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05:00 - 21:0021:00 - 00:00

5:25 AM
@CadeRoux In Budapest street musicians are harassed by the authorities. In theory you can get a permit, but it is ridiculously difficult. So no chance here for such a performance...
 
 
3 hours later…
8:24 AM
Grammy winners playing a house party for another Grammy winner
 
 
1 hour later…
9:28 AM
@CadeRoux Thanks a lot! only one question remained: where they are (on the video, I mean)? :)
 
 
3 hours later…
12:31 PM
Hi Mark, I promised a reference for my claim that pre-industrialisation lifespans were comparable to modern man—but a little reading has led me to believe I was exaggerating at best :) This article seems pretty well balanced: johnhawks.net/weblog/reviews/life_history/…
He links to a very sciency pdf that concludes: "We are not living as long as we thought we were."
 
12:44 PM
@JackDouglas awesome, cheers
 
1:11 PM
@JackDouglas @jcolebrand I know we were told not to flag first post, but unfortunately I had to do just that on to questions today
 
1:30 PM
@dezso Inside Irvin's house. The kids were still napping after a long morning at the zoo so we couldn't go across the street. But here's a photo from twitter.
Now that's what I call a study break! Sunday house concert at @IrvinMayfieldJr's with @rebirthBB. http://t.co/mUtP1Qvz
 
2:09 PM
too much drama here
 
@rfusca impossible
 
lol
 
what's going on?
 
a server had a bad stick of RAM for 3 years. They're going to replace it but they're making up reasons for taking the server down so that folks don't realize there was a bad stick for 3 years
 
@rfusca sounds funny
 
2:12 PM
@dezso ya....not so much lol
 
they have to be less imaginative than ideal if it took them 3 years to make up a reason :)
 
2:30 PM
just say they're adding X amount of RAM to the server :)
 
@rfusca how did they find out without taking the server down?
 
magic 8ball
 
2:47 PM
is sp_MSforEachTable traditionally Buggy?
I know it's undocumented so having it in some of these developer sprocs makes me nervous as it is but it also seems to crash a lot.
 
@Zane It's undocumented for a reason ;-) but seriously, aside from documentation, how often do you need to do the exact same operation for each and every table?
 
@JackDouglas the little red light had been blinking on the server for 3 years. When I went to the COLO I noticed it and followed up
@DTest thats what they're doing
 
Well after some digging and keep in mind this is on the old DB system that was built long before my arrival.
 
What they are doing is turning off constraints on a Configuration table to do an insert.....
 
2:57 PM
@MikeWalsh d you mean that @rfusca should blame it on the aliens?
 
In our classic "relational" Database.
 
@dezso Yes That is what I mean.
 
@jcolebrand What this sproc is doing is sketchy at best. Its a sproc that calls two different sprocs. One of them runs sp_MSforEageTable to turn of constraints to change some config data which why it's doing that in a supposedly relational model completely baffles me. Once it's done it's insert it runs MSforEageTable again to turn them back on.
 
@dezso a good idea ;)
 
@rfusca is it an HP?
 
3:11 PM
@Zane Sounds like it seriously needs a refactor
That's not sane business logic
 
Unfortunately the database that runs on is completely out of my hands hopefully a strong recomendation will be good enough to get the developers to fix that problem.
 
hahahaha, nope
 
:( there really is no chance is there.
 
You have to put on the robes of a SQL DBA and institute Business Practices and Best Procedures or whatever to enforce A Change Order.
 
Well luckily it's not on the servers I'm in charge of.
 
3:17 PM
@JackDouglas ibm
@JackDouglas its a box i'm kind of loosely connected with. Technically I could assume control of it if I wanted to - but it would be dangerous with office politics and generally I have no need to.
 
@SQLKiwi Your the best man. Thanks
Forward this to the entire dev lab.
 
@Zane Thank @AaronBertrand!
 
Indeed He's not in atm
 
@Zane and anyone else who uses msforeachdb for any maintenance stuff
 
3:32 PM
It's just me an one other db who is just as upset that it's being used. @swasheck
 
@Zane so you guys can cut it out (without anesthesia, but probably with whiskey) andd net a win
 
This place is a textbook example of bad practice...
 
There's a bad practices textbook? Explains a lot :)
 
@SQLKiwi and every DBA who goes into a new situation believes that "the last guy" followed it
nice work NZ
 
3:52 PM
And Denmark and Finland. I would like to visit Finland one day.
 
@SQLKiwi indeed
 
Where's antartica...sheesh
nm, i can move the map.
 
4:07 PM
@swasheck my last guy wrote it
 
i just dl, installed, and ran the new sp_Blitz script
i got result for a "High VLF Count" and the details give me "The [ReportServer] database has 0 virtual log files (VLFs). This may be slowing down startup, restores, and even inserts/updates/deletes."
bug?
(0) vlfs doesnt seem very high
 
@swasheck Sounds like it
 
it's minor
oh noes
sp_msforeachdb
 
4:24 PM
Brent wrote that?
 
Quick, get @AaronBertrand, I spy sp_msforeachdb :)
 
@SQLKiwi no
@SQLKiwi paul anderton
 
Ah ok
 
@MarkStorey-Smith ... he's a dba from the uk. this crushes my house of cards.
 
4:41 PM
@MikeWalsh I see what you mean. That particular code isn't Brent's but the sp_msforeachdbs elsewhere sure are.
 
i'm about to pee my pants, y'all
this is my first contribution and i think i found the issue
WHERE EXISTS (SELECT name FROM master.sys.databases
							WHERE source_database_id is not null);
should actually be
WHERE EXISTS (SELECT name FROM master.sys.databases
							WHERE source_database_id is not null);
otherwise you're just checking for VLFs on snapshot dbs
 
@SQLKiwi It works for what he is doing. In fact I think it works well for what he is going for with that script.. The use of sp_msforeachdb
 
Any Oracle types on here, you might want to start using rlwrap. It's awesome [if you use SQL*Plus a fair bit]
0
A: Do I have to retype information every time I make a mistake in SQLPlus

PhilSeveral ways. You can set the EDITOR environment variable before running SQL*Plus (Assuming Unix), to allow use of an external text editor (vi, by way of example): export EDITOR=vi Then type ed in SQL*Plus to edit the previous query in the vi editor. Of course, you may prefer nano, pico, emac...

 
@swasheck: What's the difference in these two code snippets?
 
@swasheck I haven't yet had my coffee.. Am I missing something?
 
4:49 PM
We were all thinking it
 
@ypercube Maybe not :-) @swasheck :-)
 
@ypercube i'm an idiot and should have changed the second to be where source_database_id IS NULL
and now it's past the edit time
 
@MikeWalsh I've closed the window now. My understanding is that sp_msforeachdb is always unreliable. What makes it safe here?
 
however ... now i have to deal with the high counts of VLF
 
@SQLKiwi I'm reading Aaron's post now and I see what you mean :-)
 
5:00 PM
Can someone vote to close this?
0
Q: Can't UPDATE record with unique key

EPQRSIm trying to do an UPDATE statement. UPDATE `users` SET `Email` = 'email@domain.com', `Mobile` = '123456789', `City` = 'Chicago', `Firstname` = 'John', `Lastname` = 'Smith', `DOB` = '1980-01-01', `Sex` = 'male' #1062 - Duplicate entry '123456789' for key 'Mobile' But I'm updating the record w...

needs 1 more vote.
 
Already done mine
 
@ypercube Done
 
A very unhappy question
@Mat should add his comment as an answer and EPQRS should accept this answer. otherwise this query will be found in the list pf queries without an answer. — miracle173 3 hours ago
True
 
Awesome, just saw @gbn drop off the icon list in a sledge.
 
@ypercube @MarkStorey-Smith @SQLKiwi i'm very impressed that there's actually a constraint that barked in the first place
 
5:03 PM
Either SE are getting in the xmas mood or the man-flu I've got is causing hallucinations
 
Anyone here ever sell a domain name? How do you know if an appraisal is accurate? I had a bunch of sites say $150, another site say $1500 and I have an offer of $1000. I don't even know if I want to sell it.
 
@MarkStorey-Smith noticed that with @bluefeet about an hour ago. i thought that i was hallucinating.
@CadeRoux weighted average?
 
@swasheck tweetcars.com is listed for sale for $2600, so I'm thinking those other sites just default names to $150 - thinking tweetcar.com has to be worth more than $150.
The buyer's name is Jafar. Should I be worried he's an evil wizard?
 
@CadeRoux maybe
 
I can't see how anyone can make an accurate appraisal on such a thing.
 
5:09 PM
@ypercube ... maybe @BenBrocka can come in and tell us all about online marketing. we had a conversation about this in the past and i agree with your sentiment.
 
@Cade You can make an (rough) appraisal yourself. Name a price that you think it way over the price you ever going to get.
And a price that is way too low for you to sell. Then find the geometric mean.
 
so how do you flag someone for a rude edit attempt? I just rejected this edit:
Or is the vandalism tag enough?
 
I see that guy's answer in that question. totally useless.
 
@MikeWalsh i dont know how to interpret. nathan daly posted that edit to OP's self answer?
 
I've also flagged his answer.. Seems like the user is starting off with some pretty big briches in the attitude department
 
5:17 PM
when pornstars moonlight as dbas
(i kid. she's legit, but it sounds like a stage name)
 
Someone downvote this guy please. — user1578653 13 mins ago
that's not particularly helpful either, is it?
 
@JackDouglas no, it's not
 
Too slow :)
 
@Jack: Does this user (1588653) see the attempted edit at his answer?
 
@JackDouglas if the whole answer goes away then the comment goes too?
 
5:21 PM
@JackDouglas nah.. Really that whole thread isn't helpful.
 
@swasheck yup of course
 
@JackDouglas how many flags is that "answer" up to, now?
 
3 or 4 :)
effort on the other guy probably wouldn't be productive
 
@JackDouglas c'mon ... start a private chat with nathan daly and then we can all dogpile
 
@jcolebrand can we superping someone who has never been in chat?
rep=36
 
5:25 PM
Yes
 
thanks :)
 
SuperPing!!
 
run @@ and then in the userbox provide their site ID and make sure the appropriate site has been selected.
 
@user1578653 Please can we have a quick word here in The Heap (dba.se chat room)?
 
@SQLKiwi that hurt my ears
 
5:26 PM
So technically if they have 36 on Home Improvement and 11 on Database Administrators you can still super-ping them here (but chat uses an aggregate rep I think)
 
by the way, @SQLKiwi ... what's shaking?
 
@ypercube Interesting, for wolframalpha.com/input/?i=geometric+mean+500%2C+10000 I get $2200
 
@user1578653 in short, thanks for posting your question and coming back with a self-answer, but please don't post comments like "Someone downvote this guy please" on someone's post. Do it here in The Heap ;)
 
5:43 PM
@JackDouglas @user1578653 ~ where we can at least temper the rage ...
So, there are some complaints about this suggested edit:
We appreciate the concern, but no more fuss needs to be raised over it, the appropriate resolution steps have been taken. Thank you for your time.
 
@jcolebrand soap in the sock?
 
This includes no more fuss over the associated answers, commentary (existing, if new harassing commentary arises, please inform us via the appropriate mechanisms) or etc.
@swasheck something like that ... we start with feathers, but I pack a mean swing.
 
6:10 PM
Lots of deleted posts while I hit up lunch
 
@Zane we like to keep you on your toes
 
believe it or not I get enough of that here.
 
gbn
6:33 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith eh? what?
 
speaking of lunch ... i need to go eat but it's just north of 20F here
 
@gbn When users drop off the icon bar (top right), they now do so in a sledge :)
 
gbn
wow
whizzy
 
@swasheck did you guys get the snow storm?
 
Now I want my hats!
 
gbn
6:34 PM
I'm simple minded and easily impressed
 
@gbn Sounds like a club I should be a member of
 
@Zane we got about 1.5" ... nothing. it was disappointing
 
gbn
@swasheck ah snow. I remember that
 
@gbn not much snow in malta, eh?
 
gbn
I'll see plenty this weekend. off to Weihnachtmarkt in CH
@swasheck not in living memory
 
6:36 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith I saw that earlier but didn't really notice it, just sort of saw it ...
 
@gbn took me a while.
the helvetica confederation ;)
 
so apparently my boss ran into our old DBA (who is now consulting) - told the previous guy that he should let us know the places he's consulting at so that I can follow after and clean up! lol
 
@rfusca at least you know your boss has your back
 
@swasheck indeed
 
gbn
someone send me a linked in? @swasheck?
 
6:49 PM
@gbn yeah. you popped up on my potential connections
 
gbn
accepted, thanks
 
@gbn the honor's mine
 
7:11 PM
@swasheck we got a little over a foot at my place
 
Does anyone know if SQL Server 2008 stores the creation date for execution plans? I was hoping to see if some schema changes might have forced some new plans being made, which would slow down a user's experience.
 
@EugeneM good question ... perhaps one for the site?
 
ah good point!
 
I'd +1 it
 
7:27 PM
0
Q: New admin for MS Access, how to modify existing macro

WildBillI'm a new admin for an MS access database. I'm very new to MS Access so please forgive me if I ask something that does not make sense here.... The current staff has a small (5MB or so) .mdb file on their desktop. Clicking that file opens access and lists queries on the left hand side of Access...

 
If I'm not mistaken once the plan is changed or removed from the cache it is just cleared out.
For example if you run SELECT *
FROM sys.dm_exec_cached_plans you will see not dates there. once the plan is gone it's gone. Unless someone brighter than I knows otherwise
 
Yeah, I don't see any dates there. I don't need an old execution plan, I wan't to see if a bunch of new ones were made over the weekend.
afk a sec, but working on a legit question
 
7:44 PM
@EugeneM Got a script ready for you, one for procs and one for adhoc
 
@MarkStorey-Smith i wait with 'bated breath
 
I'm hoping I'm wrong and this information can be find
found*
 
@Zane i believe you mean "finded"
 
Meeting time
 
8:00 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith That's kind of awesome. I suppose I should still post the question so you can get the first answer?
 
@EugeneM Post it up so the next time someone asks, they can find the answer:)
Don't accept my answer, someone else may come along with a better solution
 
0
Q: Does SQL Server 2008 store the creation date of execution plans?

Eugene MWe recently upgraded an application we use, which involved modifying the schema for the database. These changes could have forced cached execution plans to be discarded. If SQL Server was forced to create a bunch of new plans, this could have slowed down the user experience. I'd like to find out ...

I'm pretty stoked I had a good question
 
0
A: Does SQL Server 2008 store the creation date of execution plans?

Mark Storey-SmithIt isn't stored in sys.dm_exec_cached_plans, nor is it buried anywhere in the plan XML that I can find. There is useful information in other DMVs however. For stored procedures we can get the time a plan was cached from sys.dm_exec_procedure_stats: SELECT TOP(250) p.name AS [SP Name] ,...

 
@EugeneM +1 for your effort
@MarkStorey-Smith and +1 for yours ... just wait for the NOLOCK crowd to come in, though.
 
@swasheck I've not questioned why its deemed good behaviour to nolock everything from the DMVs but its widespread practice. Glenn Berry's DMV scripts use it everywhere.
 
8:12 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith yeah. i'm just saying to wait for them to start commenting, perhaps not knowing what they're saying, just that someone once said that (NOLOCK) is bad practice
 
The way I've understood it, using NOLOCK on DMV queries is so you don't accidentally get in the way of the engine while trying to get at that info.
DMV queries are pretty much the only time I'll even look sideways at NOLOCK.
 
@MikeFal that's my understanding as well
 
However, I think NOLOCK is deprecated with 2012. I'm seeing folks moving towards setting the isolation level to READ UNCOMMITTED.
 
@MarkStorey-Smith The DMVs don't present a transactionally-consistent view anyway.
 
@SQLKiwi @MikeFal gotcha
 
8:22 PM
AFAIK the change from creation_time to cached_time was just because procedures and triggers were added in 2008 and the opportunity was taken to choose a more descriptive name. The created/cached time reflects the last compilation, not the creation time of the original plan.
 
@SQLKiwi Are they updated/modified lazily by a background process?
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Depends on the DMV/DMF. Mostly they are views on internal data structures.
 
@SQLKiwi Mind if edit with credit your creation/cached comment? :)
 
@MikeFal Not deprecated. People move to isolation level from table hints because it is easier to change when they want to move to e.g. RCSI, and ultimately less typing and less error-prone (easy to miss off a NOLOCK hint).
@MarkStorey-Smith Just edit, no credit necessary. And for the love of fluffy bunnies don't put EDIT or UPDATE text in the answer :)
 
@SQLKiwi Bah, your damned names going in there somewhere... I can blame you if its wrong that way!
:D
 
8:26 PM
@SQLKiwi Gotcha. I see where I was thinking of the deprecation, looks like it was deprecated on UPDATE and DELETE statements for the FROM clause. msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms143729.aspx
 
@EugeneM Be aware that create/cache time changes whenever the plan is recompiled (for any of the normal reasons)
 
What an a amazingly well-mannered group of dba's. This may be a good career for me to continue accidentally falling into.
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Ha ha ok then
@EugeneM Bugger off you idiot
:D
 
lol
 
@MikeFal Yes it never worked anyway!
 
8:27 PM
@SQLKiwi thank you for not sullying our bad name
 
@swasheck n.p.
 
@SQLKiwi Fortunately for my purposes, that's fine. I mainly want to see if a bunch of plans got recompiled today, which seems to be the case.
 
@EugeneM Sweet as
Weird that there are DMVs for ad-hoc queries, procedures and triggers...
...but not functions.
 
@SQLKiwi That would be handy... for beating function abusers to death with
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Soap in a sock.
 
8:33 PM
@SQLKiwi niiiice
 
Very few things in this world can not be solved with soap in a sock.
 
Except how to get soap out of a sock, perhaps
 
That's one of those few things. :)
 
@MikeFal where in denver are you?
 
Google is very scary.
 
8:36 PM
@swasheck Work in Louisville, live in Westminster.
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Why the heck is my post about temporary tables the one below that question?
 
@MikeFal incoming linkedin
(i just discovered it)
 
But yes, spooky fast
 
I still want to learn more about how Google manages their data. They still use Big Table?
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Yeah that was kinda fast
 
8:37 PM
@MikeFal F1 and some other utility
 
(that's just ads)
 
0
Q: New admin for MS Access, how to modify existing macro

WildBillI'm a new admin for an MS access database. I'm very new to MS Access so please forgive me if I ask something that does not make sense here.... The current staff has a small (5MB or so) .mdb file on their desktop. Clicking that file opens access and lists queries on the left hand side of Access...

Crikey WildBill has used all his rep on a bounty for that q
 
@swasheck Added via LinkedIn. You ever come to the Denver SQL user's group?
 
@SQLKiwi That post doesn't show in my results, I've got pinal dave talking about recompilation :)
 
8:40 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith You clearly read the wrong blogs
 
hurridly clears cache
 
LOL!
 
@MikeFal never. i'm honestly re-integrating into the DBA world. i was on my way out until some life changes took place
 
@SQLKiwi actually some blog suggestions would be awesome. I real a lot of sqlserverpedia
 
@SQLKiwi To be fair, he is somewhat ubiquitous
 
8:41 PM
@swasheck I'm a regular there. We'd love to have you show up!
 
@MarkStorey-Smith Pinal Dave results dominate about 33% of all of my sql searches
 
@EugeneM Check this link out: thomaslarock.com/rankings It will get you started
 
@MikeFal Good suggestion
 
@MikeFal thanks. where/when?
 
@EugeneM What Mike said. What's your level of expertise and interest areas? Tom has quite a list there - we might be able to pick some out for you to look at first.
 
8:44 PM
also ... @SQLKiwi ... RESOURCEDB ...
 
@swasheck Typically third Thursday in the DTC. denver.sqlpass.org
 
@swasheck cough cough
 
@MikeFal down the street. i'm in meridian
 
Tom will realize his error at some stage I am sure.
 
we're in the presence of greatness
 
8:46 PM
@EugeneM Off the top of my head, @SqlKiwi, @AaronBetrand, all the SQLSkills.com crew, Chris Webb, Adam Machanic, @BrentOzar and crew, Thomas Kejser, Jason Strate, @JohnSansom (nice little weekly blog roundup/links), Michael Swart... that should get you started :)
 
@SQLKiwi Bah. You deserve your place there, sir. LOVE your posts on the query optimizer internals.
 
embarrassed silence
 
John's Something For The Weekend round ups are great. And not just because he occasionally links my own blog. johnsansom.com/sftw
 
@EugeneM you can also spend time on Twitter trolling through #sqlhelp and watch the experts' answers. most of the ones that @MarkStorey-Smith just listed are active on there, too
 
@swasheck You on Twitter?
 
8:48 PM
@swasheck I haven't bothered to try that but I probably should
also thanks for the suggestions
 
plus, if you can establish yourself as "less-than-wanker" then you can ask dumb questions and get good answers. it's how i've been able to sustain a community presence.
 
Is it just me or does this maybe belong on SO?
2
Q: New admin for MS Access, how to modify existing macro

WildBillI'm a new admin for an MS access database. I'm very new to MS Access so please forgive me if I ask something that does not make sense here.... The current staff has a small (5MB or so) .mdb file on their desktop. Clicking that file opens access and lists queries on the left hand side of Access...

 
@MikeFal yes. my username is quite creative
@jcolebrand it's been posted in here thrice. i say kill it with fire
 
I'm only asking because it's been posted in here twice
 
@jcolebrand Might have more of the right eyes over there
 
8:50 PM
@MarkStorey-Smith That's mah thinking
 
@swasheck Huh, I must have fat fingered it earlier. Follow request sent. :)
 
@jcolebrand i know. i think i was tracking with your line of thought.
 
so why encourage me to kill it with fire?
 
@jcolebrand discharge to SO?
 
that isn't kill it with fire
that's just close as off topic
 
8:55 PM
apologies. same line of thought. different semantics.
 
an important difference to we mods ;-)
 
i can see that
 
I'm a DBA, cleansing things with fire is always my favorite option.
2
Not always the RIGHT option, but if I can make it work.....
 
yeah. when i first started hanging out @jcolebrand was all about the whole "coordinated airstrike" and "banhammer" lingo. i forgot about that.
i should be more careful with my words
 
@swasheck I will seriously destroy a post in the blink of an eye if I can
 
8:59 PM
@MikeFal forgive my ignorance ... but those meetings are in the evening?
@jcolebrand i know. i should learn to be more careful with the targets that i paint
 
I also want to go drop a 250 rep bonus on that post for him, but I'm right at the teeter point to drop back below 10k
 
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