2 + (Farsi-Thai)/2)/2.

o_O

چه اشکالی با مریخ خبر؟

Confusingly understood

O_o

12:51 PM

@DamkerngT. After 5 minutes of talk, yeah.

@JimReynolds I wouldn't trust GTranslate if I were you.

"What's wrong with going to Mars?" (0:

@CopperKettle Well, I translated the gibberish he wrote to mean "What problem with Mars news?"

That's not Google Translate. It was my cat walking on a piece of paper. I transcribed it.

(0:

So I can completely understand an Afghani (usually their leader talks and stuff aren't translated at all when aired on our shows) but I'll prolly die laughing at him @Dam.

12:54 PM

Haha!

Hah!

@Cop's cat read my cat's writing!!!

Ha!

Wait ... we have yet another cat in here, and it's not even cat. OMG

The thing is, to someone speaking Persian, Afghani sounds a bit "squashed".

12:55 PM

@JimReynolds Horatio Nelson doesn't speak Farsi.. (0:

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. :D

@JimReynolds @BJB is as pure a cat as it gets.

@Ϻ.Λ.Ʀ. An interesting way to put it!

My error.

Hi @bjb568 Mar said you are as pure a cat as it gets.

I assume you have blocked him, so I'll tell you what he says sometimes.

O_O

12:56 PM

As a public service, I read his comments and relay them to others when I think people need to be warned.

O.-

An ax suddenly falls on @JimR's head

An ox suddenly falls on Jim's head O_O

I'll be AFK for a few. An ox fell on my head at a terrible time.

If I had had time to remove the ax, things might have gone better for me.

@JimReynolds Yay! We have saved the day.

0_o

user image

1:01 PM

Did that fall on my head, too?

No.

It's supposed to resemble something familiar

Am I missing a reference?

I just learned about fubar foo fuz quz quzz or whatever they are, because of your reference on your little meta post.

Now, I think I truly know everything! Thank you!

Hmm...

You are right: "If this had been full, that would have been really badass" is the standard way of expressing what is meant here, and that is the use you should employ. But in Real Life Conversations people don't pay as much attention to these things as we do on paper. Moreover, the whole system of realis/irrealis expression appears to be in the middle of what may turn out to be very far-reaching change. — StoneyB 10 hours ago

0

A: Conditional mixed vs past conditional

"If this were full" is a use of the subjunctive mood to express unreality (It isn't [N.B. present tense] full but if it were). You would not say "It isn't full but if it was". However, "If this were full, that would have been really badass" is wrong. It should be "If this were full, that would be...

I didn't expect that...

"If this were full, that would have been really badass" sounds perfectly natural to me.

It goes well with my here-there hypothesis.

Maybe I should watch the clip.

Ahh... I see.

What, they want a more perfect tense?

As it were?

Also, who let the cat in?

Oh no. Hides

I promise the cat will promise to behave itself/himself/themselves/herself.

1:13 PM

You have to clean the litterbox.

@tchrist After watching the clip, I think "If this were full, that would have been really badass" is perfectly natural, but "If this had been full" is probably more technically correct.

I doubt I would have remarked on it in real life.

nods

1:39 PM

@tch Can you comment on why this is off-topic?

12

A: Shortest complete sentence in English

It is said both the longest and the shortest sentence comes from the wedding ceremony: I do.

@JimReynolds haha I am ;)

@Man_From_India Delicious to see you!!

@JimReynolds It was closed as Not constructive.

But I just met an accident...my car totally crashed. The front portion, luckily nothing happened to me.

Because, it's sort of like, What's the one true religion?

1:41 PM

@Man_From_India s/met/had/ || s/met/met with/

Jim nice to see u after a long time. @tchrist u too. How r u guys are doing?

Well, that great, and terrible. Sorry about that.

Glad you are ok.

@Man_From_India Oh, no!

@Man_From_India s/ u / you /g && s/ r / are /g

You're okay is the best news!

1:42 PM

I'm in a perl coding trance, to be perfectly frank.

@DamkerngT. Definitely.

I don't know what happened. But I couldn't stop the car instantly :(

Was it a low-impact collision?

@tchrist haha

Ice storm?

Oh no....actually the bus before me suddenly changed track, and halted for some reason unknown :(

The driver said it's some stray dog just jumped before the bus

1:46 PM

Obviously the same stray dog that causes every accident that would otherwise be a bus driver's fault.

That's a busy dog, and wide-ranging.

Did your airbag deploy?

No fortunately....the glass is intact. engine is ok too. only the passenger door jammed. And the bonnet crushed. Head light smashed.

If the airbag didn't deploy, the crash probably wasn't too severe (to yourself). And that's good news too, imo.

I mean there was no need of air bag. everything inside is fine

Yay!

I don't know if there is any saying in English for this kind of event, but in my first language, we'd say something like, "The car got it for you."

1:50 PM

But my legs were shaking long after the impact. Never experienced anyhting like this other than in movies :P

Adrenaline, perhaps. :D

@DamkerngT. I know what you mean :-)

-2

A: Is "A Star Shoots" a complete sentence?

The verb SHOOT, meaning "to move very fast" - for example like a star across the sky - has a different grammar from the SHOOT meaning "to fire a gun". SHOOT meaning "to move very fast" requires a Locative Complement telling us something about the place the thing is shooting to. This means the v...

this is really strange that this got downvote :O

Let's decrease the number of down-votes. :-) I actually agree with this answer.

Obviously, some people think "A star shoots" is a complete sentence, and some don't.

I actually don't quite agree with the answer, though I agree with several things in the answer.

(Not my downvote, anyway!)

:-)

Hmmm what you think about that sentence?

I think it's grammatical, though we may have to be careful when we use it.

Some real examples:

18 hours ago, by Damkerng T.

> And lo ! the joy that cometh with the morning,
Brightly victorious o'er the hours of care !
I have not watched in vain, serenely scorning
The wild and busy whispers of despair !
Thou hast sent tidings as of heaven. -- I wait
The hour, the sign, for blessed flight to thee.
Oh ! for the skylark's wing that seeks its mate
As a star shoots ! -- but on a breezy sea
We shall meet soon. -- To think of such an hour !

19 hours ago, by Damkerng T.

> Great fire-balls darted across the firmament leaving luminous trains, while others seemed stationary for a long time. Scientists and others who ... Not a star shoots nor a sparrow falls without his knowledge.

1:57 PM

In another answer it refers to some dictionary usages. And there also it says the verb when used intransitively should have some prepositional or adverbial complements.

And in corpus also I have seen such thing.

nods -- That's why I think it's a fair warning in several answers under that question.

I disagree completely.

@DamkerngT. Ornament.

It's a perfectly fine sentence.

12

A: Shortest complete sentence in English

It is said both the longest and the shortest sentence comes from the wedding ceremony: I do.

LOL

« first day (226 days earlier) ← previous day next day → last day (3023 days later) »

Transcript for

Jan '1631

Language Overflow

This is the main chat room for ell.stackexchange.com. Welcome!

join this room
about this room

00:00

06:00

12:00

18:00

all times are UTC

site design / logo © 2024 Stack Exchange Inc; legal

mobile