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02:00 - 15:0015:00 - 23:00

3:00 PM
@LucasKauffman "Set him on fire." There, am I hired?
 
@LucasKauffman I really would not expect a noob to have a clue.
@LucasKauffman what is the position?
 
@AviD assistant level (so entry entry)
 
@LucasKauffman as what?
 
@AviD pentester
 
@Adnan Finished. Did I forget anything? crypto.stackexchange.com/questions/14971/…
 
3:01 PM
@ton.yeung ancient history, man.
@LucasKauffman are they expected to know ANYTHING?
 
@AviD no like I said, I just want a way to assess if he can think straight
 
if not, I would say maybe give them some homework, to prepare.
 
and to see if he's got some basic basic knowledge
@AviD ooh interesting
 
"a big part of our job is learning new things all the time. So it's okay that you've never heard of XSS before; go learn a bit about it".
 
I usually ask some technical detail questions, but I also ask stuff like, "How do you keep up to date? Do you read blogs, listen to podcasts, mailing lists? Which ones?"
 
3:04 PM
then give him some DVWS or webgoat or gruyere or whatever. Exploit.
 
One of my favorite Linux admin questions is "How do we figure out what process has a specific file open?"
I'm looking for lsof, but I like to hear how they respond.
Even if they don't know. Hell, especially if they don't know.
 
@ScottPack very good
 
@ScottPack kill one process at a time. When the file is not locked anymore, you found it.
;-)
 
@AviD Actually, one guy said he'd look at the list of processes, find likely candidates, send them a signal to dump memory...
Or some shit like that.
 
@LucasKauffman mind, thats more about seeing if they have an interest, if they're passionate about it and read on their own time, or if its just a paycheck.
 
3:05 PM
He had a background as a DC operations guy for a big hosting firm.
@AviD Oh that's definitely true. I want to hire people who can learn and are interested in discovery.
 
@CodesInChaos To me, it looks like it has fully covered the question. Thank you.
 
well the guy has an LPIC 101 so I could ask the lsof question
 
@ScottPack right, so there's really no wrong answer except "no".
 
@AviD Exactly. If they do any of those things then it's an indicator that we can steer them towards better resources.
 
@LucasKauffman Why would you ask a linux sysadmin question if you are hiring a pentester?
 
3:07 PM
@LucasKauffman is the candidate expected to be technical at all?
 
@AviD yea
 
e.g. should she know about HTTP?
 
@AviD of course basic CS stuff
but I've got those type of questions covered
really easy stuff
wel not easy easy
 
@LucasKauffman no, not the easy stuff - the conceptual stuff.
 
@LucasKauffman Here, let me see if I can dig up my questions and post them somewhere
 
3:08 PM
@ScottPack you've got my email :p
 
like, how does SSL work.
Or what does it do.
 
@LucasKauffman Oh, that's true I do.
 
@AviD That's waaaaaaaay too advanced for entry level.
 
And how can proxies fit in that??
 
@LucasKauffman I'll see if I can get it done today, it may not happen until tonight.
 
3:09 PM
@TerryChia not looking for the cryptography. the basic functionality and high level logic.
Certificate validation, EV, etc. From a user's perspective.
 
@AviD Ah.
 
If he never went mucking around with that, I would say it's unlikely he's a fit for the job.
and if he knows CS theory - you can talk about buffers, overflows, canaries, etc. Basics, but dig deep on the basics.
also maybe things like access control, depending on his education.
Really though, since there are no specific requirements here - let him lead you. Uni student? "What are your favorite classes? what do you enjoy about them?"
Partcipate on SE? "which sites? What q's did you have? what are your best tags for answering?"
etc.
Not about what he has done, not even what he CAN do, but about what he WILL BE ABLE to do.
I think for this, learning is the #1 criteria.
Criterion?
If he has the aptitude, interest, and passion.
 
@AviD good I like this approach
 
and energy, to actually do work....
 
@AviD "How much rep do you have on SE?"
@AviD "Consider you have a question posted by Evan Carol, what do you do?"
 
3:15 PM
@LucasKauffman meh, we all know that in that rep is not necessarily an indicator of skill or knowledge.
heheh
 
@AviD that's true
 
Another thing you need to look at, considering that you're at Big4 (though this might be another interviewer's job). How well they can express themselves, explain complex issues (that they barely understand), and format a big pretty lookin report.
 
@AviD yea that's one of the issues, he's not really tri-langual apparantly
 
I'm not saying that pejoratively - that was one of my bigges hurdles becomming a consultant.
still is.
@LucasKauffman ANY language. doesnt matter.
 
@AviD he needs to be fluent in at least two :p
 
3:17 PM
writing is a language-agnostic skill. obviously, a language you're not comfortable in will be harder, but that's irrelevant.
@LucasKauffman ah, well, Big4....
 
@AviD No any company in Belgium :p
unless you only speak English
 
@LucasKauffman French and German?
 
@AviD French and English or Dutch and English
preferably all three
but native + english is a minimum
or the willingness to work on it
 
I dont think that really needs to be in the scope of your interview....
let HR worry about that...
 
good point
normally we switch between languages during the interview
thanks guys ^^
 
3:21 PM
btw, another thing you can try - I had this done to me once, it was awesome - teach him about a new attack he's not familiar with, just the basics. Then ask him to figure out an exploit, or the next level, or how to mitigate it, etc.
Basically how he thinks, how he absorbs new information, etc.
added benefit, if you dont take him, he goes out and tells all his friends about how awesome this place is, he already learned so much.
 
@LucasKauffman When's the interview?
 
3:43 PM
@ScottPack 1 hour
:p
It's a last minute request
 
@TerryChia Yo momma is the joke.
 
@Iszi Hilarious.
 
 
3 hours later…
6:17 PM
wep
 
@kiBytes I like it
 
me too, easy to crack'n'use it =)
good news today too, not best news
but very good news after all
after all the "I'm moving to the security team" thing
today I have been told that I will be in charge for the security in the development team
 
@kiBytes Woohooo.. Congrats! Let's crack open the bottles
Well, your bottles. Mine is already open.
 
xD
there's a catch
the development department (with more than 60 guys)
have very bad relations with the security team
 
@kiBytes That's not a catch.
That's just a challenge
 
6:29 PM
and they have never met the security recommendation
so basically, the development department works on its own
@Adnan yes it is, that is the best part
I have work for the development team during the last years
*worked
so now my current bosses will have to listen to my recommendations ( if they want )
well it is more like: I need to convince them they need security
need to go :S
later!
 
6:42 PM
were the demands of the security team overbord, or were the developers lazy and/or incompetent?
 
7:00 PM
@CodesInChaos My bet is on the demands being overboard, don't go with an established threat model, aren't governed by a cost-benefit analysis, and/or are unclear.
 
So I was having something of an argument WRT the security implications of using regular expressions as a parser
And specifically for use validating certain kinds of input. Like email addresses, etc.
Is this a thing in the security industry? Is there a common viewpoint?
OK, this even better. Just now I was just digging through a customer's database to figure out how the passwords were stored. I literally laughed out loud when I saw this:
  mysql> select * from user limit 1 \G
  *************************** 1. row ***************************
                          id: 1
                usr_username: jim
                usr_password: 123456q
             usr_encpassword: 3cf347b9265534a17d098d9564f85400
 
7:16 PM
lol
 
the problem with regex+email addresses is that the email address spec is horrible and can't be expressed reasonably via regex
 
This is Everything that is wrong with the security industry. Right here.
By the way, this is from a CMS that the company built, which they RENT to their clients for $100/mo.
Because everyone knows how insecure joomla is
clearly anything must be better, right?
@CodesInChaos Yeah, I pointed them to this: regular-expressions.info/email.html
 
@Adnan I wouldn't want to bet either way. There are incompetent devs (just send me the SQL. No need for SQL injection) and overly annoying security people
 
And also pointed out that foo@bar.baz is not a valid email right now only because .baz is not a valid TLD. But it might be two years from now.
 
Personally I think "it has exactly one @ in it. Move along." It's an email.
For a time I used a mail service where a number or * indicated how many emails should be sent to this address before it shuts down. The * variant often got rejected
 
7:30 PM
I never really got email validation.
Even the protocol doesn't give a shit about most of it.
 
hmm [a-z0-9!#$%&'+/=?^_`{|}~-]+(?:\.[a-z0-9!#$%&'*+/=?^_`{|}~-]+)*@(?:[a-z0-9](?:[a‌​-z0-9-]*[a-z0-9])?\.)+[a-z0-9](?:[a-z0-9-]*[a-z0-9]) from the page tylerl linked seems like a sane choice. It doesn't support the quoted variant, but I've *never seen that one. I'm not really bothered about rejecting @ip either.
(on a related note: markdown backtick escaping rules suck)
why not something simple, like doubling the backtick
 
I'm not even sure if comments/chat implement backticks properly
 
8:14 PM
Um, OK, so in theory, how is the NSA breaking IKE?
 
8:32 PM
@MichaelHampton how about by sabotaging the standardization process such that every implementation in incompatible with every other?
 
8:50 PM
@tylerl I suppose that's as good a guess as any. Was just wondering if someone had seen today's news and had any thoughts.
 
@FEichinger That's pretty neat.
 
 
1 hour later…
10:05 PM
@CodesInChaos well, I will discover it eventually, development thinks the requirements were overbord, but I am sure that security thinks they are being reasonable.
 
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