Root Access

12:04 AM

hm,

'join my favourite rooms' is missing

I've having too much fun with this. What else should I add? Maybe glitter graphics, DHTML effects? lol t3hpengu1nofd00m.com

Now it has a Like button and "commentses" sections!

Journeyman Geek

@iglvzx: what are you trying to do? ;p

iglvzx

@JourneymanGeek Just having fun. Teaching myself SEO and Facebook API. Thought I'd make a website for my favorite piece of Internet literature as an exercise. More info here: knowyourmeme.com/memes/katy-t3h-pengu1n-of-d00m

Journeyman Geek

The internet is an odd place ;p

I guess that makes sense tho

iglvzx

Yeah.

allquixotic

12:17 AM

I'm back \o/

jokerdino

1:28 AM

@allquixotic @OliverSalzburg Hehe, thanks guys.

@allquixotic I am conserving my bandwidth for the month. Yet to switch to unlimited bandwidth plan. Will hang around more starting next month. :)

allquixotic

2:13 AM

@jokerdino you can switch to an unlimited data plan? O_O

jokerdino

The one I am currently on is 2.5GB / month and I am sharing that with my sis and dad.

I am trying to get my dad to switch to the unlimited bandwidth plan. Meaning no surcharge for exceeding any limit whatsoever.

Yes, please, clippy.

allquixotic

@jokerdino you're so lucky that you have the opportunity to actually switch to an unlimited data plan. -_-

over here, no amount of money (short of remaining "grandfathered" into an existing plan) will allow you to upgrade to unlimited.

Journeyman Geek

@allquixotic: which sucks

though

Bob

6:56 AM

Aaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrggggghhh

I have never been so close to defenestrating a computer

Journeyman Geek

lol

what're you installing instead?

Bob

Attempting COM automation with Word in "pure" C++

With basically no idea what I'm doing

No MFC, no ATL, bleh

Alexey Ivanov

7:35 AM

@Bob I did it with Excel 8 years ago, exported the results of computation into an Excel workbook. Nothing fancy, just put the values into cells

Bob

7:47 AM

@AlexeyIvanov well, I have no idea:P

barely managed to get the program to open

suddenly - memory error

can't open a saved document

wth is a variant

did the same thing in .NET earlier today, that was messy enough

I'm beginning to think it would be easier to find some way to compile the .NET version (with all associated libraries) to native code

but then mono has issues with COM

Alexey Ivanov

8:49 AM

Well, as far as I remember it took me quite a lot of time on how to do it right. If I'm not mistaken I used the built-in Visual Basic for Applications to prototype and lookup properties and methods, then I ported it to C++.
I didn't save the document.

Bob

@AlexeyIvanov I know which COM methods to use (from the .NET version)

it's actually using COM from C++, and the typing, that's screwing me over :P

also, the type library is subtly different somehow

Alexey Ivanov

@Bob .Net was relatively new thing then...

and I actually never wrote anything using .Net

I don't have that code with me and I already don't remember how I did it that time

It didn't seem too hard yet it was tedious

Bob

lol

so, uh.. anyone here know COM/C++ and would be willing to try to help? :P

or be a rubber duck? :P

Alexey Ivanov

9:16 AM

@Bob You can try at Stack Overflow. There are more programmers there :)

Bob

@AlexeyIvanov but they're scary D:

lol

Alexey Ivanov

@Bob And I used MFC – not pure COM.

Bob

@AlexeyIvanov Ah, yea. I can't use that from VC++ Express, AFAIK

Journeyman Geek

9:37 AM

bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-21410565

Bob

o.O

also, how do you get stabbed with a screwdriver?

I mean, how much damage can that cause? :S

Journeyman Geek

quite a bit

especially if its sharpened

Bob

..ok, note to self: learn martial arts. and maybe wear body armour everywhere

also, never search cstring on Google in a work environment

jokerdino

@Bob no, i am not going to search that. aaaah

@JourneymanGeek looks like you and me will progress to the next round. :D

Journeyman Geek

9:56 AM

@jokerdino: yeah ;p

barely in my case

jokerdino

There are five people in the negative I think.

Journeyman Geek

yeah, massive downvotes

I got like 17

jokerdino

woah.

Journeyman Geek

o0

jokerdino

i had 2 and was sad enough ;/

Journeyman Geek

9:58 AM

no, 10... not that bad

@jokerdino: ...2?

WHY?

jokerdino

No idea. Everyone got downvotes.

Journeyman Geek

Yeah

which feels wierd to me

like really, unless someone is totally unsuited for mod-ship ._.

jokerdino

or someone feels strongly about someone

Journeyman Geek

in this case, maybe stratergic voting ._.

jokerdino

that could be it

Journeyman Geek

10:02 AM

/me isn't sure if he can make it for all of the town hall chat

jokerdino

I dont think I can

It is in the middle of the night.

Journeyman Geek

its during dog walking time for me

jokerdino

but i think we can answer questions after the one hour.

Journeyman Geek

yeah, we can

Bob

@jokerdino next round? o.O

Journeyman Geek

10:06 AM

actual elections

jokerdino

I mean the next phase.

Bob

...what elections?

I missed something big...

Hm, elections in AU.

@Bob: on AU

ah

11:03 AM

Morning

Bob

Morning.

Or, rather, evening.

allquixotic

11:23 AM

@Bob that is folly. why are you trying to do that?

I've seen examples of COM server automation in C++. It should be illegal to write a programming interface that unfriendly.

Apache POI or OpenXML SDK for huge processing workloads. VBA or C# COM automation for quick hacks (I'd prefer the simplicity of VBA over the verbosity of C++ anyday.)

barlop

12:05 PM

anybody skilled enough to find the download links for any of these drivers ?! mediatek.com/_en/07_downloads/01_windows.php?sn=500

Bob

@allquixotic I have a C# implementation already

but they want one that does not rely on .NET

it's painful.

I really can't figure this out :\

May have to ask on SO (or their chat)

@barlop aren't the download links on the page?

do you have access to the computer?

barlop

yeah

I can't see them

Bob

slightly more human friendly names can sometimes be found in the device manager

barlop

err

Bob

@barlop click the 'part number's

barlop

12:08 PM

I have access a computer with internet access hence I can type this

I am looking for RT 2571

I clicked that one but still no download link

USB (RT257x/RT2671/RT520x) mediatek.com/_en/07_downloads/01-1_windowsDetail.php?sn=5008

Bob

@barlop you may need to provide an email address and they email thel ink?

@barlop just enter any junk and any email@example.com and click submit

:P

barlop

yeah i've sent them two

Bob

@barlop ..when you click submit, a download should start...

the actual download is a post request to dl.php with a couple of params

barlop

hmm

well, it says waiting

Bob

o.O

barlop

12:17 PM

ah you're right.. thanks

Bob

it was instant for me :S

barlop

maybe 'cos it was waiting 'cos you were downloading / had requested it ? ;-)

Bob

lol

I never actually downloaded

but if they have a max of one concurrent request.. someone needs to be smacked

barlop

somebody needs to be smacked for designing that webpage so you can't just access the download link

with a hyperlink

Bob

they do that quite often

to collect emails

@Hennes has the right idea

Feb 6 at 19:51, by Hennes

Ok, submitted from info@tumblr.com (crap requiring mail may eat their own spam)

I need to start doing that

Hennes

12:24 PM

abuse/info/postmaster@potential.spammer.tld

Bob

@Hennes even more convenient in this case

Hennes

If I feel vengefull I will try sales@ .. ;)

Bob

Hennes

grins

leo

1:07 PM

hello there!

Bob

hello!

leo

how long does it take to install Windows Vista?

yesterday, only the last step in the setup it took about 6 hours

and apparently it was far from finish. It just put a black screen with pointer at the center.

and do nothing

Bob

urgh

why does C++ have half a dozen different string types?

@leo depends. if not installing updates, I'd say an hour at most on a modern machine.

(that's for Win7 anyway)

maybe give it two hours. but 6? :S

leo

@Bob This one is from 2007

Bob

shouldn't be 6. except maybe updates over a slow connection

leo

1:19 PM

it have an AMD Athlon. I've read that those slow the installation.

Oliver Salzburg

@Bob std::string and std::wstring should be sufficient

Bob

@OliverSalzburg ...COM automation.

Oliver Salzburg

killmenow :D

leo

and that's the thing. The computer is off line

Oliver Salzburg

Then CString, I guess? :D

Bob

1:22 PM

I'm currently fiddling with _variant_t (BSTR), char *, CString (TCHAR). Looking at CComVariant, CComBSTR, COleVariant. Also seeing LPCSTR and LPCWSTR...

@leo yea, definitely abnormal

the HDD could be dying

@OliverSalzburg exactly how I feel :P

leo

@Bob indeed!

Bob

as a C# guy, all I needed to worry about before were a single string class (with different encoding options) and character arrays

oh, and maybe converting to and from byte arrays. but that was easy

Oliver Salzburg

@Bob LPCSTR AND LPCWSTR are just the bare pointer types

Bob

what are all these strings and string-like things?!

Oliver Salzburg

For char and wchar respectively

Bob

1:24 PM

ah. that helps quite a lot :P

thanks

leo

just happened something like this

Oliver Salzburg

I would assume the TCHAR based CString to be the hot sauce

leo

I'll format the disk with some Live CD. Then I'll try again

Bob

@OliverSalzburg the Word automation method requires VARIANT

@leo I'd do a surface scan too

Oliver Salzburg

@Bob Never seen that actually :D

Bob

1:25 PM

you probably have nothing to rescue, considering you're installing an OS

@OliverSalzburg that's what I was thinking :P

apparently it's more of VB's typing contamination

in C#, the same code would use object

leo

suddenly lack of energy does crashes the disk, right?

Oliver Salzburg

_variant_t seems to be some pointer wrapper/resource manager of sorts, I guess msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/k74e1xsh(v=vs.80).aspx

Bob

ok, i have a LPSTR and a TCHAR array that I need to combine now. hm.

@leo it could happen, but most disks are quite well protected against power loss nowadays

@OliverSalzburg yea, I'm using that

we really should be talking about this in the fake programmers room :P

meh.

Oliver Salzburg

@Bob If you're using TCHARs in your project, you shouldn't have strings that use LPSTR

Bob

once I'm done with this, I'll have to joy of figuring out multithreading and notification icons in C++

Oliver Salzburg

1:29 PM

Should be LPTSTR or LPCTSTR, I guess :D

Bob

@OliverSalzburg I don't know! :P

Oliver Salzburg

TCHAR is a macro that is expanded to CHAR or WCHAR, depending on if you're building for Unicode targets

Bob

ah

Oliver Salzburg

LPSTR implies a pointer to CHAR, so, that would be a problem when building for Unicode

But, you could first convert one to the other, then concat

Bob

well, the LPSTR was a constant anyways. So, add a L and problem solved. I hope.

Oliver Salzburg

1:32 PM

@Bob If it is a constant, it's surely a LPCSTR, right ;D

Bob

@OliverSalzburg hm.. perhaps!

Hennes

Whut?

Why would an athlon slow the installation?

Also, I never installed vista, but installing windows 7 (sort of vista SP1/2) takes somewhere between 30 minutes (from DVD) and 10 minutes (from USB)

I can't imagine vista being that much slower

Bob

@Hennes the 1 hour time I gave was more installing to VMs :P

Hennes

Isn;t it even faster on a VM with using an iso file?

Bob

no

thrashing is evil

not to mention IO throughput in a VM can be pretty crappy with expanding disks

Hennes

1:39 PM

I never use expending disks

I always allocate all needed space up front

Bob

I have more VM disk space than physical :P

on my laptop, anyway

Hennes

If I need more space I can always add a second virtual drive

Bob

still got maybe 3TB free on the desktop

Hennes

Anyway. Gets a timer. One sec

Bob

(which is filling up fast - I really need to delete some things)

Hennes

1:40 PM

And keep what you deleted on the backups ?

Bob

must have half a terabyte in VM disks, at least

Hennes

No shared disks in the VMs ?

Bob

@Hennes well, backups make up 1 TB

so that's 1 TB actual data and 500 GB os/programs/games

wth is that data

@Hennes nah.

I use shared host folders for that

one less file system to corrupt

Hennes

I got 76GiB (SSD, 20 GB used after 4 years), 1x1TB RAID (200GB work space, rest as storage).

Bob

and better concurrent access

I don't imagine VirtualBox being too happy about me starting two VMs with one virtual disk shared

Hennes

1:42 PM

OK, VM created. 20 GB disk allocated, egg timer ready to to time a win7 SP1 installation

"windows is loading files"

I have done that before without running two VMs at the same time

/usr/ports on one disk (always updated)

and two VMs which would use that disk file

"Expanding windows files" done at 5m38 sec. That took longer then I remembered

6m16 windows needs to restart.

9m30 setup will continue after rebooting your computer.

Installation complete at 11m 33 sec

Close enough to my 10 minutes guess.

Bob

2:09 PM

oh

FINALLY

turned out the stupid thing required an absolute path..

COM in pure C++ makes me want to throw/punch something

I have never been so frustrated with programming

problem in C#? hang tight and solve it

problem in C++ (STL was a horrible experience too)? wtfwtfwtf HOW DOES THAT EVEN WORK wutwutwut

Bob

2:38 PM

is anyone actually getting a Surface Pro?

Hennes

Nope.

1) Too expensive

2) The weight should be in the keyboard, not in the screen

(I would use it as a laptop)

Then again, I probably do not belong to the target audience for it

Bob

@Hennes hence the stand :P

heck, I don't even have a tablet

and not really planning to get one

Hennes

I want esATA out, display port out, one or more cardbus connectors. One of two free MiniPCIe slots for being able to expand it, ....

Bob

@Hennes ...just get a laptop :P

or, better, a desktop

Hennes

A tablet would be fine. With proper expandability, a plug for a full sized keyboard (no BT keybopard running on empty batteries) and a plug for a mouse

Aye. I have a laptop (3-4 KG). And I almost only use a desktop

Bob

2:42 PM

I doubt there's enough space for all that in an untrabook/tablet

@Hennes 3-4? that's pretty old?

Hennes

Dell E6500

I guess 4 years.

Bob

Most new (15") laptops are maybe up to 3kg at the heavier end

lighter non-ultrabooks maybe 2kg

Hennes

I am not even sure which CPU is in it. Just a nice LEd backlit keyboard (a must!) and a good (1920x1200) display

Bob

lol

I kinda wanted a hih res display

then I actually used one today.. the text is tiny

Hennes

Text size is up to you

If it is too small, increase the font.

And get crispier, sharper text

Bob

2:44 PM

too bad backlit keyboards are near impossible to find without customising one online

@Hennes not all programs support this, unfortunately

Hennes

Then the program is broken.

Bob

@Hennes also does not work too well for images. I get the impression that resizing/zooming images tend to introduce more artifacts than a lower pixel density

@Hennes well, yes. but what can you do? :P

Hennes

Stop using DOS age programs?

Bob

one is developed in a language/framework that should have died decades ago

Hennes

Well, buit yeah. Some stuff just is broken

Or does not work unless you have 800x600 screen res.

Bob

2:46 PM

(that language is still actively updated, too)

Hennes

(e.g. tax office internal software. Error on 1024x768 -> screen is to small)

Bob

@Hennes most of those are just fullscreen. at 640x480 or 800x600 (if you're lucky) :P

@Hennes overflow?

wait.. what data structure overflows in that range? :S

there isn't any..

Hennes

Bad coding. If 800x600 then start else throw error

Bob

lol

Hennes

old software

Bob

2:47 PM

heh. MS screwed up remote desktop client on Vista/7

Hennes

They should have used <= instead of <

Bob

does not maximise to fullscreen after restoring to windowed, if your resolution is 1366

there was a hotfix somewhere

@Hennes ah, yes. I hate that.

Hennes

But I have not run into any problems with a 15 inch 1920x1200 screen, except when I tried a game or two. ((rending to native resolution with an older laptop GPU is slow)

Bob

note to all developers: if you check OS version with string comparisons and i meet you, I will punch you.

get the major/minor version numbers and do greater/less than comparison ffs

Hennes

if (OS_version=="windows 97") then printf(" ....

Bob

2:49 PM

same goes for browser detection

this image is relevant surprisingly often:

Feb 4 at 8:58, by Bob

looks like they might have fixed tat

I'm tempted to download Beta to see if they fixed it properly

Journeyman Geek

@Hennes: or the ones tho thought firefox 4 was older than IE6

Hennes

Well firefox 1 8 and 1<6 ;-)

Bob

@JourneymanGeek heh. I guess i'm kinda making the assumption of Windows NT

DOS based Windows would have a different numbering scheme

anyone got a copy of Win98?

Hennes

Not anymore.

Why, does version number ?

I still got command.com and the two sys files to boot 98 though

Bob

I wanted to check how .NET's OS verion responds

I have a copy of the install ISO somewhere

the disc is probably buried under a mountain of crap in the basement

probably have better luck digging for the ISO.. assuming i remembered to copy it when moving computers o.O

uh oh

anyone got a boot floppy handy?

O.O

user88311

2:58 PM

Think I still have a copy of 98 but as to where it is, I'd have to dig through a pile of crap as well to get to it

Bob

apparently VMware can't boot the ISO

user88311

Actually

yes

Journeyman Geek

the dos boot disk windows xp generates is from 98

user88311

But it's in the same place as the 98 disc

Bob

@JourneymanGeek great! lemme fire up my XP- oh wait

:P

Journeyman Geek

2:58 PM

which you can get off baywolf I think

bay-wolf.com/usbmemstick.htm

Bob

ah, yea, there it is

I hope the image works in VMware

cause I honestly have no clue how to convert a floppy image

bay-wolf.com/downloads.htm

user88311

Google.com

Bob

hm.. shit. SCSI was a bad choice

HaydnWVN

Hey guys

Bob

hey

HaydnWVN

3:07 PM

Interesting one... Have some domain Win7 machines with a better spec than some much older XP machines that are much slower performance wise... Have done all the usual checks/malware scans/updates but not found anything - any other tools you would recommend?

Bob

does Windows 98 even support multicore?

@HaydnWVN what exactly are the specs? :P

and are they new?

# of running processes? memory usage? CPU hogging process? crappy GPU? incompatible drivers?

Hennes

No. I ran win98 on a multicore host. It used one of the CPUs. (dual booting to Linux made that system a lot faster)

user973810

lol

Bob

hm

that's funny

boot

configure (select disk to use)

reboot (formatting...)

and now it asks about a 'routine check'

funfun old setups

yay scandisk

it's fun how it's boasting about how easily you can connect to the internet (and how it's "even easier to use than Windows 95")

holy shit... 30-60 minutes?!

O.O

I can choose a directory to INSTALL it in?

user973810

fun!

Ben Richards

3:21 PM

@Tanner Yup! Still liking it!

Bob

...there's a Portable option?

Ben Richards

XP didn't even have proper multicore support, actually. It was bolted on after the fact with a patch.

Ok I gotta go. I'll be back later, I guess. :P

Tanner

lol been busy lately?

Bob

@BenRichards really? wow.

wow. a full core is in use

looks like Win98 just uses busy waiting...

Win98 had group policy?!

Tanner

@Bob srs?

That... that would've been an NT domain right?

Bob

3:33 PM

@Tanner yup. it was in the optional system tools components

I have no clue. Win98 had no concept of domains or even proper user security/multiuser AFAIK

allquixotic

@Bob for your project that needs to not involve .NET, I have two possible suggestions

Bob

oh, wait. Win98 does have some domain support O.O

support.microsoft.com/kb/555038

@allquixotic hm?

allquixotic

one is to use Apache POI + Excelsior JET to make a Java JAR into an EXE; the other possibility is to use Delphi or VB6, either of which give much higher level COM automation APIs and compile into native code

Bob

my CPU fan is going crazy :P

@allquixotic Java? Urgh. Delphi? Noclue. VB6? Perhaps.

:P

too bad mono doesn't seem to work properly with my current code or I would just AOT compile it

allquixotic

@Bob AOT compiling CIL doesn't stop it from depending on the runtime; it just does the JIT compilation step at compile time

it still has to be hosted by mono.exe or monow.exe

and why doesn't it seem to work properly? maybe there's a way I can help?

Bob

3:38 PM

@allquixotic I was under the impression that it could.. ah