The Nineteenth Byte - 2014-10-09

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1:00 AM

You'd think TMZ would be free of that, but then again, they have the same parent company as CNN (TimeWarner). It's my understanding that CNN has learned a few things about reporting from TMZ ;)

1:54 AM

@MartinBüttner I wouldn't say really really good. Maybe about 5% of the way to complete mastery. (For Vim, that's saying something :D)

5 hours later…

7:23 AM

@EricTressler Thomson-Reuters? You could argue that the Reuters part is British, but the conglomerate is headquartered in NY.

sup

oh

you may be right; I hope you are

I just hate to see the decline of the fourth estate

Dewey defeats Truman -> Is your toothpaste KILLING YOU?

So what you're saying is that the accuracy hasn't changed much, but the headlines are more sensationalised? ;)

7:53 AM

@PeterTaylor I guess my new platform is that you are mean

but yeah, it's always happened. and it's always alarming

it would be so gratifying if there were an independent american news source

2 hours later…

10:20 AM

@EricTressler: I frequent zerohedge.com for market news (there are also numerous pieces on Ebola, various wars, the ECB, etc.), but they sensationalize things too. Also, their servers are based out of Belgium, so I'm not sure they constitute an "American" news source.

Sad to see the decline of the MSM, both in terms of quality, honesty, and viewership/readership. I admit I can't watch US news. The pap they feed us up here isn't much better.

At least "Ebola is Coming" smeared on a wall in blood isn't Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, or a five-year-old hanging from a woman's breast, or "America's First G…

@VisualMelon: RT has some good articles. The Guardian out of the UK is hit and miss, but they have some good articles too.

11:09 AM

@COTO thanks, I'll check out zerohedge. al jazeera is actually very good typically, but I live around a bunch of christian fundamentalists, and they think the very name is trying to attack them

"Al Jazeera? I will defuse it!" -idiots

@COTO aye, Guardian seems reasonably independent, but I don't like it's writing style much of the time. As long as you ignore anything about Eastern Europe RT is pretty reasonable in my rather limited experience, BBC gets on my nerves

I was under the impression that American news is mostly entertainment these days, anyhow

1 hour later…

12:46 PM

@VisualMelon That's... pretty accurate. The problem is the large portion of the population that thinks it's still news.

2 hours later…

Martin Büttner

2:33 PM

ah, finally someone gave that a go: codegolf.stackexchange.com/q/38653/8478 ... I was thinking about doing a "square the circle" code-challenge (for accuracy) before...

@EricTressler: I've got some fundamentalist Christian in myself, but I don't mind Al Jazeera. ;)

@VisualMelon: It seems as though "all entertainment" is what they're shooting for, but the programming isn't even entertaining. The reporting is myopic, perfunctory, and absurdly repetitive. It's no coincidence that many of the late nite laff shows in the US parody the MSM news format.

@MartinBüttner: Could be interesting. I wonder if that LOGO library in Python would be up to the task. IMO that thing will murder any other language when it comes to drawing simple primitives.

3:23 PM

I can edit posts on my own, but I can't approve edits by others. I wonder why that is.

githubphagocyte

@Rainbolt you're considered highly responsible but also highly suggestible? That sounds an odd combination...

That's... odd. Those two privileges definitely come at the same time.

@Geobits Ok what I meant to say is, I can't be the sole approver of an edit. It requires two reviewers.

I can suggest edits with zero approvals, but to approve an edit requires a second.

githubphagocyte

3:38 PM

Perhaps it is expected that we will pay more attention to our own edits, but be more likely to skim over someone else's edit and miss something problematic.

Oh, that. It's probably in place solely to stop robo-reviewers :P

That is sad :(

I agree with github, though. Even without the robo-reviewer issue, people probably do pay more attention to their own edits than others in general. Even if it's not a conscious decision, there's a certain "ownership" aspect to it.

githubphagocyte

3:54 PM

@Geobits there's also more accountability - I can't easily see who approved an edit so if there's a mistake the editor will be the one who gets blamed :)

To be fair, if there's a mistake, the editor should take most of the blame. The reviewers might share a bit of it, but...

githubphagocyte

4:19 PM

indeed :)

5:17 PM

I, for one, welcome our new cetacean overlords.

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Ruler-and-Compass Triptych code-challenge geometry graphical-output (ruler-and-compass? There's this, and there might be some future challenge ideas like this.) The ancient Greeks used only two tools to do geometry: an unmarked ruler and a compass. With those only a very limited number of "oper...

Martin Büttner

@Geobits remind me, what's that a reference to?

Originally Empire of the Ants, but made popular by The Simpsons. knowyourmeme.com/memes/…

Martin Büttner

thanks

I think I've heard it with "crustacean" somewhere

Soon, however, we will see roving bands of murderous orcas and dolphins working together to upset the human dynasty. Then these pop-culture references will be meaningless.

Martin Büttner

5:24 PM

heh

there's a really good German biothriller about oceanic life declaring war on humanity

it sounds a bit ridiculous like that, but it's actually scientifically fairly sound

Sure, but biothrillers often sound ridiculous. Michael Crichton made a fortune on that principle :P

Martin Büttner

amazon.com/The-Swarm-Novel-Frank-Schatzing/dp/0060859806/…

amazon oneboxes? o.O

First I've seen of it. Sweet.

Martin Büttner

in Germany it's actually one of the most popular and successful thrillers/books of that decade I'd say

I may have to check that out. Looks interesting, and I need something to do while breeding Eevees >_>

Martin Büttner

5:28 PM

lol

have you guys seen the comments on this?

4

Q: Anti-aliased ASCII Aureoles

Consider the following ASCII image of five concentric anti-aliased ASCII aureoles: ........ .@..............@. ..... ..... .@.. ...@@@@@@@@... ..@. .@. ..@@.. ..@@.. .@. .@. .@@. ........ .@@. .@. .@ ...

code-golf ascii-art kolmogorov-complexity

I'd love to jump in, but it seems like my English isn't quite good enough... at least I can't come up with anything meaningful at the moment ^^

F, huh... what's the SE policy on swearing again? :P

Martin Büttner

hehe

5:44 PM

Okay, F submission added.

Anyone following me gets a free @Geobits for G

New Sandboxed Posts

5:59 PM

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Golfing the Core code-golf python Note: although this is tagged as Python, other languages are permitted Challenge What you have to do is write the shortest functions to perform the same actions as the following Python 2 built in functions: Range >>> range(1, 10) [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9] >>

1 hour later…

New Sandboxed Posts

7:07 PM

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Swipe Type The next revolution in typing on laptops was released on the first of April, 2014 by SwiftKey. However, I want to be the first person to write a swiping nano clone, but, as I can't find a good swipe-ascii to text library, and I can't wait for them, I'm asking here. Task Write a prog...

7:20 PM

Anyone think 'Golfing the Core' is good enough to post?

Martin Büttner

@BetaDecay what error should be thrown upon invalid input?

You didn't respond to any of the output format questions I asked.

Just leave it for a bit. The sandbox isn't generally supposed to be an hour-long thing...

3

hi

I would like to pose a challenge that takes as input a photograph of real puzzles pieces jumbled on a white background and then has to output the puzzle piece put together properly

is that too much for this site?

@Geobits I edited the question to account for your questions.

hi @BetaDecay

7:32 PM

@user2179021 Hey!

do you think my challenge would be interesting?

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 possibly

maybe I should set where's wally first :)

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 I think that's been done but got only trolling responses due to bad spec

you could then sell it for 99 cents as an app :)

@MartinBüttner the puzzle one or the where's wally one?

7:34 PM

@user2179021 That seem similar to the recent picture-stitching challenge, but far more complicated. For an actual photo, you have to account for perspective, reflections from light sources, arbitrary piece shape/rotations... I'd pass.

Martin Büttner

if someone does Calvin's rice one (meta.codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/2007/8478), we might find out. that's basically a simplified version of your idea

@Geobits well yes and no. I mean we would need a nice scoring function so it's not 1 or 0

@Geobits so you get some points for having some of the pieces in the right place

Martin Büttner

8

Q: Can you find Waldo?

Where's Waldo is a searching game where you are presented an image of some scene, and your goal is to find a man named Waldo in the picture. Here are a couple pictures showing what Waldo looks like. He always wears a red and white striped sweater and hat, blue pants, brown shoes and hair. He can...

@MartinBüttner I see

That doesn't make it less complicated, just less impossible :P

7:36 PM

I suppose I could use just one puzzle and just say I will move the pieces around

@Geobits :) There are lots of lovely libraries these days too

which take a lot of the pain away

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 then it's going to be hard to draw the line between hardcoding and input-specific optimisation

so how about having it for one puzzle and just moving the pieces around for the tests?

Martin Büttner

s/hard/impossible/

@MartinBüttner why is that? There are an infinite number of ways of moving the pieces around

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 but the desired output is always the same

therefore it doesn't even technically depend on the input

7:39 PM

@MartinBüttner oh I see.... ok so I can improve this

ok how about this. The piece when correctly arranged are labelled 1 to n

you take the jumbled pieces image as input and label the pieces in the jumbled image with the number 1 to n

numbers

you get a point for every correct label

Martin Büttner

as I said... we should try counting rice first. that's a simpler problem and even that might be too difficult to get a lot of response on PPCG.

counting rice?!

oh I see

I think that can be done these days with standard libraries

Isn't the point of most challenges on PPCG to write code without libraries that do it for you?

@Geobits I think it depends. Some challenges still make sense if you can use libraries

I mean libraries can just be viewed as another bigger language

@Geobits I don't know of a "count rice" library :)

Sure, but if the challenge is to count rice, I'd say anything that separated an image into distinct areas by edge detection/etc would be off limits.

So saying "there are libraries for that" doesn't really change the challenge.

7:47 PM

@Geobits maybe. I am not sure vision is so easy in practice if the pictures are taken with a real camera

Agreed, I said that above...

@Geobits so in order to understand how interesting the problem is, we need to understand how much extra is needed on top of the libraries you can just download

or we need to specify exactly which libraries are allowed

the point I am making is that there exist challenges that are still hard even if you allow people to use any library they want

but i can't tell if counting rice is one of them

can you?

Allowed to use any library, it's probably not that hard. I'm sure you could dig up some obscure code a poor grad student wrote somewhere that does something similar.

:)

ah.. I knew I had seen this

it's a demonstration that comes with matlab

If you limit it to standard libraries, I have no idea. I'm not familiar with what's considered "standard" in every language.

Martin Büttner

7:52 PM

@Geobits heh, Mathematica

Exactly. That's why most ban builtins completely ;)

@Geobits mathworks.co.uk/help/images/image-enhancement-and-analysis.html

my view is that "all libraries" should mean anything you can install using apt-get install on ubuntnu without adding a new repositories :)

Sucks for Windows users, huh?

do they exist?

I don't acknowledge the existence of windows users who also love coding :)

Sure! @Rainbolt boots into Windows when he's tired :P

7:54 PM

:)

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 Hello there!

hi @MartinBüttner

Martin Büttner

And there you acknowledged my existence.

I am tempted to post a fastest code question related to my plane one...

@MartinBüttner aha :)

@MartinBüttner no windows at all?

Martin Büttner

what?

7:56 PM

I use Windows at work (not much choice)

@MartinBüttner err.. I mean.. do you really not use linux at all?

@Geobits well that's ok.. as long as someone is forcing you to :)

but I don't understand how keen programmers use windows. I mean you can't even get pip install to work properly :)

Martin Büttner

oh I do every now and then. there are some people who don't have any hatred towards any OS and just use the one that currently seems more appropriate or convenient

and gcc in windows is a pain too

@MartinBüttner unbelievable :)

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 I don't really use Python on Windows (or at all), and I haven't had any problems with gcc so far

@MartinBüttner interesting.. How do you use gcc? From the command line?

7:58 PM

I keep an install handy at home either way. It just happens to be the easiest/sanest way to write Windows applications :P

Martin Büttner

there also keen programmers who like coding in C#

@user2179021 yes

@Geobits now that has to be the truth!

@MartinBüttner doesn't it annoy you that you can't actually compile much open source code in windows?

Martin Büttner

no

I tried compile numpy once in windows.. argh1

argh!

Martin Büttner

on Windows, binaries just work

8:00 PM

or they don't. No grey area at least ;)

but then you seem to have to download binaries from random websites

this just seems really dodgy

how do you get binaries you trust from open source projects in windows?

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 implying I'd actually review the code I'd be compiling...

Downloading from random websites isn't much different than adding a one-off repository for a package, is it?

@MartinBüttner it's not so much that you review it, it's more that it all comes from the official repository

@MartinBüttner and not just some guy's website

@Geobits just the same but you almost never add a one-off repository do you?

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 I very rarely need to go to the lengths of finding binaries on third-party sites... most stuff I need/use provides windows binaries.

8:02 PM

The kind of code you find on "some guy's website" isn't generally the same type of code you find in official repositories... If it's something standard (or even popular), the websites are much less dodgy.

I mean all the stuff is gpg signed on the official repositories

@Geobits that's not really true.. take the binaries for numpy for example

lfd.uci.edu/~gohlke/pythonlibs is the recommended location

no gpg signing, he doesn't have any relationship with numpy as far as I can tell

it's just some guy providing binaries that you are supposed to then execute on your machine

Martin Büttner

the domain ends in .edu ... it must be legit!

@MartinBüttner :)

anyway.. you take my point.. it seems a crazy way administer a machine

The sourceforge project isn't recommended?

In other words, what makes the site you linked "the recommended location"? I found the sourceforge one straight from googling "numpy windows".

download executables from many different places and run them

Martin Büttner

8:05 PM

@user2179021 as I said, I almost never come across a case in which I need to find binaries on third-party sites

there was only one thing recently that I can remember, which was gifsicle, so I just left it alone, because I couldn't be bothered to look for a safer alternative

@Geobits I did try all these options a while ago. so the currrent recommendations seem to be scipy.org/install.html

But to answer your earlier question, I have at least 5-6 one-off repositories set up. I can't remember what for at the moment, but yea, it's not that uncommon if you want something that isn't straight out of the box.

@Geobits interesting.. actually I think I have two but they are direct from the developers and still gpg signed

@Geobits to get more recent versions of pypy and libreoffice

I want to say one of mine was something to do with Spotify. A couple others for system tweaks dealing with menus or nautilus (definitely some random guy's site).

aha

8:10 PM

oho

:)

so the rice challenge seems to need some tight rules

about libraries

back on that topic :)

Martin Büttner

what's with JavaScript on the aureoles challenge? codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/38641/…

actually my real opinion about windows is different from what I am claimaing

in reality I think for real experts in windows it's just the same as linux is for me. I once new a windows expert and he could hack it up in just the same ways I can hack linux

knew

it was very impressive

That's probably true. OS wars are ridiculous for the most part :)

Unless you're talking trash about Apple. Amirite?

Martin Büttner

as are most standard/product competition related wars in software engineering

except ranting about IE, that's okay

8:13 PM

there was a time when I felt linux was solid in a way windows wasn't

but to be honest I have to reboot my ubuntu machine about once a month

which isn't great

It's solid in a way Windows 8 isn't. If by "solid" you mean not broken into tiles.

I mean, for example, if you ran a really badly behaved piece of software linux would just keep on working where windows would become unusable

but now linux becomes unusable too

this may be the default setups no longer have an OOM killer and things like that

but it's a pain

Martin Büttner

in my experience, especially if you're not an expert, it's much easier to completely wreck a linux system than a windows system

actually the lack of the OOM killer is the worst thing..I wonder why they turned it off

@MartinBüttner you mean as root or as a normal user?

It's absolutely easier to wreck by accident. It might just be easier to fix, though, as long as you have another means to Google the problem.

Martin Büttner

8:16 PM

@user2179021 as root I guess... I've only seen it happen when people set up/configure/administer their system

At home, all new users are root :P

@MartinBüttner oh I see.. sure. I meant more running something that used all the RAM

ok this has inspired me to finally work out how to turn the OOM killer back on

it's really annoying

:)

I don't have a problem with OOM crashing my system (and I've done it several times playing on PPCG).

Martin Büttner

oh that's true... Mathematica can sometimes completely lock up my PC if I accidentally run the wrong kind of computation

@Geobits but this didn't use to happen. Linux used to handle it gracefully and not just lock up

8:18 PM

No, I'm saying mine doesn't lock up. It asks me if I want to kill it after a short wait.

Same for excessive CPU usage.

nice!

which setup?

I think I lost the Unity sidebar once, but it just restarted the sidebar. No reboot required.

13.04 desktop. I'm pretty sure I haven't changed any settings related to that, though.

interesting.. I am on 14.04 and I can kill the computer dead by just running a python script that makes a large list!

Wait, I'm pretty sure it's 13.10 now that I think about it. My laptop has 14.04, but I don't do much crazy stuff on that one.

I should give you one of my murderous python scripts to test :)

but really they do nothing more than make one large object

8:21 PM

I could probably find one on my own despite not knowing python :)

Kernel fails to execute code for killing OOM task if oom_kill_allocating_task = 0

The problem is thoroughly described in this question: http://askubuntu.com/q/398236/20275 Steps to reproduce: Make sure oom_kill_allocating_task = 0 (it's the default configuration) cat /proc/sys/vm/oom_kill_allocating_task echo 0 | sudo tee /proc/sys/vm/oom_kill_allocating_task Disable your swap to make the test faster. Fill your RAM. After that the machine will freeze completely forever spinning HDD for some reason and thus slowly degrading it. ProblemType: Bug DistroRelease: Ubuntu 14.04 Package: linux-image-3.13.0-34-generic 3.13.0-34.60 ProcVersionSignature: Ubuntu 3.13.0-34.60-generic 3.13.11.4 Uname: Linux 3.13.0-34-generic x86_64 ApportVersion: 2.14.1-0ubuntu3.3 Architecture: amd64 AudioDevicesInUse: USER PID ACCESS COMMAND /dev/snd/controlC0: int 2114 F.... pulseaudio CurrentDesktop: KDE Date: Thu Aug 21 16:40:15 2014 HibernationDevice: RESUME=UUID=52f0a457-e6ab-4711-a129-83170285523b MachineType: ASUSTeK COMPUTER INC. X502CA ProcFB: 0 inteldrmfb ProcKern…

linux (Ubuntu)

Medium / Incomplete

I may try that out next time I'm on my laptop.

wow this chat room expands urls a lot ;)

github.com/julman99/eatmemory :)

great application!

I didn't know launchpad bugs were oneboxed... That's two new oneboxing sites discovered today.

ok so this is my fastest code proposal

given n hyperplanes in d dimensions, output the signature of all the O(n^{d-1}) regions

a signature is just a vector or 1s and -1s which tells you which side of each hyperplane you are on

Martin Büttner

8:25 PM

@Geobits we should just memorise them once and for all

@Martin What's the fun in that? :P

the reason it might be interesting is that it's not even obvious what the right time complexity is

so people can exercise their algorithmic imaginations

@MartinBüttner might this interest you?

given n hyperplanes in d dimensions, each of which goes through the origin

Martin Büttner

hm, probably not. it is interesting, but somewhere between not interesting enough and too tough for me to bother figuring out a solution

@MartinBüttner that's a shame

any idea how I can move it towards interesting enough?

I could propose code in python and ask people how much faster they can make it :)

people seem to like to beat python

Martin Büttner

@user2179021 no clue... I guess I just can't be bothered to wrap my head around hyperplanes partitioning d-dimensional space

8:57 PM

well

I was just given some stock data as part of a hedge fund interview process

I have to send it back to them by Tuesday

I'm not sure what exactly I should do with it

@EricTressler What type of data is this? Historical returns?

no, it's stock data

not sure if it's real or simulated

As in prices for tickers?

it's their valuation

yeah

Random trivia: Did you know that you can have comments in email addresses? Apparently foobar@example.com is equivalent to (thisisacomment)foobar(anotherone)@(andanother)example.com(lastone).

9:01 PM

i did not know that, but is that actually set in the protocol?

Can you use that to figure out who is spamming you?

@EricTressler Yep

Martin Büttner

@Doorknob @EricTressler more importantly, what's the use of that?

I guess it's for email clients that format emails like "some.body@example.com (Some Body)" and don't bother to remove the name before sending...? Heh, I have no idea

githubphagocyte

@MartinBüttner I imagine the primary purpose is to allow highly golfed programs to be included in an email address :)

I wonder if parentheses are permitted within the enclosing parentheses

9:12 PM

@Geobits Am I really the only one in this chat room who uses and likes Windows?

Martin Büttner

@Rainbolt No.

My machine may as well just be Visual Studio 2013 Ultimate and Chrome. I don't think anyone cares that much about the OS these days. All that matters is the apps that run on top of it.

@Rainbolt Personally, I rely heavily on workspaces and it feels weird when Ctrl+Alt+Arrow keys doesn't work.

What are workspaces and what does ctrl+alt+arrow do?

Oh god. He doesn't know.

Martin Büttner

9:18 PM

@Doorknob Windows 10!

Workspaces are basically awesome. I don't know what to say past that.

I managed to find this question: I would like to know where i can find the way that I can stop my computer from changing the orientation of my screen because i have to press CTRL/ALT and my arrows to play commander keen and everytime i use my pogo stick it changes my screen and this is annoying and i keep dying....please help

2

@Rainbolt They're basically like little groups of windows, kind of. I have 9 on my laptop, and for example, right now the bottom three are filled with Android app stuff that I'm trying to figure out. It's much more organized, and you don't have to keep bringing up windows one by one over and over and over again. They're just... really good.

Martin Büttner

@Rainbolt that's one of my favourite windows features... very useful to troll the uninitiated

I guess it comes down to personal preference. I prefer to close things when I switch tasks because I'm a neat freak

And when I want it back, I WindowsKey- > "Foo" -> Enter

9:22 PM

Oh, also, can you map Caps Lock -> Ctrl on Windows?

I find that incredibly useful.

I've found that on my desktop, I rarely have to close anything any more. Between workspaces and having a good amount of RAM, it's easier/faster to just switch between apps depending on what I'm doing.

^ Yeah, basically that.

If I know I'm completely done with something, I'll close it, but other than that... My son has had Minecraft open on the bottom-right workspace for probably a week now.

He's also got his own browser window there to look at related stuff while he's playing.

Martin Büttner

@Doorknob my keyboard does that

Ooh, another thing: Terminator is pretty nice. It's a thing that lets you have multiple terminals in one window. So I can have one terminal with Vim open to some python file, another one with just a bunch of ./something.pys for testing, another one with the REPL open to do some quick tests, and even one dedicated to pep8 if I want. It's pretty great.

9:27 PM

Eww. One terminal per window, please :P

Why? :P I usually just have the Terminator window maximized, so it's basically just a bunch of terminal windows except they're all grouped together. (Also you can use Alt+Arrow keys to switch between them.)

I'll have to look up what you mean, I guess. I like having multiple non-maximized windows for terminal. It just feels right to me.

Here's a screenshot of one I have open right now

(there's vertical splits too, of course, which I usually use also, but for 3 terminals that just feels weird)

Oh god no. That would drive me insane. Don't ask why, I couldn't explain it. It's just wrong.

Heh, I know that feeling. But it's really pretty easy to get used to, and really convenient after that.

9:33 PM

I use windows 7 because I play video games. I could probably get as much work done on Ubuntu

(I also own photoshop and illustrator, and those only work on windows)

1 hour later…

10:37 PM

@user2179021 And you can in Linux?

10:48 PM

@MartinBüttner, cheddarmonk.org/papers/lapidary.pdf

Martin Büttner

@PeterTaylor Thanks! I'll try to read that tomorrow

I currently have to write a project outline and literature survey for my final-year project, and the field I'm surveying seems to be ridiculously vast.

Today, I found a review from 2010 by a guy whose works are quoted all over the place, and the review starts with "Computational hydraulics is a broad branch of Computational Fluid Dynamics (CFD) whose recent advances are becoming difficult to follow and virtually impossible to review comprehensibly."

I wonder how I'll be able to finish that survey within a week ^^

Well, off to bed...

Cite him and you're done.

Martin Büttner

Heh, I probably should :D

Bachelor's projects don't have to advance the state of the art, so novelties from the last 4 years aren't that important.

Martin Büttner

well it's an MSci project

but yes, that's still undergraduate

10:54 PM

I've seen masters' projects which were pretty uninnovative too.

(I read one earlier this week - someone who used the inclusion-exclusion idea I mentioned in the sandbox post on Langford pairings. He clearly didn't understand the technique he was modifying at all. IMO he was lucky to compute the right answers).

Anyway, I'm off to bed too. Goodnight.

Martin Büttner

goodnight!

11:20 PM

sup

11:33 PM

@Rainbolt Dr. Shankar has broken me and my brother, Torque in 3D is torture

oh no, it actually works youtube.com/watch?v=NeXIV-wMVUk

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