TRPG General Chat

I can't take any credit for it :)

I think I left it up in a tab somewhere. I wasn't even aware hipsters named businesses things like that? I agree though, it comes up with some nice names.

user61230

I'm imagining "the Judge & Jacket" as a high-end noble tavern. A place where nobles meet to discuss boring things like politics and murder.

I fully support the theory that Captain EO is Starlord's real father.

Tweeted by KyleKallgren on November 22, 2014 at 6:05 AM

6:09 AM

Hmm. Rat & Cider. Not sure I want anything to do with that place.

3

Thorn & Flower is bringing to mind a magic shop full of rare plants and herbs (some more poisonous than others).

user61230

The Chain & Coffin - all embalming tools 50% off!

@AgentPaper Would Snitch & Cider be better?

Depends if I've done anything illegal recently.

...and how good the cider is.

@Emrakul Complimentary stakes included.

6:12 AM

Twine & Victim? Sounds... lovely. [edges away]

Honey & Wolves... I don't even know.

Chicken & Bread... don't expect anything fancy. That's all you're getting.

"Chain & Coffin: order two stakes, get a stake free."

I'm having fun with acronyms.

The Nibiru Evaluation And Response Multi-International Strategic Subcomittee.

user61230

@BESW A thin, scraggly man skirts quickly into a small, musty bar in the corner of the slums. He passes through the door quickly, then closes it with a soft snap. His eyes dash around the room, hastily checking to see whether he threw himself into the fire - but finds himself in a small, dimly-lit, but friendly pub. He in breathes deeply, and exhales. Smiling gently, he approaches the counter...

user61230

6:14 AM

[names like these make me want to write again; I miss writing]

You should!

Seconded.

user61230

we'll... have to see...

You should. And I should too. Argh. Writing.

user61230

usually once I start, I end up devoting a month or two of my life to writing, and that can be a problem

6:16 AM

I have a question i don't know how to make a good fit for the site...

Speaking of writing, I was poking at a topic for the blog, but I think I've condensed it into a paragraph, so I might as well just put it here.

In a game where failure is boring, game mechanics which signify a character is bad at something exclude that character from participating in those activities, as their contribution is disregarded by the system. The more time an activity takes up in-game, the more of an issue it is: a situation where half the players are having fun, and your character sheet says you can't, is to be avoided.

This is the source of combat optimization, and this is why stats are detrimental in D&D.

6

I am considering changing or (de)emphasizing rules depending on the situation of the campaign.. and I want to know if its been done before successfully. Basically, if the players are in a survival situation, counting bullets matters, and using encomberence rules matters. If they are adventuring, well stocked, with time to rest... not so much.

@Magician Blog it anyway.

@BESW If we get some sort of a conversation going to give me some more material. Or do you think a single paragraph is worth it?

That paragraph well could be.

However, expanding on its implications and contexts could be valuable.

For example, a Devil's Advocate response:

6:21 AM

Seems like it's only looking at one side of the situation. Going by that, you seem to be suggesting that all players should be equally capable at all tasks, which effectively removes all character customization.

How does a system disregard failed contributions, when the system itself is what determines the failure? That's interaction!

Also--address systems which run on being bad at something.

Alternatively, you might be contending that failure itself should also be fun, which seems like a more reasonable argument to make, but it doesn't seem like that's what you were going for.

@AgentPaper You can still have customization within a task: one can be good at combat in a dozen different customizable ways. But one frequently either has high Charisma and social skills, or they don't.

@BESW Hmm? Can you provide an example of such system?

@Magician Paranoia, Great Ork Gods, Roll For Shoes.

Even in Fate, it's fundamental to compels and fail-forward plot advancement.

@BESW Have only played one of them, and didn't know the rules by order.

@BESW Yes, but Fate doesn't have boring failure.

6:27 AM

Okay, so the "a game where failure is boring..." Hrm.

@BESW Lack of agency!

@Magician So, your argument is that all characters should be good at any general task, and instead vary in how, specifically, they handle said task?

@AgentPaper In a sense. Or they can be bad at a task, but in such a way that they still affect the game.

Sadly, I'm being summoned away. Will read anything you have to say once I'm back!

user61230

@BESW I can hardly call it great, but seeing as you generated the name for it, /shrug. I think I'm not gonna continue right now, though. It's late, and I'm tired, and... not really up to writing to my quality satisfaction at the moment.

@Emrakul Heheh.

user61230

6:31 AM

The name just inspired a rather vivid image. Thank you for that!

My pleasure.

@Magician That makes more sense, though few tasks are as easily defined as combat. Does it really make sense to ensure that everyone can contribute to, say, tracking an enemy, when that might come up a handful of times in a given campaign?

@AgentPaper "The more time an activity takes up in-game, the more of an issue it is" ;)

And now I'm really gone

@Magician True, in that case then what you're really saying is that, the more important a certain aspect of the game is, the more that game should flesh said aspect out. So, in the case of Dungeons and Dragons, which has a major focus on combat, it makes sense that combat gets the most focus. Few other elements are likely to take up as much time, as often, to deserve similar treatment.

Obviously it depends on the group, but the only thing that I can think of that comes close to combat is simple role-playing, which this doesn't really apply to since you can't "fail" at role-playing unless you're simply bad at it as a player.

Social interactions with NPCs might also count, but 1) DnD isn't really meant to handle that, 2) As much as it is meant to handle it, it's meant to rely more on roleplaying rather than roll-playing, and 3) It already does allow players to participate in different ways, to a degree.

you can be the charismatic guy convincing people, but you can also be the wise man that understands others well and uses that to convince people, or the intelligent person who can use facts and logics.

You can even be the strong guy that intimidates people into doing what you want, or the nimble guy that uses slight of hand to trick people.

You know, once you access the ability to hijack helicopters in Prototype... It suddenly becomes very cheap XD

6:40 AM

Some of these are, obviously, more effective than others, and if you really want to do well in social situations you'll want a good mix of them, but I think it's more rare for one or more players to feel "left out" and unable to contribute for extended periods of time than you give credit for.

Also, it's just awesome flying around in a chopper for a while blowing everything up, then all of a sudden just dropping out of the chopper and landing in the middle of a military base like "Oh, this is perfectly normal, don't mind me."

> PROJECT DAEDALUS Mission: To (a) design, (b) construct, and (c) launch a (d) manned spacecraft to be (e) flown within Mercury orbit for (f) rendezvous with the celestial object known as Nibiru-1 (henceforth N-1) with the purpose of (g) evaluating its nature and threat level and subsequently (h) destroying N-1 or (i) neutralising N-1 or (j) retrieving N-1 for further study, as determined by the appropriate authorities.

@BESW, what's this for, anyways?

My game tonight.

I mean what kind of game

6:46 AM

We're using slightly modified Atomic Robo RPG (Fate engine) rules for a custom modern fantasy/sci-fi setting inspired by Atomic Robo, Hellboy, X-Files, Warehouse 13, Stargate, etc.

Project Orion (nuclear propulsion)

Well, not sure if this is relevant, but if you're planning a long-distance space journey, you should totally use this:

Project Orion was a study of a spacecraft intended to be directly propelled by a series of explosions of atomic bombs behind the craft (nuclear pulse propulsion). Early versions of this vehicle were proposed to take off from the ground with significant associated nuclear fallout; later versions were presented for use only in space. General proposals were first made by Stanislaw Ulam in 1946, and preliminary calculations were made by F. Reines and Ulam in a Los Alamos memorandum dated 1947. The actual project, initiated in 1958, was led by Ted Taylor at General Atomics and physicist Freeman Dyson...

Aye, I'm planning to mention it to my players when propulsion options come up.

I have an idea if they don't come up with one, partially inspired by Project Orion, but more details would need to be in The Spoil-Lair.

But magic and mad science are also options for propulsion in this setting.

`ello.

[wave]

I find it hard to believe that you could get more mad science than "blow yourself across the solar system with nuclear bombs"

6:49 AM

I NEED SOMEONE WITH LINGUISTIC SKILLS

@AgentPaper Well, I'm hoping that interstellar travel turns out to be maddeningly eldtrich, so...

I need a neck massage...

@Lord_Gareth I ACCIDENTALLY THE CAPSLOCK.

@BESW EXCELLENT

I NEED A TERM WHICH IS OPPOSITE IN MEANING TO 'ENTROPY'

Wait, no, there it is.

6:51 AM

Really, GameMechanics.SE? I'm a bit skeptical.

Define entropy in your context.

@BESW Rot, breakdown, decay. The trend of the universe to erode and die.

So You Want to Be a Wizard entropy

Growth?

@Lord_Gareth Are you referring to entropy in physics, or as a symbolic concept?

Harmony, growth?

6:52 AM

[rubs temples] I apologize if my cat ever sends messages when I'm out of the room (or, at times, in the room, but then I can delete them :P). She almost did just now... it chiefly consisted of "ewwwwwwwww." Apparently, Shadow is not amused by the topic at hand. But nobody asked her.

Wait, what's that thing where life springs from nothingness?

@AgentPaper THIS. THIS IS WHAT I WANT

What they used to think made flies show up around dead meat

Oh! That! Hrm...

Spontaneous generation?

6:53 AM

Autopoeisis is one option: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autopoiesis

Creation.

Genesis

> "Autopoiesis" (from Greek αὐτo- (auto-), meaning "self", and ποίησις (poiesis), meaning "creation, production") refers to a system capable of reproducing and maintaining itself.

Autogenesis or Abiogenesis seems to be it

Abiogenesis

Abiogenesis (/ˌeɪbaɪ.ɵˈdʒɛnɨsɪs/ AY-by-oh-JEN-ə-siss) or biopoiesis is the natural process of life arising from non-living matter such as simple organic compounds. The Earth formed about 4.5 billion years ago. The earliest undisputed evidence of life on Earth dates at least from 3.5 billion years ago, during the Eoarchean Era after a geological crust started to solidify following the earlier molten Hadean Eon. There are microbial mat fossils found in 3.48 billion-year-old sandstone discovered in Western Australia. Other early physical evidence for life on Earth is biogenic graphite in 3.7 billion...

afk a while

@lisardggY I love you. Marry me.

6:54 AM

@Lord_Gareth I'm afraid local laws and customs forbid me from taking another spouse.

But I'll put you on the waiting list!

I knew that unfinished seminar on network theory would come in useful some day.

[Sigh]

TFW I finally acquire Steam and I'm still too poor for games.

7:16 AM

@Lord_Gareth Dont worry, when the steam sale comes around you'll starve yourself a bit for a few games lol, everyone always does. Stock up on ramen now before the sale comes, you'll thank me later.

(ps: I don't have steam, but I always keep a stockpile of ramen for just such an occasion that I MUST have this game AND it's on sale AND I can't eat for a while if I get it.)

@Dorian Children, rent, and broken car say 'no'.

Thankfully the smell of ramen doesn't make me gag anymore. For a while it used to, but then again I had been eating it nonstop for about 3 months straight due to lack of finances.

@Lord_Gareth That's why you take it out of your personal food budget. I didn't say shirk your other obligations, but you can meet them and cut out a couple of your own meals a day :P

Miniman

I leave chat alone for a few hours and it explodes...

@Miniman It has a tendency to do that.

trogdor

@Miniman welcome to my life XD

though to be fair I often times leave it alone a little longer than a few hours

7:28 AM

Also, finally started my Fate/Dresden Files campaign, spent the first session creating the city we'll be playing it, and it's fabulous.

7:54 AM

@lisardggY Oooer. Share, share!

8:24 AM

@AgentPaper @AgentPaper it's a related topic, but not quite the same. The more fleshed out rules for an activity are, the more opportunity there is to express the desired nuance of character customization in it. With a bit of effort, one can use Charisma in combat in D&D. But if one doesn't have good Charisma, their contributions to social scenes are severely limited by the system.

This is due partly to goblin dice, and partly subverted by not actually using rules (like you describe) in "roleplaying", a topic of my previous post, paradigms of play.

Prodigious self-promotion, yay.

"Prodigious Self-Promotion" would be a good name for an insufferable hipster band.

("Insufferable Hipster" would, in turn, be a good name for a post-post-irony band.)

@BESW I'd think it's something like "Band".

No, that's post-nuance.

@Magician Charisma might be the most important stat for a social scene, but that doesn't mean it's all-important, or that characters with lower charisma can't contribute. Wisdom and Intelligence can very much contribute, and even Strength and Charisma can help in less obvious ways, like picking the bad guy's pockets for the macguffin, or intimidating someone with a show of strength, etc.

I agree that some characters will likely contribute more, but "severly limited" seems to be over-stating things, and it's rare that an encounter will be purely social in the same way that most fights are purely combat.

@BESW Also, post-post-irony sounds like a good name for an insufferable hipster band.

@AgentPaper Consider a party with a half-orc barbarian and an elven sorcerer. Both can contribute equally well in a fight (potentially), but one can also talk to people well. To take 3.5 as a game with this paradigm that I still remember something about, there'll be a difference of about 10 in their social skills.

8:39 AM

Ah, well I'm mostly talking about 5e, where the difference is, at most, 6, and more likely much smaller.

er, wait. I forgot proficiency

Ayup

So I guess it could go up to 12 at the extreme end.

Which grows with levels

There is still nuance, of course, and counter-examples and use cases to be found. Instead, consider a simplistic system, where there are only 3 skills: action, talk, find. PCs get to assign +1, +0 and -1 to them (skill check is a d6 roll). It's a obviously bad system, as it forces PCs to sacrifice not areas of expertise, but areas of gameplay.

Still, I'm not sure the alternatives are better. From what I can tell, either you need to make the bard and the barbarian equally good at social skills, making them homogenous and removing a lot of what makes the bard unique, or you have to add a whole lot of extra to the social system to allow each of them to contribute in different ways.

One example of making this work is FAE with its approaches.

8:43 AM

Oh, though a Barbarian is likely to have a higher wisdom than the sorcerer/bard/etc, so they can contribute by, for example, knowing when the merchant is lying, or understanding the true motives of the noble, when the socerer/bard might not by canny enough to notice.

They don't describe what you do (Strength = punching people, Charisma = talking to people), but how you do it. I'd ask BESW for a more in-depth example here, as I'm not quite familiar with that iteration of Fate myself.

@AgentPaper Neither class has anything to do with Wisdom, and it's a nice tertiary stat for all of them. So they could have it, or not.

I don't really like the sound of that. Seems like you're basically telling the player what they do, rather than telling them what they can do.

In 5e, barbarian gets some good bonuses from wisdom, such as an AC bonus and I think a couple other things.

It's probably not 20 or anything, but it's higher than most.

(normally)

Miniman

Um...barbairan doesn't get a bonus from Wis

his AC bonus is from Con

Oh. Whoops.

I guess that would be the Monk doing all that then, heh.

There's a middle ground between the extremes you're imagining @AgentPaper. D&D works it like this: either you have social skills (even cross-class), or you don't. If you don't, you don't get to participate in social scenes.

Which is...

Kinda bad

By which I mean extremely bad.

8:46 AM

I disagree that it's that big of a deal, but sure.

Even the dumb barbarian can contribute by intimidating people, if nothing else.

But the solution is not necessarily "Everyone is equally good at this in different ways" but rather implementing ways in which everyone can contribute to the problem at hand.

@AgentPaper Intimidate is typically a Cha skill too, sadly.

There are rules for using Strength as well.

You just need to reason it out a bit, like say that you're bending an iron bar to display your strength or whatever.

Which works only in some contexts, but not in many others. Doing that at a royal ball to intimidate a duke would not be entirely appropriate, for instance.

Frankly Scion has this problem really hard. The system expects you to pitch groups that contain, like, a dude who juggles battleships (not kidding) and a dude who can lie to reality (still not kidding) at the same problems and both come out having done something.

When, really, if you're swapping riddles with Thoth then Captain Battleship doesn't get to do jack.

And if you're fighting Surtr chances are Mr. Suave isn't really doing jack either.

8:50 AM

You also seem to be implying that there's nothing to social encounters other than "roll to convince NPC" or similar. Even if the Bard is the only character that has good social stats, the rest of the party is likely still involved in the meat of things, which is role-playing and talking. The bard might be the one that mechanically contributes the most, but that doesn't necessarily mean that he's the only one participating.

Yes, social encounters are special that way because many people don't use rules, or use them sparingly (see that paradigms post). But that hardly excuses the rules themselves.

@AgentPaper The thing is, you can't make that claim about a system unless the mechanics back it up. Social mechanics exist for a reason. What if a person who's shy in real life wants to play a suave character?

Being able to ignore the rules does not excuse you from creating competent rules.

Then they should play a suave character. Being able to play a suave character depends on player skill, not character skill.

If they want to back that up with mechanical competence, then they can do that too.

@AgentPaper So you want the shy person to just stop being shy?

That's kinda a "poor people should just stop being poor" solution.

Anyways, I'm not trying to say that the issue doesn't exist, only that it's not as big a deal as you're making it out to be, or as fundamental to the game.

8:54 AM

If that is the solution, why are there social skills on the sheet?

@Lord_Gareth Mechanics can't make a shy player stop being shy, is what I'm saying.

@AgentPaper But they can help that person feel like they're playing a suave, sophisticated character in the same way that mechanics can make you feel like a mighty warrior.

Which is why making them competently is so freaking important.

Sure, and the rules already support that.

Pump charisma, take social skills, done.

'Kay, but then we get back to the heart of the issue, which is: if we all cleared our schedules to sit down with each other for 4-8 hours straight and play a game

Why are there chunks of it where some people don't get to play?

Yeah, I agree that's an issue. I just don't think it has an easy solution.

8:57 AM

The concept is easy. The execution's a bitch.

At least, not one that doesn't make the problem worse by sacrificing other important aspects of the game.

But, then, creating most simple things is usually vastly complicated.

Hence the discussion.

The best thing to do, at least for now, is to keep it in mind as a DM and not design situations where half of your group has to sit out.

Sure, being mindful of involving all characters is important. But that doesn't solve the underlying issue many systems have: forcing players to choose which type of scene they want to contribute to.

9:00 AM

@Magician This. You can make the system so it helps, rather than hinders, the group dynamic.

If there are 3 types of equally important activities characters can engage in, putting points into them from the same pool is, perhaps, suboptimal. That's the thing that's causing people to choose between Skill Focus(Diplomacy) and Weapon Focus.

I don't think the issue is whether they can contribute or not. It's whether they can participate or not. It's OK for the fighter to not be as persuasive as the bard, as long as he has plenty to say during the conversation with the noble, or whatever.

Suggestion: social scenes are the most clear example, mechanics wise, but they do come with the "just roleplay it" baggage. Switch to exploration, instead?

Sure

Or hacking, or whatever. I'm told Shadowrun had this issue: hackers began doing their thing, others can go have a pizza.

9:02 AM

In that case, the physical stats become more important, but all of them are still viable, I think, except perhaps charisma (ironically)

@Magician Despite being a big fan of "just roleplay it", I do despise this baggage. Just because it's fine for my group doesn't mean it's okay to lean on as a solution in the system >.<

Well, one nice thing is, even if your group doesn't want to roleplay social stuff, you can just have the bard roll a few dice and bam, social encounter over. On to the part you want to spend time on!

Of course, that does become a problem if the bard does want to roleplay it out, but everyone else doesn't, but that's more an issue of playstyles conflicting.

Anyways, I have to get to sleep. Will read stuff in the morning if need be.

G'night!

Assuming chat messages last that long.

It's all logged, forever!

9:21 AM

heres an idea for a social combat hack... no matter who is doing the talking, the skill level of the entire party counts.

Evens the playing field

9:37 AM

I just noticed the bloody charisma talk and noticed my chat was lagged to no end.

Well here's my two cents: Screw Charisma. In the evil PF game I'm in, the most socially adept person has a 7 in Charisma. It's my Inquisitor. The Antipaladin with a high Charisma can't even match me (I think his Charisma is 18-20 range?). Because Inquisitors get this nice Inquisition... Change Bluff and Intimidate to Wisdom skills. Also, have another feature (forget if it's an Archetype or a Trait) that allows me to add both my Wisdom and my Charisma to my Diplomacy.

So even my Diplomacy rivals that of the Antipaladin party face.

Didn't care so much about Diplomacy, was more interested in Bluff/Intimidate, because of infiltration and all the fun stuff that Intimidate can do. But having Diplo decent is good to have too, just in case it's a good idea to tell the truth about something for once lol.

10:02 AM

@Lord_Gareth wrargh, you talk about my charisma problems without me, guys.

The worst thing about charisma is that if you roleplay a high charisma character without being charismatic, it shows and often breaks immersion (especially in a game like mine where you can't say "and he does his diplomatic thing" but everything needs to be roleplayed). All while charisma is the best stat to go if you want to be SAD, because of all the feats and spells that change things to be Cha-based.

10:33 AM

@Zachiel Yeah, easy to make a monster of Charisma and dump all the stats. But you would be a monster with all that dipping, it's probably not a good idea lol

No that actually makes you weaker

I didn't mean "monster" as in a powerful character. I meant "monster" as in abomination.

@Dorian And yes, that makes you weaker.

having all things go to charisma is useless when you don't have something to use those rolls with. E.G. a high bab for better full attacking.

10:49 AM

@Zachiel Well if you're using fractional BAB it's slightly better

11:03 AM

@Dorian if I'm going full monster, it's often level adjustments

@Zachiel Oh but there are so many ways to stack templates without getting a massive LA

12:05 PM

Alright, time to fiddle with race ideas... Considering a Swordsage/Factotum character... Whisper Gnome might be fun... Was also thinking about an Incarnate Construct Warforged plus something else (if it's allowed lol). Any interesting suggestions that would be fun to play and might bring a some unique flavor or mechanics to this dualclass?

Phrenic might be nice. The DM already stated that Psionic Transparency is not in effect so its Power Resistance isn't as powerful anymore... Though it's Psi-Like Abilities might just be much more powerful now too... (DM also stated that he has little plans to have the party face Psionic users)

Could try to use the Spellwarped Creature template... It would fit the flavor and have some interesting roleplay effects...

1:32 PM

In tonight's #Paranoia playtest, our heroes met... The Candyman. Everyone died. http://t.co/BWPqLJmXXI

Tweeted by gshowitt on November 22, 2014 at 1:20 PM

Doom candy! Now color-coded!

4

very nice :) hehehe

@Magician don't touch the ones you're not cleared for

2:01 PM

Tonight we did chargen and intro session for our Weird Stuff campaign.

Characters:
- photobiologist/astroengineer who turned himself into a plant mutant
- the plant he uplifted into a humanoid as proof of concept before trying it on himself; she is now a xenosociologist studying humanity
- geneticist/ninja with a perfection complex (and apparently prejudice against mutants despite being blasé about re-writing his own genetics)
- retired G-man looking for Magic And Wonder
- telekinetic security guard with a Jedi-like code of honour
- hacker/gearhead plagued with moral qualms

And two of my players made this:

Between all our PCs, we have overt references to Warehouse 13, Star Wars, Stargate, and Doctor Who (twice).

In the past few hours I have wrecked more helicopters with my bad driving than I have by actually playing the game and killing military folks =_=

Oh look, I rammed another BRIDGE. =_=

And there go a few more street lights.

@Dorian In the past few hours I've been falling countless times from the same invisible bridge, with a golem charging at me

What game?

Dark [snip]ing Souls

Aah, good game lol. Don't think I made it to the part you're talking about though. I can only take it in small doses lol

YES CITIZENS FLEE IN TERROR OF MY SMOKING NEARLY DEAD CHOPPER AS IT FLIES OVERHEAD OCCASIONALLY RAMMING INTO BUILDINGS AND BREAKING ALL YOUR STREET LIGHTS

(note, the above is said in an Arnold Schwarzenegger voice)

Awww crud... Helicopter died. Time to hijack another one!

2:22 PM

what are you playing? The Walking Dead?

Prototype.

Currently flying through all of NYC trying to find certain targets that spawn at random =_=

(where you can get a chopper and one of those things with a bulky cylinder to flatten the streets and combine them into a firethrowing death rollstomping badass bike)

It's much easier in a helicopter than running. It's a little more slowgoing, but less dodging bullets and "infected"

I've been playing DS since... I think it was january

I'd like to be able to progress faster

Then play a different game :P

You can't progress faster in Dark Souls

2:25 PM

I started it as a sort of "let's show the world even I can get to the end of this very hard game"

I played Demon's Souls before it, loved it, replayed it repeatedly. Sad that it's only PS3 and I had to sell mine. Liked it better than Dark Souls also. Though Dark Souls is more challenging in its own way.

I don't want to change game and I like exploring the world, it's just... frustrating, at times

Oi vhey you should see me in Skyrim =_= If I don't dedicate myself to a specific task I'll wander the world for eons.

And even when I do dedicate myself to a specific task... I usually wander alot, and collect random gear pieces because I wanna look cool.

Oh, what did you pick as your starting gift?

aaand again

the master key

And what did you pick as your class?

2:27 PM

bandit

Aah, I usually pick black firebombs and thief.

now I'm in havel's ring, claymore, black iron shield and black iron garb, except for my trousers

Because thief gets the key anyways, and the black firebombs are great for clearing early bosses.

I don't like consumables

I use the Master Key to cheat a bit lol.

2:28 PM

I'm a hoarder

and a completionist

Well most of the other gifts kinda suck, and the black firebombs rule for taking out early bosses with ease.

and also a minmaxer

The Master Key lets you sequence break a bit early on, which works out pretty well for me. I follow the sequence still, but I break it to get powerful gear early.

I can't count how many times I died in Blighttown entering from the back door and running to collect as much gear as I can lol

I'm a bad completionist. I couldn't get to attack Priscilla

she did nothing wrong

Blah. This time the golem two-shotted me

He can also oneshot me

The fartherst I've been was a bit after the second bell.

Though I've explored alot beyond that (just avoided bosses because they'd whoop me bigtime lol)

That was on my "farthest" game, which I erased a while back because I screwed up my build lol

2:41 PM

@Dorian you can't screw up, unless you go for PVP

You can if you're at a point where you do crap for damage and all your gear is set up for the wrong stats and you can't kill things in the area you're in lol

3:14 PM

you just go elsewhere and farm

there's nothing like a level cap

you can get 99 in all stats

3:32 PM

Yeah... I'd rather start over than completely re-grind at that point, usually takes less time lol

Metool

3:45 PM

@Magician Scrolled up to this, expecting keycards.

Miniman

4:05 PM

Damn you internet, keeping me up till 3am...

@Miniman Yes, 'tis I, le Internette, twirling my mustache as I disrupt your dreams.

4:30 PM

DARKNEEEESSS

grats, Lord

9:39 PM

So, I've got a bit of a problem.

For my campaign, I have 12 major countries that makes up the world, each based on an element such as fire, ice, wood, moon, storm, etc.

So far, I've just been calling them "Wood Kingdom" or "Sand Nation" or whatever, but that just seems lazy and not very interesting.

However, at the same time I don't want to call them "The Kingdom of Almerid" or "The Sultanate of Hoobooboo" or whatever random names.

I want each country's name to have a solid tie-in to the element it represents, if nothing else so that they're easier to keep track of and remember, and I'd also like for them to have at least a bit of consistency with each other.

Any ideas?

latin names?

Such as?

Garan

Anyone else think the 5e counterspell is overpowered?

It certainly seems powerful, especially in the situation of 1-2 casters versus a more powerful caster, such as a party going up against a lich, but I don't have enough experience to say whether it's over-powered.

It certainly makes it so that you don't want to lead with your strongest spell, though.

Garan

Ah, just checked and it's ability check and not spellcasting check. Still a bit weird, but not on the level of 40% chance of countering a 9th level spell at 6th wizard level.

9:55 PM

Ah, yep. At best, a 35% chance with a casting stat of 20.

Though that has some other odd effects. For example, a Bard would add half proficiency from Jack of All Trades

Garan

But then you'd need to multiclass into bard. Could be worth it if you're optimizing (which, with this char, I'm not)

remember that counterspell can auto counter if you just cast it in a higher slot. High failure chance vs higher slot use for auto success doesn't seem all that OP to me

Joshua Aslan Smith

10:12 PM

Counterspell only works specifically against spells right, not monster abilities that are like spells but not spells?

@AgentPaper lich's have spell slots out the wazoo

Do they also have actions out the wazoo? Doesn't matter how many slots they have if the wizard can effectively cost them half of their turns or more.

I guess any single caster meant to be a threat should be getting legendary actions or the like, though.

Also, just remembered that Abjurer adds their proficiency to counterspell as a feature (starting at level 10), so they'd be the prime counter-speller, not a bard.

At that level you could easily have a +9 mod, so 50-50 chance of counter-spelling a level 9 spell with a level 3 slot. Which, to be honest, is probably what it needs to be for counterspell to be worth using.

10:29 PM

@AgentPaper yep

Hey folks

Hello

Have any of you had someone who is a min-maxed that wanted to be GM? I am curious as to what to expect from him

Min-maxer even...

Min maxing is an accepted playing style here.

Its a play style, not a problem

I think the biggest thing to be aware of (and ask about!) is whether he expects you to be min-maxing your characters or not

otherwise, you could wind up in over your head when it comes to encounters

(i.e. your party isn't as optimized as your DM expects it to be)

the only other question I'd have -- and this is mostly for RP purposes -- is how profession-dedicated he expects characters to be

10:46 PM

Yeah, not saying it's bad...we enjoy playing with the guy...just not sure if there's anything to be prepared for

does he expect his party's bard to be spending most of their town-time in the tavern carousing, or sitting there alone with his flute practicing eight hours a day?

We haven't played with him GMing yet

nods I'd ask him both those questions up-front -- they'll go a ways into setting the social contract for the game

But my biggest concern is that role-playing goes out the window

Not a bad suggestion.

@DavidWilkins: Stormwind Fallacy, man. you can have highly optimized characters that still make for good story

there's also some value to pushing parts of the optimization aspect in-character (as much as the game will let you, at least)

10:52 PM

Thanks...that alleviates my worries some

while your characters may not know the exact stats on gear -- they can make qualitative comparisons nonetheless

mages might bounce thoughts on what spells to have ready for the next day off of each other

as well as the tactical aspects of planning, for that matter

there's nothing inherently wrong with RPing out what makes your party a well-oiled machine

Did I mention my sorcerer is secretly going insane? Hehe....

It's a slow process

some say that sanity is overrated. ;)

He shifted the tables in our favor against a mean Naga by repeatedly using a rod of wonder....got really lucky

Thanks again shalvenay....later!

11:20 PM

@DavidWilkins I've found that often a person's playstyle shifts strongly between running a PC and being a GM.